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Wednesday, July 12, 2006

Defensive Rankings by Position- American League

The following data represent the defensive rankings for the American League players by position, with a minimum of 200 innings played.

RSpt is Runs Saved for the playing time of the player above average for that much playing time.
RS/150 is how many runs that would be in 150 games played.

This is explained in the methodology here.


Catchers

Pos	First	Last	        Team	GP	GS	INN	RSpt	RS/150
2	Ramon	Hernandez	BAL	77	74	638.3	5	11
2	Ivan	Rodriguez	DET	65	64	563.3	5	12
2	Gerald	Laird      	TEX	31	26	236.3	4	23
2	Joe	Mauer   	MIN	65	64	568.7	3	6
2	Jason	Kendall 	OAK	72	72	647.3	2	5
2	Jose	Molina  	LAA	41	40	337.0	2	9
2	Kenji	Johjima 	SEA	81	74	659.7	2	5
2	Jorge	Posada  	NYY	72	64	563.7	1	3
2	Vance	Wilson  	DET	29	24	227.7	1	7
2	Rod	Barajas 	TEX	62	62	540.7	1	3
2	John	Buck    	KCR	63	60	519.3	0	1
2	Mike	Napoli  	LAA	45	37	349.7	0	0
2	Paul	Bako   	        KCR	33	27	237.3	0	0
2	Gregg	Zaun            TOR	36	30	276.7	0	0
2	Jason	Varitek 	BOS	68	64	569.3	0	-1
2	A.J.	Pierzynski 	CHW	73	69	631.0	-1	-2
2	Toby	Hall    	TBD	61	55	494.0	-1	-3
2	Josh	Paul    	TBD	32	27	233.7	-1	-8
2	Kelly	Stinnett 	NYY	31	22	205.7	-2	-10
2	Bengie	Molina  	TOR	58	57	486.3	-4	-12
2	Victor	Martinez	CLE	77	73	644.7	-7	-15

First Base

Pos	First	Last	        Team	GP	GS	INN	RSpt	RS/150
3	Chris	Shelton 	DET	86	82	737.0	12	21
3	Kendry	Morales 	LAA	42	40	364.7	5	19
3	Doug	Mientkiewicz 	KCR	82	74	656.7	5	11
3	Andy	Phillips 	NYY	59	36	366.7	4	14
3	Justin	Morneau 	MIN	81	80	707.7	2	4
3	Travis	Lee     	TBD	69	57	518.3	2	6
3	Lyle	Overbay 	TOR	72	71	620.7	2	4
3	Dan	Johnson 	OAK	69	67	612.7	0	1
3	Kevin	Youkilis 	BOS	77	72	623.0	0	-1
3	Mark	Teixeira 	TEX	86	86	757.7	0	-1
3	Jeff	Conine  	BAL	52	35	332.7	0	-2
3	Ben	Broussard 	CLE	71	51	491.3	-1	-3
3	Richie	Sexson  	SEA	87	86	758.7	-2	-4
3	Kevin	Millar  	BAL	53	53	423.3	-3	-9
3	Jason	Giambi  	NYY	44	44	337.0	-6	-26
3	Paul	Konerko 	CHW	82	81	692.7	-9	-18

Second Base

Pos	First	Last	        Team	GP	GS	INN	RSpt	RS/150
4	Placido	Polanco 	Det	74	73	652.0	12	25
4	Mark	Grudzielanek 	KC	77	77	648.7	9	18
4	Brian	Roberts 	Bal	68	67	586.7	9	20
4	Marco	Scutaro 	Oak	34	30	277.7	6	29
4	Mark	DeRosa  	Tex	26	26	223.7	5	33
4	Aaron	Hill    	Tor	51	51	442.3	5	15
4	Mark	Ellis   	Oak	52	51	447.3	2	7
4	Rob.	Cano    	NYY	69	68	602.0	2	5
4	Ian	Kinsler 	Tex	46	44	386.7	0	2
4	Ty	Wigginton	TB	39	33	297.3	-2	-10
4	Mark	Loretta 	Bos	82	79	701.0	-2	-4
4	Jose	Lopez   	Sea	86	85	757.0	-3	-4
4	Tad.	Iguchi  	CWS	72	72	648.3	-4	-8
4	Adam	Kennedy 	LAA	80	76	679.7	-5	-10
4	Ronnie	Belliard 	Cle	83	81	711.3	-7	-13
4	Luis	Castillo	Min	75	75	647.3	-9	-20
4	Jorge	Cantu   	TB	44	44	388.0	-10	-36

Third Base

Pos	First	Last	        Team	GP	GS	INN	RSpt	RS/150
5	Mike	Lowell  	BOS	83	80	700.0	16	31
5	Brandon	Inge    	DET	85	83	749.0	10	18
5	Adrian	Beltre  	SEA	87	87	770.0	4	7
5	Tony	Graffanino	KCR	26	25	207.3	3	20
5	Dallas	McPherson	LAA	29	25	221.3	2	15
5	Hank	Blalock 	TEX	83	82	727.7	2	4
5	Joe	Crede   	CHW	84	81	705.0	2	3
5	Aubrey	Huff    	TBD	60	60	480.7	2	4
5	Troy	Glaus   	TOR	77	72	632.7	-1	-1
5	Alex	Rodriguez	NYY	83	83	737.3	-2	-3
5	Eric	Chavez  	OAK	72	72	642.0	-3	-6
5	Aaron	Boone   	CLE	80	79	682.0	-3	-6
5	Chone	Figgins 	LAA	29	27	237.3	-3	-19
5	Mark	Teahen  	KCR	56	52	465.3	-4	-11
5	Melvin	Mora    	BAL	88	88	755.3	-5	-9
5	Tony	Batista 	MIN	50	50	434.0	-7	-21

Shortstop

Pos	First	Last	        Team	GP	GS	INN	RSpt	RS/150
6	Juan	Uribe   	CHW	75	70	632.0	10	21
6	Alex	Gonzalez	BOS	68	67	591.3	6	13
6	Bobby	Crosby  	OAK	77	77	677.0	5	9
6	Carlos	Guillen 	DET	79	78	680.0	4	7
6	Tomas	Perez   	TBD	25	23	200.3	2	15
6	Orlando	Cabrera 	LAA	84	84	724.7	2	4
6	Jason	Bartlett	MIN	23	23	203.0	2	11
6	Julio	Lugo    	TBD	60	59	516.3	2	4
6	Michael	Young   	TEX	87	87	761.0	1	2
6	Russ	Adams   	TOR	36	31	271.0	0	2
6	Jhonny	Peralta 	CLE	84	83	729.3	0	0
6	Yuni.	Betancourt	SEA	87	87	759.3	-1	-3
6	Aaron	Hill    	TOR	34	31	281.7	-2	-11
6	Juan	Castro   	MIN	50	48	408.0	-5	-15
6	Miguel	Tejada  	BAL	83	83	719.7	-5	-10
6	Derek	Jeter   	NYY	78	78	680.0	-6	-12
6	Angel	Berroa  	KCR	80	79	687.7	-9	-18

Left Field

Pos	First	Last	        Team	GP	GS	INN	RSpt	RS/150
7	Carl	Crawford        TBD	82	80	702.7	7	14
7	Emil	Brown   	KCR	69	67	574.7	4	10
7	Marcus	Thames   	DET	32	32	244.7	3	17
7	Reed	Johnson 	TOR	56	32	328.0	3	11
7	Nick	Swisher 	OAK	65	63	573.7	3	6
7	Craig	Monroe          DET	59	52	474.3	2	7
7	Lew	Ford    	MIN	40	24	240.7	2	13
7	Raul	Ibanez  	SEA	86	86	768.7	2	4
7	Jeff	Conine  	BAL	33	32	256.3	1	4
7	Scott	Podsednik	CHW	79	73	669.0	1	1
7	Garret	Anderson	LAA	60	60	518.0	1	1
7	Shannon	Stewart 	MIN	34	34	286.0	1	2
7	Jason	Michaels	CLE	62	61	539.0	-1	-2
7	Hideki	Matsui  	NYY	30	30	251.0	-1	-8
7	Frank	Catalanotto 	TOR	61	55	433.0	-3	-10
7	Melky	Cabrera 	NYY	46	45	401.7	-5	-17
7	Brad	Wilkerson	TEX	67	66	572.3	-6	-14
7	Manny	Ramirez 	BOS	82	82	685.3	-12	-23

Center Field

Pos	First	Last	        Team	GP	GS	INN	RSpt	RS/150
8	Vernon	Wells   	TOR	81	79	689.0	8	16
8	Corey	Patterson	BAL	80	71	639.0	7	15
8	Torii	Hunter  	MIN	84	84	730.7	6	11
8	Brian	Anderson	CHW	68	54	490.0	5	15
8	Johnny	Damon   	NYY	72	71	607.3	5	10
8	Curtis	Granderson	DET	86	80	738.0	4	7
8	Grady	Sizemore	CLE	87	87	755.3	3	6
8	Darin	Erstad  	LAA	27	25	220.7	3	20
8	Chone	Figgins 	LAA	40	37	332.0	1	5
8	Joey	Gathright 	TBD	68	62	546.0	1	1
8	David	DeJesus 	KCR	36	33	281.7	0	-1
8	Jeremy	Reed    	SEA	64	55	507.3	-2	-5
8	Rocco	Baldelli	TBD	27	25	233.0	-2	-12
8	Willie	Bloomquist	SEA	26	23	200.3	-2	-14
8	Mark	Kotsay  	OAK	78	76	680.3	-2	-5
8	Rob	Mackowiak	CHW	43	34	308.0	-3	-14
8	Coco	Crisp   	BOS	44	43	390.7	-5	-17
8	Gary	Matthews	TEX	73	72	628.7	-8	-16

Right Field

Pos	First	Last	        Team	GP	GS	INN	RSpt	RS/150
9	Alex	Rios    	TOR	70	59	547.7	5	13
9	Ichiro	Suzuki   	SEA	88	88	778.7	4	7
9	Bobby	Kielty  	OAK	27	25	231.0	4	24
9	Mark	DeRosa  	TEX	29	29	251.0	4	22
9	Casey	Blake   	CLE	60	60	526.3	3	6
9	Reggie	Sanders 	KCR	61	58	495.7	2	6
9	Vlad.	Guerrero	LAA	78	78	661.7	1	3
9	Milton	Bradley 	OAK	27	27	232.0	1	7
9	Jay	Payton  	OAK	39	36	330.0	1	4
9	Damon	Hollins 	TBD	55	34	341.7	1	3
9	Nick	Markakis 	BAL	56	32	321.3	0	-1
9	Magglio	Ordonez 	DET	79	79	696.0	-1	-1
9	Russell	Branyan 	TBD	40	32	264.3	-1	-7
9	Trot	Nixon   	BOS	75	68	610.7	-2	-5
9	Jerm.	Dye     	CHW	78	77	662.0	-2	-5
9	Jay	Gibbons 	BAL	44	44	349.7	-3	-11
9	Michael	Cuddyer 	MIN	67	62	560.7	-3	-7
9	Kevin	Mench   	TEX	52	52	447.7	-6	-18
9	Bernie	Williams 	NYY	43	39	326.0	-6	-26

For outfielders, there is presently no added bonus for throwing runners out.  At this point in the season, there are very few outside of +/- 1.1 runs.  Most are less than that.  The exceptions are: Melky Cabrera (+1.4) and Frank Catalanotto (+1.3).

Chris Dial Posted: July 12, 2006 at 01:56 AM | 31 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
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   1. Chris Dial Posted: July 12, 2006 at 03:18 AM (#2096380)
These are runs above average, which means you can add them to offensive runs above average to get total value.
   2. shock Posted: July 12, 2006 at 06:22 AM (#2096492)
Loving the Toronto outfield.
   3. 1k5v3L Posted: July 12, 2006 at 06:27 AM (#2096494)
Ya gotta figure Hendry traded Corey Patterson right when his trade value was at its peak...

Smart move, ghost-buster. Now go and get another reliever.
   4. Greasy Neale Heaton (Dan Lee) Posted: July 12, 2006 at 06:59 AM (#2096505)
Funny that Jhonny Peralta, who most Indians fans are just convinced is a horrible defensive shortstop, is the third-best defensive player on the team according to this system.

I've always thought he was halfway decent, and it appears the numbers back me up.
   5. Slide-Piece Posted: July 12, 2006 at 07:31 AM (#2096515)
It's funny how the rankings mostly conform to expectations...and then you see something like Russ Adams rated higher than Yuniesky Betancourt at shortstop.
   6. Mike Green Posted: July 12, 2006 at 02:48 PM (#2096670)
The Adams numbers are a bit unusual. He's +2 per 150 games at short, and -42 per 150 games at second base. Subjectively, he has looked a lot better at second where his lack of arm strength has been less of an issue. BP has him at 94 at short and 100 at second, for what that's worth.

He's only been at second for 22 games, so we'll have a better handle on this at the end of the year.
   7. mgl Posted: July 12, 2006 at 06:27 PM (#2096916)
Remarkably similar to my 06 UZR! I am very impressed. Here are Chris' top and bottom 3 at each position along with their UZR per 150 games:

First Base

Pos First Last Team GP GS INN RSpt RS/150 UZR
3 Chris Shelton DET 86 82 737.0 12 21 12
3 Kendry Morales LAA 42 40 364.7 5 19 20
3 Doug Mientkiewicz KCR 82 74 656.7 5 11 12

3 Kevin Millar BAL 53 53 423.3 -3 -9 -4
3 Jason Giambi NYY 44 44 337.0 -6 -26 -33
3 Paul Konerko CHW 82 81 692.7 -9 -18 -9

Second Base

Pos First Last Team GP GS INN RSpt RS/150
4 Placido Polanco Det 74 73 652.0 12 25 21
4 Mark Grudzielanek KC 77 77 648.7 9 18 22
4 Brian Roberts Bal 68 67 586.7 9 20 14

4 Ronnie Belliard Cle 83 81 711.3 -7 -13 -7
4 Luis Castillo Min 75 75 647.3 -9 -20 -24
4 Jorge Cantu TB 44 44 388.0 -10 -36 -30

Third Base

Pos First Last Team GP GS INN RSpt RS/150
5 Mike Lowell BOS 83 80 700.0 16 31 28
5 Brandon Inge DET 85 83 749.0 10 18 8
5 Adrian Beltre SEA 87 87 770.0 4 7 6

5 Mark Teahen KCR 56 52 465.3 -4 -11 -12
5 Melvin Mora BAL 88 88 755.3 -5 -9 -1
5 Tony Batista MIN 50 50 434.0 -7 -21 -20

Shortstop

Pos First Last Team GP GS INN RSpt RS/150
6 Juan Uribe CHW 75 70 632.0 10 21 18
6 Alex Gonzalez BOS 68 67 591.3 6 13 15
6 Bobby Crosby OAK 77 77 677.0 5 9 6

6 Miguel Tejada BAL 83 83 719.7 -5 -10 -5
6 Derek Jeter NYY 78 78 680.0 -6 -12 -13
6 Angel Berroa KCR 80 79 687.7 -9 -18 -18

Left Field

Pos First Last Team GP GS INN RSpt RS/150
7 Carl Crawford TBD 82 80 702.7 7 14 9
7 Emil Brown KCR 69 67 574.7 4 10 18
7 Marcus Thames DET 32 32 244.7 3 17 5

7 Melky Cabrera NYY 46 45 401.7 -5 -17 -16
7 Brad Wilkerson TEX 67 66 572.3 -6 -14 -5
7 Manny Ramirez BOS 82 82 685.3 -12 -23 -23

Center Field

Pos First Last Team GP GS INN RSpt RS/150
8 Vernon Wells TOR 81 79 689.0 8 16 13
8 Corey Patterson BAL 80 71 639.0 7 15 14
8 Torii Hunter MIN 84 84 730.7 6 11 8

8 Rob Mackowiak CHW 43 34 308.0 -3 -14 -20
8 Coco Crisp BOS 44 43 390.7 -5 -17 -24
8 Gary Matthews TEX 73 72 628.7 -8 -16 -3

Right Field

Pos First Last Team GP GS INN RSpt RS/150
9 Alex Rios TOR 70 59 547.7 5 13 -1
9 Ichiro Suzuki SEA 88 88 778.7 4 7 5
9 Bobby Kielty OAK 27 25 231.0 4 24 19

9 Michael Cuddyer MIN 67 62 560.7 -3 -7 -14
9 Kevin Mench TEX 52 52 447.7 -6 -18 -4
9 Bernie Williams NYY 43 39 326.0 -6 -26 -28
   8. mgl Posted: July 12, 2006 at 06:34 PM (#2096923)
While Betancourt has a rep as a defensive whiz, his UZR this year and last are negative. You never know. A guy can look real flashy, but for whatever reason, not have great range. We'll see how his numbers play out over the next couple of years.

R. Adams has been the worst (he and M. Young) defensive SS in baseball for several years now, according to UZR. I also have him as better at SS this year than 2B, but in such a small sample, it doesn't mean anything (48 chances at 2B and 83 at SS). I haven't seen him play much over the years, but given his UZR numbers, I would think that he is a statue at any IF position. 3B may be better suited to him, although I don't know what his arm is like.
   9. Kyle S Posted: July 12, 2006 at 06:36 PM (#2096927)
Looks like Alex Rios is where y'all disagree most. Why would that be? Both systems like Wells, so that's not a reason.

BTW, what do Manny's supporters think about his defense these days? Have y'all accepted that he's probably a true -25 yet?
   10. PJ Martinez Posted: July 12, 2006 at 06:38 PM (#2096929)
It's funny how Mike Lowell and Alex Gonzalez (plus few errors at the positions that generally have few errors, and 2B) have convinced people in Boston that our defense is great. Coco doesn't seem to get good reads, but those numbers are even worse than I expected. And Trot's declined.

Where can I get gb/fb numbers for pitchers? If I'm not mistaken, Boston's staff has more fb guys than gbs. Not a great combination with our OF defense.
   11. PJ Martinez Posted: July 12, 2006 at 06:41 PM (#2096930)
"BTW, what do Manny's supporters think about his defense these days? Have y'all accepted that he's probably a true -25 yet?"

Does anyone actually support Manny's defense? I think the real debate was whether any player could be -40, if I remember correctly. I think the consensus was that he's probably more around -25... and lo and behold.
   12. Dan Turkenkopf Posted: July 12, 2006 at 06:43 PM (#2096933)
Where can I get gb/fb numbers for pitchers? If I'm not mistaken, Boston's staff has more fb guys than gbs. Not a great combination with our OF defense.


From Hardball Times (hopefully the formatting works)

R/G    ERA   FIP   DER   LD%   GB%  IF/Fly  K/G  BB/G  HR/G HR/Fly  SLG    LOB%
BOS     4.80  4.54  4.62  .701   18%   42%    12%   6.9   3.1   1.3   13%  .436     72


They appear to be about average in GB%, allow a fairly low LD% and a lot of IF%.
   13. Jorge Luis Bourjos (Walewander) Posted: July 12, 2006 at 06:47 PM (#2096939)
I hope this explains to people why the Tigers are playing so well... although is Johnny Damon really playing better D than Granderson??

Thanks for this, Chris.
   14. Kyle S Posted: July 12, 2006 at 06:53 PM (#2096944)
Does anyone actually support Manny's defense? I think the real debate was whether any player could be -40, if I remember correctly. I think the consensus was that he's probably more around -25... and lo and behold.

Oh, yeah, I guess that wasn't the argument. IMHO, it's possible for someone as bad as manny to be a true talent -25 and also put up a -40 season (which at 10 runs per SD is only 1.5 SDs below his true talent - equivalent to a hitter stinking a la paul konerko 2003). but that's neither here nor there. I also recall being frustrated that my position was ridiculed as if I believed he was a true talent -40, which no one that I'm aware of has ever said.

I think the true question is whether it's possible to be -40 in left field. Given that Bernie and Griffey frequently grade out that poorly or worse while playing outfield, and no one questions those rankings, seems possible to me. If its possible to do, Manny's the guy to do it :)
   15. Srul Itza Posted: July 12, 2006 at 07:09 PM (#2096956)
Remarkably similar to my 06 UZR!

Is the same true for his NL rankings? Any disagreement between the systems that stands out there?

Again, thanks to both Chris and mgl for the work.
   16. chris p Posted: July 12, 2006 at 07:21 PM (#2096972)
Does anyone actually support Manny's defense? I think the real debate was whether any player could be -40, if I remember correctly. I think the consensus was that he's probably more around -25... and lo and behold.

yeah i remember it pretty much the same way, but i would add that part of the debate was whether manny's "impossible" -40 uzr was a reason to throw uzr out the window entirely.
   17. PJ Martinez Posted: July 12, 2006 at 07:28 PM (#2096974)
Thanks for the link, Dan. They seems pretty average on gb/fb-- and their FIP is higher than their ERA, so that IF defense (on the left side) does seem to be helping. Amazing (though not surprising, I guess) how much Detroit's D seems to be helping their pitching numbers at this point.

Paul Konerko 2003 seems like a good analogy for Manny's defense that year. I think if people saw it that way-- he's a very bad fielder who had a terrible year-- they might be less resistant to the idea. It's just hard to get one's head around the idea that a leftfielder could cost his team 40 runs in a season, especially with half his games in Fenway. Not saying it's wrong at all, just that it's a little counter-intuitive.
   18. Chris Dial Posted: July 13, 2006 at 01:10 AM (#2097207)
Thanks for the info, mgl. I appreciate your input.
   19. shock Posted: July 13, 2006 at 01:26 AM (#2097216)
3B may be better suited to [Adams], although I don't know what his arm is like.

His arm is awful. It's the reason he moved to 2B from SS in the first place. The minor leagues may be better suited to him.
   20. mgl Posted: July 13, 2006 at 11:16 PM (#2098084)
I'll checkout the NL numbers later today. On a quick perusal, they look very similar to mine as well, which I expect given the AL numbers.

Everyone must keep in mind that a half year of UZR or Dial ratings can easily (10-20% of the players?) be far from their true defensive talent (such as Bonds and Crisp). In 50 or 100 chances, only 5 or 10 really make a difference. One player could have 5 easy to catch balls in any one zone and another player could have 5 hard to catch balls in that same zone.
   21. Los Angeles Waterloo of Black Hawk Posted: July 14, 2006 at 07:19 AM (#2098608)
From my understanding of what people smarter than me have said in the past, looking at defensive numbers halfway through a season is like looking at offensive numbers halfway through May; in many cases you'll be right, but there's still a lot of noise in your way.
   22. mtagliaf Posted: July 21, 2006 at 02:32 PM (#2106436)
how are you doing catchers - I didn't think ZR was done for catchers.
   23. Chris Dial Posted: July 25, 2006 at 09:33 PM (#2111812)
mtag,
catchers are based on CS, SBA, E, PB.

You are correct - it isn't a ZR-based rating.
   24. bigseries Posted: August 15, 2006 at 05:29 PM (#2141646)
Just as a reality check...Shelton is the leading 1B with 12 runs saved. Wells is the leading CF with 8 runs saved.

Is it really possible that a 1Bman could be that much more valuable than the best defensive CF in the league?
   25. Chris Dial Posted: August 15, 2006 at 05:39 PM (#2141660)
bigseries,
yes. It says that teams are more willing to have a poor fielder at first base than they are in CF. So the overall talent in CF is closer than the talent is at 1B wrt fielding the position.

In general, I think 3B has the widest range of talent. Some teams believe it is a sluggers spot, defense be damned. Some teams believe it's a glove spot; some teams balance it.
   26. DCA Posted: August 15, 2006 at 05:40 PM (#2141662)
Is it really possible that a 1Bman could be that much more valuable than the best defensive CF in the league?

Why not? Erstad hasn't played much, he's as good as Shelton on a per-game basis. And there are some real butchers -- Giambi, Konerko -- pulling the 1B average down. Throw in some random noise and we shouldn't be surprised.
   27. Dewey, Soupuss Not Doomed to Succeed Posted: August 15, 2006 at 05:45 PM (#2141670)
there are some real butchers -- Giambi, Konerko -- pulling the 1B average down.

Konerko's not that bad of a fielder. He doesn't have much range, but he makes the plays he needs to.
   28. Chris Dial Posted: August 16, 2006 at 02:51 AM (#2142590)
Konerko is a butcher. One of the worst over the last 20 years.
   29. Hello Rusty Kuntz, Goodbye Rusty Cars Posted: August 16, 2006 at 04:09 AM (#2142643)
Konerko's got to be the best fielding White Sox 1B over the last 15 years.
   30. Dr. Vaux Posted: August 16, 2006 at 05:07 AM (#2142661)
What a huge loss Polanco is.
   31. Chris Dial Posted: August 16, 2006 at 11:52 AM (#2142730)
Konerko's got to be the best fielding White Sox 1B over the last 15 years.

You'll find out very shortly.

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