BBTF's Game Chatter Discussion :: Boston Red Sox (96-66) @ Cleveland Indians (96-66), Tuesday, October 16, 2007, 8:00pm

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Tuesday, October 16, 2007

Boston Red Sox (96-66) @ Cleveland Indians (96-66), Tuesday, October 16, 2007, 8:00pm

BOS: Tim Wakefield (40, RHP, 17-12, 4.76)
CLE: Paul Byrd (36, RHP, 15-8, 4.59)

The Primer Chimp Posted: October 16, 2007 at 09:00 AM | 638 comment(s)
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1. TomH Posted: October 16, 2007 at 02:39 PM (#2579624)

60 deg F, maybe rain on/off, 80% humidity, wind from S at 7mph. Don't know which way Jacob's Field faces. What's that all do to a knuckler?

2. Curse of the Graffanino (dfan) Posted: October 16, 2007 at 03:42 PM (#2579752)

LET'S GO RED SOX

It'll be fun to see the Rockies in the World Series, whoever wins the ALCS.

3. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: October 16, 2007 at 05:33 PM (#2579876)

According to the radio, via SoSH...

2B Pedroia
1B Youkilis
DH Papi
LF Manny
3B Lowell
RF Drew
CF Crisp
C Mirabelli
SS Lugo

Dougie's goin' deep tonight!!

4. Dan Posted: October 16, 2007 at 06:21 PM (#2579937)

The Red Sox deserve to lose this game and this series for not taking it seriously enough to start Beckett tonight. That is all.

5. Joe Bivens, Ditch Digger Posted: October 16, 2007 at 06:48 PM (#2579972)

Nah. I agree Beckett should get the start, but remember 2004. Down 3-0.

6. Bernal Diaz has an angel on his shoulder. Posted: October 16, 2007 at 07:25 PM (#2580001)

O/U on number of pitches over 88 mph by both starting pitchers. I am setting it at 15 1/2

7. Joe Bivens, Ditch Digger Posted: October 16, 2007 at 07:30 PM (#2580007)

O/U on # of Wakefield pitches over 88mph: 1. I will take the under.

8. Textbook Editor Posted: October 16, 2007 at 07:32 PM (#2580008)

Bernal, I would take the under. I'd put the line at more like 3.5. I doubt Wakefield has hit 88 all year, even with a FB. Byrd may not have hit 88 in the start against the Yankees.

All we're asking for Timmy is that you channel your inner 1992 NLCS self and use him tonight. That's it. I'll never ask anything else from you the rest of your career.

Should the Indians make it to the WS I will look on in amusement at the Paul Byrd start at Coors Field in Game 4.

9. Elevate Phil Coorey Later Posted: October 16, 2007 at 07:32 PM (#2580010)

Wake is gonna choke!

10. Elevate Phil Coorey Later Posted: October 16, 2007 at 07:33 PM (#2580011)

Wake got the win in Game 4 of the 2003 ALCS, right??

That was huge

11. PJ Martinez Posted: October 16, 2007 at 07:36 PM (#2580014)

"Wake got the win in Game 4 of the 2003 ALCS, right??"

Game 1, too, IIRC.

12. Elevate Phil Coorey Later Posted: October 16, 2007 at 07:37 PM (#2580016)

Game 1, too, IIRC.

Of course

That was Manny oppo field homer game - nice.

13. Gamingboy Posted: October 16, 2007 at 07:41 PM (#2580020)

The Knuckleballer Cometh-A poem

If it's high
Let it Fly
If it's low
Let it go

14. Textbook Editor Posted: October 16, 2007 at 07:48 PM (#2580030)

Wake was the MVP of that 2003 ALCS if the Red Sox had won, no question.

I confess between the knuckleballs and double-pump windups it'll be a lot of fun to watch the pitchers in this game.

15. Elevate Phil Coorey Later Posted: October 16, 2007 at 07:50 PM (#2580032)

I'm gonna watch this at home, might check in here and there.

Enjoy everyone

16. GIANTlhbASS Posted: October 16, 2007 at 07:50 PM (#2580035)

2003 was good but the 1992 NLCS was better. Two complete game victories over Glavine. And since knuckleballers only get better with age, this has to be relevant, right?

17. Bernal Diaz has an angel on his shoulder. Posted: October 16, 2007 at 07:51 PM (#2580036)

I hope Byrd does the triple pump.

18. strong silence Posted: October 16, 2007 at 07:58 PM (#2580045)

In a surprising turn of events, the American League Championship Series will decide the World Series runner-up!

19. Brian White Posted: October 16, 2007 at 07:59 PM (#2580048)

O/U on number of pitches over 88 mph by both starting pitchers. I am setting it at 15 1/2

Actual speed, or souped up FOX radar gun speed? If its the latter, Paul Byrd might be pitching in the low 90s tonight.

20. Gamingboy Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:01 PM (#2580051)

Joe Buck says the rain went through.

21. Bernal Diaz has an angel on his shoulder. Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:03 PM (#2580054)

Joe Girardi looks like he gets his haircut by a prison barber.

22. Lassus Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:04 PM (#2580056)

Good choice for lead-in music. Yay U2.

On the other hand, the recurring Chief Wahoo makes me want to drag about 350 Native American corpses onto the field to make a point, but oh well.

I'm going for a 7-game series here.

23. Greg Maddux School of Reflexive Profanity Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:05 PM (#2580058)

Nothing says "baseball" like a song about Myanmar.

24. Lassus Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:09 PM (#2580060)

Is that "Walk On" song about Myanmar? I've never really been a lyrics guy, I admit.

25. Lassus Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:10 PM (#2580062)

What is the Nation's Defcon status on Wakefield? Are they really freaked?

26. Gamingboy Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:13 PM (#2580065)

That segment was the definition as to why FOX should not broadcast baseball: a movie-related, biased, unfunny adversegment that is at 8:13.... when the game should already be in it's 2nd inning if, y'know, the games didn't start at 8:30.

27. PJ Martinez Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:15 PM (#2580067)

I haven't read the thread, but on SoSH, there's a poll, and 73% (of 388) thought Beckett should start this game if the Sox were down 2-1.

28. Bernal Diaz has an angel on his shoulder. Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:17 PM (#2580070)

Is this 22 minutes of pregame really needed?

29. AuntBea Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:19 PM (#2580072)

When does this game actually start? One of the things I absolutely hate most about American sports is that it is often hard to find exact starting times for sporting events. The TV networks dominate the landscape so much that they want you to tune in early to watch their irrepressible advertisements. Both ESPN.com lists the game starting time as 5:00 Eastern Time. The implication on mlb.com is that the game has already started. #######.

30. Gamingboy Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:19 PM (#2580073)

Is this 22 minutes of pregame really needed?

NO

31. Lassus Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:19 PM (#2580075)

26 - in FOX's defense (AAAAAAAAGH I can't believe I said this) there was actually a rain delay and the tarp just came off the field, causing the late start.

That movie tie-in was awful awful awful, though.

I really like the animation style in this XM ad.

32. Gamingboy Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:20 PM (#2580076)

O, there was a rain delay. Okay, I guess I can spare FOX some grief...

They have five seconds....

1....
2....
3.....
4......
5.......

Fox Sports sucks for Baseball

33. PJ Martinez Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:20 PM (#2580077)

"One of the things I absolutely hate most about American sports is that it is often hard to find exact starting times for sporting events."

The New York Times listed this game as an 8:21 start. According my computer it is 8:20.

34. Lassus Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:21 PM (#2580078)

Boy, you guys are GRUMPY about this start time. Would you like to file a complaint with the Rockies and have them talk to god about the rain?

35. Nick Warino Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:21 PM (#2580079)

Kevin Youkilis looks like he's probably a ####.

36. Tony H. Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:21 PM (#2580080)

Lots of emotion here from Youkilis.

37. Bernal Diaz has an angel on his shoulder. Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:22 PM (#2580082)

Way to work the count Dustin.

38. PJ Martinez Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:23 PM (#2580083)

Better slide might have worked.

"Way to work the count Dustin."

Isn't Byrd a preternatual strike-thrower?

39. Lassus Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:24 PM (#2580084)

Pedroia was amazing on my fantasy team this year. Sadly, reality is not really treating him as well in the post-season.

HEY! He did the A-rod thing looked like with trying to whack the 1B's hands. How many A-Rod-hating Red Sox fans will admit that, I wonder? And I am rooting for the Red Sox this series.

40. Bernal Diaz has an angel on his shoulder. Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:24 PM (#2580085)

Holy #### Buck with an excellent point. The umps strikezone has alot to do how Byrd pitches.

41. Gamingboy Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:24 PM (#2580086)

Paul Byrd: Question or Answer?

(sorry folks)

42. JoelW Iz in Ur Baseball Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:24 PM (#2580087)

Also, he hit the ball damn hard, he just hit it right at Blake.

43. Bernal Diaz has an angel on his shoulder. Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:24 PM (#2580088)

Byrd throws pretty much all strikes.

44. Bicycle RepairMan Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:25 PM (#2580089)

Walk On is dedicated to Aung sang su kyi...

45. Gamingboy Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:25 PM (#2580090)

To 40:

I've always had this feeling that Joe Buck would be a fine announcer if it weren't for the fact he was so waited down by the fact he was on FOX, where he must shill everything and speak to the lowest common denominator.

46. Bernal Diaz has an angel on his shoulder. Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:25 PM (#2580091)

Ortiz v Byrd scares me. A lot.

47. Bernal Diaz has an angel on his shoulder. Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:25 PM (#2580093)

DOUBLE PUMP BABY!!!!

48. JoelW Iz in Ur Baseball Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:25 PM (#2580094)

Good god. Awful.

49. Gamingboy Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:26 PM (#2580095)

Wow. Byrd pitched like a man possessed there....

50. Marc Sully's not booin'. He's Youkin'. Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:26 PM (#2580096)

And here we go...

51. Nick Warino Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:26 PM (#2580097)

What the #### was that?

52. Tony H. Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:26 PM (#2580098)

Love teh double pump.

53. Lassus Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:26 PM (#2580099)

That was very very odd. I loved the complete broadcaster silence after that strikeout, but.... it was kind of bizarrely unexpected.

54. bigcpa Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:27 PM (#2580101)

Is that Joe Buck's new ultra-hip strikeout call? " !"

55. AuntBea Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:28 PM (#2580102)

I don't care when the game starts at all, so long as I can find out what time that actually is. It annoys the hell out of me that mlb tries to keep the actual time on the down low, so to speak, to maximize their revenue.

56. Gamingboy Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:28 PM (#2580105)

This just in folks: Hafner is good at fantasy football and Kenny Lofton is known as "K-Lo".

57. Lassus Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:28 PM (#2580106)

WebMD - a nation of uninsured persons (myself included) diagnosing themselves.

58. Bicycle RepairMan Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:29 PM (#2580107)

KLo? really?! god, these nicks suck

59. Marc Sully's not booin'. He's Youkin'. Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:30 PM (#2580108)

Honest to God.

60. Nick Warino Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:30 PM (#2580109)

Ugh. This game is super annoying already.

61. PJ Martinez Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:31 PM (#2580112)

I'm having visions of a blowout, followed by massive second-guessing on the Beckett/Wakefield decision.

Come on, Wake.

62. Bicycle RepairMan Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:32 PM (#2580113)

Has there ever been a left handed knuckleballer?

63. Bernal Diaz has an angel on his shoulder. Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:32 PM (#2580114)

Hafner is batting .111 vs Wake.

64. Bicycle RepairMan Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:33 PM (#2580115)

Why didn't Sizemore steal during that AB?

65. AuntBea Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:33 PM (#2580116)

What was that strikeout pitch to Cabrera? It was slower than the knuckler.

66. Curse of the Graffanino (dfan) Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:33 PM (#2580117)

Has there ever been a left handed knuckleballer?

A little googling turned up Gene Bearden and Wilbur Wood right away.

67. retro-shiite Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:33 PM (#2580118)

Love teh double pump.

Very retro.

So naturally, I like it.

68. Bernal Diaz has an angel on his shoulder. Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:33 PM (#2580119)

Wilbur Wood

69. Tony H. Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:34 PM (#2580121)

Has there ever been a left handed knuckleballer?

On video games I always make myself a left-handed submarining knuckleballer.

70. Nick Warino Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:34 PM (#2580122)

Wilbur Wood was a lefty knuckler. Gene Beardon too.

71. Gamingboy Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:34 PM (#2580123)

I hope that when Wakefield retires, he becomes a coach so that the Knuckleball does not die with him.

72. Bicycle RepairMan Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:34 PM (#2580124)

Thanks dfan and bernal.

Better late than never for Sizemore

73. Lassus Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:35 PM (#2580125)

That strikeout pitch to Hafner was incredible.

74. The Ghost of Sox Fans Past Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:35 PM (#2580126)

It would have been really tricky for Cabrera to get up lefty, let Grady steal, then switch to right-handed.

But I am assuming that Tim knows of which he speaks. Sorry, silly me.

75. Marc Sully's not booin'. He's Youkin'. Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:35 PM (#2580127)

If he strikes everyone out tonight, I like Wake's chances.

76. retro-shiite Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:35 PM (#2580129)

KLo? really?! god, these nicks suck

Dave Otto coined that one during the Cubs' '03 stretch run. I blame him.

Man, watching knucklers is weird. It's like watching guys taking full cuts in slo-pitch.

77. AuntBea Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:35 PM (#2580131)

Another slow knuckler for a strikeout? Does Wake take something off of his knuckler with 2 strikes sometimes?

78. Nick Warino Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:36 PM (#2580132)

On video games I always make myself a left-handed submarining knuckleballer.

Same here, usually with a 100 MPH fastball. Never seems to fool the computer like it should.

79. Curse of the Graffanino (dfan) Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:36 PM (#2580133)

That was a decent Wakefield inning.

80. Lassus Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:36 PM (#2580134)

That was a pretty encouraging inning, after the walk.

Pitcher's duel!

81. Bernal Diaz has an angel on his shoulder. Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:36 PM (#2580135)

Pitch count for Wake is not an issue ever is it? I mean he can probably throw 200 knucklers easy.

82. Bicycle RepairMan Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:37 PM (#2580137)

That inning was bad news for the Indians. The knuckler is dancing

83. Nick Warino Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:38 PM (#2580138)

Pitch count for Wake is not an issue ever is it? I mean he can probably throw 200 knucklers easy.

According to Wakefield, this isn't true. He says his arm tires like everyone else's. I can't recall him going over 120 pitches in the last 5 years.

84. Bernal Diaz has an angel on his shoulder. Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:38 PM (#2580140)

I wonder if his hand gets tired as well.

85. AuntBea Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:38 PM (#2580141)

Wake threw all his knucklers 66 to 68 mph except for the 2 strikeout pitches, 63 to Pronk, and 60 to Cabrera. Both hitters swung high and early.

86. retro-shiite Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:39 PM (#2580142)

Do knuckleballers vary much in effectiveness from inning to inning during a particular start? I mean, a normal pitcher, you can usually tell if he's got good stuff. Is that true of knucklers as well?

87. Lassus Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:39 PM (#2580143)

Please Chuck Norris save me from reality television.

88. Joe C isn't Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:39 PM (#2580145)

Does Wake take something off of his knuckler with 2 strikes sometimes?

I remember seeing something on TV a few years ago where he said he throws two different knucklers, one he calls a "hard" knuckler. IIRC, he tends to throw the hard knuckler when he's ahead in the count, as it has more movement, and he has less control over it than the slower one.

89. Lassus Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:40 PM (#2580146)

They are using some kind of different camera for the pitcher close-ups. Is that as noticeable for any of you on HD?

90. Joe C isn't Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:40 PM (#2580147)

Wake threw all his knucklers 66 to 68 mph except for the 2 strikeout pitches, 63 to Pronk, and 60 to Cabrera. Both hitters swung high and early.

Or, I could be wrong :-)

91. Bicycle RepairMan Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:40 PM (#2580148)

Manny is someone who I think would kill finesse pitchers like Byrd, double pump or not.

92. Gamingboy Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:41 PM (#2580149)

Paul Byrd: Weird Windup or Bizzare Windup?

93. Bernal Diaz has an angel on his shoulder. Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:41 PM (#2580150)

Manny kills everyone, finesse or not.

94. AuntBea Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:41 PM (#2580151)

Does that mean the "hard" knuckler is slower? That would only make sense to a knuckleball pitcher.

95. Bernal Diaz has an angel on his shoulder. Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:41 PM (#2580152)

Paul Byrd: Traditional windup.

96. retro-shiite Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:41 PM (#2580154)

Not on HD, but I've got the digital antenna broadcast; the shots of the pitchers definitely look more pixelated, for some reason.

97. Bernal Diaz has an angel on his shoulder. Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:41 PM (#2580155)

Double pump didn;t work that time.

98. Bicycle RepairMan Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:42 PM (#2580157)

Its a bird, its a Byrd, no! its a double winding Byrd!

99. Gold Star for Robothal Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:42 PM (#2580158)

HOON LIVES!

100. MSI Posted: October 16, 2007 at 08:42 PM (#2580159)

It seems like a different film quality.

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Boston Red Sox (96-66) @ Cleveland Indians (96-66), Tuesday, October 16, 2007, 8:00pm

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