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Tuesday, July 29, 2008

Chicago Cubs (62-44) @ Milwaukee Brewers (60-46), Tuesday, July 29, 2008, 8:05pm

CHC: Carlos Zambrano (, RHP, 11-4, 2.96)
MIL: Ben Sheets (, RHP, 10-3, 2.87)

The Primer Chimp Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:00 AM | 265 comment(s)
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   1. Stevens Posted: July 29, 2008 at 11:17 AM (#2879875)
Okay Cubs. Let's keep it going.
   2. Cabbage Posted: July 29, 2008 at 12:21 PM (#2879976)
<crocodile dundee voice>
<view yesterday's matchup>

That's not an interesting pitcher matchup. This is an interesting pitcher matchup.

</tied-down Kangaroo sport>
   3. Stevens Posted: July 29, 2008 at 12:29 PM (#2879986)
No big surprises on historical OPS performance. Fielder and Braun have hurt Z in the past. Lee's the only one to really damage Sheets in meaningful PAs. I'd be surprised if Reed Johnson isn't in the lineup tonight--Edmonds has been awful against Sheets. In the fun dept., Z is hitting .357 against Sheets. All singles.

Just love this matchup. A couple stud opening-day pitchers who were born and raised in their respective team's farm systems duking out a 90-mile rivalry.

Damn good baseball.
   4. Bunny Vincennes Posted: July 29, 2008 at 02:20 PM (#2880180)
Yes, this is what its all about. I was in a bar last night, that I wouldn't consider a sports bar or a baseball bar at all, and the Milwaukee faithfull (since it isn't Packer season yet) were very much into the game. Playoff style fun. It was a fun time.
   5. Bunny Vincennes Posted: July 29, 2008 at 02:41 PM (#2880234)
My question is, wtf is going on with DLee? His numbers look okayish, with the exception of the GIDP. But everytime I watch (which is almost everyday) he seems to suck. Why do I feel this way?
   6. retro-shiite Posted: July 29, 2008 at 02:43 PM (#2880240)
Funny--I feel the same way about Lee lately. And the atmosphere at the bar I was at last night was definitely playoff-esque. Tonight, as it's on WGN, I can enjoy it in the peace and quiet of home.
   7. Bunny Vincennes Posted: July 29, 2008 at 02:52 PM (#2880246)
Jill is up in Minneapolis at a science conference and I think might see the Twins and White Sox at the Boringodome with Andere. So, I'll be on the town watching with friends at Genna's which is a much more Cub freindly than the place I was at after dinner last night.
   8. retro-shiite Posted: July 29, 2008 at 03:08 PM (#2880274)
Hoping for another lively chatter; that's the tradeoff of watching games in bars...can't chat. Was a lot of fun reading last night's chat.
   9. Bunny Vincennes Posted: July 29, 2008 at 03:16 PM (#2880289)
I spent my morning reading the chatter. That's actually how I knew Andere was at the APS conference up there and put Jill and he in touch. I could chatter from Genna's as they have the best wireless ever, but I fear some idiot Brewer fan spilling beer on my laptop. Afternoon games, not so much, its much more quiet.
   10. Moses Taylor didn't fall far from the awesome tree Posted: July 29, 2008 at 05:09 PM (#2880476)
I'll be chatting again tonight.
   11. A Surfeit of Peaches Graham (SdeB) Posted: July 29, 2008 at 05:42 PM (#2880509)
Blast from the past!

Random thoughts from BTF posters on some of the current Cubs:

From September 2005:

"I'm encouraged by Cedeno's play but he's not someone I would worry about blocking with a star player. I see Ronnie as something short of a sure fire major leaguer as of right now. Of course, Cedeno's going to be blocked by a veteran whether or not the Cubs sign Furcal."

"I suspect, or at least hope, that Cedeno might be rather better than we've had an opportunity to see so far. In the few opportunities he's had to show it, he definitely has shown a rifle of an arm, he looks to me to have good range and a good glove. I don't know whether the bat can do the job consistently, but I've seen enough not to write off his possible upside."

"Theriot is a nothing prospect who is bound to be a quadruple A type."

"So, has anyone noticed that Dempster is sporting a really nice 2.74 GB/FB ratio this year, with a very low 0.39HR/9IP rate, and 8.6K/9IP? Very solid stats.

He's a very good bet to have a few very good years as a closer if he can continue to maintain the GB/FB and HR/9 rates; and I see no reason why he will not."

From June 2006:

"Mike Fontenot, who was part of the package from Baltimore in exchange for Sammy Sosa’s desiccated remains, has quietly put together an excellent season at Iowa. He’s currently swinging a hot bat, and now sits at a pretty .316/.402/.472 line. 2006 is Fontenot’s third season in Triple A, and he has continued to improve each year. He takes walks, has pop, has some speed, and is a solid defender from the, admittedly few, accounts I’ve read. If Hendry can find a taker for Todd Walker (the Mets are a real possibilty), he should fetch a solid prospect. If this team has any sense at all, they’d then hand over the 2B job to Fontenot, who just turned 26, for the remainder of the season. He’s certainly a better prospect than Theriot, and he might turn into a pretty good number two hitter."

"All I have to say is that if the AAA success of Fontenot, Wuertz and Hill is the most positive news we can come up with, this team is in big trouble."
   12. retro-shiite Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:02 PM (#2880838)
Peaches, you have way too much time on your hands. :)
   13. Moses Taylor didn't fall far from the awesome tree Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:07 PM (#2880857)
Heh, WGN really flubbed that lineup.

DeRosa at C and Soto in CF? Ha.
   14. Moses Taylor didn't fall far from the awesome tree Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:07 PM (#2880861)
Bad Soriano.
   15. NTNgod Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:08 PM (#2880862)
Soriano didn't last long against Sheets there.
   16. retro-shiite Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:10 PM (#2880871)
This ump does not appear to have a huge strike zone.
   17. retro-shiite Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:12 PM (#2880875)
Nobody ##### with DeJesus.
   18. Moses Taylor didn't fall far from the awesome tree Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:12 PM (#2880880)
There's the Jason Kendall we remember from last year.
   19. retro-shiite Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:12 PM (#2880881)
Ha. Rifleman Kendall foiled. C'mon, Aramis.
   20. NTNgod Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:13 PM (#2880883)
Theriot gets drilled by a throw to first, now gets nailed by the throw on the steal.
   21. NTNgod Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:13 PM (#2880886)
With Sheets on the mound, it doesn't matter who's catching. He's glacial to the plate. Always very easy to steal on.
   22. Moses Taylor didn't fall far from the awesome tree Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:13 PM (#2880888)
Man, he lunged. He hasn't looked the same since that White Sox series.
   23. Moses Taylor didn't fall far from the awesome tree Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:14 PM (#2880891)
The throw was about 5 feet to the right of 2nd. That's what we're commenting on.
   24. Moses Taylor didn't fall far from the awesome tree Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:16 PM (#2880893)
WGN still has it ###### up! What a 2nd class operation they run over there.
   25. NTNgod Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:16 PM (#2880897)
Oh, it was a bad throw, no doubt. With Sheets, you have to rush the throws, though, to even have a chance - especially on a breaking ball.

Kendall actually threw out two runners a week or two back during a Sheets start, which may have been his most impressive performance.
   26. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:21 PM (#2880908)
This may seem obvious but I give Ned credit for playing Durham and Branyan.

While Ray ain't no great shakes I prefer his modest consistency to Weeks lurches from every so often scintillating to mostly galling.
   27. retro-shiite Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:24 PM (#2880915)
That Sammy Sosa deal's turned into a hell of a trade.
   28. retro-shiite Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:25 PM (#2880916)
Harveys, just wanted to be sure you got here in time for those two Cub lineouts this inning. :)

Sheets isn't getting the call on that fastball away.
   29. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:27 PM (#2880926)
This has to be Lou's influence. The Cub hitters ability to check their swing is amazing.

See Ben, was that so hard??

I am so SICK of guys getting up 0-2 then nibbling to a full count.

Throw a GODD#MN strike......
   30. NTNgod Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:30 PM (#2880940)
Hart with a hit. How about that!
   31. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:30 PM (#2880942)
You can tell Prince is anxious. The season is 2/3 over and he STILL has not a hot streak.

And finally a good swing by Hart.

Been a month..
   32. retro-shiite Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:30 PM (#2880943)
2 on for Branyan. I'm not a fan of this.
   33. retro-shiite Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:32 PM (#2880951)
Ate Branyan up there.
   34. BeanoCook Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:33 PM (#2880953)
You can tell Prince is anxious.


Much FATTER in 2008.
   35. NTNgod Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:33 PM (#2880954)
Don't know what Cameron was looking for there.
   36. retro-shiite Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:33 PM (#2880956)
Nasty pitch on 0-2. That .188 average against Z after an 0-2 count sounds pretty high. I'll bet that's higher than average.
   37. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:33 PM (#2880957)
two pathetic at bats.

Zambrano didn't even exert himself.
   38. retro-shiite Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:35 PM (#2880959)
Much FATTER in 2008.

So am I to conclude that Fielder's vegetarian diet consists of mac and cheese, fried okra and Haagen Dasz?

Hey--Theriot ranged more than 3 feet to his left. Amazing.
   39. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:35 PM (#2880960)
Oh for heaven's sake Jason. Why are you lunging at a pitch outside??
   40. BeanoCook Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:36 PM (#2880962)
Cameron is one of the streakiest players I have ever seen. He can win an entire series by himself and then stand there like a statue for a full week.
   41. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:38 PM (#2880975)
As Prince tries to maim another Brewer pitcher with a poor throw.

Good grief
   42. BeanoCook Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:39 PM (#2880978)
Soriano v Sheets are some violent at-bats.
   43. Moses Taylor didn't fall far from the awesome tree Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:39 PM (#2880979)
Another bad throw.
   44. NTNgod Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:39 PM (#2880981)
Another bad throw by Kendall, although it wouldn't have mattered
   45. Moses Taylor didn't fall far from the awesome tree Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:40 PM (#2880983)
Helluva play by Hardy.
   46. retro-shiite Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:40 PM (#2880987)
Between the 2 steals and his running hard on the comebacker to CC last night, I haven't seen Soriano run like this all year. (After his dogging it on the first inning double last night, of course.)
   47. BeanoCook Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:41 PM (#2880992)
I just read M Young SS of Texas has $80mm coming to him over the next 5 years, starting next year. What will JJ get on the open market?
   48. NTNgod Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:42 PM (#2880998)
I don't know if Sheets has had this much consistent velocity all year.
   49. Moses Taylor didn't fall far from the awesome tree Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:42 PM (#2881002)
Hardy doesn't have the rep that Young does, for whatever reason. When's he a FA?
   50. BeanoCook Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:42 PM (#2881003)
That fastball was exploding.
   51. NTNgod Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:43 PM (#2881008)
When's he a FA?

After 2010
   52. BeanoCook Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:44 PM (#2881011)
Hardy has 2 more years? About Sheets velocity, I spoke to a scout that said he would be the 2nd best closer (Rivera) today, with those 2 great pitches and ability to dial it up to 98.
   53. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:45 PM (#2881016)
Hardy stunk for two months and now is outstanding.

It's like he shed an ugly suit.
   54. Moses Taylor didn't fall far from the awesome tree Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:45 PM (#2881017)
I'm sure there's plenty of great starters who would be great closers.
   55. Moses Taylor didn't fall far from the awesome tree Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:47 PM (#2881026)
Filthy strike 3 pitch to Ray.
   56. BeanoCook Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:48 PM (#2881030)
Certainly, but it sure helps to have that excellent command of 2 pitches and ability to avoid walks. Very few pitchers avoid walks as well as Sheets.
   57. retro-shiite Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:49 PM (#2881032)
These guys are dealing.
   58. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:50 PM (#2881036)
They showed that stupid sidearm flip by Weeks. The team has worked with him and then when pressed reverts to bad form.

Bah...
   59. BeanoCook Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:50 PM (#2881037)
So is J Lackey v Boston. 0 hits through 6.
   60. Moses Taylor didn't fall far from the awesome tree Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:51 PM (#2881041)
I wonder what year Young signed his deal. He was pretty good in 2005, better than Hardy's ever been. But outside of that year, his average year is about the same as Hardy's last year. And Hardy is better defensively.

Hardy will do alright for himself.
   61. Moses Taylor didn't fall far from the awesome tree Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:53 PM (#2881048)
Very few pitchers avoid walks as well as Sheets.

That's true.
   62. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:53 PM (#2881049)
Ben overthrew that one. Sigh.
   63. Moses Taylor didn't fall far from the awesome tree Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:54 PM (#2881056)
Damn.
   64. retro-shiite Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:54 PM (#2881057)
Kosuke falling into bad habits. I hate seeing him hit the ball in the air.
   65. Moses Taylor didn't fall far from the awesome tree Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:55 PM (#2881061)
That'll get it done.
   66. retro-shiite Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:55 PM (#2881062)
Attaboy, Mark.
   67. BeanoCook Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:57 PM (#2881066)
So is the magic of Lou getting semi-scrubs like DeRosa/Theriot to play like all-stars?
   68. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:57 PM (#2881069)
With the Brewers offense only going 5 deep Zambrano's job is pretty straightforward.
   69. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: July 29, 2008 at 08:59 PM (#2881079)
DeRosa is a solid player.
   70. BeanoCook Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:00 PM (#2881086)
Braun's swing very much reminds me of Paul Molitor, but with an uppercut. Buy that?
   71. NTNgod Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:00 PM (#2881088)
He was kind of a scrub until he played in Texas. Odd path to break out at 30+.
   72. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:01 PM (#2881094)
Prince, what in the H#LL are you swinging at???

He was baiting you.

Sigh
   73. retro-shiite Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:02 PM (#2881098)
What are Brenly and Len talking about? Wasn't the infield fly rule in effect there?
   74. retro-shiite Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:02 PM (#2881101)
And they answer my question: need runners on first and second or the bases loaded. Did not know that.
   75. BeanoCook Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:03 PM (#2881106)
Z is showing me an ability to pitch that I have not seen before.
   76. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:03 PM (#2881108)
Great pitch.

But strike 2 has been a ball up til then
   77. davoarid Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:04 PM (#2881112)
Just a runner on first. As soon as I saw Fielder wasn't running, that was my first thought too.
   78. BeanoCook Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:04 PM (#2881113)
I do think Branyan's swing will play up to Z's pitching, oddly.
   79. retro-shiite Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:05 PM (#2881117)
Fontenot's definitely playing at the top of his range this year, but his minor league numbers showed a player with good on-base skills and good pop for a middle infielder.
   80. Moses Taylor didn't fall far from the awesome tree Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:05 PM (#2881120)
Z is showing me an ability to pitch that I have not seen before.

You obviously haven't been watching.
   81. NTNgod Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:06 PM (#2881125)
Zambrano was fortunate he missed the target way high on the 0-2 pitch. I couldn't believe where Soto had set the target - if he had actually THROWN it there, that would have been a bad idea.
   82. retro-shiite Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:06 PM (#2881126)
Z is showing me an ability to pitch that I have not seen before.

Z's matured as a pitcher in the last year or so, I think. His strikeouts are down quite a bit this year, but he's also walking fewer hitters, and seems generally to be more in control of things. So even without being as overpowering as he's been in the past, his ERA's still south of 3.
   83. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:08 PM (#2881129)
I wish Prince would stop smashing his bat into the ground and instead hit the baseball.

The team was woofing nonstop coming into this series and are getting their ears pinned back.

The objective fan in me is glad.

Win something before you talk.
   84. BeanoCook Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:08 PM (#2881130)
Lackey 0 hits through 7 v Boston.
   85. retro-shiite Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:08 PM (#2881132)
And there goes the bat. Heh.
   86. Moses Taylor didn't fall far from the awesome tree Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:08 PM (#2881133)
Seriously, Z. Calm the #### down.
   87. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:10 PM (#2881136)
And Ben overthrows again.

Does EVERYONE have a case of the yips???
   88. BeanoCook Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:11 PM (#2881141)
You obviously haven't been watching.


Well, I think #82 Retro summed it up. Z is a notorious stuff pitcher.

He has been throwing stuff up there with great movement for his entire career, racking up Ks and BBs. This year and tonight, he has shown a great ability to move the ball around and hit spots and attack hitters, keeping them off balance. He is pitching very well, not just overpowering.
   89. SouthSideRyan(CASEY'S GONE!!) Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:11 PM (#2881142)

You obviously haven't been watching.


You obviously aren't familiar with Beano.
   90. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:12 PM (#2881145)
Finally a Cub chased.....
   91. BeanoCook Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:13 PM (#2881158)
Boston being no-hit @ home thru 8. Talk about a statement by the Angels, trade for power, then *no-hit World Champs in Fenway. Lackey is underrated each year.

Thru 8.
   92. Moses Taylor didn't fall far from the awesome tree Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:13 PM (#2881159)
Well, I think #82 Retro summed it up. Z is a notorious stuff pitcher.

He has been throwing stuff up there with great movement for his entire career, racking up Ks and BBs. This year and tonight, he has shown a great ability to move the ball around and hit spots and attack hitters, keeping them off balance. He is pitching very well, not just overpowering.


My point is you're basing this on one start. He's had plenty of starts just like this one. The problem is that he mixes in bad starts. He's had fewer of those this year.
   93. BeanoCook Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:15 PM (#2881166)
This year and tonight


One start? No. But he has taken it to another level tonight. So yes, I am basing his taking his game to another level today off the game being played today.
   94. Moses Taylor didn't fall far from the awesome tree Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:15 PM (#2881167)
Ouch.
   95. BeanoCook Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:15 PM (#2881169)
Z has never showed the ability to locate like he has tonight. Hitting corners and mixing it up and down.
   96. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:16 PM (#2881170)
WHAT IS HE SWINGING AT?
   97. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:19 PM (#2881180)
Do NOT get pickef off!
   98. Moses Taylor didn't fall far from the awesome tree Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:19 PM (#2881183)
He most definitely has, just not very consistently from game to game. That's why Cubs fans have already overrated him. He was always a step down from the top level aces, but we've always considered him one of the best starters. This year, we might actually be right.
   99. Moses Taylor didn't fall far from the awesome tree Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:20 PM (#2881185)
already=always
   100. Moses Taylor didn't fall far from the awesome tree Posted: July 29, 2008 at 09:20 PM (#2881188)
That was sad, Ben.
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