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Friday, September 30, 2005

Chicago Cubs (78-81) at Houston Astros (87-72) - 8:05 PM EDT

CHC: Zambrano (14-6, 3.33)
HOU: Pettitte (17-9, 2.42)

The Cubs will attempt to spoil Houston’s postseason plans.

Sean McNally Posted: September 30, 2005 at 09:56 AM | 54 comment(s)
  Related News: Chi CubsHouston

Reader Comments and Retorts

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   1. Hendry's Wad of Cash (UCCF) Posted: September 30, 2005 at 11:05 AM (#1653755)
All in all, Zambrano's been pretty good this year. A little consistency would really help him out, but he's pretty clearly established himself as one of the better pitchers in the league at this point.

I may listen to this, but only to root for Matt Murton to keep playing well and Derrek Lee to get that 100th XBH. I think he's at 99 now, and with 3 in the bandbox, I predict he'll make it.
   2. Neil M Posted: September 30, 2005 at 11:37 AM (#1653841)
More unlikely than Lee getting 100 XBH this season, Jose Macias will be going for his 3rd straight lead-off walk. Personally, I'd rather see him walk off into the sunset.
   3. Pops Freshenmeyer Posted: September 30, 2005 at 11:43 AM (#1653853)
I still can't bring myself to watch this team on television.
   4. Biff, Red Sox Jinx Posted: September 30, 2005 at 11:45 AM (#1653857)
Damn, it'd be nice if the Red Sox still had Murton.
   5. Urban Faber Posted: September 30, 2005 at 11:49 AM (#1653862)
Personally, I'd rather see him walk off into the sunset.

That somehow reminds me of Oriole outfielder Pat Kelly telling Earl Weaver about walking with the Lord and Weaver replying "I'd rather see you walk with the bases loaded."
   6. 1k5v3L Posted: September 30, 2005 at 11:49 AM (#1653864)
Where would he play, Biff? He's pretty much limited to left field, and they've got Manny there. He's a guy with nice upside, but he would've been a trade bait if he were still on the Sox...
   7. Sweet Posted: September 30, 2005 at 12:49 PM (#1654036)
It's a dead heat --

Neifi OPS: .670
Lee SLG: .670

In other races, Murton has pretty much locked up the "Murton VORP vs. all other OF VORP" battle, and still has an outside chance to catch Burnitz --

Murton VORP: 14.9
Burnitz VORP: 16.3

Stay tuned . . . . or not.
   8. Neil M Posted: September 30, 2005 at 04:03 PM (#1654515)
He's pretty much limited to left field,

Although I'd say that his arm would confirm that statement, Murton has played RF at AA and has played CF, at least in a late inning reshuffle, at AAA.
   9. Hendry's Wad of Cash (UCCF) Posted: September 30, 2005 at 04:19 PM (#1654569)
Did we see the discussion in the Dugout that Nomar would like to return to the Cubs in 2006, perhaps in LF? I kind of like that idea -- he's hit the ball pretty well since coming back from injury.

Shift Murton to RF and leave Patterson in the middle and shade him toward LF to help out Nomar. Outside of Brian Giles, it's hard to see a better offensive option of LF than Nomar on the market this winter (unless we're talking a trade).
   10. Sweet Posted: September 30, 2005 at 04:54 PM (#1654696)
it's hard to see a better offensive option of LF than Nomar on the market this winter

The OF free-agent crop is incredibly thin, but I'm not convinced that Nomar is the right fit for the Cubs' outfield needs.

Nomar's yearly OPS figures since his serious 2001 injury:

2002 -- .880 (635 AB)
2003 -- .869 (658 AB)
2004 -- ~.840 (311 AB)
2005 -- .782 (218 AB)

PECOTA and ZIPS know better than I, but I'm thinking an .850 OPS is about the top of the projection range and .800 is going to be closer to the mean. Throw in a significant chance of injury and defense that will likely be average at best, and the Cubs might do well to look elsewhere. All that aside, I'd love to have a healthy, happy, productive Nomar protecting the ivy. He's just fun to watch.

So tough to know what to do. Giles is great but old, Furcal is very good but could block a decent prospect, the back end of the rotation is a little ragged but not so much so that spending big on a starter makes much sense, the bullpen is thin but a crapshoot in any event, etc. Too bad it's not last year (with Drew, Beltran, etc. on the market) or next year, when we'll know with much more certainty whether Pie and Sing are for real. I really fear that the Cubs will sign Jacque Jones and/or Preston Wilson to multi-year deals.
   11. Pops Freshenmeyer Posted: September 30, 2005 at 05:21 PM (#1654772)
Outside of Brian Giles, it's hard to see a better offensive option of LF than Nomar on the market this winter (unless we're talking a trade).

I'm surprised that they aren't thinking RF with his good arm and LF being the toughest position to learn and all.

I think the best you could hope for from Nomar is league average. That's a big improvement on a lot of candidates the Cubs are probably considering but I'm not sure it's the right direction.

For one thing, Nomar's salary will certainly outstrip his contribution from the corner OF due to the rep he built as a star by slugging at shortstop. This isn't a terrible idea if the Cubs don't have a better place to spend cash because of the limited options but I don't see how it could be an efficient use of resources.
   12. Neil M Posted: September 30, 2005 at 05:23 PM (#1654779)
The OF free-agent crop is incredibly thin,

For sure. This year, Jim Hendry probably has more disposable cash than any Cubs GM has had before. He also has a number of marginal trading chips - Mitre, Wellemeyer, Hill (?), Patterson come to mind. Hendry has to look beyond the FA market and do some creative trading.

My feeling about Nomar is probably fairly close to that of most Cubs fans - he's a man without a position and, though the upside might be terrific, we've already been bitten twice with no reason not to think that it wouldn't happen again. I think the Cubs have to pass on him.

I noted that Hendry was talking up Felix Pie yesterday, but I suspect that that was a final warning shot across Corey's bows rather than any statement of intent.

I don't want Burnitz back. I hate the thought of Preston Wilson. I do fear that we'll see Jaque Jones next year.

All in all, it's a sorry mess. With the money available and the positions to be filled, this should be the most interesting hot stove season in years. Instead, it could be a bigger nightmare than this season has been.
   13. Pops Freshenmeyer Posted: September 30, 2005 at 05:24 PM (#1654783)
Furcal is very good but could block a decent prospect

I'm encouraged by Cedeno's play but he's not someone I would worry about blocking with a star player. I see Ronnie as something short of a sure fire major leaguer as of right now. Of course, Cedeno's going to be blocked by a veteran whether or not the Cubs sign Furcal.

Does anyone have an opinion on the relative defensive abilities of Cedeno and Furcal? Who would be better to move to 2B if they're both on the roster?
   14. Pops Freshenmeyer Posted: September 30, 2005 at 05:27 PM (#1654801)
I do fear that we'll see Jaque Jones next year.

As I see it, this is the most likely scenario for the OF "fix."
   15. Sweet Posted: September 30, 2005 at 05:40 PM (#1654844)
If the Cubs do sign Furcal, they might also consider a four-headed Cedeno-Garciaparra-Walker-Murton monster (Cedeniapawalton?) manning second base and the corner OF slots. That is, Cedeno and Walker would man second base, Walker and Garciaparra would man left field, and Murton and Garciaparra would man right field.

No telling whether Walker and Garciaparra would go for that. And it might not even be a good idea. But I like the idea of actual redundancy at a few positions, instead of the precipitous drop-off from starter to reserve that the Cubs have employed the last few years.
   16. Neil M Posted: September 30, 2005 at 05:42 PM (#1654856)
I'm encouraged by Cedeno's play but he's not someone I would worry about blocking with a star player.

While I kind of concur with your view, it's worth bearing in mind that the club has consistently rated Cedeno higher than observers have. Consider, too, Todd Walker's comments the other day when talking about his own future - 'They have to play Ronnie'.

I suspect, or at least hope, that Cedeno might be rather better than we've had an opportunity to see so far. In the few opportunities he's had to show it, he definitely has shown a rifle of an arm, he looks to me to have good range and a good glove. I don't know whether the bat can do the job consistently, but I've seen enough not to write off his possible upside.
   17. 1k5v3L Posted: September 30, 2005 at 05:43 PM (#1654862)
Why is Nomar so keen on remaining in CHN, as far as even playing LF for the Cubs? I mean, some team out there will offer him an incentive rich contract to play SS next year. I don't understand it...
   18. Neil M Posted: September 30, 2005 at 05:56 PM (#1654906)
I read enough talk to be pretty well convinced that Rothschild is to be this year's sacrifical lamb from the coaching staff. I saw mention somewhere today that there is talk of promoting the Iowa pitching coach (name escapes me and I'm too lazy to check).

Leaving aside the advisability of removing one of the few non-cronies from Dusty's staff, is there not a case for dumping either Clines or Matthews and bringing up Von Joshua to be the hitting coach? In limited time, Murton, Cedeno and even Theriot have shown better discipline than almost all of the establishd players.
   19. 1k5v3L Posted: September 30, 2005 at 06:02 PM (#1654927)
Who is Theriot?!
   20. Pops Freshenmeyer Posted: September 30, 2005 at 06:05 PM (#1654941)
Who is Theriot?!

AAAA'er

I read enough talk to be pretty well convinced that Rothschild is to be this year's sacrifical lamb from the coaching staff.

Glad they're identifying the problem. That $60 million offense may fail to score 700 runs but the pitching coach is holding the team back.
   21. 1k5v3L Posted: September 30, 2005 at 06:16 PM (#1654969)
Who is Theriot?!

AAAA'er


Who?!
   22. Pops Freshenmeyer Posted: September 30, 2005 at 06:21 PM (#1654990)
Theriot is a nothing prospect who is bound to be a quadruple A type.

Here's his page from the baseball cube.
   23. 1k5v3L Posted: September 30, 2005 at 06:23 PM (#1654998)
For a long time, I thought that The Riot was Macias's nickname.
   24. retro-shiite Posted: September 30, 2005 at 06:24 PM (#1655003)
Shiette gets credit for coming up with the nickname "Ryan the Riot."
   25. 1k5v3L Posted: September 30, 2005 at 06:25 PM (#1655004)
As in, Macias is such a joke at the plate, he is The Riot to watch...
   26. Pops Freshenmeyer Posted: September 30, 2005 at 06:25 PM (#1655006)
Shiette gets credit for coming up with the nickname "Ryan the Riot."

Quiet Theriot?
   27. Neil M Posted: September 30, 2005 at 06:28 PM (#1655016)
Theriot, like Scott McLain, is one of these guys who lurk at the bottom of the depth chart. He was called up when Cedeno got hurt. If it had been earlier in the year, the Cubs would have tracked down another Enrique or Rey-Rey to fill the void.

In 10 years time. Theriot will be a proven veteran getting entirely too much playing time for Dusty's D-Backs.
   28. 1k5v3L Posted: September 30, 2005 at 06:31 PM (#1655025)
Ah, how quickly the Cubs fans have grown out of love with Dusty. I remember the honeymoon, when he was the man to lead them to the promised land...

The Tribune is too cheap to cut him, and no other team will take his overpriced arse off the Cubbies' hands. So he'll continue to amaze all of Cubdom...
   29. 1k5v3L Posted: September 30, 2005 at 06:37 PM (#1655038)
So, has anyone noticed that Dempster is sporting a really nice 2.74 GB/FB ratio this year, with a very low 0.39HR/9IP rate, and 8.6K/9IP? Very solid stats.

He's a very good bet to have a few very good years as a closer if he can continue to maintain the GB/FB and HR/9 rates; and I see no reason why he will not.
   30. Neil M Posted: September 30, 2005 at 06:44 PM (#1655044)
Dempter still walks a few too many, but does have a sub-2.00 ERa as a reliever. Hasn't given up a homer since the end of May, I think. Credit Hendry for spotting the potential. Debit Baker for ignoring his GM at the start of the season.
   31. Pops Freshenmeyer Posted: September 30, 2005 at 06:45 PM (#1655046)
Debit Baker for ignoring his GM at the start of the season.

He really lost both ways by putting Glendon in the pen.
   32. Neil M Posted: September 30, 2005 at 06:48 PM (#1655049)
He really lost both ways by putting Glendon in the pen.

Particularly when he already had Ohman and Remlinger (yeah, I know about his splits, but Dusty didn't seem to care) as lefty options.
   33. Neil M Posted: September 30, 2005 at 06:58 PM (#1655065)
A note on last night's game.

It marked the 4th time in the last 3 years that Charles Gipson has appeared against the Cubs. Each time, he has come in as a PR. In 3 of the 4 games, he has been nailed on the base-paths. That has to merit some sort of award for futility.
   34. Neil M Posted: September 30, 2005 at 07:03 PM (#1655074)
Theriot
Perez
Lee
Nomar
Murton
Burnitz
Barrett
Patterson
Zambrano
   35. Pops Freshenmeyer Posted: September 30, 2005 at 07:21 PM (#1655107)
That has to merit some sort of award for futility.

The Moises Alou Lifetime Achievement Award for Lack of Excellence on the Base Paths
   36. Neil M Posted: September 30, 2005 at 07:36 PM (#1655135)
So what would be the popular nickname for the award?

A Moany?

Would Gipson be a three-time Alouser?
   37. Cabbage Posted: September 30, 2005 at 07:38 PM (#1655139)
The Nomar plays everywhere option would be nice. As would getting Milton Bradley. C'mon, we know he's available!

or would the racist media give him too much flak?


that question is actually semi-serious.
   38. Cabbage Posted: September 30, 2005 at 07:41 PM (#1655145)
So what would be the popular nickname for the award?


"Holy Moses!"

"Nephew of JESUS!"
   39. Moses Taylor didn't fall far from the awesome tree Posted: September 30, 2005 at 08:05 PM (#1655195)
"Holy Moses!"

You rang?
   40. Pops Freshenmeyer Posted: September 30, 2005 at 08:45 PM (#1655249)
So what would be the popular nickname for the award?

The Pee-Body
   41. Neil M Posted: September 30, 2005 at 08:50 PM (#1655256)
The Pee-Body

We have a winner!
   42. Neil M Posted: September 30, 2005 at 09:12 PM (#1655315)
FSN Houston are a little arbitrary with their numbers but, based on a minimum of 425 ABs, Corey is about to post the lowest BA by a Cub since 1940.
   43. 100 Years is Nothing Posted: September 30, 2005 at 09:51 PM (#1655398)
Didn't Kessinger hit something like .203 a couple years?
   44. Neil M Posted: September 30, 2005 at 09:57 PM (#1655410)
One season of .201, but only 300+ appearances. Otherwise, comfortably higher than Corey.
   45. Meatwad Posted: September 30, 2005 at 10:08 PM (#1655441)
and they take the lead, philly may end up loving us
   46. Johnny Zen Posted: September 30, 2005 at 10:26 PM (#1655472)
Definitely feeling the love from Philly
   47. Johnny Zen Posted: September 30, 2005 at 10:27 PM (#1655476)
No!
   48. PatrickInTheWoods, Apostate Posted: September 30, 2005 at 10:33 PM (#1655483)
Yes!
   49. Johnny Zen Posted: September 30, 2005 at 10:37 PM (#1655487)
At this moment, Ryan Dempster is the most important person in the universe.
   50. Johnny Zen Posted: September 30, 2005 at 10:46 PM (#1655506)
Alive.
   51. PatrickInTheWoods, Apostate Posted: September 30, 2005 at 10:52 PM (#1655509)
At this monet, Ryan Dempster is greatest person in the universe.
   52. PatrickInTheWoods, Apostate Posted: September 30, 2005 at 10:53 PM (#1655513)
Heh, moment.
   53. Hendry's Wad of Cash (UCCF) Posted: October 01, 2005 at 12:47 AM (#1655649)
I watched the scores for this game trickle by on the crawl:

1-0 Houston
1-1
2-1 Cubs (8th)
3-2 Houston (8th)
3-3 (9th)
4-3 Cubs (9th)

And never once was I tempted to turn on the game. I was perfectly content watching BOS-NYY and then CHA-CLE (which was the ESPN game here).

I'll take delight if the Cubs knock the Astros out of it (or at least into a playoff), but it's not enough to make me pay real attention.
   54. gfoxcook Posted: October 22, 2005 at 01:17 AM (#1697648)
#28: Ah, how quickly the Cubs fans have grown out of love with Dusty. I remember the honeymoon, when he was the man to lead them to the promised land...

I'm not a Cubs fan... but I never understood why they were in love with Dusty to begin with, but... oh well.

In any event... One day after a 3-2 loss, a 4-3 loss results... horrible. I wouldn't say Houston was in a panic or anything like that (hell, there'd been much worse moments in the earlier portions of the season)... but it wasn't fun, let's just say that.

Me and the guys at work who follow the Astros... well, we certainly had some things to talk about that Friday (ouch with more ouch on the way shortly) and then Monday after the weekend came along and "made everything all better." heh.
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