BBTF's Game Chatter Discussion :: San Diego Padres (37-58) @ St. Louis Cardinals (53-43), Thursday, July 17, 2008, 8:15pm

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Thursday, July 17, 2008

San Diego Padres (37-58) @ St. Louis Cardinals (53-43), Thursday, July 17, 2008, 8:15pm

SDP: Jake Peavy (27, RHP, 7-5, 2.47)
STL: Kyle Lohse (29, RHP, 11-2, 3.39)

The Primer Chimp Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:00 AM | 103 comment(s)
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1. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 07:27 PM (#2862753)

Saw John Gall in the minor league all star game, was kinda surprised, thought he went to Japan, but it looks like he's been playing in the Braves minor leagues, surprising because they sent Franceour down, if Gall was available it's surprising they didn't bring him up then.

2. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 07:35 PM (#2862778)

they are interviewing Barden right now, is it possible that he could play second base in the majors?

3. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 07:37 PM (#2862783)

Ok looking at Bardens numbers he plays a lot of shortstop in the minors, just bring him up now and release Izturis.

4. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 07:43 PM (#2862789)

Al is rambling and not answering the question (which is the biggest needs for the Cardinals)

The biggest need is very apparent, we need a lefty reliever (I have a fantasy of us making a trade with the Royals for Mahay and Grudz)

5. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:03 PM (#2862820)

Mahay and Grudz would be great. As long as we don't do anything stupid, like trading Rasmus for the X-man, I'm ok with some moves.

6. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:15 PM (#2862845)

Shockingly, this is a good pitching matchup.

Oh look, FSN missed the first pitch - and first out! That never happens!

7. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:18 PM (#2862851)

I've been looking at potential trades that I feel the team could make that wouldn't cost a lot. I imagine Mahay is a free agent at the end of the season, I think Grudz is also so they shouldn't cost much. I figure that we give them Kennedy (pay his remaining contract) and one of our excess minor league outfielders (Stavinoha is my guess) and maybe Reyes (but that actually may be more than they would ask to be honest)

8. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:18 PM (#2862852)

Everytime I think the Cardinals' lineup sucks, I look at the NL West lineups. They make me feel better.

9. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:19 PM (#2862854)

Reyes is too much in that package. I think dumping Kennedy and a prospect would be fair, the Royals need bats.

10. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:20 PM (#2862858)

Dan not only thinks the ASG is a positive economic impact on STL, he thinks Ballpark Village will be ready to go. Oh, Dan.

11. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:23 PM (#2862864)

#### me, that was a weak run.

12. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:24 PM (#2862870)

It depends on whether or not Grudz is worth a compensation pick in that trade. Also you have to consider other teams should be pursuing Mahay. I do think Reyes is too much but I imagine a trade for those two would require that we send three players in their direction, probably one has to be an arm.

13. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:25 PM (#2862873)

why wouldn't the all star game be a positive economic impact?

I understand that sports teams aren't positive impact in that it just reshuffles the entertainment money around, but an event is almost always a positive financial impact because it brings in out of towners money.

14. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:26 PM (#2862876)

Ok, that was a surprisingly bad inning. Lohse looks a little rusty. Let's hope they remembered how to hit.

15. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:29 PM (#2862881)

Study on Super Bowl impact.

Basically, the estimate is always high, and the actual impact is much lower. So the ASG benefit will be marginal, since most of the attendence is local.

16. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:31 PM (#2862889)

Now THAT was lucky. Miles is carrying around a ####### horseshoe this year.

17. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:31 PM (#2862891)

I went to a game last year that Peavy started against the Cards. It was ugly.

18. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:33 PM (#2862895)

In my world this is the cardinal lineup august 30th.

C Yadier
1b Albert Pujols
2b Grudz
SS Barden (in a truly perfect world it's Polanco)
3b Glaus
RF Schumaker
CF Ankiel
LF Ludwick (Bonds instead of Schumaker in a truly perfect world)

Bench pretty much the same, just no Duncan or Izturis.

Rotation
SP Carpenter
SP Wainwright
SP Lohse
SP Wellemeyer
SP Looper

Bullpen
Kinney, Mcclellan, Springer, Bradford, Mahay, Garcia, and Franklin.
(notice no Isringhausen either)

19. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:37 PM (#2862905)

I don't think Polanco can still play SS.

20. Bicycle RepairMan Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:37 PM (#2862907)

Gall is with the Marlins, not the Braves.

21. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:39 PM (#2862910)

anyone that would believe $300mil+ economic boost from just the superbowl should be labeled as an idiot. I think that $50 mil is good but probably generous and $25mil for an all star should be a safe assumption. Anything more than that is absurd.

22. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:41 PM (#2862912)

don't ask me where I got Braves from, I guess I just lump all those NL east teams into one batch.

I wasn't too sure about Polanco being able to play shortstop, but him and Grudz are about the only two I found during my search that I imagine could be available and would be affordable and could play a passable shortstop.

23. Bicycle RepairMan Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:44 PM (#2862915)

Ask the A's for Mark Ellis. They seem to be trading everyone with more than 1 yr service time.

24. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:44 PM (#2862918)

also on that list I wouldn't be against dumping Looper for a bettter pitcher if one is available.

25. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:45 PM (#2862922)

tied game off a blast by Glaus

26. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:45 PM (#2862925)

Ellis would be great. I think we're stuck with Looper.

Speaking of great trades, that Glaus trade was awesome!

27. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:46 PM (#2862927)

problem with Ellis is that I don't want the Cardinals to trade with Beane, the Cardinals will somehow give up something actually good that according to everyone is an overpay.

28. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:48 PM (#2862934)

I don't know, opinion here was quite anti-Beane on the Harden trade.

29. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:52 PM (#2862941)

I'm assuming we are stuck with Looper and he's been an acceptable fifth starter, (better than I ever imagined he would be) but if we chould get say Tim Redding, Odalis Perez, Jeremy Guthrie, Jake Westbrook etc... then go for it)

30. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:52 PM (#2862942)

Lohse gives it right back. He looks off.

31. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:54 PM (#2862947)

I don't know, opinion here was quite anti-Beane on the Harden trade

really? I think I was the only one who defended the trade for Mulder, even though I was upset that we included both Calero and Barton (when Beane insisted on Barton, Walt should have pulled Calero off the table) Almost everyone here knew Mulder was done and attacked the trade, I was slightly negative to it, but defended the thinking.

32. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:55 PM (#2862954)

Lohse gives it right back. He looks off.

agreed, he doesn't look too good and seems to be laboring.

33. Bicycle RepairMan Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:56 PM (#2862959)

Should check the TO thread on it. I remember defending the trade saying the Cards had a shot at the WS with Mulder, even if they slightly overpaid.
It worked out, but not quite the way I imagined it !!

34. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:57 PM (#2862963)

We need Odalis Perez to be on another team so Pujols can hit against him.

The Mulder trade was a disaster, but I was talking about Harden. Beane doesn't win all the time.

35. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:57 PM (#2862965)

nice play, too bad the tv announcers didn't notice it happening because they want to interview a non-sport event.

36. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 08:59 PM (#2862969)

Beane doesn't win all the time

agreed, just against the Cardinals. I mean the Mulder trade bothered me because somehow Walt forgot he included Calero when Beane insisted on Barton. That was the non-sensical part of the trade that always bothered me. I have no problem giving up Barton and Haren or Haren and Calero it's the inclusion of all three that bothered me the most.

37. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:07 PM (#2862989)

Lohse...all star snub. I'm getting tired of hearing that one. Sorry but he wasn't a snub. there were probably three pitchers ahead of him that didn't make the game.

38. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:08 PM (#2862991)

####### great play by Miles. Didn't think he had a chance on that one.

and the greates commercial of all time is on the air.

39. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:08 PM (#2862992)

Miles with a nice play. Maybe Ellis is not needed.

40. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:13 PM (#2863007)

Rick the Slick!!

41. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:13 PM (#2863008)

Miles can play shortstop we still need a secondbaseman.

My goals in order
1. lefty reliever
2. reliever
3. get rid of Izturis
4. get rid of Kennedy/Brendan Ryan(to minors)
5. get rid of Duncan

Ankiel quickly ties the game back up.

42. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:14 PM (#2863009)

Glaus can't be shown up by the kid.

43. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:14 PM (#2863011)

And Glaus! Back to back!

44. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:15 PM (#2863014)

remember in the first month of the season it seemed like we would never hit a homerun

45. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:16 PM (#2863020)

any chance Duncan makes contact?

46. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:17 PM (#2863021)

Duncan ALMOST makes it 3 in a row. But no.

47. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:20 PM (#2863026)

where are the cardinals at for season for lob? I imagine we have fallen off the record pace finally.

48. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:23 PM (#2863033)

I love the split stat option on bb-reference, it has a split that is the first time I've seen it, but I love it last 365.

for Ankiel. .276 .338 .537 .874, 130 games, 31 hr, 89 rbi, 84 runs.

49. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:26 PM (#2863040)

Cards are way off the record pace now, the OBP has fallen due to no one taking a BB anymore, and the SLG has increased enough to clear some runners.

50. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:26 PM (#2863042)

That's a pretty good line for Rick.

51. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:27 PM (#2863044)

Ludwicks last 365. .282 .368 .546 .913, 28hr, 94rbi, 86 runs, 156 games.

nice play bad guys.

52. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:28 PM (#2863050)

A's just traded Blanton to the Phils for 3 prospects.

53. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:29 PM (#2863052)

Cards are way off the record pace now, the OBP has fallen due to no one taking a BB anymore, and the SLG has increased enough to clear some runners.

Yep, noticed this when looking at Izturis, he has 19 walks this season, and it seems like he's been at 19 since june. he's gotten 2 walks since may 25th, had zero in June.

54. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:29 PM (#2863055)

oh, forgot to say that about blanton it was in another thread earlier. I didn't know who they got in return for Blanton but knew about the trade

55. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:31 PM (#2863061)

Yeah, I just saw the Blanton thread. It doesn't look like the Phils gave up anyone too good, their best prospect is not on the list.

56. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:34 PM (#2863070)

Lohse is looking a little better as the game goes on, hopefully it was just rust.

57. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:35 PM (#2863071)

baseball prospectus liked Cardenas a little (think Ray Durham minus the stolen bases). Spencer doesn't get a writeup, and best name for a pitcher, Outman they were ambivalent towards but do seem to think if he gains control that he would be a good pitcher.

58. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:39 PM (#2863077)

Outman is a great name. If he's a young Ray Durham, that's a pretty good player for Blanton, who may be better in the NL but is probably an innings-eater. Of course, the Phils rotation is not good.

59. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:40 PM (#2863080)

Albert finally gets a halfway decent strike, puts it through the hole for a hit.

60. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:41 PM (#2863084)

note those reviews were prior to the season, on the trade thread it appears Outman has regressed, Spencer is still a nobody but Cardenas is considered the "real deal".

61. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:41 PM (#2863085)

Albert has a 2:1 BB/K ratio. That is good.

Oh Al, no one who hits 30 HRs in the minor was kept down for too many Ks. Power hitters (almost) always K a lot! Argh.

62. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:43 PM (#2863086)

I missed that, who was he talking about.

63. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:43 PM (#2863090)

have to agree with the announcer, that was a tough pitch not to swing at.

64. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:44 PM (#2863093)

catcher is trying to do the Atlanta thing and move the strike zone out further, aint working.

65. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:47 PM (#2863103)

This is not a good matchup for Duncan.

66. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:48 PM (#2863107)

This is not a good matchup for Duncan.

you mean playing major league baseball (figured I would sound like the stltoday contigent)

67. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:49 PM (#2863110)

Al was complimenting Albert's low K total, insinuating that back in his day, a lot of Ks would keep you out of the show regardless of how good a hitter you were. Al obviously does not realize that the list of low-K power hitters in the ML today is:

1. Albert Pujols

And the historic list of low-K power hitters is:

1. Joe Dimaggio
2. Albert Pujols

68. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:50 PM (#2863111)

you mean playing major league baseball

I laughed.

69. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:51 PM (#2863113)

Yep, I mean Reggie Jackson, Dave Kingman or Greg Luzinski didn't play during Al's days.

70. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:54 PM (#2863124)

how the #### do you give the bullpen a c?

71. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:55 PM (#2863125)

Peavy has 2 freakin' hits. Oh well, two out. Assuming Lohse gets an out here, that's 7 IP, 2 ER, which is better than I would have expected at the outset of this game.

72. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:55 PM (#2863126)

I had my own grades the bullpen got a D-, Starters got a B- (and I was probably being a tad generous) but no way does the bullpen get any passing grade.

73. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:55 PM (#2863128)

Yeah, the bullpen deserves much worse than a C. D-, I would think.

74. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:56 PM (#2863133)

Starters get a B, they've done well considering.

75. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:01 PM (#2863152)

it depends on how you grade, relative to baseball or expectations. Originally I was giving them a B+ but then I realized it was because of how I perceived the team coming in, when I looked more at it I realized that we had a 4.13 era which was good for 7th in the nl(league average for starters is 4.27) and figured that was worth a B-.

76. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:01 PM (#2863154)

Mather with a solo hr....who needs baserunners I guess.

77. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:01 PM (#2863155)

Mather goes deep - has Peavy ever allowed 4 HRs in a game before tonight?

78. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:04 PM (#2863166)

Yes.

79. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:04 PM (#2863167)

it looks like in 2003 he allowed 4 hr on jul 9th against arizona.

80. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:05 PM (#2863168)

guess you beat me to it... love bb-ref

81. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:05 PM (#2863171)

Liriano needs to quit his whining.

82. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:07 PM (#2863178)

Everytime I see Miles hit the ball in the air, I die a little inside.

83. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:09 PM (#2863180)

I was afraid you were going to say something like everytime I see Miles hit the ball over his head you die a little, then I realized that this would include two foot hoppers.

84. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:10 PM (#2863182)

just say no to villone.

another goal I forgot to list, get rid of Villone.

85. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:10 PM (#2863184)

A 2-time All-Star Scott Cooper reference!

86. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:13 PM (#2863192)

Villone and Flores both need to go, they are killing me. Villone at least has shown a slight ability to get out lefties, but TLR thinks he is the long man out of the pen. Flores is just a ticking bomb at this point, hopefully his rehab is long.

What?!?! McClellan is one of our only good relievers, and TLR is pulling him for Villone, AFTER HE JUST PITCHED TO A LEFTY?!!??!?!?!?!?

This is incomprehensible.

87. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:15 PM (#2863205)

Of course, Villone Ks him on 4 pitches. That's how that works.

88. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:15 PM (#2863206)

ok, Villone was successful there.

89. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:16 PM (#2863210)

I think TLR doesn't want to overexpose McClellan. I'm always a fan of using your worse possible relievers in the first game of a series.

90. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:17 PM (#2863213)

for the record that comment wasn't sarcastic.

91. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:18 PM (#2863216)

So you're all for Franklin in the 9th, huh.

92. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:20 PM (#2863221)

I'm not a fan of using your closer in the first game of a series if you can avoid it.

93. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:25 PM (#2863231)

damn, great catch.

94. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:25 PM (#2863232)

Izzy then? Someone's got to pitch. And you could make a case for a lot of guys being the worst reliever.

Wow, nice catch by Gerut.

95. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:28 PM (#2863239)

Bad start for Franklin.

96. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:30 PM (#2863243)

I'm fine with Issy pitching, but it's a 'save' situation so you almost have to use your closer.

97. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:31 PM (#2863250)

REALLY bad start for Franklin. I am amazingly not surprised.

98. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:33 PM (#2863254)

is he trying to even things up for Lohse with the other hard luck pitchers on the team?

99. Guts Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:35 PM (#2863272)

Nice of the Pads to help Franklin out by sending this guy up to PH.

100. cardsfanboy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:37 PM (#2863279)

you can tell Issy helped mentor Franklin into becoming a closer

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