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Sunday, October 21, 2007

ajc: Super-agent Scott Boras is king of the squeeze play (RR)

Move over Don Buchwald…it’s Super-Agent Scott Boras!

Many think Boras has gone too far.

“I think when he starts talking about Andruw Jones being worth — what, $20 million-plus for [six] years? — I think that that’s utterly preposterous,” said baseball economist Andrew Zimbalist, a professor at Smith College.

The Braves stopped laughing long ago. Team President John Schuerholz has termed Jones’ projected price tag “ridiculous and obnoxious.” Schuerholz declined to comment for this article, saying, “I’ve got way more important things to do.”

...His critics have accused him of inflating player values by asserting interest from unspecified teams when negotiations begin to warm up. All the better to massage the agent’s 5 percent cut of every contract, those detractors say.

Boras says he welcomes all questions.

“My attitude is, I want fairness,” he said. “If you can give us information to demonstrate what we think is incorrect, please do.”

Repoz Posted: October 21, 2007 at 08:03 PM | 42 comment(s) | Login to Bookmark
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1. scareduck Posted: October 21, 2007 at 08:21 PM (#2586549)

"fairness" == "what I'm demanding and not a dime less".

2. Teheran's Uranium Enriched Missiles Posted: October 21, 2007 at 08:24 PM (#2586552)

squeeze play huh. Has he rectified the count yet?

3. Buster Olney the Lonely Posted: October 21, 2007 at 08:31 PM (#2586556)

Superagent Don Buchwald! A Stern reference!

4. Shredder Posted: October 21, 2007 at 08:39 PM (#2586562)

Funny how these articles about what a great agent Boras is never mention the deal he got for Jered Weaver, which was pretty much the same deal that the Angels had offered months ahead of time. In other words, his hardball tactics did nothing for his client except slow down his development by about 8 months. Well done, Scott.

5. Hal Chase Headley Lamarr Hoyt Wilhelm (ACE1242) Posted: October 21, 2007 at 08:42 PM (#2586564)

#2 -- Danny Sprung, David Nieporent, & I (in about that order) bow in your general direction.

6. Kyle S Posted: October 21, 2007 at 08:43 PM (#2586565)

I don't understand why Schuerholz acts like this with Boras. No reason to cop the attitude - just tell him his number is too high and to call back with a more reasonable number. Sheesh.

7. Teheran's Uranium Enriched Missiles Posted: October 21, 2007 at 08:48 PM (#2586570)

#2 -- Danny Sprung, David Nieporent, & I (in about that order) bow in your general direction.

funny that. Seen the first of those names on BBO commentating on some matches. Didn't think there were many people left who pro-actively enjoyed both games.

8. Squash Posted: October 21, 2007 at 08:49 PM (#2586573)

I thought the agent's cut was 3% ... am I wrong?

9. ellsbury my heart at wounded knee Posted: October 21, 2007 at 08:50 PM (#2586574)

I don't understand why Schuerholz acts like this with Boras. No reason to cop the attitude - just tell him his number is too high and to call back with a more reasonable number. Sheesh.

I don't understand either. If a GM doesn't want to pay that much for a player, they don't have to. I get the sense that Boras could be frustrating to negotiate with because he doesn't change his demands until he absolutely has to at the last minute, and may be "creative" in how he talks about offers from other teams, but he's their rep. That's what he's paid to do.

10. flournoy Posted: October 21, 2007 at 08:52 PM (#2586575)

Why is Scott Boras head and shoulders above other agents? Can't other agents use the same negotiation tactics?

11. Squash Posted: October 21, 2007 at 09:00 PM (#2586580)

Why is Scott Boras head and shoulders above other agents? Can't other agents use the same negotiation tactics?

In my experience, the people who are best in negotiations are those that truly believe what they're saying, or at least are able to convince themselves they believe it. I'm betting that Boras falls into the latter. There's a certain amount of shamelessness (I mean that in a good way) required to be able to do that, and not all people have it. I personally don't - I'm not the best negotiator.

12. joker24 Posted: October 21, 2007 at 09:00 PM (#2586581)

I thought the agent's cut was 3% ... am I wrong?

Boras takes 5% from everything I've ever read. It's not like he doesn't earn it.

13. Teheran's Uranium Enriched Missiles Posted: October 21, 2007 at 09:05 PM (#2586586)

In my experience, the people who are best in negotiations are those that truly believe what they're saying, or at least are able to convince themselves they believe it. I'm betting that Boras falls into the latter.

He has proven it with his actions in the past ( Harrington, Drew and Drew, Weaver ). So certain GMs might be wary of calling his bluff

14. Squash Posted: October 21, 2007 at 09:06 PM (#2586588)

Boras takes 5% from everything I've ever read. It's not like he doesn't earn it

Doubtless he does, but it's not up to him - agency fees in all fields are capped by law, state law I believe.

15. Hal Chase Headley Lamarr Hoyt Wilhelm (ACE1242) Posted: October 21, 2007 at 09:28 PM (#2586606)

#7 -- what's your BBO handle? There, as here, I'm ACE1242.

16. Crispix Attacks Posted: October 21, 2007 at 09:30 PM (#2586608)

Boras takes 5% from everything I've ever read.

I hope he at least lets you finish reading first.

17. bob gaj Posted: October 21, 2007 at 09:37 PM (#2586611)

i don't play online, and have zero master points, but i still get my b. bulletin every month, as i have for at least 10 years.

i think the last time i played in a tourney was at nyu in the mid 90s...

18. Keith Law Posted: October 21, 2007 at 09:47 PM (#2586624)

His critics have accused him of inflating player values by asserting interest from unspecified teams when negotiations begin to warm up. All the better to massage the agent’s 5 percent cut of every contract, those detractors say.

Right, so better to offer unverified criticisms from unspecified detractors.

19. Teheran's Uranium Enriched Missiles Posted: October 21, 2007 at 09:53 PM (#2586628)

#7 -- what's your BBO handle? There, as here, I'm ACE1242.

one of my old handles, godot79.

i think the last time i played in a tourney was at nyu in the mid 90s...

I am impressed you managed to wean yourself away from the game. I waste entirely too much time on it :(

20. flournoy Posted: October 21, 2007 at 10:05 PM (#2586643)

In my experience, the people who are best in negotiations are those that truly believe what they're saying, or at least are able to convince themselves they believe it. I'm betting that Boras falls into the latter. There's a certain amount of shamelessness (I mean that in a good way) required to be able to do that, and not all people have it.

That's a good point, and it's undoubtedly true. But it seems odd to me that no other agent, to my knowledge, is considered in Scott Boras' ilk. He's Super-Agent Scott Boras, and everyone else is just "the rest of them." There are plenty of excellent negotiators. Surely one of them has noticed that there's probably room in baseball for another Super-Agent or two? There's a lot of money to be made...

21. flournoy Posted: October 21, 2007 at 10:11 PM (#2586650)

What I'm trying to say, I suppose, is that I don't think what Scott Boras does is so prohibitively difficult that nobody else could do it. I imagine that he hires a team of experts (some of whom are probably not unlike a good number of posters here) to formulate cases for his players. His negotiating tactics are not secret; anybody could pick up on them. What's left is his knowledge base, his negotiating ability, and his reputation. The first two could be acquired by the right person, and the reputation would follow suit after some success.

22. flournoy Posted: October 21, 2007 at 10:13 PM (#2586655)

Now that I think some more about this... how would one break into the player agent business? Hypothetically speaking...

23. Squash Posted: October 21, 2007 at 10:22 PM (#2586666)

Now that I think some more about this... how would one break into the player agent business? Hypothetically speaking...

Have any athlete friends who need representation? Any friend's kids? Or take a low-level job at an agency, build yourself some credibility, and package yourself that way. I think Boras got started by repping a friend of his from his own baseball days.

24. Colin Posted: October 21, 2007 at 11:09 PM (#2586740)

I don't understand why Schuerholz acts like this with Boras. No reason to cop the attitude - just tell him his number is too high and to call back with a more reasonable number. Sheesh.

even though it's officially "all business", I imagine all GMs feel an emotional stake in the teams they create. to that end, we shouldn't be surprised when we see an emotional component when they talk about the people they perceive as obstructing their work.

25. Mike A Posted: October 22, 2007 at 12:51 AM (#2587318)

Schuerholz acts this way towards Boras for several reasons. I believe the kicker was when Boras said Maddux would not take arbitration because Greg had several multiyear offers. Maddux surprised the Braves by accepting, throwing the payroll off. This culminated in Schuerholz trading Millwood in a deal that was highly embarrassing (though honestly didn't work out badly). Now Schuerholz pretty much won't offer arbitration at all.

Another was Boras claimed Jeff Blauser was on a 'hunting trip' and couldn't be reached, in essence not allowing Jeff to listen to the Braves' offer. Blauser ended up signing with the Cubs, and subsequently said he would have taken less to stay with the Braves. Did Boras 'hide' Blauser away from Schuerholz so he could get more money? Or was the hunting story on the up-and-up? There is some debate over this one, but I don't think Schuerholz was happy about the situation.

I'm sure there's been other issues as well. But Schuerholz won't speak to Boras, period.

26. Will Young now works at Rowing Girl's School Posted: October 22, 2007 at 02:39 AM (#2588199)

Boras was a minor league pitcher for the Cubs (who paid for his law school education during the winter as part of his contract!) and then represented his former teammate Bill Caudill a few years later. His big break came when he was hired to be Tim Belcher's "adviser" and he and Belcher spurned the Twins repeated attempts to reach a deal as the #1 overall pick in 1983.

Here's the Belcher story.

27. AJM Posted: October 22, 2007 at 02:40 AM (#2588205)

Has anyone written a book on Boras? I think that would be interesting to read.

28. joker24 Posted: October 22, 2007 at 03:20 AM (#2588429)

and then represented his former teammate Bill Caudill a few years later.

Caudill was the 14th and 18th highest paid player in baseball in '86/'87 according to the Baseball Cube. Boras is good.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/c/caudibi01.shtml

29. Homer Summa Posted: October 22, 2007 at 03:44 AM (#2588463)

He's never gotten a penny more than someone was willing to pay.

30. scareduck Posted: October 22, 2007 at 05:16 AM (#2588505)

There's a certain amount of shamelessness (I mean that in a good way) required to be able to do that

Especially when the goods you're selling are Jeff Weaver.

31. Shooty: Applying to be Fearless Leader

Posted: October 22, 2007 at 10:47 AM (#2588532)

Now that I think some more about this... how would one break into the player agent business? Hypothetically speaking...

I have a friend who tried to become an agent by signing Latin ballplayers and he says it was a combination money pit/nightmare. The players know they have you over a barrell so they extort money from you by asking for loans and then, just when they're about to make the big leagues, nothing can stop them from jumping to another agent, probably one that has clandestinely offered them cash up front. In the long run, the players hurt themselves because a lot of agents are terrified they're going to lose their clients so they try to lock the player up with a team as soon as they can to guarantee the commission. It's a dirty business all around.

32. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: October 22, 2007 at 11:16 AM (#2588539)

He has proven it with his actions in the past ( Harrington, Drew and Drew, Weaver )

It was Tommy Tanzer, not Boras, who told Harrington to play hardball over the $4M offer, and wound up with nothing. Boras' clients have received their money.

33. Slinger Francisco Barrios (Dr. Memory) Posted: October 22, 2007 at 11:56 AM (#2588551)

Now that I think some more about this... how would one break into the player agent business? Hypothetically speaking...

Good question. I worked with a guy in IT who chucked it all and went to law school with that very end in mind; he was a pretty good athlete to boot (had a cannon of an arm, but I couldn't put him at SS like he wanted because he never knew where it was going and didn't know when to let up, and I didn't want my 1Bman killed...and my 1Bman was me). I lost track of him, but I do know in the end he most definitely did <u>not</u> end up representing anybody...at least, not yet. Who knows, maybe I'll hear of him one day.

34. Slinger Francisco Barrios (Dr. Memory) Posted: October 22, 2007 at 12:04 PM (#2588557)

Here's the Belcher story.

Well told, Mr. Young.

You quoted a scout to the effect that in that draft only Belcher had a major league fastball. One wonders why the scout didn't think that about Roger Clemens, as well. Maybe there's more doofusery in scouting than I suppose.

35. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: October 22, 2007 at 12:40 PM (#2588589)

"It was Tommy Tanzer, not Boras, who told Harrington to play hardball over the $4M offer, and wound up with nothing. Boras' clients have received their money."

It was Tanzer who failed to get a deal done the first time Harrington was drafted, but Boras was his rep when he failed to sign with the Padres as a second-round pick the next year. He turned down a $1.2M bonus on Boras's advice. (Link)

36. Shooty: Applying to be Fearless Leader

Posted: October 22, 2007 at 12:49 PM (#2588599)

Maybe there's more doofusery in scouting than I suppose.

Be careful. You might get accused of having never seen a game if you question the superior wisdom and genius of the scouting community.

37. Mike Emeigh

Posted: October 22, 2007 at 01:20 PM (#2588627)

You quoted a scout to the effect that in that draft only Belcher had a major league fastball. One wonders why the scout didn't think that about Roger Clemens, as well. Maybe there's more doofusery in scouting than I suppose.

38. Slinger Francisco Barrios (Dr. Memory) Posted: October 22, 2007 at 01:52 PM (#2588677)

The exact quote was that Belcher was the only pitcher who "could really throw the ball by a hitter". Clemens then, as throughout most of his career, didn't rely primarily on blowing the ball by hitters; he wasn't a typical high-strikeout pitcher, but a power groundballer.

Bowrrrr? Clemens may not be a "typical high-strikeout pitcher," but a high-strikeout pitcher is exactly what he was from Day One of his major league career through 2006 (not so much in '07). There's no flippin' way at that stage of his development that Clemens couldn't throw the ball by hitters, and he made a living doing just that (and more, of course). That scout was either ill-informed (which is bad) or blind to Clemens (which is worse).

39. Will Young now works at Rowing Girl's School Posted: October 22, 2007 at 02:52 PM (#2588767)

Maybe Clemens liked to just "pitch to contact"?

40. Mike Emeigh

Posted: October 22, 2007 at 04:20 PM (#2588899)

There's no flippin' way at that stage of his development that Clemens couldn't throw the ball by hitters, and he made a living doing just that (and more, of course).

Clemens didn't have a true "power fastball", in the Johnson/Ryan mold. He did use a four-seamer, but he used the two-seamer with more devastating effect, getting a lot of weak grounders. Both the four-seamer and the two-seamer were in the 94-95 range. His strikeout rates (except for 1988) early in his career were in the high 7s/low 8s per 9 innings - top 5 in the league, but not in the stratosphere of the guys you think of as "blow-em-away" types.

Where Clemens made his living, so to speak, was with (a) pinpoint command and (b) keeping the hitters off-stride by mixing his pitches. When he needed to get an out early in his career, he used the two-seamer; later on, he used the splitter.

-- MWE

41. The Yankee Clapper Posted: October 22, 2007 at 05:38 PM (#2589054)

. . . agency fees in all fields are capped by law, state law I believe.

I don't believe that is generally the case, certainly not as far as representing professional athletes or even entertainers.

42. phredbird

Posted: October 22, 2007 at 10:02 PM (#2589638)

What I'm trying to say, I suppose, is that I don't think what Scott Boras does is so prohibitively difficult that nobody else could do it.

i think what you might be missing here is that there are agents as energetic and creative and shameless as scott boras, they just aren't in sports. from the short time i've been here in L.A. the stuff i've read about agents seems to indicate the movie business is jammed with scott boras clones. maybe the payoff is better in show biz, i dunno. i'd be a terrible agent. i knew i was a bad negotiator when my boss told me what a good negotiator i was during our salary negotiations. riiight.

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ajc: Super-agent Scott Boras is king of the squeeze play (RR)

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