I'm not in position to check and I may have missed it because I'm in a hurry, but I'd think the 56 Dodgers line up that Larsen no-hit (perfect) must have been a fairly good lineup.

Congratulations to Lester. Well done.

That Lester, Bucholz and Parnell have no-hitters while Lefty Grove does not is one of baseball's little mysteries.

Can't blame Francona for letting Lester pitch the no-hitter and ring up a (too) high pitch count. Question-can some of the damage be mitigated by letting Lester skip his next start, giving him 8-10 days to recouperate?

Or ribeye and blue crab, if you prefer.

Porterhouse and stone crab claws.

I think tonight I'll make ribeye and stone crab.

Nolan Ryan no-hit this lineup (16K and 2BB). Player and their OPS+ that season:

D.White (116)
R.Alomar (115)
K.Gruber (102)
J.Carter (124)
J.Olerud (115)
M.Whiten (87)
G.Hill (103)
G.Myers (94)
M.Lee (54)

Two things:
That's a pretty strong lineup and holy cow Manny Lee was a terrible hitter.

Mike Warren no-hit the White Sox in 1983 (which looks roughly like it had most of its league-leading offense in the game). For his career, he pitched 204.2 innings with a 75 ERA+. In 1983, his best year, he threw 65.2 innings with a 93 ERA+. Dunno where any of that stacks up on the unlikelihood scale, but it probably bears mentioning.

The Padres whom Milt Pappas came within one disputed ball of perfecting were an unimpressive bunch:

Enzo Hernandez - .195 batting average for 1972, .224 for career
Dave Roberts - a .244 hitting 21 YO rookie
Leron Lee - Derrek Lee's uncle, hit .300 on the year, 40 points higher than any other season.
Nate Colbert - great slugger, but a sub .250 hitter
Cito Gaston - had one really great year in his career, this wasn't it. Hit .269.
Derrell Thomas - .238 in 1972, .249 for career
Johnny Jeter - No relation. 1972 was his best season. He hit .221
Fred Kendall - Yes relation. Hit .216 in 1972, .233 for career.
Mike Caldwell - Average hitting pitcher. Career OPS+ of 2. Hit .140 in 1972.

Padres had 2 PH that game, sporting batting averages of .242 and .232.

Only one player in that game had a career batting average above .250 - Cito Gaston at .256.

What does it mean to Pittsburgh a steak?

I had to look it up. Sounds similar to seared Ahi.

Can't blame Francona for letting Lester pitch the no-hitter and ring up a (too) high pitch count. Question-can some of the damage be mitigated by letting Lester skip his next start, giving him 8-10 days to recouperate?

130 in 9 isn't as bad as 130 in 7. It's less than 15 pitches per inning. He only faced 30 batters or so and did it in 2 1/2 hours. Besides, one game, like one drink, won't kill you. It's the cumulative effect.

Can't blame Francona for letting Lester pitch the no-hitter and ring up a (too) high pitch count. Question-can some of the damage be mitigated by letting Lester skip his next start, giving him 8-10 days to recouperate?

I was thinking this too - I wonder if Lester stays in the 90-100 range for his next couple of starts.

Question-can some of the damage be mitigated by letting Lester skip his next start, giving him 8-10 days to recouperate?

Probably not, but his next start will be on five days' rest.

Tue 05/20: Justin Masterson (with Chris Smith being sent down?)
Wed 05/21: Bartolo Colon (with Masterson being sent back down?)
Thu 05/22: Daisuke Matsuzaka
Fri 05/23: Tim Wakefield
Sat 05/24: Josh Beckett
Sun 05/25: Jon Lester

Their next off day is Thursday 5/29, coinciding with Clay Buchholz's potential return from the DL... though if nothing goes wrong with the above rotation I'd expect Buchholz to get a rehab start or two.

I guess the question is this: when Buchholz comes back from the DL, they have six starters including Colon. Who moves to the pen? Would it be better for Lester's recuperation to move to the pen for a while? Or are they (and he) better off with him in the rotation in the short term?

I guess it's a nice problem to have.

so i guess the best thing that can happen for Lester, long-term, is to give up a hit early, avoiding the need for ANOTHER 130 pitch game. Me? i would skip a start or just put him on a 90 pitch limit for a couple of games, on a "it couldn't hurt" approach.

Can't blame Francona for letting Lester pitch the no-hitter and ring up a (too) high pitch count. Question-can some of the damage be mitigated by letting Lester skip his next start, giving him 8-10 days to recouperate?

It's not the pitch-count itself that's bad, it's the pitches thrown while fatigued. Lester didn't look fatigued at all. His last pitch of the night registered at 96 mph, and he was humping it up to 95 mph regularly in the late innings. The lead off walk in the 9th wasn't good, but he didn't look like he was laboring at all.

I guess the question is this: when Buchholz comes back from the DL, they have six starters including Colon. Who moves to the pen? Would it be better for Lester's recuperation to move to the pen for a while? Or are they (and he) better off with him in the rotation in the short term?

I think Buchholz gets some minor league time to keep his innings down regardless of if he's healthy or not. They'll probably give him the full number of rehab starts before optioning him down to Pawtucket. He'll get the call the next time they need a spot start or until someone else in the rotation goes down.

I had no clue who Chris Smith was. The UConn guard from a few years ago? The Sox basically use a 30 man roster it seems.

Dunno where any of that stacks up on the unlikelihood scale, but it probably bears mentioning.

Indeed, Mike Warren bore mentioning way back in post No. 85.

The Sox basically use a 30 man roster it seems.

Our bench is thinner than Calista Flockhart.

Our bench is thinner than Calista Flockhart.

That's what we get for letting Hinske go.

To me, no-hitters are one of those things in baseball that are very impressive at least half because they're so unlikely/flukey. There are plenty of shutouts that are as impressive as/more impressive than plenty of no-nos (as shown by many posts above).

j

vi, not for nothing, but I would switch Dice-K and Wakefield in your planned rotation. Mostly because Dice-K has been a much better pitcher with more than 4 days rest.

Indeed, Mike Warren bore mentioning way back in post No. 85.

You can say that again!

I'd like to see him skip a start, but make a 2-3 IP "structured relief appearence" somewhere in between.

I think the worry over one start is overdone. If an extra day can be done without screwing around with everyone else, fine. Otherwise, let him start and make decisions based on how he looks/feels. I wouldn't leave him in for 130 pitches again in the next start, but then I think the Sox aren't likely to do that except under unusual circumstances such as a no-hitter.

Our bench is thinner than Calista Flockhart.

You mean bullpen.

2008 OPS+
109 Ellsbury (or 110 Crisp)
140 Casey
125 Cash
154 Cora
135 Moss
118 Lowrie

2008 ERA+
74 Delcarmen
52 Timlin
60 Hansen
41 Corey
67 Tavarez

vi, not for nothing, but I would switch Dice-K and Wakefield in your planned rotation. Mostly because Dice-K has been a much better pitcher with more than 4 days rest.

Fine; I'm just regurgitating the order in which they've recently pitched.

Congratulations to Lester. I didn't see it, but if "no hitter" is kind of gimmicky, "complete game shutout" isn't.

vi, OPS+ or ERA+ at this point in the year is besieged with sample size issues for full-timers. For bench players and relief pitchers, it's almost completely meaningless.

Does anyone remember Bud Smith? Threw a no-hitter in 2001 as a 21 year old, had a terrible year in 2002, and never again made it to the big leagues.

Smith's no hitter was the first and, as of today, only one I've seen start to finish. I'll probably always remember him because of that.

vi, OPS+ or ERA+ at this point in the year is besieged with sample size issues for full-timers. For bench players and relief pitchers, it's almost completely meaningless.

Well, duh. I'm not suggesting they'll keep performing at that level; I'm just pointing out what has happened to date. And to date, the bench has not been a problem.

That Lester, Bucholz and Parnell have no-hitters while Lefty Grove does not is one of baseball's little mysteries.

Don't forget Earl Wilson and Bill Monbouquette.

There was a quote about Greg Maddux by one of his Braves teammates years ago, saying Greg would never throw a no-hitter because he focused on the long term. If he had a game in hand, he might throw a guy a pitch he could hit to set him up for the NEXT time they faced each other.