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Thursday, December 27, 2007
Cardinals Diaspora: Cardinals Front Office = Liars
“You’ve taken my life-so take my soul
that’s what you said-and I believed it all
Liar-Liar-Liar”
What are my options? Let DeWitt and co earn interest so they can ’spend’ the money in the right places or have them blow some cash on a big gamble like Silva or Tejada? Blow the dough. What’s it matter to me? We’ve already spent the cash- they’re the ones not. Who knows what will pan out or what won’t 2-3 years from now? Nobody does. So to think that this team will have a better chance at a player or players 36 months from now is not only absurd- it’s insulting- just like trying to force-feed me a pu pu platter of LaRue/Izturis/Kennedy/Ludwick up the middle on a team that features the best player in the world. And PS: We’re kind of overlooking the fact that we’re wasting the prime of the best Cardinal ever! It’s funny how much better a guy like Silva or Kudora can be when they play with the best in the world- just ask_____ (Hector Luna, Ronnie Belliard, Abraham Nunez, Jason Marquis, Jeff Weaver, Jeff Suppan, ect al.)
Midway through the off-season, many teams are making final tweaks to their roster. Filling in holes that the big pushes didn’t cover. Putting a team together that will be whittled down to 40 before it gets to 25. For Cardinal fans, the promises that were made 3 years ago, last year and this year have turned out to be lies. A spade is a spade and until we get some proof that DeWitt, Johnny Mo or any other person employed by the team is willing to make the changes necessary to elevate this business above mediocrity, than we shouldn’t relent. After all, it’s a business. And us, the customers, have been lied to long enough.
Repoz
Posted: December 27, 2007 at 08:32 AM | 200 comment(s)
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Waaaaaaa! We're about to go through one of those 'interminable' 2-3 year stretches of sucking. Waaaa!
And PS: We’re kind of overlooking the fact that we’re wasting the prime of the best Cardinal ever!
Cry me a feckin' river. Like you didn't get 2 pennants, a world series title and a fistful of division titles out of Pujols' prime years. (I know he's only 28 now [heh], but his early years were obviously eons better than most people's "prime" years--he was pretty much a fully-formed HOFer when he first set foot on a MLB field.)
Aren't all those players in the same general ballpark?
Not sure Mr. Pujols has earned that title yet, though he's a contender. Sure, he's got a career OPS+ of 167 after a great 7 years, but The Man posted that same 167 after 17 years (1941-58 with '45 in the military), before his last 5 years (at 118) pulled it down to a final 159.
I can't remember the last time I saw you write anything without putting "best fans in baseball" at the beginning. For me, it's getting really old. If someone isn't going to ##### on a Cardinal blog, where can they?
That was my thought. Albert is good, maybe as good as Musial if this is his peak, but even someone as peak-obsessed as I would award a tie like that to the guy who did it for two decades.
Unrelated question: Why did The Man get to play 1943 and 1944, while almost every other star was trying to get revenge on the Germans for what they did to Pearl Harbor?
I guess all the other baseball players who were in the service prior to that were either drafted earlier or else volunteered.....
Nothing is over until we decide it is!!
BTW, retro-shiite, the Cubs are a fringe contender that is looking an awful lot like a $120 million piece of #### by '09, which is exactly what jackass fans like you deserve.
I'm curious -- what moves SHOULD they be making?
I certainly get what you're saying, Vlad,and I know I need to temper my complaints since there are so many other teams out there that have waited years and years for playoff successes, but it doesn't make it less frustrating to see it happen.
Cardinals fans are used to winning every year. I know it's utterly shocking that as the realization that they'll be punting a season sinks in, some dude on a blog no one has ever heard of loses his ####.
a few years ago, everybody knew that Rolen/Edmonds etc. would be old and declining (although the two freak Rolen injuries certainly hastened his demise), and that they would either need to shore up the minor-league system---which they've been doing---and make some strategic free-agent acquisitions if they wanted to remain competitive during the Pujols years.
Trades aren't too much of an option because the Birds have very little at the major-league level that anybody would want---except they should move Chris Duncan to an AL team for some pitching if they get the chance---and you don't want to defeat the plan by dealing away prospects for expensive (or soon-to-be-expensive) veterans..
And the reality is that there's not much of any value in the FA market this year that's worth tying up a lot of cash...
So given that, it's not unreasonable to expect that 2008 will have to be a rebuilding year... most Cardinal fans understand that.. and not many I know are advocating throwing money at Carlos Silva... I mean if he's the 5th-starter/innings-eater you need to round out your championship-contending roster, yeah maybe, but on a .500 team (or worse), why bother?
Let's see if Brendan Ryan can contribute at a .700 OPS clip---if he can, he's Eckstein for a fraction of the dough... Let's see if Ankiel can put up an .800+ OPS everyday---if he can, he's Juan Encarnacion for a fraction of the dough... let's see if Colby Rasmus can put up a .750+ OPS in CF---if he can, he's Jim Edmonds (ca. 2007) for a fraction of the dough...
Well, yeah, but ask Walt Jocketty how that works.
As Russ put it, the Cardinals look like Pirates + Pujols - LaRoche. It's not pretty, especially as the team announces increases in ticket prices.
You've apparently missed my posts on non-Cardinal threads. I'm aware I've used that tweak a handful of times, but it's not exactly the bulk of my BTF participation.
For me, it's getting really old.
I'm sorry if it bugs you, and knowing that, I'll tone it down, but you'll forgive me if I think the "best fans" self-proclamation is both (1) incredibly self-righteous and (2) belied by the tendency to whine whenever something doesn't go the team's way, after having experienced so much success. The comment is not directed toward the more (for the most part) level-headed and thoughtful Cardinal fans I encounter on BTF, to whom no offense is intended.
XOXOXOXO
Thanks for proving my point (at least, as to certain Cardinal fans), Sparkles. Yes, god knows my stepping on the feelings of a thin-skinned Cardinal fan on BTF rightfully should subject me to watching crap baseball for the rest of my life. I suggest you look in the mirror; I've never called you, or to my recollection, any Cardinal fan on BTF a "jackass," however much it might've been warranted.
Incidentally, you want to place a friendly wager on which of the (non-White Sox) I-55 teams has the better record in '09 and '10, I'm game.
And, finally, I'll note that neither you nor Blalock addressed the substantive portion of my post, the point of which is that the claim that the Cardinals have "wasted" Pujols is a load of horseshite.
FWIW, I've found you much more tolerable since the steroid issue's shown some movement toward a resolution of some sort.
Incidentally, I'm almost tempted to fly into Baltimore to sit a couple rows behind your meetup with Nieporent, just so I can be entertained by whatever ensues, for better or worse. I was thinking "Christmas miracle" when I read that exchange.
Four times in Pujols' first 6 seasons the Cardinals were in the NLCS with a chance to go to the World Series, and they went twice and won it once.
That's a pretty sweet run.
They've now hit a lull, and one that many Cardinal fans saw looming, but hoped could be minimized through smart management. And that's where we are now. If everything breaks right for the Cardinals in 2008, in the weak NL Central, they could contend, but most Cardinal fans I communicate with don't expect that, and are more excited about player development in 2008, and are looking forward to 2009.
I'd rather trot out sub-million-dollar players at c, 2b, ss, lf, cf, and rf and save the $$$ to spend on an impact player if and when such a player can help propel the team to a championship. But to spend just to spend seems pointless...
And I've never, ever understood name-calling on on-line forums...
For starters, there has been a ton of young outfield talent passed around this offseason without even a passing interest shown by the Cardinals. Mozeliak seems to agree with the Cardinals fans who view the Duncan/Rasmus/Ankiel/Ludwick outfield without a shred of objectivity and refuse to commit any resources to shoring it up. Yes, they could all prove projections and scouts wrong by forming a dominant starting outfield and a very good fourth outfielder, but there are questions about all of them and there is room for improvement.
Much as we appreciate the '06 title, it was clear to astute fans and to DeWitt himself that the extraordinary work Jocketty did from '96 to '04 overrode the inertia of his later years. DeWitt wanted to make a change towards a more sustainable front office model of building from within, but he didn't get his first choice and had to settle for Walt's disciple. Mozeliak has alternated between following the '05-'07 Jocketty model (Which gave us the Pineiro contract) and his own version of building from within, which looks an awful lot like cost-cutting at this point. Suggesting that Cardinals fans are fickle because the new rookie GM isn't being given extensive leeway is ridiculous, especially as the owner is slashing payroll after packing a new stadium for two years.
Were this to transpire, it might be the most surreal meetup in BTF history. Tempting.
Is it just me, or have you moved around more than Reggie Sanders in the last couple of years? I didn't even realize you were in Baltimore till I read that conversation with Nieporent.
You have, on the other hand, acted like an utter jackass in just about every Cardinal-related thread of the offseason.
Bully for you having not actually used the word, though.
I live within walking distance of OPaCY, so count me in.
Again, look in the damn mirror. I'm not the one engaging in name-calling here.
And way to toss around pejoratives without support. Nobody else seems particularly bothered (other than Blalock's comment above, which I've already responded to); thus, I conclude that you are particularly thin-skinned.
Bully for you having not actually used the word, though.
Not only have I not "actually used the word," I have not directed any personal insults to any Cardinal fan BTFers. If I "deserve to have a $120 piece of #### team" to watch, you clearly DON'T deserve the success your team's given you in recent years. As Vlad so aptly put it, you wouldn't last five minutes as a fan of the Pirates.
I tend to agree
I wasn't bothered, but that's because I already thought you're a jackass. I'm just happy you got "Best Fans in Baseball" right, since a number of Cubs fans have screwed that one up ("Greatest Fans in the World" or some such).
And, well, that's fine, and completely appropriate. I never said, or even suggested, that Cardinal fans should not be at all critical of their team, or the direction they're now taking, or the conduct of their front office. Hell, despite their recent success, were I a Cardinal fan, I would be annoyed (despite the success of the major-league team) by certain aspects of the organization (most obviously their having let the minor league system stagnate).
My objection is to such ludicrous hyperbole as the suggestion that the Cardinals have "wasted" Albert Pujols, which smacks of a fan who's completely oblivious to (and unappreciative of) the tremendous success the Cards have had dudring the Pujols era. The Cards have had about as much success as any organization in baseball during Pujols's career (which, though Pujols was surrounded by an outstanding supporting cast through most of that time, is hardly coincidental). I was responding to this particular blog poster, who seems to be lacking in perspective. (OK--the "world's greatest fans" reference was an unnecessary tweak, but I also don't think it calls for the frothing at the mouth we're seeing from Sparkles here.)
Haven't looked at the '08 schedule, but I'd lobby for a game against the Twins or Angels. Think those two teams, along with the O's, are the only teams I haven't seen in person.
'Course, if I were really that hot to see any of those teams, I could always catch 'em at the Cell.
Let's go with the Angels. Perhaps AROM can be convinced to show up.
Of course, the game is secondary to the kevin-DMN Main Event.
Well, obviously, but as long as I'm there, might as well knock a couple of the remaining teams I haven't seen off my checklist.
Thanks. I have no particular problem with you, but duly noted.
I need to get a job back in DC before baseball season. I want tickets to the new park.
I seem to remember some of this. I was rooting for the Indians, of course.
Well, if those're the choices, I'd just as soon see the Yanks or Sawx. Better the Sox, since kevin's a Sox fan. Add even more drama to the kevin/Nieporent thing.
That might be a good thing.
kevin only plays an attorney on BTF. ;-)
May 31 against the BoSox gets my vote.
Can I get your Cubs tix if they are playing at home that weekend? ; )
Heh. I should probably check the Cubs' schedule before I make any firm travel plans, shouldn't I? (Hell, JV, you should come along. Ain't seen you since April.)
Uh, kevin, this is not lavalife.
Oh, and what do you do these days? Honest question.
I know its been way too long. I need to get down to Chicago this winter. Jill is going to Milwaukee for a weekend in January, I may go to Chicago and see you and scotto.
I'd love to go to Baltimore, but I'm in San Diego for the US Open the first week in June.
I should hope not, as I was most certainly not trying to get to "know" kevin in that sense.
lavalife's a hell of a good time, btw, if you're a single urban professional.
We can carpool down, Daly.
I was going to get a Champ Summers or Zack Wheat jersey though.
Well, screw you, then!
The "San Diego" part sounds great. The rest, not so much.
Dating website.
Nah. Go with Lee Lacey, in that nasty late-70s/early-80s neon Pirate yellow.
So surely you noted his very odd career trajectory.
I was gonna say--doesn't divorce tend to *decrease* the size of one's residence? Sorry about your marriage, BTW.
Weird indeed.
That was a bold display of candor. I guess it's one way to find out if you really are on everyone's ignore list.
Won't be too hard to do. The Angels also play the NL East this year. I have tickets for Wednesday June 25th
For as many times as kevin and I've butted heads (sometimes in fairly nasty fashion), I don't recall putting him on "ignore." I believe there's only one poster who's earned that distinction.
What do I win?
Amazing how once you've gotten past the pain of realizing things aren't working, the most difficult part of actually separating's the logistics.
um, let's see ... i fight with my gf all the time, we have a carville/matalin type relationship. there.
btw, retro, i've noticed you tend to jump into the card threads with something snarky way too fast for my taste, but i will say you've done a good job of calming the waters in your responses to the ire you've raised. besides, i always remind myself that you are a cub fan, and that's prob. enough of a burden without me adding to it.
:->
Don't I know it. :-)
I'm very sorry to hear about your marriage. If nothing else, you lose all that "married to a black woman" credibility that so impressed Eraser.
You know, they have PEDs that can take care of that for you.
Well, I hear DC's full of hot Asians.
I like that Kevin's marriage appears to have broken up over the inevitable end of a physical attraction that has not yet ended.
Main Event? What does that make Retardo--The Showstopper.
To those of us unfamiliar with OPaCY traditions, this simply sounds sick and wrong. To say nothing of fattening.
As for the weekday thing, Kevin, I have to come down from NJ, so that's out. May 31 should be fine if that's not Memorial Day weekend.
Jeez, that leaves me without excuse...
Well, I'm contemplating it, at least.
Jeez, that leaves me without excuse...
Well, my best friend from college lives near Annapolis, so it's not like this'd be my ONLY motivation.
To that end--thanks for the offer of a pickup, kevin, but I'll probably end up renting a car, so I can get around the state. (If not, I may well take you up on your offer, assuming it stands.)
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