BBTF's Newsblog Discussion :: Celizic: Guys like Pujols, Ortiz are good, but not memorable like Bonds, McGwire

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Tuesday, May 13, 2008

Celizic: Guys like Pujols, Ortiz are good, but not memorable like Bonds, McGwire

As that old Pedro Felizean proverb goes…“Don’t hang your hat higher than you can BLEEECCH!!

But it’s teams we’re watching more than individuals. The individuals are either not compelling personalities or overpowering at what they do. It’s not their fault. I love watching guys like Justin Mourneau and Pujols and Manny and Big Papi hit, but I don’t think most fans plan their evenings around those at-bats.

Does anyone want to watch Maddux pitch six cagey innings for the pathetic Padres? Maybe Pujols is great, but we don’t watch his every at-bat. Same goes for Manny. After all, 500 homers, like the dollar, aren’t what they used to be. The same goes for Griffey. He’s worth watching, but he’s playing for Cincinnati, and nobody’s showing their games. Besides, 600 homers is also a devalued currency. He may have done it the right way — that’s the perception, at least — but there are five guys with that many ahead of him. When Aaron got to 600, just two had been there before him.

...But there aren’t any superhumans out there — at least not yet. The great pitchers don’t strike out 20 a game, or even 15. And even if someone hits 50 home runs, it’s no longer special. If Ryan Howard or Prince Fielder wants to try a run at 61, we’ll watch the chase, but that’s months — or years — away.

Repoz Posted: May 13, 2008 at 03:00 AM | 23 comment(s) | Login to Bookmark
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1. Roy Hobbs of WIFFLE Ball Posted: May 13, 2008 at 03:26 AM (#2778636)

But there aren’t any superhumans out there — at least not yet. The great pitchers don’t strike out 20 a game, or even 15. And even if someone hits 50 home runs, it’s no longer special.

Nobody achieves anything great anymore. Except for the players that achieve great things. But they don't count!

2. The Most Interesting Man In The World Posted: May 13, 2008 at 03:33 AM (#2778642)

I love the link midpage, "When athletes and celebs get together", featuring the power duo of Zito and Milano.

Funny, Celizic doesn't look like the sort of guy who would say "Remember way back in 2007"....

3. joker24 Posted: May 13, 2008 at 03:52 AM (#2778653)

It's as if he's just trying to get hits by getting his stuff linked to by FJM.

4. Walks Clog Up the Bases Posted: May 13, 2008 at 03:52 AM (#2778656)

Um. Pujols isn't memorable? He plays for a team I'm supposed to despise and I can't help but pay attention every time he's at the dish. I know I'm not alone. The guy's one of the best hitters of the decade. I think even casual fans are going to have the Pujols homer from the 2005 NLCS etched in their minds for years.

And honestly, do we want the likes of Pujols and Papi to be memorable like Bonds and McGwire. One will forever have the label of cheater attached to his name, while the other is pathetic joke.

5. Harry Balsagne's transparent jealousy

Posted: May 13, 2008 at 04:29 AM (#2778662)

I love watching guys like Justin Mourneau

I wonder if that's a deliberate effort to increase Justin's French-factor.

6. Elston Gunn Posted: May 13, 2008 at 04:52 AM (#2778672)

If ESPN cut out of Skip Bayless yelling at some poor dude every time Pujols came to the plate, I might actually turn the channel on every once in a while.

7. Charter Member of the Jesus Melendez Fanclub Posted: May 13, 2008 at 05:08 AM (#2778673)

600 homers is also a devalued currency. He may have done it the right way — that’s the perception, at least — but there are five guys with that many ahead of him. When Aaron got to 600, just two had been there before him.

No one could hit a lot of HR before the so-called live ball era. So let's assume no one who began their career before, oh, 1914 had a chance at 600 HR. Babe Ruth reached 300 in 1925. Probably no one realized it at the time, but let's say this is the first time fans were aware of someone hitting a lot of career HR. Aaron reached 600 in around 1970, 35 years later. 35 years of watching career HR totals and Aaron was the 3rd guy to get there. 38 more years of watching career HR totals and Griffey will be the 6th to reach 600. Well OK, it's always more special to see the first people do something, but it doesn't look like 600 career HR has been completely devalued.

Anyway, based on TFE, this article is completely retarded, and even seems to be trying to be, so I don't know why I've spent 5 minutes responding, except I'm drunk and afraid to go to sleep

8. Charter Member of the Jesus Melendez Fanclub Posted: May 13, 2008 at 05:09 AM (#2778674)

And Aaron reached 600 right after Mays. Easy to forget (I wasn't there), but I'll bet it didn't seem quite as special when 2 guys did it after no one else had for 40 years.

9. alskor Posted: May 13, 2008 at 05:16 AM (#2778677)

Well, this all fits perfectly with my long held belief that Celizic lost his mind about 10 years ago... the last thing he remembers is Mark Mcgwire - and he remembers as twenty stories tall with lasers shooting from his eyes. Why cant Big Papi do that?

How sad.

You know what hell is? Being stuck in a car for fourteen hours on a road trip to the baseball hall of fame with Mike Celizic, Dan Shaughnessy and Richard Justice. Id console myself with the idea that I could do the world a tremendous amount of good by driving off a bridge.

10. Long John McCaine Mutiny on the Bounty (scott) Posted: May 13, 2008 at 06:00 AM (#2778682)

this guy gets paid to write?

the new market inefficiency is turgid, grumpy, warmed over prose!

11. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: May 13, 2008 at 07:43 AM (#2778686)

And honestly, do we want the likes of Pujols and Papi to be memorable like Bonds and McGwire. One will forever have the label of cheater attached to his name, while the other is pathetic joke.

It's 2008, and apparently there are still fans who'd be stunned if it emerged that either Pujols or Ortiz used PEDs. Those fans have a different label attached to them.

Think of those Looney Tunes cartoons where Elmer Fudd would run off the side of a cliff, then freeze in midair, realize his predicament, and turn into a giant lollipop.

12. Guts

Posted: May 13, 2008 at 08:10 AM (#2778688)

Why are we still linking to HatGuy?

13. buddaley Posted: May 13, 2008 at 10:41 AM (#2778701)

He has a deadline, has to write something and doesn't have a clue what. So he reaches into the nostalgia grab bag and plucks out a variation where the nostalgia is for something recent and generally considered bad. There is no substance or insight, but it gives him enough words and he can use some famous names.

"Whew", he thinks. "Another one out of the way and I am still getting paid. Maybe I'll do the next one about ballplayers who stick around just to get the paycheck."

14. andrewberg Posted: May 13, 2008 at 11:14 AM (#2778711)

Okay, Bonds may be more individually exciting than Morneau- I can consent to that claim. But the most interesting players in baseball are not necessarily hulking sluggers at the moment. I will go out of my way to see Hanley or Reyes batting and running. Webb, Peavy, Lincecum, Hamels, Kazmir, Carmona, and Felix are probably more exciting than just about any pitcher to come along since Pedro or Santana. Sizemore, Granderson, and some of the new, young CF are outstanding.

The Brewers, D-Backs, and Rays, in my mind, are stacked with players that entertain me a great deal.

15. EB Posted: May 13, 2008 at 12:11 PM (#2778739)

One way to approach an article like this, is to recall the first time we saw this type of article. Variations of "the players of today aren't as interesting as the stars of yesterday" article has been around as long as there have been sportswriters. It reappears like the seasons and reassures us that some things in baseball, as in life, just don't change.

The first time I saw one of these was over 50 years ago when a SPORT magazine cover informed me that we were currently watching the last true superstars. Pictures of Ted Williams and Stan Musial graced that cover. It was a long time ago and I was in elementary school, so I don't remember the details, but I do remember learning that there was no one out there who would be like Teddy Ballgame and Stan the Man.

16. Designated Sitter (GGC) Posted: May 13, 2008 at 12:27 PM (#2778750)

Why are we still linking to HatGuy?

So we can do our superiority dance.

17. bunyon Posted: May 13, 2008 at 12:30 PM (#2778752)

If you're friends aren't superior, then they're no friends of mine.

18. Chris Dial Posted: May 13, 2008 at 12:44 PM (#2778761)

I do remember learning that there was no one out there who would be like Teddy Ballgame and Stan the Man.

Okay, Bonds is Teddy BallGame. Is Pujols Stan the Man?

Because we really don't see players *that* dominant.

19. gef the talking mongoose Posted: May 13, 2008 at 01:43 PM (#2778808)

I'm drunk and afraid to go to sleep

Because ...?

Also, so's your mom.

20. Boots Day Posted: May 13, 2008 at 02:03 PM (#2778820)

The great pitchers don’t strike out 20 a game, or even 15.

This is just bizarre. There are three pitchers in history who have struck out 20 men in a nine-inning start: Two of them are still active, and the other pitched just last year (and hasn't even officially retired yet).

Does there have to be someone actually striking out 20 men in a game as he writes his column for the great pitchers to be striking out 20 in a game?

21. kubiwan Posted: May 13, 2008 at 04:05 PM (#2778964)

Does there have to be someone actually striking out 20 men in a game as he writes his column for the great pitchers to be striking out 20 in a game?

Maybe. Of course, if someone did strike 20 in a game this year, 20 K's would quickly become a "devalued currency".

Basically, he desperately wants to see great players perform great feats...and then lament deeply when they do.

22. The Most Interesting Man In The World Posted: May 13, 2008 at 04:11 PM (#2778974)

If Ryan Howard or Prince Fielder wants to try a run at 61, we’ll watch the chase,

What is so special about 61? I guess if they were in the AL, it would mean something. Now it would just mean the sixth most in NL/Major League History.

Oh wait, I know why. The 'S' word. How stupid of me.

23. Steve Treder Posted: May 13, 2008 at 04:20 PM (#2778984)

And Aaron reached 600 right after Mays. Easy to forget (I wasn't there), but I'll bet it didn't seem quite as special when 2 guys did it after no one else had for 40 years.

Oh, it was pretty special.

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Celizic: Guys like Pujols, Ortiz are good, but not memorable like Bonds, McGwire

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