I wonder what Bob Feller thinks of all this.

Actually, if someone struck me out--espcially in a crucial situation--and then blew imaginary smoke off his finger, I'd be grateful. Because I have may struck out in a crucial situation, but of the two of us, he's obviously the one looking the fool.

Oh, go blow it out your ass Tim.

It was awesome in the old days, when players were always respectful of one another and didn't do things to make the game look bad.

The fairies and unicorns and dragons on the field were fun to watch, too.

"Last year, a guy -- I'm not going to tell you who he is -- hit a double against us in the eighth or ninth inning when we were up seven, eight runs," said Nationals infielder Aaron Boone. "When he got to second base, he did the three-clap, then pointed skyward. I was playing first; I was trailing the play. I watched this, then I congratulated him. I said, 'Hey, nice going.'"

I may have missed a game, but the closest thing I found was a double Jesus Flores hit in the ninth inning of a 12-2 game that ended 12-6 on April 22. But that was a ground-rule double and the second hit of Flores's career. He'd had his first one earlier that game.

The good old days when people called Jackie a ###### from the dugout and never celebrated.

Good thing these guys never saw Tug McGraw.

It is unclear when excessive celebration began.

I thought it was when the non-emotional self-censored 1950's baseball dragged down entertainment value. Maybe Tim Kurkjian would prefer to watch Home Run derby.

There’s so much individualism in sports.

Yet there's not enough individualism in communism. Where's the middle ground, guys?

personally, i think it sucks too. the bat flipping, manny staring at a homer, it's a bit much. but what are you going to do when a pitcher can't throw at a batter without getting warned then ejected? the rules being enforced to keep beanball wars from breaking out have removed the regulatory influence pitchers used to have. and i guess its a cultural thing now too. everybody does too much celebrating.
and you kids get off my lawn yada yada yada ...

And what if a pitcher blew imaginary smoke from his finger after striking out Robinson?

“Next time up,” Robinson said, “I’d hit a home run. Then I’d tell him, ‘Blow on that.’”

Wow, what a #########.

He could hit home runs at will and he still made outs?

“Next time up,” Robinson said, “I’d hit a home run. Then I’d tell him, ‘Blow on that.’”

If you could hit a homer any time you wanted to, why didn't you?

I may have missed a game, but the closest thing I found was a double Jesus Flores hit in the ninth inning of a 12-2 game that ended 12-6 on April 22. But that was a ground-rule double and the second hit of Flores's career. He'd had his first one earlier that game.

This is the closest thing I saw too, but Boone had moved to 3B at the beginning of the inning. He probably just made it up.

That's what you get for letting emotional ethnic types play baseball.

The personal celebrations may be getting a little excessive, but I just cannot handle the sanctimonious horseshit from the old-timers about this. Give me a ####### break.

With some of the contortions today, they have to be rehearsed. They’re not spontaneous.

Thanks. Now I'm picturing Joba practicing his spin-pump in front of the bathroom mirror. In his underwear.

Then I’d tell him, ‘Blow on that.'

I miss Mike Piazza.

I have to say that I have not been a big fan of on-field celebrations (especially the staring and bat flipping after home runs). But with all these people coming out of the woodwork to ##### about it, I am really starting to come around.

Sutton is particularly fun to watch take some kind of moral highground on this issue. You won't catch him making all these gyrations on the mound -- mostlly because the sandpaper would chafe his, uh, the part he's talking out of.

The fact is that baseball is way, way behind the curve on this one. To be up with what goes on in the NFL after every tackle, a second baseman would have to run in circles, find a camera, and do some sort of dance/pose after making a play on a routine grounder.

“Next time up,” Robinson said, “I’d hit a home run. Then I’d tell him, ‘Blow on that.’”

If you could hit a homer any time you wanted to, why didn't you?

see, this is why MLB and baseball-reference should start keeping track of this stuff. We need to know if there was ever a case where Robinson struck out, the pitcher celebrated, and next time up Robinson took him deep.

I would love to see Gameday start recording plays like - "In play, out(s). Batter Albert Pujols grounds out to first baseman Derrick Lee, unassisted. Pitcher Carlos Zambrano jesters towards crotch"

Pitcher Carlos Zambrano jesters towards crotch

That's the fun typo of the week, right there.

Zambrano may not lead the league in crotch-grabbing, but he will definitely catch gray ink in skyward-pointing.

And not one comment about the irony of an ESPN mouthpiece decrying "showboating"? The same network that makes a living highlighting it?

Which came first? The showboat or the TV director running the showboat highlight reel over and over?

And what would Sutton do if a player flipped a bat after hitting a meaningless homer off him?

“The next time up,” Sutton said, “I’d see how many buttons I could take off of his jersey.”

Isn't hitting a batter (and letting him on base) just for showing you up the definition of putting your own individual interests ahead of the team's?

Frankie Rodriguez probably feels slighted right about now. He's been doing this #### for years and no one in the national media cared about it. Joba does it once and suddenly it's the big thing for everyone to talk about.

And what would Sutton do if a player flipped a bat after hitting a meaningless homer off him?

“The next time up,” Sutton said, “I’d see how many buttons I could take off of his jersey.”

Sutton wants to make sweet, sweet love to the HR hitter.

Anybody see the Bobby Valentine/Japanese baseball thing on ESPN2 last night? At one point they showed Julio Zuletta doing a full-on dance routine after a homerun, 3 feet or so in front of the camera. They said he gets thrown at fairly routinely, though he blames this on his not being from Japan.

I've heard whining about showboating since I started following MLB in 1979. I think writers have this article on some kind of macro by now. Remember Jeffrey Leonard's one flap down? Or Mel Hall's batting gloves in the back pocket so he could wave to the pitcher while he jogged around the bases? (All right, that one was kind of clever.) Or Eck's fist pumps? Or Rickey!'s snap catches? And this is just off the top of my head. Don't even get me started about the stories you hear about teams and players before WWI.

And what if a pitcher blew imaginary smoke from his finger after striking out Robinson?

“Next time up,” Robinson said, “I’d hit a home run. Then I’d tell him, ‘Blow on that.’”

I'd hit a home run, then I'd tell him "Apologize this retard."

Can't find the Zuleta dance, but here is Dan Serafini throwing a bean ball at his head and Zuleta charging the mound.

i was there before ww1. they played the game right and did all the little things to win.

Funny you mention the Zuleta, I saw his dance on that documentary on ESPN2 last night "Zen of Baseball with Bobby V." His dance is beyond ridiculous.

i was there before ww1. they played the game right and did all the little things to win.

that reminds me - next time there's one of those gimmicky throwback nights, with the teams wearing the baggy wools, shouldn't they go the full route and have throwback rules? One umpire! Guys cutting third base! Scuff and spitballs! No outfield walls! C'mon, who wouldn't enjoy that?

see, this is why MLB and baseball-reference should start keeping track of this stuff. We need to know if there was ever a case where Robinson struck out, the pitcher celebrated, and next time up Robinson took him deep.

And another reason Neyer was born.

“I don’t like it—it is disrespectful to the players and to the game, to showboat,” said Don Sutton, a Hall of Fame pitcher. “Today, it’s about me. It’s not about winning teams or competing teams. There’s so much individualism in sports. I was told by veteran players coming up: Don’t show up your opponent. And I’m not buying the excuse that ‘I’m just being me.’ That sums it up. It’s about me. With some of the contortions today, they have to be rehearsed. They’re not spontaneous. If it’s spontaneous, emotional, elation, no one would have a problem with that. But today’s players need a choreographer for their stunts.”

And what would Sutton do if a player flipped a bat after hitting a meaningless homer off him?

“The next time up,” Sutton said, “I’d see how many buttons I could take off of his jersey.”

Don Sutton, eh?

From October Men by Roger Kahn (page 165 in my edition):

Sutton saw, or thought he saw, a swagger in Jackson's manner. This annoyed the Dodger ace, probably the strongest character ever to emerge from Clio, Alabama, and he decided that he would embarrass Jackson right here and now at Dodger Stadium in full view of 55,955 fans and the customary national television audience of millions. Before the catcher, Steve Yeager, could put down a sign, Sutton looked at Jackson and made a small, thrusting motion with his right hand and wrist, the universal signal for fast ball. Pitchers use that sign when warming up, to tell the catcher what kind of pich is coming. But here in a brash and naked dare Sutton was telling Jackson -- the hitter -- that now he was going to throw his fast ball. I'll tip what I'm going to throw, you swaggering s.o.b., and you still won't be able to hit it. That is not precisely what happened. Sutton threw his fast ball and Jackson hit a huge, high drive that cracked into the top of the right-field foul pole. "Through all the years I caught," Johnny Oates, then with the Dodgers, told me, "that was the single hardest-hit ball I ever saw."

Remind me why allowing pitchers to hit a batter they feel has shown them up is a bad thing? It isn't like there was so much fighting that the game had lost its integrity. Let the players police this nonsense. I'm sure with Sutton and the rest, it all boiled down to "I didn't like a particular guy, and if he does anything I don't like, he's getting drilled."

And #22 has a very accurate point re this whole thing.

Said Sutton: "I blame the video games."

Until Greg Maddux taunts Chipper Jones with the Curly Shuffle, leading Chipper to retaliate with a shooting star piledriver, "MLB SlugFest" gets a pass from me on this rap.

I've heard whining about showboating since I started following MLB in 1979
It probably started in the 70s. I remember R. Jackson kind of watching his homers, and like you say, Hammonds, Mel Hall.
This sounds like a Steve Treder historical article for THT. Somehow I doubt that Steve would be terribly interested.

I'm sure the ubiquitousness of the camera is as much to blame as anything. No modern player worth his salt doesn't know where the camera is at all times.

"I blame the video games. My 11-year-old daughter has a video game where a batter is hit by a pitch [and] charges the mound. We're teaching a generation of kids that if you don't like something that happens, charge the mound. Baseball is reflected in a video game."

Must not be MLB '08. I hit like 15 guys in a row before I got pulled, and none of them charged the mound. The worst thing that happened was Matt Vasgersian saying "Oh, you're real tough" or something like that. I will admit, though, that beaning a guy after giving up a homer does make me feel better sometimes.

I remember R. Jackson kind of watching his homers

Probably true, but also: Sorry to quote October Men again, but it's more about Reggie Jackson than anyone else. Anyway, Kahn points out that Reggie's home run trot was actually faster than most other sluggers, and interprets that as "Once he had defeated the pitcher, there was no need to prolong his agony", or something like that.

No modern player worth his salt doesn't know where the camera is at all times.

Umm, everywhere? Don't they have about 50 cameras these days?

Remind me why allowing pitchers to hit a batter they feel has shown them up is a bad thing? It isn't like there was so much fighting that the game had lost its integrity. Let the players police this nonsense. I'm sure with Sutton and the rest, it all boiled down to "I didn't like a particular guy, and if he does anything I don't like, he's getting drilled."



There's an asymmetry between hitters and pitchers. Don't we have to allow hitters to charge the mound too?

"There are a bunch of selfish, self-centered players today.”

So's your mom.

Anyway, Kahn points out that Reggie's home run trot was actually faster than most other sluggers, and interprets that as "Once he had defeated the pitcher, there was no need to prolong his agony", or something like that.

That's generous. I saw it as rushing to greet the adulation of his mirror.

Two Cardinal pitchers from a ways back:

For having an extravagant routine before the pitch, mid 1970's: Al "The Mad Hungarian" Hrabosky.

For "showboating" antics after getting batters out, including blowing on or holstering finger pistols, early 1980's: Joaquin Andujar.

WAAAAAAAAAAAA-KEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEN AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAN-DU-HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAR!

"Joe-a-Quinn Andu-Jar."

Ah, Harry Caray. I miss you so.

Andujar. I remember the first game he pitched for the A's after the Cards traded him to Oakland the offseason after his infamous World Series meltdown. I had the best tix I'd ever had for a ball game--a few rows behind the home team dugout--and Andujar was shelled in the 5th inning or something and was pulled. Some guy in a satin Cardinals jacket proceeded to run to the top of the dugout and just berated Andujar as obscenely as possible at the top of the lungs for Andujar's entire shuffle back to the dugout. I'd never seen anything like it. I still can't decide what was most striking about it--that this Cardinal fan had bought tickets to this game with the premeditated intent of screaming at Andujar, or that Andujar just kept shuffling back to the dugout with his eyes on his feet as if nothing unusual was going on. Now I would just dismiss the whole episode because I've seen it a million times, but then it was as if some veil had been lifted and, while I knew already I would never give sports fandom up, I knew I'd always be ambivalent about being a fan. There is just something inherently pathetic abouts sports fandom. It's not dominantly pathetic, but there is a sad aspect to it and at times I wish I could just put it away. Sorry for the digression--the mention of Andujar's name just brought back a strong memory of mine.

i know what you mean, shooty. years ago, i got way too invested in the new orleans saints as a fan. i'm from there and let me tell you the way saints fans carry on is unbelievable, and i was no different. it was the infamous season when they were tied with the rams for the last playoff berth and had to play them in the last game of the season, and needed to win or go home, first winning season in the balance, and of course they lost on a field goal to end the game. i carried on so long my wife thought there was something wrong with me, and i realized in the middle of it that there was. it was just a game. i've never been much of a fan of sports since, especially football.
although i do still follow the cardinals obsessively. but that's different. baseball matters.

baseball matters.

Well yeah. It's like when I'm on the wagon and single malt scotch doesn't count as alcohol. I'm ok with that.

No modern player worth his salt doesn't know where the camera is at all times.

Umm, everywhere? Don't they have about 50 cameras these days?

There is--or was--a camera in Yankee Stadium that would capture the batter perfectly as he rounded 2B on a HR trot. A couple of Yankees--A-Rod leaps to mind--have tipped their hats at it when rounding the bases on a walk-off homer.

Sutton is being something of a hypocrite here. He said something like he had never seen someone be criticized as much as Milledge for simply displaing his emotion. He was talking about him high-fiving fans when he his homer against Benitez.

Frankie Rodriguez probably feels slighted right about now. He's been doing this #### for years and no one in the national media cared about it. Joba does it once and suddenly it's the big thing for everyone to talk about.

Yeah, but at least Frankie waits until the end of the game.

I'm of mixed mind about all this. I like decorum and guys going about their business, but I also appreciate that a lot of players are fired by emotion and will get as excited by big moments as I am. So I guess I'm okay with some celebration. I guess just keep it respectful and don't direct it at your opponent. How will I say what's over the line? I'll use the obscenity standard. I can't think of any other way.