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Wednesday, June 04, 2008

Exploring The Value Teams Get From First Round Picks

The only time Reggie Smith will be mentioned in the same breath as Cal Ripken:

The Orioles got 21 seasons out of Cal Ripken.  But did the Red Sox do better with Reggie Smith?...You could probably make a case either way for which team got more “value” from their 21 seasons.  In my opinion, Ripken is still more valuable but it’s no longer a stretch to say that the Red Sox got nearly equal value out of the draft pick that netted the club Reggie Smith as the Orioles did from Cal Ripken.

vegasman2000 Posted: June 04, 2008 at 02:18 PM | 11 comment(s) | Login to Bookmark
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   1. DKDC Posted: June 04, 2008 at 03:01 PM (#2805617)
Exploring The Value Teams Get From First Round Picks


Ripken was a second round pick, and Reggie Smith was taken in a strange hybrid of today's rule 4 and rule 5 draft that took place before the modern draft was instituted in 1965.

You'd think you'd get the headline right when you are linking to your own blog.
   2. Slinger Francisco Barrios (Dr. Memory) Posted: June 04, 2008 at 03:04 PM (#2805619)
Reggie Smith was a damn good player who was better than some decent HOFers. He just couldn't play 150 very often.
   3. Steve Treder Posted: June 04, 2008 at 03:36 PM (#2805654)
Reggie Smith was taken in a strange hybrid of today's rule 4 and rule 5 draft that took place before the modern draft was instituted in 1965.

Yes, it was the "first year draft," in which the Red Sox plucked Smith from the Twins organization. But it wasn't really comparable to the amateur free agent draft that was instituted in 1965; Smith was already in pro ball when the Red Sox got him.

And though the first year draft was only in effect for a few years in the early-to-mid '60s, Rule 5 was in place as well, as it has been continuously since 1903.
   4. salvomania Posted: June 04, 2008 at 04:29 PM (#2805714)
I was looking at Reggie Smith's BBREF page and he put up an OPS+ of 137 in more than 8000 career plate appearances... that is damn impressive, and it was the second best among his top-10 most-similar batters (Indian Bob Johnson had a 138), all the rest of whom (Fred Lynn, Moises Alou, etc.) were in the 120s or lower.

Cal was 112, but I guess the positional adjustment and his longevity and reputation for durability add luster to that.
   5. Steve Treder Posted: June 04, 2008 at 04:31 PM (#2805721)
his ... reputation for durability

I think it's fair to say that Ripken had more than just a reputation for durability.
   6. no neck Posted: June 04, 2008 at 05:45 PM (#2805775)
The White Sox have 7 former 1st round picks on their 25 man roster with BA being the only home grown #1.

Linebrink is a 2nd round pick.
   7. rlc Posted: June 04, 2008 at 06:04 PM (#2805791)
his ... reputation for durability

Nolan Ryan had a reputation for throwing hard.
   8. JPWF13 Posted: June 04, 2008 at 06:07 PM (#2805796)
Cal was 112, but I guess the positional adjustment and his longevity and reputation for durability add luster to that.


It was around 122 when he had Smith's PAs...

At the age of 30 Ripken hit .323/.374/.566, an OPS+ of 162. His career OPS+ was 126, and he was a good defensive SS (Not just better than Jeter, but actually good).

From that point on, Ripken had 5800+ PAs of 96 OPS+ performance, plus steadily diminishing range in the field.
Of his last 5 years, only 1, 1999, was he anything special.

Reggie Smith is an interesting comparison, because if you subtract Smith's numbers from Ripken you get: 4800 PAs of .256/.295/.380 performance (an OPS+ of 82)

So, how much more value did Ripken give his teams than Smith?
   9. Eugene Freedman Posted: June 04, 2008 at 06:35 PM (#2805817)
So, how much more value did Ripken give his teams than Smith?


Tens of millions of dollars at the very least. Oh, you meant wins versus losses.
   10. Slinger Francisco Barrios (Dr. Memory) Posted: June 04, 2008 at 07:01 PM (#2805850)
So, how much more value did Ripken give his teams than Smith?

The value of a SS over a CF/RF, and a guy who in his prime you could <strike>pencil</strike> Sharpie into the lineup.
   11. Robinson Cano Plate Like Home Posted: June 04, 2008 at 09:06 PM (#2806050)
4800 PAs of .256/.295/.380 performance (an OPS+ of 82). So, how much more value did Ripken give his teams than Smith?

I don't know. What is 8 years of Jason Bartlett worth?
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