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Wednesday, July 01, 2009

Fraley: A’s GM Beane not so far ahead of the pack

Fraley is some quarters of Garbool Sector 12-NEEB is pronounced Paullebowitz.com

This will also be Oakland’s fourth consecutive losing season. The Athletics’ progress is more the stuff of a comedy than a celebration of big brains with laptops, but the “Major League” franchise cornered that market years ago.

The Beane-led Athletics had good ideas, but the organization was not as far ahead of the pack as the book would have had readers believe. Six years after the publication of “Moneyball,” Oakland is nowhere close to being a playoff club. The Athletics’ new-wave plan is to develop young pitchers and trade them, an approach that keeps the club trapped in a down cycle.

...The irony of “Moneyball” is that while the book relentlessly paints the Athletics as discovering the hidden value of on-base percentage, their lineup has been terrible in that area.

Through June, Oakland ranked last in the AL for on-base percentage at .312. A year ago, the Athletics tied Seattle for last in on-base percentage at .318.

Who would want to watch a movie about that?

Repoz Posted: July 01, 2009 at 05:04 PM | 88 comment(s) | Login to Bookmark
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1. JJ1986 Posted: July 01, 2009 at 05:17 PM (#3239163)

This will also be Oakland’s fourth consecutive losing season.

No.

2. Shooty: Applying to be Fearless Leader

Posted: July 01, 2009 at 05:20 PM (#3239167)

This will also be Oakland’s fourth consecutive losing season.

No.

You beat me. It's the third. It's a miserable season but I'm getting excited by the youth. Chris Carter, Cardenas, Jemille Weeks, the young pitching. I can't wait for the next reincarnation of the team. (As an A's fan, you get used to peaks and valleys. It just seems to be the intrinsic nature of the franchise.)

3. salvomania Posted: July 01, 2009 at 05:21 PM (#3239171)

No.

Maybe he's writing from the future. Or the past.

4. Shooty: Applying to be Fearless Leader

Posted: July 01, 2009 at 05:24 PM (#3239183)

Maybe he's writing from the future. Or the past.

Please be the past please be the past please be the past please be the past

5. Moneyball can't buy you love (Joey B.) Posted: July 01, 2009 at 05:24 PM (#3239184)

Hear, hear Gerry Fraley, preach on brother! The emperor has no clothes, and the mighty wizard is just a midget behind a curtain with a bunch of amplifiers and a smoke machine.

6. Shooty: Applying to be Fearless Leader

Posted: July 01, 2009 at 05:26 PM (#3239188)

Someone turn the lights on!

7. Al Kaline Trio Posted: July 01, 2009 at 05:39 PM (#3239215)

Beane poops his pants!!

8. Shooty: Applying to be Fearless Leader

Posted: July 01, 2009 at 05:41 PM (#3239219)

Mass hysteria!

9. Al Kaline Trio Posted: July 01, 2009 at 05:42 PM (#3239222)

If there is one thing that Beane has done is to have the job security to make the tough decisions. Trading away all players with value and increasing money spent on young talent hasn't been done to this extent as far as I know. He has really taken an extreme game plan the last few years.

10. Swedish Chef Posted: July 01, 2009 at 05:45 PM (#3239232)

Trading away all players with value and increasing money spent on young talent hasn't been done to this extent as far as I know.

The Marlins have done it, except for the part about spending on young talent.

11. Shooty: Applying to be Fearless Leader

Posted: July 01, 2009 at 05:48 PM (#3239242)

He has really taken an extreme game plan the last few years.

I'm a little disillusioned with what he's done with veterans and the major league level, though. Branyan and Willingham were the two guys I thought he should make a run at and he went the uber boring route with Giambi. He made his reputation with guys like Stairs and Jaha and Hatteberg but he seems to have turned his back on giving guys like that a shot. I'm also a little bitter about dumping Scutaro and keeping Crosby. That one stings. I do LOVE what he's done in the draft and in the DR the last couple of years and he hasn't lost his touch finding young pitchers. I'm just baffled that he can't put together a functioning offense anymore. (Maybe this will get easier once the Crosby/Chavez era finally and mercifully ends.)

12. Tripon Posted: July 01, 2009 at 05:48 PM (#3239244)

What was the point of trading Harden, Haren, and Blanton years before free agency though?

13. Al Kaline Trio Posted: July 01, 2009 at 05:48 PM (#3239246)

Have they changed GMs in the last few years? I don't follow them too closely.

14. Famous Original Joe C Posted: July 01, 2009 at 05:52 PM (#3239253)

Hear, hear Gerry Fraley, preach on brother! The emperor has no clothes, and the mighty wizard is just a midget behind a curtain with a bunch of amplifiers and a smoke machine.

If only we could find someone could trot out Backlasher's tired old act from 2004, only with a total lack of intellect or sense of humor...it'd be just what the site needs.

15. Quiet Flows the Don Taussig Avenger (Edmundo)

Posted: July 01, 2009 at 05:52 PM (#3239255)

What was the point of trading Harden, Haren, and Blanton years before free agency though?
One of these is not like the others and for him Beane got Outman and Cardenas, who should be mainstays for the three years that Beane keeps them before trading them away. (that last bit was for you, Shooty).

16. Shooty: Applying to be Fearless Leader

Posted: July 01, 2009 at 05:53 PM (#3239257)

What was the point of trading Harden, Haren, and Blanton years before free agency though?

Harden--the fear was he'd break again any second and you'd better cash in while you could.
Blanton--I just don't think the organization thought he was a good bet for the long term.
Haren--Arizona offered a lot. He had also faded dramatically in the second half his last 2 years in Oakland and I think there was some fear of injury.

17. Moneyball can't buy you love (Joey B.) Posted: July 01, 2009 at 06:06 PM (#3239296)

The Marlins have done it, except for the part about spending on young talent.

They locked up Hanley Ramirez for six seasons for $70 million; he's theirs to the end of 2014.

So who do the A's have locked up for the next five and half seasons who's still fairly young and really good?

18. Danny Posted: July 01, 2009 at 06:07 PM (#3239299)

What was the point of trading Harden, Haren, and Blanton years before free agency though?

They wanted to restock the farm system instead of hoping a mediocre team could make a run. Harden's a free agent after this year, while Blanton and Haren (until the D-Backs extended) would have been free agents after next year.

The Blanton trade looks pretty good, though it would look a lot better if Outman didn't need TJ surgery. It's still early, but the Haren trade seems to be working out as well as either side could have hoped. Gallagher and Donaldson could both still contribute, but the Harden trade is looking like the worst of the bunch.

19. Shooty: Applying to be Fearless Leader

Posted: July 01, 2009 at 06:09 PM (#3239303)

So who do the A's have locked up for the next five and half seasons who's still fairly young and really good?

Shooty and Danny and Johnny Clash and Al Kaline Trio, just for starters! We're, like, awesome and stuff.

20. Rich Rifkin Posted: July 01, 2009 at 06:11 PM (#3239311)

Since Beane became GM in 1998, how well have they drafted? Here are my grades:

1998: B -- Mark Mulder; Eric Byrnes.
1999: B -- Barry Zito; Ryan Ludwick.
2000: C -- Rich Harden.
2001: C -- Bobby Crosby; Jeremy Bonderman; Dan Johnson.
2002: B+ -- Nick Swisher; Joe Blanton; Mark Teahen; John Baker.
2003: C- -- Andre Ethier.
2004: B -- Huston Street; Kurt Suzuki; Dallas Braden.
2005: F+ -- Travis Buck.

That's a fairly good record (compared with others I've recently looked at, such as the Cubs and Yankees). However, not one all-star among position players has come through the A's system (as an A's draft pick) in the Billy Beane era.

21. Jose Can You Seabiscuit Posted: July 01, 2009 at 06:14 PM (#3239319)

Rich - Have there been players they had to/chose to avoid due to signability issues that would have fit into the star category there? I'm not a draftnik so I don't really know but it would be interesting.

22. Designated Sitter (GGC) Posted: July 01, 2009 at 06:17 PM (#3239332)

Shooty and Danny and Johnny Clash and Al Kaline Trio, just for starters! We're, like, awesome and stuff.

What happened to Greg Maddux School? Did he get non-tendered?

23. Shooty: Applying to be Fearless Leader

Posted: July 01, 2009 at 06:19 PM (#3239336)

However, not one all-star among position players has come through the A's system (as an A's draft pick) in the Billy Beane era.

I'm hoping this changes now that they're mixing in more high-upside, high risk guys with the polished college hitters, not to mention the signabilty guys they're throwing cash at in the later rounds.

24. Shooty: Applying to be Fearless Leader

Posted: July 01, 2009 at 06:20 PM (#3239340)

What happened to Greg Maddux School? Did he get non-tendered?

Lots of good A's fans on BBTF. I didn't want to get carpal tunnel listing them all. My apologies to all left off. You're all heroes!

25. Danny Posted: July 01, 2009 at 06:21 PM (#3239341)

They locked up Hanley Ramirez for six seasons for $70 million; he's theirs to the end of 2014.

So who do the A's have locked up for the next five and half seasons who's still fairly young and really good?

Billy Beane? ;)

26. Danny Posted: July 01, 2009 at 06:24 PM (#3239346)

Since Beane became GM in 1998, how well have they drafted? Here are my grades:

How are you grading these? I can't see how the 2002 draft is better than the rest. The A's got 1430 innings of 125 ERA+ from Zito before free agency--that's a pretty awesome draft even if no one else panned out.

27. kthejoker Posted: July 01, 2009 at 06:32 PM (#3239358)

Wow, people don't get A drafts even when they pick Cy Young winners? Harsh.

28. Robert Machemer Posted: July 01, 2009 at 06:48 PM (#3239399)

I thought (and correct me if I'm wrong on this) that the point of Moneyball was that Beane was trying to make more with less; and if that's right, wouldn't the real measure of the Beane era be to compare wins to dollars spent? Have the teams which have spent similarly low amounts of money on payroll had more or fewer wins than Beane's team?

29. How to lose a guy in jemile weeks Posted: July 01, 2009 at 06:52 PM (#3239410)

I'm getting excited by the youth. Chris Carter, Cardenas, Jemille Weeks

JEMILE WEEKS SIGHTING!

30. Justin T contains indigenous nudity Posted: July 01, 2009 at 06:52 PM (#3239411)

31. Rich Rifkin Posted: July 01, 2009 at 07:01 PM (#3239439)

Rich - Have there been players they had to/chose to avoid due to signability issues that would have fit into the star category there? I'm not a draftnik so I don't really know but it would be interesting.

I don't think so. In fact, the A's have recently been among the big spenders on signing foreign youngsters. If memory serves, Mulder and then Zito were given healthy signing bonuses, although nothing in the Prior or Teixeira class.

How are you grading these?

My A standard is two or more all-star caliber players deserves an A. No decent major leaguers is an F. And everything else falls somewhere in between.

I can't see how the 2002 draft is better than the rest.

That's perhaps a fair knock. I gave it a slightly higher grade because it has four major leaguers (if you count Baker) contributing at a decent level.

The A's got 1430 innings of 125 ERA+ from Zito before free agency--that's a pretty awesome draft even if no one else panned out.

Yeah, maybe 1999 deserves a B+. It produced one all-star and one pretty good major leaguer. (Of course, other than last year, at age 29, and his part-time role the season prior, it's a bit hard to say Ryan Ludwick is "pretty good," but for now I give him that benefit of the doubt.)

32. Jose Can You Seabiscuit Posted: July 01, 2009 at 07:05 PM (#3239456)

I thought (and correct me if I'm wrong on this) that the point of Moneyball was that Beane was trying to make more with less

It is. That it's a business book more than a sports book is lost on the sportswriters who have no understanding of the business world. At the end of the day the basic point of the book is "find undervalued property" which is in fact a good idea. It has nothing to do with OBP or drafting college kids, those were just the market inefficiencies of the time the book was written.

33. Fred Lynn Nolan Ryan Sweeney Agonistes Posted: July 01, 2009 at 07:14 PM (#3239487)

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

= A's fan. Still hoping for a miracle season, this year. Dammit.

34. Crispix Attacks Posted: July 01, 2009 at 07:19 PM (#3239499)

It is. That it's a business book more than a sports book is lost on the sportswriters who have no understanding of the business world. At the end of the day the basic point of the book is "find undervalued property" which is in fact a good idea. It has nothing to do with OBP or drafting college kids, those were just the market inefficiencies of the time the book was written.

Exactly.

But was it a book about succeeding by making money, or succeeding by winning games? After all, now Beane may have decided the best way to succeed, financial-wise, is to be the worst and most unpopular team in the league. The Pirates and Marlins make a no-risk profit every year.

35. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: July 01, 2009 at 07:19 PM (#3239500)

But he's still the best looking GM in the game right? Or is it Jack Zduriencik now?

36. Walt Davis Posted: July 01, 2009 at 07:22 PM (#3239509)

Well, let's be clear that, Rich's harsh grading system aside, it's not a grading of the quality of a draft. It's the grading of the combination of draft quality, development quality, and keeping players healthy.

Rich Harden may never make an AS team but, until this season at least, he has been the most talented/best starter in baseball. How that could possibly be a "C" draft is beyond me. It looks like an F on keeping players healthy and maybe there were things that could have been done during development to reduce the injury risk. But the draft is about acquiring talent and from ages 23-26, Harden K'd 9.8/9, gave up .7 HR/9, a 2.7 K/BB and a 169 ERA+. Yes, that's an "average" draft.

In contrast, the classic Braves teams drafted "poorly" (not necessarily corrected for drafting position) but developed like nobody's business (a huge number of productive very late-round picks). Also, whether by luck or design, few of their stars ever suffered major injuries (Avery (and that was a long time ago), anybody else?).

But regardless, if Rich actually sticks to that grading scheme across all teams, then those grades for the A's are fair and they will come out as one of the best "drafting" teams in baseball. There won't be more than a handful of A grades handed out, a B/B+ is a way above-average "draft."

37. Moneyball can't buy you love (Joey B.) Posted: July 01, 2009 at 07:25 PM (#3239519)

Still hoping for a miracle season, this year. Dammit.

As Dana Carvey's George H.W. Bush would say, "Not gonna happen". I incorrectly assumed before the season that the A's offense had to better than it was last season. Much to my surprise, it's even worse.

This is clearly one of the worst teams in the American League, and the trading will almost certainly be underway before too much longer.

38. Designated Sitter (GGC) Posted: July 01, 2009 at 07:27 PM (#3239523)

Was Blindside a sports book or a was there some other meaning to it?

39. Crispix Attacks Posted: July 01, 2009 at 07:28 PM (#3239524)

Rich Harden may never make an AS team but, until this season at least, he has been the most talented/best starter in baseball. How that could possibly be a "C" draft is beyond me. It looks like an F on keeping players healthy and maybe there were things that could have been done during development to reduce the injury risk.

What do you mean by "during development"? The A's had very limited control over Harden from the moment of conception until age 19. Not everything that's broken can be fixed.

40. flournoy Posted: July 01, 2009 at 07:43 PM (#3239573)

Also, whether by luck or design, few of [the Braves'] stars ever suffered major injuries (Avery (and that was a long time ago), anybody else?).

Avery is the only big one, and not only was that a long time ago, but he was very productive for a few years and was an important piece of a championship team (as important as a #4 starter can be, at least).

Chipper Jones tore his ACL in 1994 and never really regained his speed, but nobody's complaining about Chipper Jones.

Of course, the Braves have had minor league pitchers hurt their arms and disappear, just like any other team. Jake Stevens is one, I think. I guess Anthony Lerew would fit. The nature of these guys makes it pretty hard to recall names though, since they're wholly unmemorable.

41. Obama Bomaye Posted: July 01, 2009 at 07:54 PM (#3239615)

Was Blindside a sports book or a was there some other meaning to it?

Someone here knows, but they can't tell you.

42. Shooty: Applying to be Fearless Leader

Posted: July 01, 2009 at 08:03 PM (#3239636)

As Dana Carvey's George H.W. Bush would say, "Not gonna happen".

Man. Dana Carvey's George Bush? If you're going to come, come correct or spend more time worrying about your Nats. Dana Carvey. For crissakes.

43. JoeHova Posted: July 01, 2009 at 08:05 PM (#3239641)

Was Blindside a sports book or a was there some other meaning to it?

It was a book about illegal recruiting that spent the whole time insisting that it wasn't a book about illegal recruiting. It was still a good book though, and it made me a Michael Oher fan.

44. Nasty Nate Posted: July 01, 2009 at 08:13 PM (#3239650)

They wanted to restock the farm system instead of hoping a mediocre team could make a run.

It just seems incongruous with trading for Holliday.

45. Moneyball can't buy you love (Joey B.) Posted: July 01, 2009 at 08:14 PM (#3239653)

Man. Dana Carvey's George Bush? If you're going to come, come correct or spend more time worrying about your Nats. Dana Carvey. For crissakes.

I have absolutely no idea what the hell you're talking about, idiot. You do know who George H.W. Bush is, right?

46. Shooty: Applying to be Fearless Leader

Posted: July 01, 2009 at 08:15 PM (#3239656)

I have absolutely no idea what the hell you're talking about, idiot. You do know who George H.W. Bush is, right?

I have zero doubt you don't know what I'm talking about.

47. Nasty Nate Posted: July 01, 2009 at 08:17 PM (#3239660)

uh, Joey. he was making fun of you referencing a 17-year old SNL skit, I think. he has high humor standards.

48. Moneyball can't buy you love (Joey B.) Posted: July 01, 2009 at 08:17 PM (#3239661)

No, I don't. Please enlighten me.

49. Shooty: Applying to be Fearless Leader

Posted: July 01, 2009 at 08:21 PM (#3239668)

uh, Joey. he was making fun of you referencing a 17-year old SNL skit, I think. he has high humor standards.

Or just standards. Breaking out Dana Carvey's hack impersonation of the old Bush as a way to talk #### is just indescribably sad to me. Come back Backlasher! Where the hell are you?

50. Fred Lynn Nolan Ryan Sweeney Agonistes Posted: July 01, 2009 at 08:21 PM (#3239669)

I have absolutely no idea what the hell you're talking about, idiot. You do know who George H.W. Bush is, right?

I believe Mr. Shooty was "busting on" you, for your 20-year-old reference-y-ness.

Isn't that special?

Edit: one Coke, one Coke Zero.

51. Nasty Nate Posted: July 01, 2009 at 08:24 PM (#3239674)

I better not be getting the Coke Zero. When I drink it, I'm like that lady from the commercials: "Where's the beef?"

52. Fred Lynn Nolan Ryan Sweeney Agonistes Posted: July 01, 2009 at 08:26 PM (#3239679)

Whatchoo talkin' bout, Nasty Nate?

53. Danny Posted: July 01, 2009 at 08:26 PM (#3239681)

It just seems incongruous with trading for Holliday.

Sure does.

54. Shooty: Applying to be Fearless Leader

Posted: July 01, 2009 at 08:30 PM (#3239692)

I believe Mr. Shooty was "busting on" you, for your 20-year-old reference-y-ness.

I don't mind the age of the reference. But if Joey wants to keep jumping in A's threads to tell us how awful our team is I wish he'd at least make me chuckle and not make me want to take up a collection for him.

55. ?Donde esta Dagoberto Campaneris? Posted: July 01, 2009 at 08:32 PM (#3239696)

Not only the Holliday trade, but the Cabrera signing, which I believe cost them a pick, seems inconsistent with a team building for the long term.

56. The Most Interesting Man In The World Posted: July 01, 2009 at 08:36 PM (#3239701)

So who do the A's have locked up for the next five and half seasons who's still fairly young and really good?

Ray Fosse.

Well, one out of three ain't bad.

57. Fred Lynn Nolan Ryan Sweeney Agonistes Posted: July 01, 2009 at 08:38 PM (#3239706)

Yeah, like a lot of people I just thought they'd hit better.

Instead, they've got:
seven hitting as bad or worse than they ever have (Giambi, Cabrera, Hannahan, Holliday, Buck, Cust, Kennedy);
two hitting about as mediocre-ly as it seems they're going to (Suzuki, Crosby);
and a bunch of potential bright spots hurt (Sweeney, Chavez, Garciaparra, Ellis).

Feels like a snake-bit season. Again.

EDIT: formatting fail.

58. The Most Interesting Man In The World Posted: July 01, 2009 at 08:48 PM (#3239718)

seven hitting as bad or worse than they ever have (Giambi, Cabrera, Hannahan, Holliday, Buck, Cust, Kennedy

I wouldn't agree with Kennedy. In fact, I'd wager he'll be their All Star selection!

59. Fred Lynn Nolan Ryan Sweeney Agonistes Posted: July 01, 2009 at 09:05 PM (#3239737)

Sadly, even Kennedy's headed back towards his career norms, thanks to a .602 OPS in June.

Me, I'd go with Dallas Braden.
Though I have a terrible feeling the ASG would turn him into Atlee Hammaker.

60. Crispix Attacks Posted: July 01, 2009 at 09:13 PM (#3239750)

I wouldn't agree with Kennedy. In fact, I'd wager he'll be their All Star selection!

What was the last time a team's only All-Star was someone who didn't even start the season with that team?

I don't remember that ever happening. Rick Reed with the Twins, maybe? Ken Griffey Jr. with the Reds?

61. Steve Treder Posted: July 01, 2009 at 09:17 PM (#3239754)

What was the last time a team's only All-Star was someone who didn't even start the season with that team?

I don't remember that ever happening. Rick Reed with the Twins, maybe?

What's more, it isn't just that Kennedy didn't star the season with his current team. He was a mid-May scrap-heap AAA pickup, acquired merely as a stopgap injury replacement. He's basically end-of-the-roster fodder.

What a dismal ball club the A's have become.

62. puck Posted: July 01, 2009 at 09:28 PM (#3239763)

Breaking out Dana Carvey's hack impersonation of the old Bush as a way to talk #### is just indescribably sad to me

Didn't he also get the line wrong?

63. The Most Interesting Man In The World Posted: July 01, 2009 at 09:30 PM (#3239767)

I believe that Al Davis of the 1984 Seattle Mariners was an All Star who didn't start the season in the majors, although he was also a well-known prospect.

I'd guess there would be a few others that fit that description.

64. FBI Regional Bureau Chief GORDON COLE!!! Posted: July 01, 2009 at 09:39 PM (#3239773)

#45's use of the word "idiot" may be the most ironic thing I've ever read, anyplace.

65. Fred Lynn Nolan Ryan Sweeney Agonistes Posted: July 01, 2009 at 09:42 PM (#3239776)

What a dismal ball club the A's have become.

They're bad, sure, but it's not like they're the Nationals.
They're dismal.

/Dundee

66. Fred Lynn Nolan Ryan Sweeney Agonistes Posted: July 01, 2009 at 09:44 PM (#3239778)

And, Puck: yes.

The line is "Not gonna do it." (pronounced "Nah guh do it.")

"That's not gonna happen" was Clint Eastwood, in "In the Line of Fire" (1993).

67. Obama Bomaye Posted: July 01, 2009 at 09:46 PM (#3239779)

So we all agree Joey B. is an enormous ####-up of a poster in every imaginable way?

68. The Most Interesting Man In The World Posted: July 01, 2009 at 09:51 PM (#3239785)

#45's use of the word "idiot" may be the most ironic thing I've ever read, anyplace.

For a moment I considered adding that to my "Favorite Quotes" section of my Facebook profile, but then decided both that it's not gonna happen and I'm not gonna do it.

69. Shooty: Applying to be Fearless Leader

Posted: July 01, 2009 at 10:04 PM (#3239793)

So we all agree Joey B. is an enormous ####-up of a poster in every imaginable way?

On one hand I feel bad for taking Joey's bait...but yeah.

70. Fred Lynn Nolan Ryan Sweeney Agonistes Posted: July 01, 2009 at 10:05 PM (#3239794)

Joey B. loves it when a pan comes together.

71. Shooty: Applying to be Fearless Leader

Posted: July 01, 2009 at 10:07 PM (#3239796)

Joey B. loves it when a pan comes together.

That pun was DY-NO-MITE!

72. Al Kaline Trio Posted: July 01, 2009 at 10:20 PM (#3239804)

Golly gee Batman I just don't know why they won't lay off the guy!

POW!

WHACK!!

KAZAAAM!!!

73. Rich Rifkin Posted: July 01, 2009 at 10:22 PM (#3239806)

But regardless, if Rich actually sticks to that grading scheme across all teams, then those grades for the A's are fair and they will come out as one of the best "drafting" teams in baseball. There won't be more than a handful of A grades handed out, a B/B+ is a way above-average "draft."

Agreed.

This is an example of an A draft, despite Loney's 2009 performance: L.A. Dodgers 2002

1st -- James Loney
2nd -- Jonathan Broxton
17th -- Russell Martin
Plus: Delwyn Young (4th)

74. AROM Posted: July 01, 2009 at 10:53 PM (#3239818)

The allstar selection on a bad team often goes to a reliever. Almost any team has at least one with good numbers. Andrew Bailey could be the guy. Maybe Kurt Suzuki.

75. Lassus: Posted: July 01, 2009 at 10:54 PM (#3239820)

I have Joey on ignore anyhow, but is it too late to make fun of Shooty for saying "come correct"?

Hee.

76. Shooty: Applying to be Fearless Leader

Posted: July 01, 2009 at 11:07 PM (#3239826)

I have Joey on ignore anyhow, but is it too late to make fun of Shooty for saying "come correct"?

Hee.

You dissin me G?

77. A triple short of the cycle

Posted: July 01, 2009 at 11:14 PM (#3239832)

Shooty and Danny and Johnny Clash and Al Kaline Trio, just for starters! We're, like, awesome and stuff.

Right on, brother Shooty.

Not only the Holliday trade, but the Cabrera signing, which I believe cost them a pick, seems inconsistent with a team building for the long term.

UGH. Yes, agree, Beane's recent moves have been baffling. If we are building for the future, why did we sign Cabrera to play over Crosby? Giambi over Barton? Kennedy over Patterson? Nomar?! Why are Rajai and Cust playing instead of Buck? For that matter, as much as I love him, why did we resign Ellis when we have Patterson/Petit/Pennington?

78. Al Kaline Trio Posted: July 01, 2009 at 11:20 PM (#3239836)

2005 A's draft got an F+???? Here's a recap

Buck -> If he can get over the injury / early career suckiness could be a league average corner OF.

Vincent Mazzaro round 3 / pick 101 / RHP / Rutherford HS (N.J.) -> He's looking good so far.

Justin Smoak round 16 / pick 491 / 1B / Stratford HS (S.C.) -> Couldn't sign him (draft fault? or money? F away if you want)

Cliff Pennington might become a utility guy

Italiano and Jared Lansford are still pitching the minors and might make it to the big league club. I'd say that it's very premature to label that draft as an F+.

79. Lassus: Posted: July 01, 2009 at 11:28 PM (#3239841)

You dissin me G?

Never, I know you Castro Valley types are tough.

80. phredbird

Posted: July 01, 2009 at 11:29 PM (#3239844)

al, at lunch i saw a guy with an alkaline trio shirt on, and i had a moment where i thought to myself 'i'm supposed to know that guy, but i can't remember from where ...'

81. Shooty: Applying to be Fearless Leader

Posted: July 01, 2009 at 11:31 PM (#3239846)

Never, I know you Castro Valley types are tough.

Hayward, dammit. Hayward!

I stopped listening to rap about 1992. I'm a little sad how much of the lingo I've forgotten. I can't even do a crappy Pete Nice anymore.

82. Steve Sparks Flying Everywhere Posted: July 01, 2009 at 11:32 PM (#3239849)

2005 A's draft got an F+????

I believe the Astros 2007 draft qualifies as an F+

83. Obama Bomaye Posted: July 02, 2009 at 12:33 AM (#3239913)

I can't even do a crappy Pete Nice anymore.

Props on keeping it baseball-related.

84. Crispix Attacks Posted: July 02, 2009 at 12:36 AM (#3239916)

Shooty gets the gas face.

85. FBI Regional Bureau Chief GORDON COLE!!! Posted: July 02, 2009 at 01:00 AM (#3239940)

For a moment I considered adding that to my "Favorite Quotes" section of my Facebook profile, but then decided both that it's not gonna happen and I'm not gonna do it.

Wouldn't be prudent at this juncture?

86. FBI Regional Bureau Chief GORDON COLE!!! Posted: July 02, 2009 at 01:01 AM (#3239942)

You dissin me G?

I'm not trying to hear that, slice.

87. Al Kaline Trio Posted: July 02, 2009 at 04:00 PM (#3240408)

#80 That's pretty funny or sad depending on your point of view.

88. Walt Davis Posted: July 02, 2009 at 08:00 PM (#3240847)

My A standard is two or more all-star caliber players deserves an A. No decent major leaguers is an F. And everything else falls somewhere in between.

1st -- James Loney
2nd -- Jonathan Broxton
17th -- Russell Martin
Plus: Delwyn Young (4th)

I guess you're going for Broxton and Martin as 'AS caliber players". Broxton's been good, but it's still just 280 IP. I'm not sure Martin & Broxton are greater than Zito or Mulder on their own (we'll have to see if Martin bounces back).

Loney's gonna have to go all Carlos Pena before I'll think he's ever gonna be much.

And Martin makes my point. He was a 17th round draft pick. That's not good drafting, it's either astounding luck or a great job of development.

And to whoever it was who asked, "development" = "the years between drafting and making the majors" ... y'know, the period during which talented draft picks turn into quality major leaguers (or don't).

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