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A mildly intriguing subplot to the Ghana-Serbia matchup is that Ghana are coached by...a Serb!
Nigeria is not the team they were 10-15 years ago, but I don't think many people will.
This is true. But South Korea is not the team they were in 2002 with Guus at the helm. They've always been in the World Cup as far back as I can remember because their qualification route is so piss-easy. And just as reliably, they've always gone out in the group stages. Pretty much every time except the year they co-hosted, I think.
Greece is the dark horse in Group B. I hope they make a swift exit because they're appalling to watch, but that same style of play somehow won them the Euros five years ago. They make themselves difficult to beat, and that counts for a lot in internationals.
Seems like a weird thing to have strong feelings about.
South Korea always seemed to me to be a hard working, fast team that couldn't get a result because they don't play anywhere near as good as it looks. Maybe the Anti-Greece.
It's not "Campeones de la Serie Mundial." It's "World Series Champions." You're a ####### American. We speak English, not that gibberish there in your name.
I'm intentionally using in another language, not affecting a native familiarity with it.
Seems like a weird thing to have strong feelings about.
Nothing chaps my ass more than some tapered-jeans hipster who never played a day of soccer in his life who decides to "get into" soccer because "its the world game", and 6 months later is standing on line outside of Nevada Smiths on Saturday mornings talking about how much he loves "sport", how the conditions on the "pitch" are unacceptable for "football", and how some soccer player is a "class performer" with an "excellent work-rate".
The English invented a lot of things which they call by different names and spell in different ways. We don't use those names and spellings because we're American and we're not affecting a false Continental chic.
How about if I've played and followed soccer since I was a kid, 2nd generation of Italian immigrants who loved the game, and don't think there's any such thing as unacceptable pitch conditions (rain harder!). Hell, I even went to a Cosmos game when I was like 5. Can I call it a pitch?
If Shooty is a tapered-jeans hipster, though, then have at it. Ass-chaps away.
Why discard the terminology when importing the sport just to satisfy some yearning for a linguistic purity that has never been a reality? It's the same language after all.
This is better: 'zop, you're exceeding Gaelen's levels of rude lunacy.
Because we're not importing the sport! We all, or at least most of us, played soccer as a kid. And maybe your soccer coach or camp counselor or whathaveyou were different than mine, but we played "soccer" on a "field". What's exasperating is not the word "pitch", which is a perfectly fine word and no better or worse than field, but the way that soccer fandom in the US has become tied up with this affected internationalism. The whole point, for those people, of watching soccer, is that its not-common currency in the US and the intentional adaptation of non-American verbiage is part of the false coolness.
So yes, if you're the child of someone from Europe and you called it a pitch your whole life etc etc then there's nothing obnoxious about it; but for the people for whom soccer is basically indie rock with cleats, then, they can go bugger themselves. Irony intended.
You must be a lot younger than I am.
I'm third-generation Polish, played soccer for a very long time, and have called it both a pitch and a field with little thought for the reasons since it was called both by the same 1st, 2nd, and 3rd-generation northern New Yorkers since I was 13. Your theory is ludicrous and your reasons for it are unreasonable shrill.
I consider myself lucky that I don't know any of these douchey types.
Now excuse me, I have to go lace up my boots and kick a football on the local pitch with my mates before we go down the pub and have a few pints.
And SA '10 are worse than USA '94. USA '94 had the benefit of a stable manager (sorry, coach) , a great team ethic and a relentless schedule of friendlies (sorry, exhibition games) to mould them into basically a club team rather than an international team.
By comparison SA has infighting, a manager (sorry, coach) who keeps resigning and the demands of club football (sorry, soccer) overriding their preparations. If they manage to make it through the group they will be the living proof in fans being able to rise a team to new levels.
See: http://www.ussoccer.com/Teams/US-Men/Player-Pool/Player-Pool.aspx
It won't surprise you in the least but I laughed at both of zop's posts. Shooty is a friend, but those were some good lines.
" . . a truck becomes a lorry because it is carrying lemon curd," is a good line. And the follow up is even better: "talking about how much he loves "sport", how the conditions on the "pitch" are unacceptable for "football", and how some soccer player is a "class performer" with an "excellent work-rate". That's funny any way you slice it.
Oh, and I'm not rude.
I like the weird adjectives UK announcers use when calling soccer. There's an insistent tackle! they're probably just UK sports cliches, but after a lifetime of American sports cliches washing over me, it's a nice change. There's this one Brit announcer that sounds like a drunken hooligan when he calls the game, but I can't remember his name. That guy is a lot of fun.
I do, however, stick by the lunacy comment. :-D
Aside from the fact that that's what the game is called, calling European football by its proper name is good because it annoys the #### out of uptight dickwads.
I always like it when a failed attack is called "a good idea" or "an interesting thought".
one summer at camp, I think I was 13 or so, they brought in a soccer coach/counselor from Scotland. And aside from all the glorious soccerisms that he'd say was one particularly funny one (which i now realize, having listened to announcers from the UK, is really common):
Anything "bad" was "unlucky!"
Slip and fall? "Unlucky!" Kick the ball into your own team's net? "Unlucky!" Run face-first into a goal-post? "Unlucky!"
It got to the point where we started adopting it for use elsewhere in camp life. Get shot down by a girl at a social? "Unlucky!" Fall for the icy-hot-on-the-toilet-bowl trick? "Unlucky!" Bunkmate with a twisted testicle? "Unlucky!"
That was a fun summer.
You were that boy, weren't you? No wonder you hate Britishisms. In my mind, your new handle is Unlucky.
Naw, I kid. The Scottish are great, except for that particular breed of Scot who says "yeah" after every sentence. For some irrational reason that bugs the hell out of me.
You were that boy, weren't you? No wonder you hate Britishisms. In my mind, your new handle is Unlucky.
I was sure the kid who was shot down at the socials, but not the poor souls with the testicle issues. Actually, that kid had sort of an interesting story- age 13, he's in my bunk at camp, sort of a normal kid except he fell for the icy hot trick and twisted his testicle and made a stupid mistake during color war that everyone gave him #### for. But otherwise just like everyone else. I run into him 2 years later, and he's gay, and not gay like "i like guys" gay, like, SUPERINCREDIBLYFLAMING, with a totally different voice, mannerisms...virtually unrecognizable, like a Carson Kressley type but already at age 15 or 16.
Sometimes I wonder what the hell musta been going through his head that summer.
He was probably masturbating to the vision of your wet, naked body as you came out of the shower. Unlucky indeed!
He was probably masturbating to the vision of your wet, naked body as you came out of the shower. Unlucky indeed!
Sir, you have never seen me naked. As my girlfriend puts it, "Its not your best look."
That's not bad. My girl can't formulate a complete sentence through her laughter.
Maybe with a hat?
Or maybe that was "John Candy".
Now, one of my favorite habits of these British people is their tendency to use the word "shocking" as the worst possible insult. It doesn't even seem to mean "surprising", just bad. Imagine Steve Buccigross saying "The Buffalo Bills' offensive line was shocking. Six sacks, and Ryan Fitzpatrick had to throw the ball away at least six times."
Also the constant appearance in headlines of the words "shock", "dream", and "horror" as adjectives.
Very much so. My Mum considered it a swear word, not as bad as the F-word, but basically on a par with the S-word...
Oh and it's a cricket pitch.
And it wouldn't be surprising if one of the bigger premier league teams went in for Dempsey, he's been very good under Roy Hodgson.
When evaluating the teams don't underestimate the effect of the manager; don't expect much from Portugal or Argentina because they are both managed (specially the latter) by guys who couldn't find their arse with both hands and a map. Same as England under the wally with the brolly.
I think that was down to communication issues. Schteve had trouble getting hish point acrosh to the ladsh when schpeaking in hish native Hollandaise.
It wouldn't shock me, but I would be surprised if Dempsey left Fulham anytime soon.
He's always struck me as someone very aware of both his strengths and his weaknesses. I think he knows that he owes a lot of his current success to Hodgson. And I think he also knows that if he moved to a 'bigger' team he wouldn't get the minutes he does with Fulham.
Put those together and you get a situation where he's probably a lot better off playing everyday in a well put together Fulham team than sitting on the bench for Aston Villa.
And what's more, as long as Hodgson is there, you could make a case for Fulham as a 'bigger' team. They'll never challenge for the top 4 obviously, but they're in Europe right now and have an outside chance of returning. It's not glamorous, but it's also not like he's at Hull or Ipswich or something.
I think this is the reverse of what 'dzop is saying. I think.
Also, living in London is a lot more bearable than those places, or any other English city.
He's actually doing very well in the Eredivisie at the moment, topping the table. His biggest problem was "assistant manager to manager" syndrome...
Where are you in London? If by the grace of Dog you're still here in the summer, we should have a World Cup meetup, if not sooner.
He's actually doing very well in the Eredivisie at the moment, topping the table. His biggest problem was "assistant manager to manager" syndrome...
Many of the pundits seem to think he was too buddy-buddy with the players to be effective in the national team role. Could be that approach works better at club level; I don't know.
I'm actually out in Farnham for the past year or so, I just say London because it's easier than trying to explain where Farnham is!
Anyways, I am not a big soccer fan, but I love the World Cup and the qualifying, etc. One of the amazing things is how an internal rooting hierarchy will evolve as I'm watching random games during the WC. I think this was more or less what I settled on in '06:
USA
England and other English-speaking countries from the old British Empire
sub-Saharan African countries
CONCACAF countries (non-Mexico)
Far East countries
Eastern Europe / Russia / Former Soviet states
South American countries
Middle East / North Africa
Western Europe
Mexico
France
Based on this hierarchy, I usually end up disappointed in the match result. I mean score of the game.
Jeez, that's practically in Hampshire out there! Farnham is ringing a bell in my little pea brain for some reason. I think there's a trout fishery near there that one of my mates was keen to try in the spring, maybe that's it.
I'm in Teddington. The other London guys I've met are at least south of the river, or in SW or Surrey, though I think there are one or two located downtown or north.
My rooting interests for thus next Cup will go something like
USA
Honduras
England (I think this is a function of a shared heritage and that the majority of European games on the tube are EPL so I'm familiar with a lot of the players.)
Netherlands (they are fun to watch. I would love to see them win.)
Any African country except Algeria
Australia
Spain
Brazil
Then I'm undecided. I do know I'll crap my pants in disgust if Italy or France win.
I see it called footie here sometimes. I don't care for that term; not because it sounds hipsterish, but because it sounds like baby-talk.
Yep! Work in Hampshire and I got sick of commuting out of London, still only 35 minutes away on the fast train so it's not too bad. I used to live in Surbiton so I just moved further down the A3!! And, yesh, there is a fishery near Farnham I think I drive past it whenever I head out to my nearest farmshop.
Ah, that makes sense. And I think I actually should have read your previous post that way. Oh well.
I've mentioned this before, but I actually follow the referees and ARs more than the action typically. I was on track to be a pretty high level referee through age 19 before developing tendinitis in both my knees. When I'm watching a game (or match!), I'm usually about 5 minutes ahead of the announcers in explaining why an unusual decision occurred as they scramble around on the air in exasperation yelling, "That's not right!" until someone points out how the play fit into the Laws.
US, Italy, Germany. It's ancestral, what can I say?
I enjoyed watching the Netherlands and Australia play in the past.
Other than that though, I usually just 'root' for a well-played match. Fast, creative; basically the opposite of the negative stereotype the game gets in a good part of American media. African and Asian countries seem to have fit in this category more than not in the recent past.
Does this include the referees? There was some game in 2005 or 2006 or so where the US were playing somebody and a very even-tempered friend called me in a state I have never heard him in before or since. He was apoplectic and literally incomprehensible over some call an Italian ref had made and proceeded to say a lot of legally actionable things about Italian referees.
DOWN WITH SLOVENIA
GO BACK TO RUSSIA, SLOVENIANS
Australia
Netherlands and England
Non-superpower European teams
USA, New Zealand, others..
Will actively root for them to lose: Argentina (Brazil is temporarily removed from this group, because of the amusing sight of panties being bunched over their current playing style).
Since my rooting interests go, in order, USA, Australia, Mexico, Netherlands, England, I feel okay about this. Seems like Mexico caught a tough draw, though.
EDIT: So did the Aussies.
And how about a "friendly"? That sounds like good slang for a lot of things...but in soccer, I mean. Is it just any exhibition/game that doesn't count towards one of the 173 competitions a club might be involved in during the season?
Fixture = scheduled games.
Friendly is a one-off game that has no significance to any competition. They're usually for the purpose of getting the players ready - effectively Spring Training games. Particularly for the national teams, it's a way to give them a chance to play together outside of qualifying or the actual competitions.
They're also about $$ - random games designed to pack a stadium somewhere. For instance, Real Madrid might go play a friendly in Dubai because it'll net them a million bucks or something.
- US
- Turkey (my mom is Turkish)
- Ireland (my club team is Reading who for their brief stay in the EPL were massively populated by Irish players)
- non-Mexico CONCACAF teams
- teams with a legitimate shot of winning that I like (England, Spain, Ivory Coast)
- non-European teams (particularly New Zealand right now - because they're so much worse than the other 31 teams)
- big teams that I don't dislike (Netherlands, Brazil, Argentina, Italy - though if Argentina could actually play up to their potential they might be the most beautiful to watch in the world and I would happily cheer for that)
- [anyone not specifically mentioned]
- Mexico
- Greece
- Portugal
- Germany
- France (I like a lot of their players and before the Ireland thing they would have been a lot higher but I desperately want to see them crash and burn now)
In practical terms, that means I'm supporting the US, Honduras, Spain, England, Ivory Coast, and New Zealand - and then rooting for the underdog with a preference for those outside of Europe pretty much everywhere else.
*Also including rule changes like automatic reds, too many yellows and ballless ideas like suspending someone for a handball after the game is over.
And you ragged on me for calling it a pitch? You suck utterly and completely!
What are you Goring to do about it, eh? Donitz tell me you're never seen such hypocrisy.
I'm pulling for Man City to at least make a show of it - I'd like to see some turnover in the top four. Plus, I'd love to see Arsenal win it all and someone picking some points off Chelsea is pretty essential if that's going to remain even a slight possibility.
Of course, Van Persie not being made of glass would make a much bigger difference.
I was living in Swindon during the 2004 Euro championships. Mysteriously, the Portugese deli near me had its windows broken just after England got knocked out. Funny, that.
Yeah. Boy did that ever get chippy. That was nearly a derby level of animosity, although you could say it was mostly just Chelsea's petulant side showing up again for the first time in a while.
As a Spurs fan, I was holding my nose and pulling for Chelsea to at least draw. Why couldn't they have sucked against us instead?
It was a fun match.
I'm pulling for City to win the league, even though I'm not a City fan; that would start another bout of epic whinging from Wenger, and cause the top 4 to piss their shorts as one of them will have to start looking to a future of no Champions League money.
It is much more fun to see England do reasonably well, raise the hopes of their fans, and then lose and crush the hopes of those fans, and cause those fans to engage in the usual copyrighted English whinging and moaning.
I was living in London's Little Portugal, and got quite nervous, because when the Portuguese win anything at these national-side-championships the neighbourhood fills up with Portuguese driving around in cars, honking horns, and waving Portuguese flags. Thankfully, nothing untoward happened, possibly because this is just north of Brixton, where there is enough dope being peddled to keep everyone calm.
All the kids throwing around "pitch" and "touchline" better stay out of my garden.
Except that a pitch is what it's called. I suppose any British people interested in baseball aren't allowed to call it a baseball diamond?
If Tottenham holds off Everton for a result in full time can Spurs supporters start dreaming of Europe?
edit: Nevermind. Bloody Everton.
How adorable.
As another one of these little anecdotes, I was in Strasbourg when Spain won the Euros in 2008. I figured the place would be rather quiet because of the German 'influence' in that region... boy was I wrong. The city was overrun with ecstatic Spanish fans. I was staying at a hotel near this big intersection. Cars that passed through almost had their automobiles tipped by folks who would rock the car back and forth. And then there were the two German fans who decided to walk right into the middle of the festivities and start chanting -- not the brightest of ideas. I recall seeing a plastic chair and garbage can fly in their general direction. A few minutes later cop sirens were heard and everyone booked. It was one of the most incredible things I've ever experienced.
edit: Nevermind. Bloody Everton.
Apparently Howard saved a PK in added time. As a Liverpool fan I can't outright root for Everton but that's still really ####### cool. Howard's pretty damn good. Where would folks rank him in the world -- it wouldn't be a stretch to put him in the low end of the top ten, would it?
Speaking of goalkeepers in general, I find it kind of funny that despite their superiority at nearly every other position, the US likely has two or three goalkeepers who would easily start for England.
Great as long as you're willing to call for a tow in Chicago by saying your saloon car's on a flyover and you're pretty sure someone is opening your bonnet and taking your accumulator as you speak.
He might slip into the top 10, but then there are probably 20 guys around the world who have some sort of case like that.
It's pretty hard to really get a handle on goalkeepers beyond the obvious best and the obvious mediocrities. They see so little action per game, and when they are noticed it's almost always a high pressure situation. Unless you watch 1000s of matches, it would be tough to get enough of a sample size to really make a judgment.
Does he have that kind of international reputation? Why does America produce so many world class goal keepers?
If it will annoy you, I think I'll start.
I tend to root for any team from the Americas (North, South, or Central) against any team from anywhere else. (If they're playing one another, I like the USA, then Mexico, then Argentina, then maybe whoever isn't Brazil, just on the hate-the-top-dog principle.) Among the European countries, I have spent a lot of time in Ireland (the Republic) and in England, and have often found myself rooting for them when they're playing other European teams. My current partner is German, but she has less than zero interest in sports, so there is nothing pulling me for or against Germany in World Cup play.
I sure as hell hope you aren't referring to Kasey Keller. He was the sorriest sack of #### I've ever seen and it was ridiculous to play him in '06 over Howard of Friedal.
(Which I grant is within their powers.)
Howard is good, but it was a dreadful penalty. I'm not 100% sure, but Defoe appeared to scuff it, and in any event he hit it straight into Howard's legs as he was diving to his right. If I have the stomach to watch the highlights on Match of the Day in 15 minutes, I'll get a better look at it.
Spurs of old, that was. Dominate the proceedings, build up a nice two-goal lead, squander a few more chances to really kill the game off, and then go weak at the knees at the first sign of real pressure from the other team. Worst result of the season, by far. Which, given the robbery that was Stoke at home and the several thorough beatdowns at the hands (or feet?) of the traditional Champions League powers, is saying something. Four easily baggable points dropped in eight days, sandwiched around a no-show at Old Trafford that saw us crash out of the league cup.
"Bugger."
You mean "dang."
Another nice result today for Fulham BTW. Glad to see it.
I normally find all the breathless talk about managers to be a little silly. Not that I think it's a definitive argument, but if managers were really that crucial to the success of teams, wouldn't they be getting paid a little bit more? If managers make the difference that pundits assume, why wouldn't teams be splashing out a lot more to lure the big guns.
That said, I think Hodgson is the real deal.
1. Buffon
2. Casillas
then...
Julio Cesar
Jose Reina
Hugo Lloris
Manuel Neuer
Edwin Van der Sar
Victor Valdes
Sebastien Frey
Petr Cech
They do in terms of salary - most of the managers at the very top club sides will be on salaries not that far away from the top players and most managers in the Premier League will have seven figure paycheques.
Managers tend to resign, get fired or have 'departure by mutual consent' so don't get 'transferred' as such.
He's always been the 'real deal', but has had a bad reputation in England because of general disintegration of Blackburn around the time Jack Walker popped his clogs. Around Europe he's always been held in very high regard, particularly in Scandinavia and Italy having managed Inter on a couple occasions and turned down the job as their director of football to manage Fulham.
Mmmmm, sort of. I guarantee that a dozen players at Man City are making more than Hughes (3 million a year). David Moyes has been a godsend to Everton and there was endless fights last year about whether they were willing to double his salary (all the way up to 2 million).
As a Real Madrid fan, I think Iker has been playing his way slightly out of the "Best goalkeeper in the world" discussion since Euro '08. On form over the last year, I'd say the top 3 is Buffon, Julio Cesar and Van Der Sar (not necessarily in that order).
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