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Wednesday, July 28, 2010

Joe Posnanski: Hall of Fame Comps

I think I’m going to start writing Bill Poz in every year for the Spink Award.

Maybe OPS+ is not for you either. Maybe you like those simple traditional Hall of Famer markers like 500 home runs or 3,000 hits (neither player reached those markers). Or maybe you don’t like any kind of statistical guideline or analyst’s voice. The one thing that so many Hall of Fame voters believe about the Hall of Fame is that it is about feel, about aura, about character. Dawson’s Hall of Fame case was bolstered by this sense of dignity he brought to baseball — everyone respected him and his all-around game. Rice’s Hall of Fame case was bolstered by this sense of intimidation he brought to baseball — you would hear that no player was more feared.

But using nebulous standards like aura makes comparisons EVEN MORE tempting … Dale Murphy also played with great dignity and brought honor to baseball. So did Dwight Evans. Few players were more respected in their day than Reggie Smith. Fred McGriff was classy enough to be the voice behind a training video for kids. Joe Carter was the very essence of class and he hit one of the most famous home runs in baseball history. Who was ever classier or more beloved than Gil Hodges?

As for intimidation, Rice certainly was no more feared than Dick Allen or Frank Howard or Albert Belle or George Foster or Dave Parker. Or Jose Canseco, for that matter.

Repoz Posted: July 28, 2010 at 10:53 AM | 12 comment(s)
  Related News: GeneralHistoryHall of FameSabermetrics

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   1. Teal & Black Tie's Giant Masturbatory Ninja Brain  Posted: July 28, 2010 at 01:05 PM (#3601627)
Fred McGriff was classy enough to be the voice behind a training video for kids.


FOR ETERNITY.

"Hi, I'm [dub] 20th century baseball player [/dub] Fred McGriff! I want to teach you [dub] citizens of Moon Base Europa [/dub] how to play baseball [dub] in order to properly honor our Sino-Plutonian overlords [/dub]."
   2. vortex of dissipation  Posted: July 28, 2010 at 03:05 PM (#3601788)
Few players were more respected in their day than Reggie Smith.


Couldn't Smith be something of a handful when he had a point to make? I remember that when he was playing in Japan, he went onto the field one day with his uniform on backwards.
   3. (smileyy) is bringing Option Jay back  Posted: July 28, 2010 at 05:31 PM (#3601958)
But the knuckleball, inventing THAT pitch — dig your fingernails into the ball? Throw it without spin?


I'm not convinced that it's all that "hard" to invent. Players standing around having a catch will invariably get to stupid ways to throw the ball, including throwing it without spin. From there, it's not far to figuring out the best way to throw it without spin.

It's kind of like being amazed at the leap from blue-green algae to humans, without thinking about all the intermediate steps.
   4. Fred Ludacris (Crispix Attacks)  Posted: July 28, 2010 at 05:36 PM (#3601966)
Knuckleball: the flagellum of baseball.
   5. Don Malcolm  Posted: July 28, 2010 at 05:37 PM (#3601971)
Elsewhere in TFA Poz suggests that Bill James be inducted into the HoF. While that's an idea with which I personally have no problem, Poz might like to know that the Baseball Reliquary already did just that in 2008, honoring Bill with a slot in their Shrine of the Eternals. Bill was gracious enough to come out to Pasadena, and gave a wonderful speech. It would be fun to see the range of expression in the audience at Cooperstown should the powers-that-be decide to follow in the Reliquary's footsteps.

If Poz would expand his horizons a bit and tout an organization with actual imagination behind it, the world would be a better place. By focusing on moribund, metastatized entities such as the HoF, however, he simply joins the vast legions of colleagues and readers who are content to tread water.

All in all, a rather lacklustre piece. Brightest spot: the "newsflash" that Keith Law is taking a beating from his readers.
   6. McCoy  Posted: July 28, 2010 at 05:57 PM (#3601987)
I think he is saying that bj is deserving of the spinks award more than he is saying bj should be enshrrined.
   7. Van Lingle Mungo Jerry  Posted: July 28, 2010 at 06:07 PM (#3601990)
As for intimidation, Rice certainly was no more feared than Dick Allen or Frank Howard or Albert Belle or George Foster or Dave Parker.


Nice work sidestepping the racist label there, Poz. :-)
   8. Harveys Wallbangers  Posted: July 28, 2010 at 06:16 PM (#3602001)
Joe missed the obvious one and that is Willie McCovey. Willie held all the IBB records until recently and it wasn't mere chance.

And Frank Howard is a good addition. Once Frank got rolling when the strike zone was adjusted he caused pitchers nightsweats. And clearly he TOWERED over everyone.
   9. Van Lingle Mungo Jerry  Posted: July 28, 2010 at 06:23 PM (#3602005)
Joe missed the obvious one and that is Willie McCovey. Willie held all the IBB records until recently and it wasn't mere chance.


Was it fear or was it that first base was unoccupied so often after all of Mays' doubles and triples?
   10. Harveys Wallbangers  Posted: July 28, 2010 at 07:21 PM (#3602055)
Stretch's big years came on Mays downside.
   11. Ron Johnson  Posted: July 29, 2010 at 11:12 AM (#3602566)
#9 The IBBs didn't start to get silly until 1969. And Mays wasn't Mays any more. (only 17 doubles and 3 triples in 117 games)

I think Jim Ray Hart's injuries had more to do with his IBBs.

Giant #5 hitters hit .214/.314/.336 in 1969. You can see why it would be attractive to walk the best hitter in the league any time it was legal (particularly since the guys hitting 6 through 8 were terrible too. And they had lousy hitting pitchers if it matters). By the end of the year they had moved Bonds to 5th (where he hit .237/.378/.517 in 148 PAs -- which means the others hit .209/.297/.291 (!) ).
   12. DCW3   Posted: July 29, 2010 at 12:11 PM (#3602660)
Joe missed the obvious one and that is Willie McCovey.

Joe was intentionally comparing Rice to non-HoFers, to make his point.
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