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Friday, April 25, 2008

Maddux: ‘Closing’s got to be the hardest job in baseball’

Another Mad Dog Minute!

Don’t tell Greg Maddux that relievers are failed starting pitchers. Maddux, who has made 712 starts, said a closer has baseball’s toughest job because the mental burden is so great.

“When the closer messes up, you lose,” Maddux said, elaborating on comments he made Wednesday after closer Trevor Hoffman blew the save. “Anyone here can go 0-for-4—you can still win. A starting pitcher can get knocked out in the fifth—you can still win. A reliever can come in and walk the two guys he faces—you can still win.

“Mentally, closing’s got to be the hardest job in baseball.”

Maddux, who entered the majors in 1986, is amused how quickly people assume a good set-up reliever can shift into a closer’s role. “Everyone thinks it’s just physical thing—they don’t understand,” he said. “These guys who pitch before (the closer) have a good month and everyone’s like, ‘He should be the closer.’ It’s a little different. And that’s not to mention how a closer is the anchor point of the ‘pen.”

Repoz Posted: April 25, 2008 at 11:27 AM | 37 comment(s)
  Related News: GeneralSan Diego

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   1. JRVJ (formerly Delta Socrates) Posted: April 25, 2008 at 11:36 AM (#2758584)
Well, there goes Maddux's reputation amongst Primates....
   2. 1k5v3L Posted: April 25, 2008 at 11:40 AM (#2758591)
Maddux is trying to help his shitty closer feel better
   3. Vaux, A.B.D. Posted: April 25, 2008 at 11:41 AM (#2758594)
Most likely.
   4. snapper Posted: April 25, 2008 at 11:53 AM (#2758603)
Exhibit 953 on why we don't rely on players for baseball analysis.
   5. G.W.O. Posted: April 25, 2008 at 12:16 PM (#2758617)
Exhibit 953 on why we don't rely on players for baseball analysis
Except Maddux didn't say "Closing’s got to be the hardest job in baseball", he said "Mentally, closing’s got to be the hardest job in baseball".

And that's a big, big big difference. What he's saying is high leverage means high pressure.
   6. Justin Zeth Posted: April 25, 2008 at 12:20 PM (#2758620)
I agree with Greg; I think it's a little foolhardy to assume there's no mental element to a particular baseball player's job. That the Raccoon Lodge dramatically overblows something (mental toughness, in this case) doesn't make it nonexistent. In any occupation, some people handle high pressure situations better than others.

And anyhow, Maddux wasn't providing any baseball analysis that I could detect. He was stating his opinion about something.
   7. snapper Posted: April 25, 2008 at 12:23 PM (#2758624)
Except Maddux didn't say "Closing’s got to be the hardest job in baseball", he said "Mentally, closing’s got to be the hardest job in baseball".

And that's a big, big big difference. What he's saying is high leverage means high pressure.


It's funny, b/c I was just reading "The Book" by Tom Tango et. al.

They find no difference in how relievers perform in "close" games versus other games. I've seen a very few examplkes where pitchers seemed to choke under pressure, but I doubt there's much there besides random fluctuation. These are all elite athletes, if they choked under pressure, they wouldn't be anywhere near the major leagues.
   8. Fly's New Handle Was Too Long, But Clever Posted: April 25, 2008 at 12:53 PM (#2758646)
These are all elite athletes, if they choked under pressure, they wouldn't be anywhere near the major leagues.

Right. Or they'd be Zack Greinke or Rick Ankiel or Steve Blass or Matt Young. Players do crack under pressure, and I'm sure there's more pressure on a pitcher than most other players, and there's more pressure on the closer than a starter.

This doesn't mean that a closer is more valuable than a starter, just that Maddux is, at worst, close to right with his quote.
   9. Greg K Posted: April 25, 2008 at 12:58 PM (#2758652)
Not to pick on anyone

But for a lock first ballot hall of famer, people sure spell Greg Maddux's name wrong a lot
   10. Fly's New Handle Was Too Long, But Clever Posted: April 25, 2008 at 12:59 PM (#2758654)
What do you mean? I spelled it right. Perfectly right.

Another edit: I actually did correct myself before reloading and seeing the above comment. It's not that I don't know how to spell it, I just didn't spell it right despite that knowledge.
   11. Greg K Posted: April 25, 2008 at 01:05 PM (#2758659)
Yeah I think it's just a typo thing

Because clearly anyone posting on BTF knows how to spell it, and yet I see the "o" all the time here. Maybe it's a hold over from people who grew up with Garry Maddox?
   12. too fat and ugly to play third Posted: April 25, 2008 at 01:32 PM (#2758681)
But for a lock first ballot hall of famer, people sure spell Greg Maddux's name wrong a lot


Not as often as Cal Ripkin's.
   13. Master of the small sample size Posted: April 25, 2008 at 01:33 PM (#2758683)
Hmm... is it just me or Atlanta likes guys with hard to spell names? Teixeira, Francoeur, Saltalamacchia...
   14. The Jerry Royster Experience Posted: April 25, 2008 at 01:41 PM (#2758687)
Not as often as Cal Ripkin's.

Or Mark McGuire.
   15. Jon Koltz Posted: April 25, 2008 at 01:42 PM (#2758688)
Hmm... is it just me or Atlanta likes guys with hard to spell names? Teixeira, Francoeur, Saltalamacchia...


...Smelts, Jonez...
   16. too fat and ugly to play third Posted: April 25, 2008 at 01:47 PM (#2758694)
Or Mark McGuire.


I started to mention him, but he's only a former lock first ballot Hall of Famer.
   17. Slinger Francisco Barrios (Dr. Memory) Posted: April 25, 2008 at 01:47 PM (#2758695)
Right. Or they'd be Zack Greinke or Rick Ankiel or Steve Blass or Matt Young. Players do crack under pressure, and I'm sure there's more pressure on a pitcher than most other players, and there's more pressure on the closer than a starter.

What you describe is not what's under discussion, or you could've included Donnie Moore.
   18. Hello Rusty Kuntz, Goodbye Rusty Cars Posted: April 25, 2008 at 01:48 PM (#2758697)
Hmm... is it just me or Atlanta likes guys with hard to spell names? Teixeira, Francoeur, Saltalamacchia...


...Smelts, Jonez...


Booby Cocks.
   19. Slinger Francisco Barrios (Dr. Memory) Posted: April 25, 2008 at 02:05 PM (#2758716)
Rusty, I resisted that joke, why couldn't you? For shame. (Although the "Booby" was a touch I hadn't considered.)
   20. Greg Schuler Posted: April 25, 2008 at 02:08 PM (#2758720)
I thought being on someone's leg in the shower and not getting caught was the hardest job in baseball.

Oh, and Mientkiewicz. Without looking it up.
   21. king cranium maximus IV Posted: April 25, 2008 at 02:09 PM (#2758721)
Maddux had a blast coming out of the pen in the '99 NLDS.

Between a hobbling/bad Brian Jordan going yard, Otis Nixon (!!!) getting a big hit, Walt Weiss' clutch defense, and the offical line of "Rocker-W, Millwood-S," Game 3 might be the best what-the-heck? game I can remember in my lifetime.
   22. John Lynch Posted: April 25, 2008 at 02:22 PM (#2758735)
As a nitpick, Maddux is wrong. Closers often get hung with blown saves that do not result in losses.
   23. Guy LeDouche Posted: April 25, 2008 at 02:28 PM (#2758739)
"I thought being on someone's leg in the shower"


Wow, that's even worse than what Guy thought you were trying to say. And gayer.
   24. Pastor Toastman (PH) Posted: April 25, 2008 at 02:31 PM (#2758742)
Between a hobbling/bad Brian Jordan going yard, Otis Nixon (!!!) getting a big hit, Walt Weiss' clutch defense, and the offical line of "Rocker-W, Millwood-S," Game 3 might be the best what-the-heck? game I can remember in my lifetime.


Game 3 of the 2005 series was pretty good too. W-Marte S-Buehrle. Geoff Blum's homer, 10 walks in seven innings by the Sox bullpen, only one run allowed.
   25. T.J. makes a mochary or the sport Posted: April 25, 2008 at 02:45 PM (#2758752)
Going off-sport:

"Farve"

And a name that's not misspelled near as much as you'd think it would be: "Krzyzewski"
   26. Ricky C. Posted: April 25, 2008 at 05:00 PM (#2758871)
What do you know, Greg Maddux?! Oh wait, you're Greg Maddux. Never mind.
   27. Shock Posted: April 25, 2008 at 10:08 PM (#2759320)
Killerbrew. Eddie Matthews.
   28. Howie Menckel Posted: April 25, 2008 at 10:31 PM (#2759400)
Gene Michaels

Bobby Thompson
   29. Justin Zeth Posted: April 25, 2008 at 11:16 PM (#2759534)
Vito Chiaravalloti.
   30. Eric J. Seidman Posted: April 25, 2008 at 11:46 PM (#2759556)
Billy Spieieirs
   31. IronChef Chris Wok Posted: April 25, 2008 at 11:54 PM (#2759559)
Hu
   32. Dock Ellis on Acid Posted: April 26, 2008 at 12:07 AM (#2759561)
Torriii
   33. Exploring Leftist Conservatism since 2008 (ark..) Posted: April 26, 2008 at 12:15 AM (#2759567)
George W. Shithead
   34. Jose Can Jussi Jokinen (Justin T) Posted: April 26, 2008 at 12:17 AM (#2759569)
Greg Cabernet
   35. Neil Kinnock...Lord Palmerston! (Orinoco) Posted: April 26, 2008 at 12:58 AM (#2759588)
33. arkitekton Posted: April 26, 2008 at 12:15 AM (#2759567)

George W. Shithead


I could mention Osama, but I wouldn't.
   36. Exploring Leftist Conservatism since 2008 (ark..) Posted: April 26, 2008 at 01:03 AM (#2759591)
I could mention Osama, but I wouldn't.


Are you running McCain's campaign, by any chance? ;)
   37. Phenomenal Smith Posted: April 26, 2008 at 01:47 AM (#2759612)
The only difference between Obama and Osama is a beard.
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