Baseball for the Thinking Fan

Login | Register | Feedback

btf_logo
You are here > Home > Baseball Newsstand > Baseball Primer Newsblog > Discussion
Baseball Primer Newsblog
— The Best News Links from the Baseball Newsstand

Thursday, November 05, 2009

MLB: Marlins send Hermida to Red Sox

The Marlins and Red Sox wasted little time making offseason moves.

The Red Sox acquired outfielder Jeremy Hermida, a 25-year-old former first-round pick, from the Marlins in exchange for Triple-A left-hander Hunter Jones and Double-A lefty Jose Alvarez.

Hermida spoke late Thursday afternoon to Red Sox general manager Theo Epstein, and the Marlins announced the trade late in the afternoon.

The 11th overall pick in 2002, Hermida comes off a rough seasons. He batted .259 with 13 home runs and 47 RBIs. The Georgia native missed the final few weeks of the season with a right oblique strain.

Repoz Posted: November 05, 2009 at 11:02 PM | 46 comment(s) | Login to Bookmark
  Related News: GeneralBostonFlorida

Reader Comments and Retorts

Go to end of page

Statements posted here are those of our readers and do not represent the BaseballThinkFactory. Names are provided by the poster and are not verified. We ask that posters follow our submission policy. Please report any inappropriate comments.

Page 1 of 1 pages
   1. Drew (Primakov, Gungho Iguanas) Posted: November 05, 2009 at 11:15 PM (#3380181)
The hedge against losing Bay and not getting Holliday is here. I like the trade, pending any glowing reports about Alvarez. Jones is a LOOGY--big whoop, but Alvarez's numbers looked good in Lowell.
   2. Home Run Teal & Black Black Black Gone! Posted: November 05, 2009 at 11:18 PM (#3380183)
I don't like giving up on Hermida, but it's the Marlins. Whatareyougonnado.
   3. Tripon Posted: November 05, 2009 at 11:21 PM (#3380185)
Kinda interesting that the Marlins went from trading Hermida as part of any Manny trade to trading Hermida for two fringe prospects.
   4. Liver of blaspheming 'zop Posted: November 05, 2009 at 11:36 PM (#3380195)
It's like Nick Swisher, without the ability to play baseball well.
   5. Mike Emeigh Posted: November 05, 2009 at 11:50 PM (#3380209)
It's like Nick Swisher, without the ability to play baseball well.


That's not far from the mark. Hermida's probably Swisher Lite.

I've never been a big Hermida fan - he's one of those guys whose minor league BB rate was deceiving because he just sat back and waited for pitchers to make a mistake in his zone, but he has never showed any ability to cover the entire plate and he has a tendancy to work himself into a hole by passing up hittable pitches early in counts. I suspect that Boston's hoping they have another Youkilis here, but I think they'll probably be disappointed.

-- MWE
   6. The Piehole of David Wells, Red Sox Colostomy Bag Posted: November 05, 2009 at 11:54 PM (#3380215)
he's one of those guys whose minor league BB rate was deceiving because he just sat back and waited for pitchers to make a mistake in his zone


I think people said that about Youkilis when he was in the minors (except for the "waiting for a mistake" part). There was talk that he was too passive and wouldn't make it in the majors. That said, the track record on Wily Mo Pena, Carlos Pena and Choi make me think that the Sox aren't very good at fixing underachievers.
   7. billyshears Posted: November 06, 2009 at 12:11 AM (#3380239)
I continue to think Hermida is better than he actually is, but this is still a deal the Mets should have made. I know nothing about those prospects, so I can't say for sure the Mets could have put together a better package, but then again, I know nothing about those prospects, so I have to believe the Mets could have put together a better package.
   8. Tripon Posted: November 06, 2009 at 12:12 AM (#3380242)
But the Mets already have Jeff Francoeur.
   9. Mike Emeigh Posted: November 06, 2009 at 12:17 AM (#3380247)
I think people said that about Youkilis when he was in the minors (except for the "waiting for a mistake" part).


I know I said that about Youkilis, but that was based on only a couple of observations. I've also said it about Andy LaRoche, who I saw probably 10-15 times in the minors. In Hermida's case, that observation was based on a full season of AA home games (I saw him about 50-60 times that year).

Hermida's one good season - actually, a good half-season, since he was producing at more or less a normal rate for him until July - coincided with a stretch where he was aggressive early in the count. He's been hurt a lot since then and has slipped back into the old habits, from what I've seen. I will say that I've never seen someone with his ability to draw a walk take so many bas swings at good pitches in my life.

-- MWE
   10. Mike Emeigh Posted: November 06, 2009 at 12:18 AM (#3380250)
But the Mets already have Jeff Francoeur.


who is the anti-Hermida.

-- MWE
   11. SteveF Posted: November 06, 2009 at 12:23 AM (#3380256)
Clearly all some team needs to do is acquire both and hire Dr. Mephisto
   12. Tripon Posted: November 06, 2009 at 12:29 AM (#3380263)
Still, I can't see how the Marlins can keep any sustained success going if every player in their system only has a 3 year window to help the Marlins before he's traded.
   13. Swedish Chef Posted: November 06, 2009 at 12:37 AM (#3380279)
Still, I can't see how the Marlins can keep any sustained success going if every player in their system only has a 3 year window to help the Marlins before he's traded.

Their plan, inspired by nuclear physics:
If they can turn every arb player into two new players the will soon have a self sustaining chain reaction on their hands and can select their MLB squad from a pool of ~10^20 minor league players, which will include billions and billions of Bonds-class talents.
   14. Marcel Posted: November 06, 2009 at 12:40 AM (#3380282)
That said, the track record on Wily Mo Pena, Carlos Pena and Choi make me think that the Sox aren't very good at fixing underachievers.

They only had Carlos Pena for a little over a month so he's probably not very indicative.
   15. PreservedFish Posted: November 06, 2009 at 12:41 AM (#3380284)
I already told you guys. Mets are taking 2010 off. No worries.
   16. John DiFool2 Posted: November 06, 2009 at 12:50 AM (#3380293)
He bats left, so he can't be Drew's caddy-they really don't think he can play LF in Fenway Park and be anything close to what a LFer needs to hit there, do they?

And can't the two threads be merged or something?
   17. Don Malcolm Posted: November 06, 2009 at 12:59 AM (#3380306)
Actually, the weirdest aspect in Hermida's splits is located in his first at-bat of the game. He just can't hit at all then: .208/.281/.333/.614. After that, he's OK: .283/.358/.463/.821. That pattern is persistent in all of his seasons, even in 2007. I don't think I've ever seen anything like that before.
   18. Joe Bivens, Schmoo from Massachoosetts Posted: November 06, 2009 at 01:01 AM (#3380308)
Oh, sure, it was the Red Sox' fault that Wily Mo and Hee Sop Choi suck so bad. Yeah, sure. Because other teams have had such great success fixing them.
   19. Darren Posted: November 06, 2009 at 01:19 AM (#3380331)
UZR isn't fond of Hermida's defense and his offense has been pretty lousy the past 2 years. This is.... blah.
   20. MM1f Posted: November 06, 2009 at 01:23 AM (#3380338)
I think people said that about Youkilis when he was in the minors (except for the "waiting for a mistake" part). There was talk that he was too passive and wouldn't make it in the majors.

Youkilis has shown he can hit in the majors and Hermida has shown he can not hit in the majors, I don't see your point.

who is the anti-Hermida.

He is the bizarro world Hermida in so many ways.
Both were disappointing RF prospects on NL East teams. One never learned to swing, the other never learned not to swing.
Both were first round picks the same year out of suburban HS north of Atlanta. Hermida was picked higher, Francouer got a slightly larger bonus. Weirdest thing was that both were Clemson commitments.
The thought of a Hermida/Francoer platoon blows my mind.
   21. Darren Posted: November 06, 2009 at 01:54 AM (#3380357)
How would a Hermida/Francouer platoon work? Have Hermida watch the first 2 pitches then put in Francouer?
   22. Dave Spiwak Posted: November 06, 2009 at 02:01 AM (#3380359)
Actually, the weirdest aspect in Hermida's splits is located in his first at-bat of the game. He just can't hit at all then: .208/.281/.333/.614. After that, he's OK: .283/.358/.463/.821. That pattern is persistent in all of his seasons, even in 2007. I don't think I've ever seen anything like that before.


So the solution is to never let him have that first at-bat.
   23. Famous Original Joe C Posted: November 06, 2009 at 02:27 AM (#3380370)
Standard Theo era Red Sox move - depth with a decent OBP.
   24. tfbg9 Posted: November 06, 2009 at 02:43 AM (#3380378)
He's a butcher in the field, can't hit the lefties at all. Worth a shot though, still young.
   25. flournoy Posted: November 06, 2009 at 02:52 AM (#3380383)
Both were first round picks the same year out of suburban HS north of Atlanta.


Opposite sides of town, though. That makes all the difference.
   26. Jose Can You Seabiscuit Posted: November 06, 2009 at 02:56 AM (#3380386)
I like this move, at worst I would think he's a step up from baldelli and at best he becomes a real find.
   27. Darren Posted: November 06, 2009 at 03:01 AM (#3380389)
I think at worst is worse than that. But he is still young.
   28. MM1f Posted: November 06, 2009 at 03:26 AM (#3380400)
I like this move, at worst I would think he's a step up from baldelli

Though it his hard to compare Baldelli's offensive output to anyone since he has never been healthy, Baldelli has the same career OPS+, is only 2 years older and can play CF.

I might take Baldelli over Hermida on my team in a straight up trade if $ wasn't an issue. Baldelli's health would be my holdup but since the Sawx are looking at reserves here anyway, health is less of an issue
   29. Paxton Crawford Ranch Posted: November 06, 2009 at 03:41 AM (#3380407)
I think at worst is worse than that. But he is still young.

Worst case he's Jeremy Giambi. Best case he's David Ortiz. I'd settle for a lefty Kevin Millar.
   30. Darren Posted: November 06, 2009 at 04:05 AM (#3380423)
Wily Mo sounds like a more likely worst case. And best case is somewhere far far short of David Ortiz. Millar's probably a good one.
   31. La Damnation De Fausto (davekemp) Posted: November 06, 2009 at 04:31 AM (#3380434)
How would a Hermida/Francouer platoon work? Have Hermida watch the first 2 pitches then put in Francouer?


Primey!
   32. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: November 06, 2009 at 05:50 AM (#3380465)
Mutatis mutandis, Hermida == Wily Mo.

Their respective potentials are differently shaped, but the ultimate point is the same - both could be all-stars in a corner OF position, and the Red Sox are giving them a part-time job in the hopes that they develop. These sorts of moves have not worked out well for Theo's Red Sox. Hopefully this one does.
   33. Paxton Crawford Ranch Posted: November 06, 2009 at 07:48 AM (#3380485)
As a fan, this is the type of deal I love most. When you sign a star for star money, and he performs like a star, it's not as satisfying as finding an underachiever and seeing him put it all together. Obviously, the odds are stacked against Hermida becoming a regular for this team, much less a star, but when a move like this works out, it's as sweet as it gets.
   34. Tripon Posted: November 06, 2009 at 07:54 AM (#3380486)
Casey Kotchman, and Jeremy Hermida. Who's next, Daniel Murphy?
   35. The Kids Are Enright (1k5v3L) Posted: November 06, 2009 at 02:33 PM (#3380584)
Casey Kotchman, and Jeremy Hermida. Who's next, Daniel Murphy?
Have Kotchman and Hermida ever been 0.875 OPS hitters?
   36. AROM Posted: November 06, 2009 at 02:44 PM (#3380594)
I know nothing about those prospects, so I have to believe the Mets could have put together a better package.


I saw a link to a Red Sox prospect blog that ranked those two as the 44th and 45th best prospects in the system, so any team could have topped this. Looks like the Red Sox are the only team that thinks he's worth the 4 million or so that he'll get in arbitration. Curious move. As a backup outfielder (and a lefty) it doesn't make sense to use him when Drew or Ellsbury need a rest. Only way he's a bargain is if he gets at least a platoon share of LF.

But what he doesn't cost in payroll he costs in a roster spot. Intentionally downgrading from Bay to Hermida doesn't seem like the kind of move a big market team intending to compete for a championship does.
   37. AROM Posted: November 06, 2009 at 02:47 PM (#3380597)
Have Kotchman and Hermida ever been 0.875 OPS hitters?


No, but not too far off, .840 for Kotchman and .870 for Hermida. Which is better than anything Murphy's ever done in more than 131 AB.
   38. The Kids Are Enright (1k5v3L) Posted: November 06, 2009 at 02:49 PM (#3380602)
Which is better than anything Murphy's ever done
That's crazy talk.
   39. Shooty: Applying to be Fearless Leader Posted: November 06, 2009 at 02:49 PM (#3380604)
Intentionally downgrading from Bay to Hermida doesn't seem like the kind of move a big market team intending to compete for a championship does.

I think more it's likely he takes Baldelli's or Kotchman's spot (if they think Hermida can learn to play first a little.)
   40. AROM Posted: November 06, 2009 at 03:02 PM (#3380618)
Kotchman's another guy who makes little sense unless you actually plan on playing him. He'll probably also get 4 mil or so unless he's non-tendered, and that seems way too much to pay for an insurance policy/ twice a week starter/ pinch hitter for the shortstop.

And it's a waste of Kotchman, who may still turn into a decent player on a team that plays him, but has zero chance of earning a job over Kevin Youkilis.
   41. ellsbury my heart at wounded knee Posted: November 06, 2009 at 03:14 PM (#3380629)
I wonder if this is the kind of move that gives the Red Sox the flexibility to make some other kind of move over the winter if they wind up dumping Lowell or Kotchman. In isolation, though, Hermida's not a great 4th OF choice. He can't really play CF, and he's a lefty. I guess he didn't really cost them anything other than money, so what the hell, I guess.
   42. Shooty: Applying to be Fearless Leader Posted: November 06, 2009 at 03:18 PM (#3380631)
I wonder if this is the kind of move that gives the Red Sox the flexibility to make some other kind of move over the winter if they wind up dumping Lowell or Kotchman. In isolation, though, Hermida's not a great 4th OF choice. He can't really play CF, and he's a lefty. I guess he didn't really cost them anything other than money, so what the hell, I guess.

Yeah, I think it's too early to parse these moves too closely. We don't know what these teams are trying to do at a more macro level. I think the Sawx want Adrian Gonzalez really, really badly (not that I can figure how Hermida fits into helping them achieve that).
   43. Jose Can You Seabiscuit Posted: November 06, 2009 at 03:38 PM (#3380654)
Yeah, I think it's too early to parse these moves too closely. We don't know what these teams are trying to do at a more macro level. I think the Sawx want Adrian Gonzalez really, really badly (not that I can figure how Hermida fits into helping them achieve that).


I think he gives them the flexibility of being potentially a decent starting left fielder. Figure with a Fenway boost he gets back to an .800 OPS, that is OK. The Sox can now go after Gonzalez without still having a gaping hole in left field. If the get Gonzalez (or Fielder, or some other not yet mentioned trade candidate) they now have a reasonable starting left fielder. Obviously Hermida would be on the lower end of that position but Hermida/Gonzalez/Youkilis at LF/1B/3B is certainly OK while Reddick or Baldelli/Gonzalez/Youkilis probably would not be (given Baldelli's inability to play every day).
   44. Darren Posted: November 06, 2009 at 03:56 PM (#3380679)
I'm not sure the Sox are so hot after Gonzalez. They were reportedly going to move him along to Seattle for King Felix at the deadline. I'd think they're reasonably happy with their unique 1b/3b/c/dh platoon dealie. I'd think they would be focused on another good starter and a reliably good starting SS.
   45. The Kids Are Enright (1k5v3L) Posted: November 06, 2009 at 04:06 PM (#3380690)
a reliably good starting SS.
Take Stephen Drew, please!
Isn't Lowrie penned as the shortstop next year?
Also, JJ Hardy should be in Boston already.
   46. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: November 06, 2009 at 04:50 PM (#3380752)
What are the chances the guy develops while getting 150-200 ABs a year?
Page 1 of 1 pages

You must be Registered and Logged In to post comments.

 

 

<< Back to main

Support BBTF

donate

Thanks to
phredbird
for his generous support.

Bookmarks

You must be logged in to view your Bookmarks.

Hot Topics

NewsblogPrimer Dugout (and link of the day) 2-9-2012
(2 - 3:13am, Feb 09)
Last: Not The Real Fausto Carmona (Dan Lee)

NewsblogOT: NBA Monthly Thread, February 2012
(319 - 3:13am, Feb 09)
Last: Los Angeles ALBERT F. PUJOLS of Anaheim

NewsblogOT: The Soccer Thread: February 2012
(95 - 2:54am, Feb 09)
Last: Richard

NewsblogFangraphs: Cameron: The 10 Worst Transactions Of The Winter
(51 - 2:34am, Feb 09)
Last: Salt-n-Pepitone L?c

NewsblogGuelph Mercury: Argos will likely be turfed out of Rogers if Jays get grass
(2 - 1:59am, Feb 09)
Last: Vaux, A.B.D.

NewsblogJustice: 5 things that could make the 2012 season a successful one for the Astros
(10 - 1:46am, Feb 09)
Last: Fred Lynn Nolan Ryan Sweeney Agonistes

NewsblogMONEYBALL~ Oscar Nominations 2012: Academy Award Nominees List ~ MONEYBALL
(568 - 1:40am, Feb 09)
Last: Fred Lynn Nolan Ryan Sweeney Agonistes

NewsblogEdes: 'Think Factory' projects falloff for Ellsbury
(36 - 1:33am, Feb 09)
Last: Squash

Hall of MeritMost Meritorious Player : 1969 Discussion
(72 - 1:23am, Feb 09)
Last: OCF

NewsblogBASN: The MLB FRAUD - Oakland, Los Angeles, and New York
(51 - 12:57am, Feb 09)
Last: SoSHially Unacceptable

NewsblogNYT: Alderson Remakes Needy Mets From Bottom Line Up
(11 - 12:42am, Feb 09)
Last: The Yankee Clapper

NewsblogEdwin Jackson turned down three-year offer from Pirates
(100 - 12:36am, Feb 09)
Last: The Yankee Clapper

NewsblogSources: Cubs’ Starlin Castro Accused Of Sexual Assault
(5690 - 12:29am, Feb 09)
Last: Lassus:

NewsblogBPro: Wyers: Reintroducing PECOTA
(22 - 11:53pm, Feb 08)
Last: NJ is feeling better

Newsblog'Duk: Tim Lincecum slims down with swim routine, loses appetite for McDonald’s
(238 - 10:32pm, Feb 08)
Last: Rafael Bellylard: Built like a Molina

Buy MLB playoff tickets, plus 2011 World Series, 2011 ALCS tickets and NLCS game tickets. We also have Texas Rangers playoff schedule, tickets to Red Sox games and Yankees game tickets. Plus, buy Phillies baseball tickets, Tigers playoff tickets and the biggies like ALDS baseball tickets and 2011 NLDS tickets.

Demarini, Easton and TPX Baseball Bats

 

 

 

AllianceTickets.com has cheap MLB Tickets. Get all your Colorado Rockies Tickets, Seattle Mariners Tickets, San Francisco Giants Tickets and all your favorite baseball tickets here. We also carry cheap Denver Broncos Tickets, Seattle Seahawks Tickets and Denver Nuggets Tickets.

Page rendered in 0.8056 seconds
40 querie(s) executed