a better question than why more teams don't do this is why there is always so much suprise/anger (depending on whether or not it helps or hurts your team usally) when this gets done...this rule isn't exactly new, and using it as a "loop-hole" isnt either....i've never seen what the big deal is anyway

Can postseason rosters be altered from series to series?

this rule isn't exactly new, and using it as a "loop-hole" isnt either

What's the point of having the rule if there's a loophole? Either get rid of the rule or close the loophole. I don't care which, but it's silly to make teams go through these machinations.

How do they define "plays the same position"?

Any player is allowed to play any position. In fact, I don't think that any positions except for pitcher and catcher are actually defined in the rules, are they?

4: I believe the rule states "position player for position player" and "pitcher for pitcher." I could be wrong, though.

Any player can play any position.

I know that you can't replace a position player with a pitcher, or vice versa. I am fairly (although not 100%) certain that the rule also requires you to replace an injured position player with another one who is capable of playing the same position as the injured player - the intent of the rule is to keep a team from being caught short-handed at a position in the event of a late-season injury, so that they don't have to play someone out of position.

-- MWE

Can postseason rosters be altered from series to series?

Yep.

-- MWE

I am fairly (although not 100%) certain that the rule also requires you to replace an injured position player with another one who is capable of playing the same position as the injured player

What's the definition of "capable of playing the same position"?

I'm pretty sure it's infielders, outfielders, catchers and pitchers.

a better question than why more teams don't do this is why there is always so much suprise/anger (depending on whether or not it helps or hurts your team usally) when this gets done

No, a better question is why the rule exists at all. This isn't beer league softball. You don't keep a ringer in the minors only to bring him up for the playoffs. If a guy has been in your organization all year, and if you've been developing him, why the hell shouldn't you be able to use him in the post-season, even if he hasn't played a game in the majors all season? It's not like a team is going to go out on September 15th and sign an Ichiro from Japan just for the playoffs. And even if MLB was concerned about that, just make a rule that says anyone anywhere in the organization as of August 31st is eligible.

There's really currently no justification for the rule to exist in the first place.

No, a better question is why the rule exists at all. This isn't beer league softball. You don't keep a ringer in the minors only to bring him up for the playoffs. If a guy has been in your organization all year, and if you've been developing him, why the hell shouldn't you be able to use him in the post-season, even if he hasn't played a game in the majors all season? It's not like a team is going to go out on September 15th and sign an Ichiro from Japan just for the playoffs. And even if MLB was concerned about that, just make a rule that says anyone anywhere in the organization as of August 31st is eligible.

There's really currently no justification for the rule to exist in the first place.

Fully agreed. This is an impossibly vague and complicated solution to a nonexistent problem. Something for the Bureaucracy Hall of Fame.

this rule isn't exactly new, and using it as a "loop-hole" isnt either

How long has it been in place? The first time I ever heard of it was for K-Rod, so at least to me it's relatively new.

How long has it been in place?

I recall reading about an issue over the roster-eligibility rules for the 1954 World Series, with the Indians (for reasons far beyond anyone's comprehension) wanting to activate Mickey Grasso. But I don't know if those rules were the same as these.

I guess I'm in the minority here.

The playoffs are about taking the best major league teams from the regular season and deciding which is the best. How good a team's minor-league system is or whether they have any prospects shouldn't play into it.

Why wouldn't a team add a Japanese League player in Sept? Why have 25-man roster limits to begin with?

Obviously injuries happen, but the playoffs should be about one team's 25-man roster against another's. At the very least, 40-man rosters should be frozen on Aug 31 and only players on the 40-man should be eligible for the playoffs.

It's a loophole, teams use it, I don't blame them for that. As to why more teams don't do it, I assume most playoff teams already have enough guys on the DL to cover themselves.

The playoffs are about taking the best major league teams from the regular season and deciding which is the best.

Okay, but this doesn't mean that:

How good a team's minor-league system is or whether they have any prospects shouldn't play into it.

Because how good a team's minor-league system is has a major role in determining how good a team they were in the regular season; after all, they could bring up minor leaguers to fill holes/improve performance all regular season long. A team's minor league system is simply an extension of its bench/depth, and thus its inherent quality. Why should the post-season be any different in this regard?

For your argument to hang together, you should advocate that the 25-man roster be frozen on Opening Day of the regular season. If not, you've arbitrarily imposed a limitation beginning October 1st that didn't apply from April thru September.

Yeah, I gotta say that the boundaries between the major-league and minor-league rosters in a system are so porous anymore that this arbitary cutoff date makes no sense in terms of intra-organizational moves. The spirit of the rule was probably originally to keep a star pitcher from the independent high minors, a Duster Mails type, from being purchased as a ringer for the World Series; but those quality pitchers are all spoken for nowadays.

No, a better question is why the rule exists at all. This isn't beer league softball. You don't keep a ringer in the minors only to bring him up for the playoffs. If a guy has been in your organization all year, and if you've been developing him, why the hell shouldn't you be able to use him in the post-season, even if he hasn't played a game in the majors all season? It's not like a team is going to go out on September 15th and sign an Ichiro from Japan just for the playoffs. And even if MLB was concerned about that, just make a rule that says anyone anywhere in the organization as of August 31st is eligible.

So says an Angels fan!

So says an Angels fan!

Now that you bring it up, I was a Phillies fan in the Marty Bystrom Autumn of 1980 :)

So says an Angels fan!

Hell, the rule as written worked fine for my team, so I have no real dog in this fight. I don't see the Angels suddenly adding Brandon Wood to their post-season roster, so there's really no reason for them to take advantage of this rule, and with their crowded DL, I doubt they'd use the loophole this year. The only guys not on the 25 man roster that could possibly make the post-season roster are Juan Rivera, Mike Napoli, and Big Bart, all of whom are already eligible by virtue of being on the DL on August 31st.

I just think it's a really stupid rule.

I MAY have a counter-example for this rule: the Dodgers did not recall James Loney, who was optioned at Aug. 18 2006, until Sep. 1 2006. Which means Loney is a Sep. called-up. At Aug. 31, Loney was on neither active roster nor disabled list. Nevertheless, Loney was eligible for the 06 playoff and started at 1B in Game 3.

If this rule were to follow, Dodgers would do something on Loney or he may not eligible for playing Oct. games.

Probably, there are two ways to explain this:

1. Playoff eligibility is for playres on 40-man roster (that includes your 15-day, 60-day DL) prior to Sep. 1.
2. Dodgers replaced one injured guy by Loney in playoff roster. But also keep in mind Loney is a 1B, it's not possible for Loney to replace a player "whose position is the same as him" at that time.

Anyway, to forbid a team to place their optional assignment players on play off roster looks ridiculous to me ,and yes, I have no idea why Padres and Tribes did those wicked transaction moves.

I MAY have a counter-example for this rule: the Dodgers did not recall James Loney, who was optioned at Aug. 18 2006, until Sep. 1 2006. Which means Loney is a Sep. called-up. At Aug. 31, Loney was on neither active roster nor disabled list. Nevertheless, Loney was eligible for the 06 playoff and started at 1B in Game 3.

Loney simply replaced someone who WAS on the disabled list as of August 31st.

It's not like a team is going to go out on September 15th and sign an Ichiro from Japan just for the playoffs. And even if MLB was concerned about that, just make a rule that says anyone anywhere in the organization as of August 31st is eligible.

My understanding of the rule is that the replacement player must at least be IN THE ORGANIZATION as of August 31st, so the rule would already prevent this situation.

Loney simply replaced someone who WAS on the disabled list as of August 31st.

Correct. Loney replaced Jayson Werth.

My understanding of the rule is that the replacement player must at least be IN THE ORGANIZATION as of August 31st, so the rule would already prevent this situation.

This is also correct.

-- MWE

Guys, thanks a lot. Now I know the replacement player must at least be in the organization as of Aug 31. But I still a little confused with the term here.

Does "organization" mean the entire minor league system affiliated with the team regardless the level? If I have a minor leaguer who is "contract purchased" after Sep. 1 (which means this player is not on 40-man roster as of August 31), can I replace an injured guy on my playoff eligible list by this late contract-purchased guy?

Last year, the A's had an infielder who made his major-league debut in the playoffs.

It was Mark Kiger, who has one hell of a bb-ref page.

Kiger replaced Mark Ellis, whose hand was broken in game 3 of the alds. Kiger had been with the A's org since he was drafted in 2002. He's now toiling in the Mets minor league system. There's a good chance that he never has another major league stint, which would make him a really cool trivia question.

"It's not like a team is going to go out on September 15th and sign an Ichiro from Japan just for the playoffs"

Maybe not, but a guy like Roger Clemens could become a "hired gun" next year and sign on September 15 for whatever playoff team offers him the most money.

He'd have to do it by August 31st, but that's an idea that could keep him pitching till he's over 50, at least.

So September would be Roger's spring training.

Because how good a team's minor-league system is has a major role in determining how good a team they were in the regular season; after all, they could bring up minor leaguers to fill holes/improve performance all regular season long. A team's minor league system is simply an extension of its bench/depth, and thus its inherent quality. Why should the post-season be any different in this regard?

Nonsense. When minor leaguers get called up and are good enough to stick, they stick and are on the 25-man roster on Aug 31. Otherwise they are replacing injured players and if those players are still injured, then no reason not to use this guy as their playoff replacement.

There is of course no magic cutoff date -- make it on the 25-man roster on Sept 15 or the last day of the season or whatever.

I'd be happy with any number of variations -- e.g. minimum games played or PA/innings or what have you.

For your argument to hang together, you should advocate that the 25-man roster be frozen on Opening Day of the regular season. If not, you've arbitrarily imposed a limitation beginning October 1st that didn't apply from April thru September.

More nonsense. You've heard of the 40-man roster. Teams are not allowed to add players who are not on their 40-man rosters. Why should they be able to make last-minute changes to their 40-man roster for the playoffs?

I'll ask again, why even have a 25-man roster? Why have 40-man rosters? Why not have infinite options? Why have trading deadlines? Why have the wacky August waiver trades? Why not sign Clemens or Ichiro or whoever for the playoffs? Why limit it to players in the organisation on Aug 31?

I'll give you an analogy. Say Duke is about to enter the NCAA basketball tourney. Suppose they have a letter of intent from the best high school player in the country. Anything wrong with them enrolling him in March and adding him for the tourney?

There is of course no magic cutoff date -- make it on the 25-man roster on Sept 15 or the last day of the season or whatever.

Well, there is no 25-man roster after Sept 1st. But what you're advocating is precisely a magic cutoff date, namely August 31st. And if that date isn't important, and it can be "whatever," than why not July 16th, or June 3rd, or April 30th?

I'd be happy with any number of variations -- e.g. minimum games played or PA/innings or what have you.

Now that makes some sense, conceptually. But practically speaking, it becomes a function of what minimum playing time cutoff you choose, which in effect becomes a proxy for days on the active ML roster for any player good enough to be used in a regular/semi-regular role. And if he isn't good enough for that, what in the Sam Hill is the problem we're trying to solve?

You've heard of the 40-man roster. Teams are not allowed to add players who are not on their 40-man rosters. Why should they be able to make last-minute changes to their 40-man roster for the playoffs?

The 40-man roster is a mechanism to protect players from drafts. Period. That's it. Teams do have the full capacity to make changes to their 40-man roster all the time, except when frozen for certain periods preceding drafts. The playoffs have nothing to do with it.

I'll ask again, why even have a 25-man roster?

The 25-man roster is a mechanism to limit the substitution capacity of teams during games. Period. That's it. Teams do have the full capacity to make changes to their 25-man roster all the time, except when frozen for the duration of a given post-season series.

Why not have infinite options? Why have trading deadlines? Why have the wacky August waiver trades? Why not sign Clemens or Ichiro or whoever for the playoffs? Why limit it to players in the organisation on Aug 31?

Since I don't have a particular issue with any of these things, I'd suggest that the one needing to present good answers would be you. :-)

I'll give you an analogy. Say Duke is about to enter the NCAA basketball tourney. Suppose they have a letter of intent from the best high school player in the country. Anything wrong with them enrolling him in March and adding him for the tourney?

If he meets all NCAA eligibility requirements, I don't see the terrible problem, practically speaking. Duke's opponents would have the same opportunity to sign that player or any other. Whether bringing in a new, green player, no matter what his raw talent, at that point in the season would actually provide much benefit is a serious question.

He'd have to do it by August 31st, but that's an idea that could keep him pitching till he's over 50, at least

Don't give the big so-and-so any bright ideas. Actually Curt Schilling is more likely to actually read BTF occasionally, and that sounds like the kind of career path he'd like, as well ...