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Wednesday, June 25, 2008

MLB.com: MLB, union meet over maple bats

The Safety and Health Advisory Committee held its first meeting today via conference call in New York to discuss player and fan safety, including the danger of being hit with remnants of a broken bat. Members of the committee, which includes a mix of players as well as executives from MLB, individual clubs and the players’ union, expressed their concerns over the issues and concurred that they require prompt consideration and action.

The Safety and Health Advisory Committee formalized the next steps, which include consulting with bat manufacturers and experts in the field, conducting field studies, conducting laboratory tests of bats and gathering information about protective measures in Major League ballparks.
...
Potential remedies include extending netting behind the plate down the first- and third-base lines as they do in Japanese ballparks, placing restrictions on the width of bat handles and banning the use of maple bats completely.
...
The majority of Major Leaguers use maple bats, but many prefer bats made of ash. Houston’s Lance Berkman is a fan of the latter, although he fears if maple bats are banned, it will dilute the supply of good ash bats.
...
Berkman said ash bats are “less treacherous, all the way around,” adding that when a maple bat breaks, it’s a much more violent act than that of an ash bat, which has more of a flaky feel when it meets its demise… “I just prefer the ash,” he said. “It bends a little more than maple. I like the feel of the ball coming off the bat. When a maple bat dies, it’s a spectacular occurrence, whereas ash bats slip gently into its good night.”

AP: Plate umpire O’Nora hit by broken maple bat

NTNgod Posted: June 25, 2008 at 03:43 AM | 36 comment(s) | Login to Bookmark
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   1. Rich Rifkin I Posted: June 25, 2008 at 04:07 AM (#2831902)
"Potential remedies include extending netting behind the plate down the first- and third-base lines as they do in Japanese ballparks, placing restrictions on the width of bat handles and banning the use of maple bats completely."

I am not convinced that the real problem is a shard hitting a fan, though obviously that could happen. I think the greater danger is to infielders. And I think it is problematic when a fielder must dodge a flying bat part in order to try to field a hit ball. In the last 15 years, it has become the rare game when at least one bat does not shatter onto the field of play. Shattered bats used to be extremely rare, only a decade or two ago.

There may be a very good argument against my idea, but I have a proposal for solving the problem of broken bat parts flying around: If any part of a swung bat lands on the field of play after contact is made with a pitched ball, the play is dead and the pitch is considered a swinging strike. In cases where the batter had two strikes on him and his bat fragments over the field of play, he is out by strike out.

This would result in the short term in a lot of pissed off hitters who put balls in play (or even hit a home run) only to have it declared null and void and called a swinging strike. But in the long run, hitters would switch to bats which don't shatter (much like were used up to the mid-1990s) and they would be less inclined to shave down the handle into a tooth-pick.
   2. NTNgod Posted: June 25, 2008 at 04:14 AM (#2831905)
Yahoo!: Maple presents a hard problem
Though neither side offered further comment, sources said the likelihood of any change in the rules before the end of the season was extremely unlikely, even though, in the release, the committee said it would “issue recommendations as quickly as possible.”

Potential solutions are manifold, though none will satisfy all parties. Players will vehemently oppose an outright ban on maple bats, with more than 50 percent using them regularly despite being introduced only a decade ago. The prospect of protective nets surrounding the field could bother fans and wouldn’t do anything to protect players. Having a central bat inspector – one who would stamp bats OK before they get shipped to players – could prove cost prohibitive and ineffective.

And one idea that seems a happy medium, changing the dimensions of the bat – whether to a larger minimum handle size (currently 16/19th of an inch), smaller length-to-weight ratio (minus-3.5, meaning a 34-inch bat must weigh at least 30.5 ounces) or smaller barrel (2¾ inches) – would chafe some players, too.

“You can’t switch with a guy’s handle,” said Helton, who uses a 34-inch, 32-ounce model. “No. Nooo. I don’t care what they think. It doesn’t matter if handles are too thin. You can’t switch it. That’s how he’s feeling the bat. That’s his connection with the bat.”
...
And, as Helton said, “If they find out maple bats are the reason we have more broken bats, they probably ought to switch it."
   3. TVerik, AKA Snoopy Snoopy Poop Dog Posted: June 25, 2008 at 04:44 AM (#2831914)
There was a great moment on YES, in which Michael Kay was talking endlessly about how maple bats were evil because of the way they shattered and that Johnny Damon, who was hitting, has made the choice to switch from maple to ash based on that.

Right then, Johnny was jammed and the bat exploded in as violent an explosion as I've seen. Shards everywhere. Kay, to his credit, laughed at the events on the field making him look like a doofus.
   4. Brandon in MO (Yunitility Infielder) Posted: June 25, 2008 at 05:06 AM (#2831922)
Yeah, there's no problem with an umpire being hit on the head and cut open by a cheap bat.

I'd take getting hit by an exploding ash bat over getting hit by the sharp end of a maple chunk.
   5. Dan Posted: June 25, 2008 at 05:13 AM (#2831926)
Johnny Damon breaks more bats at the plate than anyone in baseball.
   6. Tuque Posted: June 25, 2008 at 07:02 AM (#2831947)
"...whereas ash bats slip gently into its good night.”

So Lance Berkman used "whereas" in the same sentence as an effective play on a Dylan Thomas poem?

I like this guy.
   7. Jolly Old St. Neck Wound, Moral Idiot Posted: June 25, 2008 at 09:04 AM (#2831958)
Having a central bat inspector – one who would stamp bats OK before they get shipped to players – could prove cost prohibitive and ineffective.

Yes, that $50,000 or $100,000 a year would be a real deal breaker. At least two or three teams might be forced out of business.

If they're worried about player safety, they shouldn't, since players are the ones creating the problem in the first place. If players themselves are really worrying about it, there's no evidence of it, since there haven't been many calls on their part to eliminate maple bats.

If they're worried about fan safety, they shouldn't, since fans who don't want to pay attention to what's going on down there on the field shouldn't be buying box seats in the first place. The last thing they need is to go the way of hockey just to indulge the neuroses of players who feel they couldn't possibly get used to an ash bat. The next logical step along this line, I suppose, would be to require fans to wear helmets and have a 60-second safety video shown before each game, complete with legal disclaimers. They could call the Flight Attendants' union and hire one of their recently laid off workers to do the video.

Maybe a "bat inspector" isn't the answer, but if he is, hire him and pay him whatever he's worth. And if it takes a team of them, hire the team.

And if they really see it as a problem, and a bat inspector isn't the answer, then just ban the damn things and send out a list of good psychiatrists for the benefit of players who are addicted to maple bats. They don't need a commission to figure this out.
   8. Belfry Bob Posted: June 25, 2008 at 10:43 AM (#2831970)
The Safety and Health Advisory Committee formalized the next steps, which include consulting with bat manufacturers and experts in the field, conducting field studies, conducting laboratory tests of bats and gathering information about protective measures in Major League ballparks.

"Quick, we've got to save our phoney-baloney jobs, gentlemen! Harumph! Harumph!"
   9. Lassus: Posted: June 25, 2008 at 10:50 AM (#2831973)
The Safety and Health Advisory Committee formalized the next steps, which include consulting with bat manufacturers and experts in the field, conducting field studies, conducting laboratory tests of bats and gathering information about protective measures in Major League ballparks.

Jesus Christ in a maple tree, just get rid of the bats. Lordy. Is the maple lobby leaving squirrel's heads in senator's beds or something?
   10. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: June 25, 2008 at 11:28 AM (#2831986)
The big problem with outright banning maple bats is that thanks to the emerald ash borer, there may not be ash bats in 10-20 years, either.

I still think that handle restrictions are the way to go.
   11. Jolly Old St. Neck Wound, Moral Idiot Posted: June 25, 2008 at 12:15 PM (#2832018)
Jackie Robinson's bat had a 1 3/16" handle. I used one of those for years without even stinging my hands, let alone breaking it. Does anyone know the diameter of some of the handles of today's bats?
   12. cercopithecus aethiops Posted: June 25, 2008 at 12:54 PM (#2832047)
$50,000 or $100,000 a year would be a real deal breaker

Does that include benefits? Where do I apply?

Does anyone know the diameter of some of the handles of today's bats?

I don't think anybody uses anything over an inch anymore. Minimum is 16/19 per the article linked in #2.

If they're worried about player safety, they shouldn't, since players are the ones creating the problem in the first place.

One could say the same thing about steroids. (ducks and runs)
   13. ColonelTom Posted: June 25, 2008 at 01:15 PM (#2832060)
Buster Olney comments on the issue on ESPN.com:
Barreling toward maple-bat tragedy
   14. phredbird Posted: June 25, 2008 at 03:50 PM (#2832200)
buster olney is a tool. but he does know how to report, and he is right. we are one swing away from a real mess.

i don't necessarily agree with rich rifkin's take, the players are trained athletes and probably can take care of themselves, that is, avoid shards etc. ... however, i do agree that maybe the broken bat pieces on the field of play could be treated as a foul ball, even if the hit ball is in play. i think the fans are way more at risk.

as someone who witnessed at close range the incident in dodger stadium back in may where a woman had her jaw broken, i have to say they really do need to address it from fan safety standpoint. the nets they have up now are not adequate to defend these large sharp shards. she was very very lucky she wasn't hurt more, or even killed. it was scary.
   15. crict Posted: June 25, 2008 at 04:23 PM (#2832220)
There's a small company in Quebec City that believes the future is yellow birch bats. Russell Martin already uses them. I believe a few other major leaguers too.

B45
   16. Who wants Teixeira dessert? Posted: June 25, 2008 at 04:40 PM (#2832234)
Well, maple bats aren't bad, but when they start using mesquite or cherry wood, I'll get more interested. Now, elm is slippery, and oak would be poison. Birch makes a fine beer.

Concerned Beaver
   17. BeanoCook Posted: June 25, 2008 at 08:43 PM (#2832389)
buster olney is a tool. but he does know how to report, and he is right. we are one swing away from a real mess.


Agreed. Buster is a sweaty mess when on TV.
   18. ValueArb Posted: June 26, 2008 at 01:27 AM (#2832838)
Selig, just be proactive for once and ban or handle restrict immediately using best interests of baseball and until the committee gives you a better solution. And tell lance there is no constitutional protection of handle widths.
   19. The George Sherrill Selection Posted: June 26, 2008 at 01:48 AM (#2832865)
Aluminum bats won't shatter. Problem solved.
   20. Jolly Old St. Neck Wound, Moral Idiot Posted: June 26, 2008 at 03:34 AM (#2833012)
Aluminum bats won't shatter. Problem solved.

Yes, let's have the Majors imitate the most bush league aspect of amateur baseball.
   21. The Ghost of Sox Fans Past Posted: June 26, 2008 at 04:57 AM (#2833064)
Yep, one severe injury or death will find MLB leaping into action. It frustrates me that one single data point can make such a huge difference. No one worried much about base coaches getting hit by batted balls until Mike Coolbaugh was hit and killed. Either these bats are a severe problem or they aren't. I think they are.

It seems silly that they can't ban a wood that wasn't used until 10 years ago, but whagtever. Maybe it is really the handle diameter anyway. Maybe they have to control the diameter for maple more than for other woods. They just have to come up with some bat criteria to limit the possibility of shattering.
   22. Poster Nutbag, Serial (Thread-)Killer Posted: June 26, 2008 at 05:02 AM (#2833067)
"Quick, we've got to save our phoney-baloney jobs, gentlemen! Harumph! Harumph!"


"I didn't get a Harumph out of that guy...."
   23. Srul Itza At Home Posted: June 26, 2008 at 05:35 AM (#2833085)
Andy, I don't think he was being serious.

Mainly because I was going to suggest the same thing, and then write "Ducks and Runs"

Oh, the disadvantages of being 6 hours behind the East Coast.
   24. crict Posted: June 26, 2008 at 11:09 AM (#2833138)
Yellow birch is even worse than maple for sheer strength. Kind of a coincidence that a company situated in a place where yellow birch is a dominant tree specie is advocating it as a replacement wood.


Of course it's not. They even say that it's the yellow birch growing in Quebec that has all the nice properties.

No idea if it's true, but of course they have incentives to say it is.

Among the major league users: Russell Martin, Ray Durham, David Murphy
Also, the Fort Myers Miracle are exclusively using them. It might provide enough data to compare with maple bats.

The only description I found was in French, but roughly: As hard as maple, as flexible as ash, more durable. Maple is too heavy and contains too much humidity. It has to be dried, which is why it tends to shatter. Quebec yellow birch contains more humidity (than other yellow birch) because of the St. Lawrence river and is harder because it grows in the north.
   25. ValueArb Posted: June 26, 2008 at 02:09 PM (#2833217)
Baseballs hidebound slowness is astonishing. Some of its traditions are great, but most are stulptifying (sic).
   26. crict Posted: June 26, 2008 at 03:56 PM (#2833345)
I have no expertise in this area, just reporting what was said in the article.

Article in French

Most probably the journalist has no more expertise than me and didn't report it correctly.
   27. Gambling Rent Czar Posted: June 26, 2008 at 04:35 PM (#2833385)
Aluminum bats won't shatter. Problem solved.

Yes, let's have the Majors imitate the most bush league aspect of amateur baseball.
It couldn't be any worse than the DH.
   28. Swedish Chef Posted: June 26, 2008 at 04:41 PM (#2833391)
Is it possible to rougly calculate how a switch to aluminium bats would affect power numbers in MLB?
   29. cardsfanboy Posted: June 26, 2008 at 04:51 PM (#2833403)
Grandfather clause to shut up the Lance Berkmans of the world (new people in the league must use bats made of approved substance etc) That is assuming that it's the bats material that is the problem, and not the diameter of the handle. Is it possible to set up different diameter requirements based upon wood type, if it's proven that thicker maple bats don't shatter as dangerously? This would satisfy the Heltons of the world (if you want the thinner handle you have to go ash) Of course I would probably still gradually increase the diameter requirement each year anyway just to be safe.

I understand that Ash is a wood in trouble, and it's in baseballs best long term interest to have other woods available for future eventualities.
   30. Srul Itza Posted: June 26, 2008 at 05:26 PM (#2833488)
Just one word. Plastics.
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