For those who did not see the game, Arod was booed when he made routine plays in the field and when he came to the plate. It was pretty vicious.

Just 9 1/2 more years of it, ARod. Great choice re-signing with NY.

Nice of little-rod to spend this evening proving that there is no such thing as clutch.

“It was an awful night,” Rodriguez said. “I pretty much screwed it up every way you can screw it up.”

The media likes ARod on his knees like this. He shouldn't give them these kinds of quotes anymore.

"I tip my hat and call the Red Sox my daddy," Rodriguez continued.

I haven't confirmed this (due to lateness and tiredness) but some announcer on one of the channels on which I watched/listened to this game said that, in the 8th and 9th innings this season, A-Rod has a total of 2 RBIs.

As I threw out in the game chatter, I think he's become the very best player that I wouldn't want on my team, surpassing Ty Cobb and Pete Rose.

Indeed it's true.

I think he's become the very best player that I wouldn't want on my team

You have fun with that. I'll still gladly take him on my team any day.

So now is anything other than 130+ RBI considered an abject failure for Alex Rodriguez? My goodness, it's amazing how quickly people get spoiled.

I think he's become the very best player that I wouldn't want on my team, surpassing Ty Cobb and Pete Rose.

seems like i've heard an argument somewhere that goes something like: rbi ... function ... on base ... other ... teammates...

where could i have heard that, i wonder?

i mean, jesus ####### christ. do you read what people write on this site?

Why wouldn't you want Cobb. Do you want to play against players that will do anything to win. He's the first player I pick for my team.

For those who did not see the game, Arod was booed when he made routine plays in the field and when he came to the plate. It was pretty vicious.

Just 9 1/2 more years of it, ARod. Great choice re-signing with NY.

Disgusting. Just disgusting. I would love to argue with you from a Yankee fan perspective. I can’t.

I have no idea if the majority of fans of other franchises are this stupid. Phillies fans hated Bobby Abreu for some bizarre reason. I’m not sure if Red Sox fans have ever been this irrationally dumb when it came to a specific individual. All I know is, the negative energy from the upper deck was absolutely palatable, and powerful.

Was I pissed at the double play against Masterson? Yes. Am I angry that my favorite team’s baseball season is circling the drain largely because of their mysterious inability to get hits with runners in scoring, and that Alex Rodriguez has been very much part of the problem? Yes, infuriated actually.

But incensed enough to boo the guy like he’s Bobby Bonilla circa 1992?

Walking out of the Stadium tonight was probably the lowest I’ve ever felt as a fan. Just a hideous, angry atmosphere in which to watch a ballgame… not the way I wanted to spend my last night on break.

I haven't confirmed this (due to lateness and tiredness) but some announcer on one of the channels on which I watched/listened to this game said that, in the 8th and 9th innings this season, A-Rod has a total of 2 RBIs.

If only they didn't change the rules so now the first 7 innings don't count.

of course they do, but the end of the game (particularly if the game is close) will have a greater lasting impact on people's perceptions. Can't be helped.

I’m not sure if Red Sox fans have ever been this irrationally dumb when it came to a specific individual.

Nothing compares to our blind hate for Julio Lugo...

But in all seriousness: Bill Buckner.
Which was why it was awesome, to see him throw out the first pitch this season, and get the reception at fenway that he did. It goes some way to reconciling the errors of the past.

@#12: You'd think with his 31 RBI's in the 8th & 9th last year the fans would cut him some slack, then.

That was all just meaningless stat padding in blowouts. Everyone knows that.

What the hell was Giambi thinking as he held the ball at 1b as Crisp scored from second on a groundout?

Thank god True Yankee Andy Pettitte was there to show what it really means to be an effective winner.

You'd think with his 31 RBI's in the 8th & 9th last year the fans would cut him some slack, then.

He basically *was* the Yankee offense (with a little help from Posaada) for those first couple of months last year. Without him, they don't smell the playoffs. But sports fans can have short memories, especially somewhere like NYC.

I've never, ever done this before, however:

But sports fans can have short memories tiny, tiny, tiny brains...

FIXED!

Thank god True Yankee Andy Pettitte was there to show what it really means to be an effective winner.

Well let's be fair, Pettitte recorded 14 outs- Alex only made 7.

Just 9 1/2 more years of it, ARod. Great choice re-signing with NY.

As countless big-contract players - including A-Rod once before - have proven over time... Get the money first, then you can worry about where to play. They can trade him tomorrow* if they wanted to, and he'll still get paid the same. If he doesn't like it there he can pout and moan and demand whatever he wants, and he'll eventually get out of town - again, with the same contract.

But in all seriousness: Bill Buckner.
Which was why it was awesome, to see him throw out the first pitch this season, and get the reception at fenway that he did. It goes some way to reconciling the errors of the past.

Buckner had had plenty of ovations at Fenway from 1987 to the present day, including when he returned in 1990. He even said this year that the fans were always good to him, but the media had been the one to rip him apart constantly. Yeah, we all hated the one play, but we didn't hate him.

Carl Everett might be the closest modern-day example**. By the end of his contract the Nippon Nibbler might also reach the level of "ire directed toward a player who actually produces" that we're talking about.

* No-trade clause willing. Oh, and, clause or not, he's a month away from becoming a 10-5 player. Enjoy!

** Assuming we're talking about players, not coaching staff. I can think of a few third-base coaches who'd probably get booed for waving in runners on a home run.

No-trade clause willing. Oh, and, clause or not, he's a month away from becoming a 10-5 player. Enjoy!

This seems like something of a theoretical notion since the likeliest teams with the scratch to want to pay A-Rod that kind of dough are teams where the Yankees would never dream of sending him. If he were still worth having, no way do they trade him to Boston or the Mets. (I suppose there are the Dodgers, Angels, and Cubs - but none of them are quite as free with the purse strings.)

Send him and $5M per to Philly for Howard, Feliz, and a few prospects. We'd cheer him for at least a few months.

I’m not sure if Red Sox fans have ever been this irrationally dumb when it came to a specific individual.

The Fenway faithful booed Jim Rice during the 1986 playoffs. OK, it's not like he was still the best player on the team by a mile or anything, so that doesn't qualify as irrationally dumb. Just petty in a "what have you done for me lately sort of way." So in that sense it's similar to Yankee fans booing Rodriguez, except that we can expect several more years of wild swings in fan reaction in his case.

Assuming we're talking about players, not coaching staff. I can think of a few third-base coaches who'd probably get booed for waving in runners on a home run.

And a few managers for bringing out a lineup card? I'm old, so I'm thinking Johnny Mac more than Grady.

This seems like something of a theoretical notion since the likeliest teams with the scratch to want to pay A-Rod that kind of dough are teams where the Yankees would never dream of sending him.

If they want to get rid of him, they can; but they likely can't get rid of his salary. And my point was that, no matter what they do with him and what portion of his salary they're paying, he's still getting paid the same.

I don't think the Yankees want to get rid of him, nor should they. But I wasn't booing him last night.

And a few managers for bringing out a lineup card? I'm old, so I'm thinking Johnny Mac more than Grady.

What about Jimy Williams? I thought he was also a local "favorite".

Buckner had had plenty of ovations at Fenway from 1987 to the present day, including when he returned in 1990. He even said this year that the fans were always good to him, but the media had been the one to rip him apart constantly. Yeah, we all hated the one play, but we didn't hate him.

Carl Everett might be the closest modern-day example**. By the end of his contract the Nippon Nibbler might also reach the level of "ire directed toward a player who actually produces" that we're talking about.

Hey, give me a break, I was 5 in '88, and it seemed pretty acrimonious at the time...

And there is absolutely nothing irrational about hating Everett.

For the most part, Arod wasn't booed this year. It hasn't been the auto-boo situation it was last year. This is the first time I have heard him boo in a while.

Last night, he killed two rallies, left what, 8 runners on base?

It was probably his worst game as a Yankee.

I don't think the Yankees want to get rid of him, nor should they. But I wasn't booing him last night.


They just signed him 10 months ago, of course they don't want to get rid of him.

And most Yankee fans understand how important he is, and they want him to succeed.

That was all just meaningless stat padding in blowouts. Everyone knows that.

No, ARod was celebrated for his ninth inning heroics last year.

He hit 7 Homers in the 9th inning, and something silly like 10 tie breaking or go ahead homers in the 8th or later. He was a clutch god last year, and he wasn't booed after April.

It seems pretty simple with A-Rod and New York. Do well, fans cheer. Do poorly, fans boo. This isn't rocket science, people.

The Fenway faithful booed Jim Rice during the 1986 playoffs. OK, it's not like he was still the best player on the team by a mile or anything, so that doesn't qualify as irrationally dumb. Just petty in a "what have you done for me lately sort of way." So in that sense it's similar to Yankee fans booing Rodriguez, except that we can expect several more years of wild swings in fan reaction in his case.

They weren't booing Rice, they were booing the fact that he hadn't yet been elected to the Hall of Fame.

Well, he hasn't really done well, compared to 07, this year, and the boos really haven't come until last night.

There was a time when Jeter was booed. Jeter. Derek Jeter. Swear to God.

He basically *was* the Yankee offense (with a little help from Posaada) for those first couple of months last year.

Um, Jeter was on base nearly 41% of the time before the All-Star break last year. He was having a monster season before he hurt his knee.

According to FanGraphs's Clutch rankings, ARod is the least clutch player in the majors this year. The fans have reason to boo, it seems.

According to FanGraphs's Clutch rankings, ARod is the least clutch player in the majors this year. The fans have reason to boo, it seems.

That jibes with how A-Rod has performed in the clutch this year. On the other hand, in 2007, the 2nd and 4th least clutch players were Manny Ramirez and David Ortiz. I don't know what to make make of this stat.

nothing, it means nothing.

Phillies fans hated Bobby Abreu for some bizarre reason
Passivity at the plate (stupid reason, for sure) and a magnetic repulsion to walls -- a reason but not much of one -- surely you've noticed

I watched one of the games vs. the Orioles with my dad. In the first inning Michael Kay said something about ARod having a great BP session, leading to this exchange:

Dad: yeah, well why doesn't he do it IN THE GAME?!
Me: what are you talking about? He's been fine.
Dad: yeah, but not recently.
Me: he had two doubles last night!

that's just the way it is with the Yankees. They don't win, people are going to go looking for someone to blame. More often than not, ARod is going to be that someone.

Jetes needs to go on with John Salley and rip the NYY fans as front-runners.

The fans have reason to boo, it seems.

No, they don't. Fans have a right to be disappointed when their team loses but not to ridicule players who are trying hard and giving an honest effort. You don't have to cheer guys sucking, but booing should, IMHO, be reserved for the wife-beaters, cheaters and other sundry a$$holes. That they booed Derek Jeter isn't evidence that they're fair-minded but that they're idiots and ingrates.

Note that this applies to every team across the board. It's more visible with the big market teams that usually win, but every fanbase has behaved this way at one time or another. It may be human nature, but it's an ugly bit of human nature and need not be excused.

No, they don't. Fans have a right to be disappointed when their team loses but not to ridicule players who are trying hard and giving an honest effort. You don't have to cheer guys sucking, but booing should, IMHO, be reserved for the wife-beaters, cheaters and other sundry a$$holes. That they booed Derek Jeter isn't evidence that they're fair-minded but that they're idiots and ingrates.

Note that this applies to every team across the board. It's more visible with the big market teams that usually win, but every fanbase has behaved this way at one time or another. It may be human nature, but it's an ugly bit of human nature and need not be excused.

This is ridiculous.

Okay, fine JC, boo the guy. But don't act like you're really behind him and on his side when he clinches the series for you next year. People lose in games. Athletes fail. In baseball, they fail a lot. If you can't deal with that, you're a hypocrite if you celebrate the good times.

Anyone who booed Derek Jeter is an idiot and an ingrate. I think he's overrated as hell, but he's been a great player who has done great things for the team and been an good representative of his team and city. If you'll boo that, or excuse booing that, then I have no use for you.

Okay, fine JC, boo the guy. But don't act like you're really behind him and on his side when he clinches the series for you next year. People lose in games. Athletes fail. In baseball, they fail a lot. If you can't deal with that, you're a hypocrite if you celebrate the good times.

Anyone who booed Derek Jeter is an idiot and an ingrate. I think he's overrated as hell, but he's been a great player who has done great things for the team and been an good representative of his team and city. If you'll boo that, or excuse booing that, then I have no use for you.

Wowee. I, and assume athletes, understand that booing and cheering is relatively fickle, and that it's not an indictment of the player so much as an expression of disappointment at failure at that time. Apparently you find it a significant human rights violation.

No, it isn't a significant human rights violation (I guess I can't express a critical opinion without it being a huge deal - this ranks far down the list of ugly things humans do but that doesn't mean it isn't ugly). Also, the fans certainly have the "right" to boo. But that isn't a reason to boo.

Booing a hometeam guy who fails is, essentially, saying that you don't care about the guy or what he's done for you. You only care about his next win, the next thing he does that will reflect just a tiny bit of glory your way. While that's life and, yes, I assume players know that going in, it is hardly an admirable thing.

Just curious for those who boo or endorse it. Do you literally say the long drawn-out "boooooooo" to voice your displeasure at a ballgame. Because I've got to say, regardless of one's views on the ethics of the matter, I'd feel absolutely ####### ridiculous having that escape my mouth. It just seems like such a moronic thing to say.

Do you literally say the long drawn-out "boooooooo" to voice your displeasure at a ballgame. Because I've got to say, regardless of one's views on the ethics of the matter, I'd feel absolutely ####### ridiculous having that escape my mouth. It just seems like such a moronic thing to say

I've given a full-throated boo to opposing players I don't like, but rarely for longer than 3 or 4 beats. I think it would be better if we went the international route and whistled.

i mean, jesus ####### christ. do you read what people write on this site?

I do. A-Rod seems to make his team's fans grit their teeth a lot. Between the perception of his streakiness in the clutch, the way the media handles him, his outside distractions, his glove slapping and "HA" shouting and such, and the difficulty he has generally getting the fans to identify him, he seems to have generated an aura about him that makes him hard to root for.

To what degree that is his fault I can't say, but it doesn't change the reality of it either way.

I read what this person wrote on this site:

Walking out of the Stadium tonight was probably the lowest I’ve ever felt as a fan. Just a hideous, angry atmosphere in which to watch a ballgame… not the way I wanted to spend my last night on break.

Maybe it's not just A-Rod, and maybe the culture of Yankee fans plays a bigger role than I am allowing for, but how many players send people out of the ballpark feeling this terrible as a fan? This, and watching him myself yesterday, true to form, having about the worst game you can have offensively in one of the biggest games of his team's season, make me not want to have him on my team regardless of what mathematical value he adds.

Because, like my perceptions of Cobb and Rose, he's hard to root for despite all his talent. And I'm not willing to remove the emotional part of rooting in total favor of the practical number-generated logic. I called him the BEST player I don't want on my team, because despite being one of the best ever I don't think I'd have that much fun rooting for him.

Please feel free, though, to continue keeping score of how good a fan I am as a result of this. I know I'm not as good as most of the people on this site because my value system is totally illogical. If you want to get all pissed off about my personal preferences, well, you have fun with that.

Just curious for those who boo or endorse it. Do you literally say the long drawn-out "boooooooo" to voice your displeasure at a ballgame.

I don't boo my own team, but when I am booing someone--espcially an umpire--I generally do the long drawn-out "Boooooo." It is a ridiculous thing for one person to do, but I think is rather impressive when a whole crowd is doing it.

If you can't deal with that, you're a hypocrite if you celebrate the good times.

No you're not. You're just a fair weather fan. Like 99.44% or so.

Do you literally say the long drawn-out "boooooooo" to voice your displeasure at a ballgame.

I never literally "boo." I usually go with something more along the lines of "#### #### #### ####### ############"!

It is a ridiculous thing for one person to do, but I think is rather impressive when a whole crowd is doing it.

I agree. When the whole crowd really vigorously boos a bad call, there is some pretty cool resonance. There's something about people's voices sort of naturally finding similar pitches after awhile that can make for some neat aural effects. I personally think booing should be reserved for bad calls, but that's just me.

I generally don't agree with talk-radio idiots, but that guy on ESPN radio who isn't Tony Kornheiser said that fans are far more critical as they spend a greater and greater amount of their takehome pay on tickets and parking and stuff like that.

I think I agree; if I'm invested twenty bucks and a night of my life, I'm more likely to be understanding if my team "takes a day off" (as the Yankees did last night) without complaint, but if I've invested hundreds of dollars in the tickets and other expenses, I'm more likely to be impatient if I perceive a lack of effort.

Just curious for those who boo or endorse it. Do you literally say the long drawn-out "boooooooo" to voice your displeasure at a ballgame. Because I've got to say, regardless of one's views on the ethics of the matter, I'd feel absolutely ####### ridiculous having that escape my mouth. It just seems like such a moronic thing to say.

It seems perfectly logical when someone like, say, Kevin Millar is strolling to the plate on the field in front of me.

Sometimes when Kevin Youkilis comes up to the plate, I want to make sure that the TV audience knows that I'm NOT saying, "Yoooook". Or "Boo-urns".

I'll generally keep it PG at the park - children and such.

Walking out of the Stadium tonight was probably the lowest I’ve ever felt as a fan. Just a hideous, angry atmosphere in which to watch a ballgame… not the way I wanted to spend my last night on break.

Maybe it's not just A-Rod, and maybe the culture of Yankee fans plays a bigger role than I am allowing for, but how many players send people out of the ballpark feeling this terrible as a fan? This, and watching him myself yesterday, true to form, having about the worst game you can have offensively in one of the biggest games of his team's season, make me not want to have him on my team regardless of what mathematical value he adds.

I think the person who quoted the above was saying it was ridiculous to boo A-Rod, at least the way he was being booed.

SoSH U at work Posted: August 27, 2008 at 11:04 AM (#2918493)

Just curious for those who boo or endorse it. Do you literally say the long drawn-out "boooooooo" to voice your displeasure at a ballgame. Because I've got to say, regardless of one's views on the ethics of the matter, I'd feel absolutely ####### ridiculous having that escape my mouth. It just seems like such a moronic thing to say.

- i disremember ever booing a astros ballplayer ON the roster. sometimes guys just have bad days but except for carlos lee not running out grounders/balls going to left, the guys do NOT dog it so i won't boo.

guys who need to get booed loudly and do

1 - carlos beltran (hate)
2 - uncle albert (respect)
3 - TLR (just because)
4 - arod (because he was disrespecful to the country of texas)

did i mention carlos the Jackal?

BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

I don't know about anyone else... but for the home team, I usually boo results, not the player himself. Even when Lugo would come to the plate, there'd be a smattering of applause, but hardly any booing. When he'd have yet another groundout, there'd be plenty of booing.

There is a significant "instant" media influence to all this, I think. There was an article last year about Lugo's struggles, and how he was losing sleep over it because he so didn't want to let the team down. For the next few games there was a lot more encouragement from the fans. Same case with Drew after word got out about his son's illness. The same works in reverse, with fans being more prone to booing after a negative article - which, I believe, was the case with A-Rod yesterday.

For Boston's opponents, I'll boo the players. It's usually a sign that they're good, and I don't want them to be. Not today, at least. If they do well, I boo louder.

Walking out of the Stadium tonight was probably the lowest I’ve ever felt as a fan. Just a hideous, angry atmosphere in which to watch a ballgame… not the way I wanted to spend my last night on break.

Maybe it's not just A-Rod, and maybe the culture of Yankee fans plays a bigger role than I am allowing for, but how many players send people out of the ballpark feeling this terrible as a fan?

My reading was that it was the other fans that made him feel this way, and not the player. That is a huge difference.

I think the person who quoted the above was saying it was ridiculous to boo A-Rod, at least the way he was being booed.

It's never ridiculous to boo Rodriguez or pile on him for any reason, no matter how trivial.

I don't know about anyone else... but for the home team, I usually boo results, not the player

Armando Benitez could have cured all cancer and ended all world strife; whether it be a shooting war or a more insidious one, and I would have booed him as soon as he walked out of the bullpen during his Yankee stint.

The Fenway faithful booed Jim Rice during the 1986 playoffs.

Did they? I don't remember this. I'm not saying it couldn't have happened -- he had a poor ALCS, as I recall. I just don't remember its happening. Source?

They weren't booing Rice, they were booing the fact that he hadn't yet been elected to the Hall of Fame.

Yeah, that could be it. Maybe they were just saying Coooooooooo-perstown!

I boo when someone throwing a ceremonial first pitch goes into a overdramatic windup and then airmails the ball past the catcher or bounces it or something. If you get up there and just chuck it and screw up that's fine, but if you make a big production out of it and Ankiel the pitch you're going to get the long boo from me.

If Santa Claus comes onto the field, he gets derided - loud and often. I don't see how anyone could argue with this law of nature.

I don't think there is nearly enough battery-throwing nowadays. It's your first amendment right.

Oh, also anytime someone in the luxury box misplays a foul ball hit right to them - that should also be booed lustily.

or when some schmuck proposes to his girlfriend on the jumbotron

#54: I think the person who quoted the above was saying it was ridiculous to boo A-Rod, at least the way he was being booed.


#57: My reading was that it was the other fans that made him feel this way, and not the player. That is a huge difference.


My impression, perhaps faulty, is that A-Rod inspires this kind of fan reaction in a way that other players do not. This is exactly from where my sentiment comes. If Jeter or Posada or, heck, even Giambi or Abreu had the same kind of night last night, I don't think the reaction would be quite as visceral or stinging. I would never want to be put in the position of having to root for a player who has this kind of relationship with the fans, such that it makes going to ballgames painful.

I don't think your impression is faulty, but I think it's pretty universal. Fans of teams are hard on the best/highest paid player on that team, all the time. Yes, some more than others, but I think his Texas contract put a big "X" on the front of the man's uniform.

A-Rod inspires this kind of fan reaction in a way that other players do not. This is exactly from where my sentiment comes. If Jeter or Posada or, heck, even Giambi or Abreu had the same kind of night last night, I don't think the reaction would be quite as visceral or stinging.

Those guys aren't as good as A-Rod. A player as talented as A-Rod is going to face unreasonable expectations, and those are only compounded by his gigantic contract and knack for saying/doing unsympathetic things. It's not fair, but it's reality.

It seems pretty simple with A-Rod and New York. Do well, fans cheer. Do poorly, fans boo. This isn't rocket science, people.

What is the baseline for "well" these days? OPS+ of 157, 16-18 SBs, adequate defense. He's an MVP candidate if he's playing for the White Sox or Twins. Kinda hard to expect a lot more no?

57. Yes, it was the "fans".

I don't know about anyone else... but for the home team, I usually boo results, not the player

Armando Benitez could have cured all cancer and ended all world strife; whether it be a shooting war or a more insidious one, and I would have booed him as soon as he walked out of the bullpen during his Yankee stint.

I'd boo Kyle Farnsworth when he came into a game, when I was watching at home, halfway across the country. Pointless, sure, but it made me feel better.

Where does Barry Zito fit in this discussion? Do you boo becasue he is getting paid all this money and has a losing record or do you boo just because of the money?

I don't think your impression is faulty, but I think it's pretty universal. Fans of teams are hard on the best/highest paid player on that team, all the time.

I sincerely doubt Ortiz would get this reception at Fenway or Pujols in St. Louis or Vlad in Anaheim. Not this bitter and unrestrained. I could be wrong. Either way, I"d rather have any of those players as someone to root for on my team than A-Rod.

I wonder how many Red Sox fans would want A-Rod on their team right now given everything he brings to the team, including the baggage with the numbers. I'm sure there are some, but I wonder if it's a majority. Even on a site like this, where numbers rule the day more often than not, I bet a significant portion of the Sox fans want nothing to do with A-Rod, as great a player as he clearly is.

What is the baseline for "well" these days?

Timing. A-Rod's OPS drops about 80 points or so against most of the teams in the AL East, which is still pretty darn good, but nevertheless has to be a disappointment to the fans.

Having just looked at the numbers, nobody deserves more boos than Giambi, who has been just pathetic against the Sox and Rays in particular.

Interestingly, the only every day regular who has maintained close to his season OPS against the top AL East rivals is Jeter. It's still a pretty unimpressive OPS, but I guess he's being more consistently disappointing.

On edit: I have no idea if 80 points is all that perceptible a drop at A-Rod's level -- it's less than 10% -- and it's certainly reasonable given that the top AL East teams obviously have better pitching. The drop is more noticeable, I guess if you are mixing 0-fers like last night in with 4-fers now and then rather than spreading the hits out. And, of course, 1-5 with a game winning grand slam last night would have been better than 3 for 4 in a loss. As I said, it's timing more than performance.

Neither of those players have dealt with extended periods of adversity - a bad overall year or a RISP-y business. I suspect that if Ortiz had the numbers late and close that Rod has this year, he'd hear it from the fans.

I suspect that if Ortiz had the numbers late and close that Rod has this year, he'd hear it from the fans

.

Maybe, but I doubt it. I think ARod's main problem in NY is that the Yankees have 0 ringzzz since his arrival and the Red Sox have 2.

I'm not sure on that point Erik. Vlad has been hugely disappointing in three separate playoffs- save for one swing in Fenway - but the hometown love is still strong. Granted a short, ugly playoff stretch isn't like hitting at Neifian levels with RISP for a full season, but the fact remains that Alex is very special. In terms of talent and fan reception.

I don't think he'd hear it from the fans with the intensity that ICR is getting. But he could be awarded a "lifetime achievement award" after enough of it.

Maybe, but I doubt it. I think ARod's main problem in NY is that the Yankees have 0 ringzzz since his arrival and the Red Sox have 2.

They also have 0 rings since Mussina and Giambi arrived. In A-Rod's case, though, there are a couple of extra points:

1. The mere acquisition of A-Rod was accepted as another case of NY beating Boston, and the Yankees' "commitment to winning for their fans" (or however GS put it at the time). It's one of the last few examples of this, and it's hollow.

2. At least Mussina and Giambi helped the team advance to the WS.

vi,

True, but Arod is the Yankees' best player. Part of it is the old Bill Jmaes thing about frustrated organizations/fans blaming the best player. And the rest is ARod being ARod, fans being fans, and the media being the media.

i don't think albert pujols will ever be booed in st. louis as long as he wears the birds on the bat. he's in stan musial territory in the minds of the st. louis fans.

coop, i think you misread matt waters. he was disgusted with the fans, not a-rod. and i'm with him. it's really bush to be booing alex. i'd put him on my team any day, but i would take him aside and ask him not to talk so much to the media. he just makes himself look bad with his mea culpas.

as for booing. i live in L.A. now, and so i root for the dodgers when i go to games (except when they play the cards. albert gets booed at the ravine, but it's definitely respect boos; i love it). i have lustily booed andruw jones, along with just about everybody else at the game. he is the only 'home' player i've ever done that with. something about how he has handled himself and been so abysmal for all that money just brings out the low rent joe sixpack fan in me. i was at a game about two months ago when he struck out five times, and i did my best to let him have it. i found out that when i try to 'boo' as loud as i can, it comes out this kind of hoarse sound that scares little kids ...

Kevin Millar.

Wow. I can quite honestly say that I've never booed a player, umpire, manager, etc. at a baseball game, or had any notion of doing so.

like i said, jones has made me irrational. i don't think i've ever booed player or ump or manager with any vitriol. maybe some good-natured light-hearted stuff for the umps or an opposing star at one point or another.

coop, i think you misread matt waters. he was disgusted with the fans, not a-rod. and i'm with him. it's really bush to be booing alex. i'd put him on my team any day, but i would take him aside and ask him not to talk so much to the media. he just makes himself look bad with his mea culpas.


I'm not misreading Matt, I don't think. I hear that his disgust is with the fans reaction. My argument is that the fans might not be acting in quite as "disgusting" a fashion if it were somebody other than A-Rod. The fans didn't boo Mattingly like this when he totally fell off and the Yankees went in the tank in the early '90s. Their reaction to Winfield wasn't, in my recollection, quite this venomous during their mediocre '80s.

They booed the guy during routine groundballs, plays that he actually made. A-Rod just seems to bring a special brand of poison to the player-fan relationship (and, relatedly, the player-media relationship) that I don't recall witnessing in other places. Maybe, as you say, Andruw Jones is close, but again I have to think A-Rod is outperforming every other boo-outlet in the league. He's the best player I don't want on my team, for this reason. Even with all his talent, he's a Fun Vacuum.

well all i'm saying is that your earlier post sounded like you were blaming a-rod for the fact that the yankees fans were acting like d-bags.

but i agree with the idea that his public persona is joyless. that's why i would have a talk with him about his relations with the press. still, that's not enough to keep him off my team, not at the level he performs.

jones is just another matter ... bad player, lousy attitude.