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Sunday, July 06, 2008

Seven first-timers dot All-Star lineups | MLB.com

Kevin Youkilis?

EDIT: Link updated.

Jim Furtado Posted: July 06, 2008 at 02:23 PM | 119 comment(s)
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1. Hey, it's what Johan uses (Matt) Posted: July 06, 2008 at 02:43 PM (#2845567)

Ryan Ludwick?

2. Tom Nawrocki Posted: July 06, 2008 at 02:47 PM (#2845576)

That National League outfield is pretty weak.

Starting:
Ryan Braun, .279/.319/.532, 120 OPS+
Alfonso Soriano, .283/.332/.547, 124 OPS+
Kosuke Fukudome, .285/.391/.420, 112 OPS+

Sitting on the bench:
Matt Holliday, .342/.424/.569, 153 OPS+

3. Max NYC Posted: July 06, 2008 at 02:50 PM (#2845588)

the link's not working for me. can someone post the reserves. thanks!

4. Every Inge Counts Posted: July 06, 2008 at 02:51 PM (#2845591)

Jason Varitek?

5. DKDC Posted: July 06, 2008 at 02:53 PM (#2845592)

The players elected these reserves: catcher Russell Martin of the Dodgers, first baseman Adrian Gonzalez of the Padres, second baseman Dan Uggla of the Marlins, third baseman Aramis Ramirez, shortstop Miguel Tejada of the Astros, and outfielders Holliday, Nate McLouth of the Pirates and Ryan Ludwick of the Cardinals.

Hurdle selected shortstop Cristian Guzman of the Nationals, catcher Brian McCann of the Braves, first baseman Albert Pujols of the Cardinals, plus pitchers Zambrano, Dan Haren of the D-backs and Billy Wagner of the Mets.

The NL pitching staff is as follows: Zambrano and Haren are joined by fellow starters Dempster, Brandon Webb of the D-backs, Edinson Volquez of the Reds, Tim Lincecum of the Giants and Ben Sheets of the Brewers. Wagner is joined by Wood, relievers Brad Lidge of the Phillies and Brian Wilson of the Giants.

The players selected these reserves: Bradley; catcher Varitek and outfielder Drew; first baseman Justin Morneau of the Twins; second baseman Ian Kinsler and shortstop Michael Young of the Rangers; third baseman Joe Crede and outfielder Carlos Quentin of the White Sox and outfielder Grady Sizemore of the Indians.

Francona added infielder Carlos Guillen of the Tigers, catcher Dioner Navarro of the Rays and pitchers George Sherrill of the Orioles, Justin Duchscherer of the A's and Joe Nathan of the Twins.

The AL pitching staff is as follows: Duchscherer is joined by fellow starters Roy Halladay of the Blue Jays, Cliff Lee of the Indians, Scott Kazmir of the Rays, and Joe Saunders and Ervin Santana of the Angels. Sherrill and Nathan are joined by fellow relievers Rivera, Papelbon, Frankie Rodriguez of the Angels and Joakim Soria of the Royals.

6. JJ1986 Posted: July 06, 2008 at 02:53 PM (#2845593)

Rosters

7. Biff. You know, for kids! Posted: July 06, 2008 at 02:53 PM (#2845594)

Jason Varitek? Seriously, Tito? That's a ####### joke and a half. If you wanted to stick another Red Sox onto the roster, why not Jon Lester?

For that matter, why wouldn't he take Lowell over Joe Crede?

Oh, now I see the players selected Varitek. ...Really?

8. Tike Redman's Shattered Dreams (shayborg) Posted: July 06, 2008 at 02:54 PM (#2845598)

Sitting on the bench:
Matt Holliday, .342/.424/.569, 153 OPS+

Also Nate McLouth, .278/.358/.517, 131 OPS+.

</homer>

9. RB in NYC (Now with a Training Schedule!) Posted: July 06, 2008 at 02:55 PM (#2845599)

Wasn't Francona, Biff, was the players. Most of whom, apparently, don't follow the game much.

Think 'Tek (or Mike Williams in '03, or whoever) are kind of embarrassed to be picked to the team when they stats like theirs?

10. Brandon in MO (Fire Trey Hillman) Posted: July 06, 2008 at 02:56 PM (#2845600)

Hurdle would be an idiot to not put Pujols in the starting lineup (yeah, putting him at DH isn't all that horrible, is it?)

Here are the Final Vote candidates for both squads:

In the NL: third baseman David Wright of the Mets and outfielders Pat Burrell of the Phillies, Corey Hart of the Brewers, Carlos Lee of the Astros and Aaron Rowand of the Giants.

In the AL: first baseman Jason Giambi of the Yankees, third baseman Evan Longoria of the Rays, second baseman Brian Roberts of the Orioles and outfielders Jose Guillen of the Royals and Jermaine Dye of the White Sox.

Ok, vote for Wright and Longoria.

11. Biff. You know, for kids! Posted: July 06, 2008 at 02:57 PM (#2845604)

Wasn't Francona, Biff, was the players. Most of whom, apparently, don't follow the game much.

Yeah, most of the bad picks seem to be by the players.

Brian Wilson is pretty bad too. I guess "Count da savezzz" is alive in well. He didn't even need to be there as a Giant because of Lincecum.

12. Better Schafer than Sorry Posted: July 06, 2008 at 02:58 PM (#2845605)

The players voted Martin in over McCann? Really!?

And Cristian Guzman? wow

13. Crispix Attacks Posted: July 06, 2008 at 02:58 PM (#2845606)

Jason Varitek? HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

At least McLouth made it.

I'm surprised Braun and Hamilton won the FAN voting.

Sitting on the bench:
Matt Holliday, .342/.424/.569, 153 OPS+

Nominee for "Final Vote":
Pat Burrell, .278/.411/.585, 155 OPS+

other nominees:
Corey Hart, .294/.333/.509, 119 OPS+
Carlos Lee, .293/.341/.543, 131 OPS+
Aaron Rowand, .303/.367/.467, 120 OPS+
David Wright, .288/.385/.508, 137 OPS+

14. Esteban Rivera Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:02 PM (#2845612)

I'm pretty sure if Giambi doesn't win the 30th man vote, he'll be named as Ortiz's replacement on the roster. Is Soriano still out? If so, one of the four outfielders will go in his place (I'm certain Wright will win the vote).

15. SouthSideRyan Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:04 PM (#2845617)

Whole lotta dreck out there.

16. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:05 PM (#2845619)

I'm surprised anyone noticed Hart's season.

Good for him.....

17. Biff. You know, for kids! Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:06 PM (#2845621)

In case anyone doesn't know just how bad Varitek has been:

.219/.301/.360, 73 OPS+

18. Padraic Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:09 PM (#2845625)

Burrell deserves a spot. Over Tejeda.

19. Darren Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:11 PM (#2845629)

Do you have anything else for AL catcher?

No, just Varitek or crab juice.

Blech. That's awful. How disgusting. I'll take the crab juice.

(Funny to me every time.)

20. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:12 PM (#2845630)

Jason Bay: .285/.388/.518, 140 OPS+. Not on the roster, and not even on the 30th man ballot. Nice to know that the tradition of Pirates getting screwed is alive and well.

21. HGM Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:12 PM (#2845632)

And Cristian Guzman? wow

The Nationals need a representative, like it or not, heh.

22. HOPE: Madison Obamagarner (Flynn) Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:18 PM (#2845646)

Stop ######## and watch the Wimbledon men's finals.

23. Crispix Attacks Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:18 PM (#2845647)

AL catchers with higher OPS than Varitek: (minimum 160 at-bats)

Joe Mauer
Dioner Navarro
Gerald Laird
A.J. Pierzynski
Rod Barajas
Miguel Olivo
Gregg Zaun
Ivan Rodriguez
Kurt Suzuki
Ramon Hernandez
John Buck
Victor Martinez

24. Gold Star for Robot Boy Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:18 PM (#2845648)

The players voted Martin in over McCann? Really!?
Gotta have a Dodger.

25. Danny Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:19 PM (#2845652)

I'd take Harden and Lackey over Saunders and (E.) Santana.

26. CFBF: Now With the Dan Werr Seal of Approval Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:20 PM (#2845655)

Jason Bay: .285/.388/.518, 140 OPS+. Not on the roster, and not even on the 30th man ballot. Nice to know that the tradition of Pirates getting screwed is alive and well.

Hey, a Pirate kept Chipper out of the All Star game in 1999.

27. Vegas Watch Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:21 PM (#2845657)

AL catchers with higher OPS than Varitek:

AL catchers with higher VORP than Varitek (min 150 PAs):

Mauer, Pierzynski, Navarro, Laird, Pudge, Posada, Shoppach, Olivo, Barajas, Napoli, Zaun, Suzuki, R. Hernandez, V. Martinez, Saltalamacchia, Buck.

Yes, there are 16 of them.

28. Crispix Attacks Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:23 PM (#2845660)

No Johan Santana!!

I see there are 6 relievers on the AL roster, and only 4 on the NL roster.

29. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:23 PM (#2845661)

Bay should be present in some fashion. The fans voted for Braun so ditch Ludwick who has only half a season on his resume.

That and I know this will irritate the Cards fans who will again claim that I "hate" the Cards. Or Tony. Or Budweiser beer.

I can't keep track which it is......

30. baseball chick, now with lousy baseball team Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:27 PM (#2845667)

miguel tejada has ZERO business on the all-star roster. i'd rather see jimmy rollins ANY day

but as for varitek - hey, the guy Knows How To Win

31. Hello Rusty Kuntz, Goodbye Rusty Cars Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:28 PM (#2845669)

I was expecting Quentin and Jenks for the White Sox.

32. JGLB has waited with a glacier's patience Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:29 PM (#2845671)

Yes, this is only the second time in franchise history that the Rays have sent two players to the AS game, the last being 1999 (Canseco & Roberto Hernandez). If Longoria wins the final vote, it'll be a new team record.

33. Crispix Attacks Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:30 PM (#2845674)

Yes, there are 16 of them.

But Varitek is still a better pick than Kenji Johjima.

That and I know this will irritate the Cards fans who will again claim that I "hate" the Cards. Or Tony. Or Budweiser beer.

If hating Budweiser beer means I have to hate Tony LaRussa too, then consider me Ron Gant.

34. The Mets make Russlan sad Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:30 PM (#2845676)

miguel tejada has ZERO business on the all-star roster. i'd rather see jimmy rollins ANY day

Or even Jose Reyes. Cole Hamels got screwed as well.

35. Jimmy P Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:36 PM (#2845696)

But Varitek is still a better pick than Kenji Johjima.

Like that's saying a lot.

36. Tom Nawrocki Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:37 PM (#2845698)

The talk here in Colorado was not whether Aaron Cook would make the team but whether he'd start. That was kind of silly, but you'd think they could find a place for a starting pitcher who is leading the league in innings with a 137 ERA+ and 11 wins.

37. vortex of dissipation Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:37 PM (#2845704)

That and I know this will irritate the Cards fans who will again claim that I "hate" the Cards. Or Tony. Or Budweiser beer.

What rationale could any sane human being have for not hating Budweiser beer?

38. Crispix Attacks Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:37 PM (#2845705)

You'd definitely think Clint Hurdle himself could have found a place for Aaron Cook.

[EDIT: Tom Nawrocki led me astray]

39. Padraic Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:40 PM (#2845710)

Cook did make the team.

40. Tom Nawrocki Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:41 PM (#2845713)

Really? Cook's not listed in post 5. Do you mean I can't believe everything I read on the Internet?

41. Padraic Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:42 PM (#2845717)

You can, but only when linked from post 6.

42. vortex of dissipation Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:42 PM (#2845720)

But Varitek is still a better pick than Kenji Johjima.

Jeff Clement has better OPS than Varitek...

43. vortex of dissipation Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:45 PM (#2845725)

40. Tom Nawrocki Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:41 PM (#2845713)

Really? Cook's not listed in post 5. Do you mean I can't believe everything I read on the Internet?
41. Padraic Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:42 PM (#2845717)

You can, but only when linked from post 6.

You can believe that Brian McCann is a first baseman?

44. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:47 PM (#2845734)

Ya'know, after Hanley that Hardy fella looks pretty ok.

2 homers today. OPS over .820 and climbing. Solid defense.

Not saying he HAS to be there. But he merits some consideration.

45. Padraic Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:49 PM (#2845741)

You can believe that Brian McCann is a first baseman?

Oh hell. Post 6 was my last hope.

46. Esoteric can feel Strasburg slowly slipping away Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:51 PM (#2845743)

And Cristian Guzman? wow

The Nationals need a representative, like it or not, heh.

Guzman might not be anyone's idea of a franchise player, but he is leading the NL in hits (on pace for 234 or so) and putting up a .315/.342/.432 line as a SS. Which is better than Ichiro is doing now as a RF, after all.

Not exactly a banner season, but it sure beats Mark Redman as an All-Star, that much is certain. I'm actually kind of surprised that the Dodgers aren't trying to target Guzman, given that they're apparently willing to trade good pieces for Jack Wilson of all people.

47. Eric J Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:52 PM (#2845749)

McCann as a first baseman is nothing - according to the "rosters by team" page, Ryan Dempster is an outfielder.

48. Craig K Posted: July 06, 2008 at 03:58 PM (#2845762)

Someone please explain to me why the first-place team in the AL East has two players, but the second and third combined have ten?

I mean, I understand the Cubs getting seven as they're in first, but the Red Sox are in second place and have as many!

I still say the ASG should have a cap of five guys from one team. Spread the love around a little.

And when did Ryan Ludwick both clone himself and get traded to the Pirates? I hope we got some good prospects for his clone.

49. Miss Remember Posted: July 06, 2008 at 04:00 PM (#2845771)

Bay should be present in some fashion. The fans voted for Braun so ditch Ludwick who has only half a season on his resume.

That and I know this will irritate the Cards fans who will again claim that I "hate" the Cards. Or Tony. Or Budweiser beer.

Him and Fukudome alike. Except Ludwick has been 1.5 wins better.

I'm so looking forward to pitchers realizing Fukudome has a .134 ISO and they don't need to worry as much as they are about walking him. That and his .335 BABIP/19% line drive rate paradox correcting itself. At least he has a cool last name.

50. Crispix Attacks Posted: July 06, 2008 at 04:04 PM (#2845785)

And when did Ryan Ludwick both clone himself and get traded to the Pirates? I hope we got some good prospects for his clone.

I think the deal is going to be for a vial of Xavier Nady's genetic material, and triplets of Adam Boeve.

51. Craig K Posted: July 06, 2008 at 04:05 PM (#2845789)

And who does Yadier Molina have to blow to get an All-Star nod? Best catcher's defense in the league, and, oh yeah, he's not an automatic out at the plate now either; he's got a 101 OPS+.

And how the #### did Kyle Lohse get beat out by Brian Wilson? What the #### is a "Brian Wilson" anyway???

52. Crispix Attacks Posted: July 06, 2008 at 04:05 PM (#2845792)

It's like a Lance Carter, but with more saves.

53. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: July 06, 2008 at 04:11 PM (#2845808)

Hardy is now 3-3 today with a double, a walk, 2 homers, and 4 runs batted in.

He is, shall we say, seeing the ball well.

54. Tom Nawrocki Posted: July 06, 2008 at 04:14 PM (#2845815)

I think Yadier needs to blow McCann or Martin out of the league. "Not an automatic out": Now there's a ringing endorsement for an All-Star.

55. wickedwitch Posted: July 06, 2008 at 04:18 PM (#2845827)

And Cristian Guzman? wow

Have you actually looked at his stats lately? He's hitting very well.

56. baseball chick, now with lousy baseball team Posted: July 06, 2008 at 04:20 PM (#2845828)

JJ hardy is better than tejada. with bat and glove

tejada has played like brad ausmus since may 27

57. Danny Posted: July 06, 2008 at 04:23 PM (#2845832)

And how the #### did Kyle Lohse get beat out by Brian Wilson? What the #### is a "Brian Wilson" anyway???

Lohse getting in based on his W-L record would be just as bad as Wilson getting in for leading the league in saves. How about Santana, Hamels, or Billingsley?

58. Craig K Posted: July 06, 2008 at 04:27 PM (#2845840)

I think Yadier needs to blow McCann or Martin out of the league. "Not an automatic out": Now there's a ringing endorsement for an All-Star.

It is if he's far and away got the best D in the majors.

59. Danny Posted: July 06, 2008 at 04:31 PM (#2845848)

I'm so looking forward to pitchers realizing Fukudome has a .134 ISO and they don't need to worry as much as they are about walking him. That and his .335 BABIP/19% line drive rate paradox correcting itself. At least he has a cool last name.

There's a lot more to walking than pitchers fearing power. Pitchers weren't stupidly walking Rickey and Eddie Yost because they were scared of extra base hits.

Fukudome's ISO is so low and his BABIP is so high because he hits a lot of groundballs. There's no paradox.

60. Boots Day Posted: July 06, 2008 at 04:38 PM (#2845865)

61. Crispix Attacks Posted: July 06, 2008 at 04:39 PM (#2845866)

uon5i3p

62. Shooty Is A One Man Legion Posted: July 06, 2008 at 04:40 PM (#2845868)

So Duke makes it as a reliever and THEN a starter. I know guys have done the reverse, make it as a starter then later as a reliever, but has anyone else ever pulled off the reliever to starter trick?

63. Crispix Attacks Posted: July 06, 2008 at 04:42 PM (#2845874)

My first guess is Derek Lowe. and...yes, Derek Lowe did so.

64. Erik, Pinch-Commenter Posted: July 06, 2008 at 04:43 PM (#2845879)

Someone please explain to me why the first-place team in the AL East has two players, but the second and third combined have ten?

I mean, I understand the Cubs getting seven as they're in first, but the Red Sox are in second place and have as many!

I still say the ASG should have a cap of five guys from one team. Spread the love around a little.

I don't really think there should be a cap on All Star reps, but the Sox and Yankees are always over represented, so perhaps we should just apply this rule to those teams. :-)

65. Craig K Posted: July 06, 2008 at 04:46 PM (#2845884)

If Yadier's D is "far and away" the best in the majors, why doesn't he throw out more runners than Jason Kendall or Brian Schneider or Dioner Navarro or Ivan Rodriguez? I don't think he even has far and away the best D for a Molina.

No one runs on him anymore; if anyone knew where I could find stolen base attempts against by team, it would prove it. Nobody runs against Yadier anymore.

66. JoeHova Posted: July 06, 2008 at 04:46 PM (#2845885)

It is if he's far and away got the best D in the majors.

But you act like he's been doing this for years and can't get any love. This is the first year he's hit even close to this well.

As for JJ Hardy, it never ceases to amaze me that a guy can be absolutely horrible for 2 1/2 months (OPS of .674 on June 19th, which was an OPS+ of about 77), then have 2 good weeks and his numbers will look very good. Jenkins was the master at that, though I'm sure it's pretty widespread.

67. greenback345397SM6 Posted: July 06, 2008 at 04:46 PM (#2845886)

That and I know this will irritate the Cards fans who will again claim that I "hate" the Cards. Or Tony. Or Budweiser beer.

I can't keep track which it is......

You hate La Russa, mainly due to your insane jealousy of the success of the Cardinals.

68. Craig K Posted: July 06, 2008 at 04:52 PM (#2845888)

But you act like he's been doing this for years and can't get any love. This is the first year he's hit even close to this well.

I'm not saying he's deserved an All-Star spot his whole career; he's always been a great defender, but not close to an All-Star (seriously, as a full-timer in '06, he had a 53 OPS+). It's just that he's learned to become an above-average hitter while keeping his "best catcher in the majors" tag. That's an all-star to me.

69. Brandon in MO (Fire Trey Hillman) Posted: July 06, 2008 at 04:58 PM (#2845892)

It's fun and a bit subversive to be a Royals fan voting against a whiny overpaid lazy Royal like Guillen.

C'mon, look at Guillen's stats, he doesn't deserve it. He only had one good month, and the rest of the time he has sucked like a vacuum.

I also switched my NL vote to Burrell.

I hope enough fans choose to give the best team in Baseball more than 2 all-stars. Instead of being sheep and voting for the Mustache or Dye.

70. The Mets make Russlan sad Posted: July 06, 2008 at 05:00 PM (#2845895)

Best catcher's defense in the league, and, oh yeah, he's not an automatic out at the plate now either; he's got a 101 OPS+.

He might have a good arm but his D behind the plate was horrible in the series he played against the Mets and Card fans were complaining about it. And realistically, that's a strong position for the NL. Molina is good but is he better than McCann, Martin, or Soto? No.

Ludwick made it. Card fans can't complain too much.

71. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: July 06, 2008 at 05:02 PM (#2845897)

gb:

If I did "hate" it pre-dated his time in St. Louis. Only a Cards fan would presume it had something to with the Redbirds.

Do recall that until the Brewers switched divisions I followed Tony in the AL.

If only the Internet had been around then so I could have let folks know the dangers of Tony's "new" bullpen approach.

72. Boots Day Posted: July 06, 2008 at 05:03 PM (#2845900)

Yadier has thrown out 12 runners in 35 stolen-base attempts this year. He's played 70 games, so that's 0.5 attempts per game, which is low, but not ridiculously so. Brad Ausmus sees fewer steal attempts per game (and per inning).

Among guys who see slightly more steal attempts, Dioner Navarro has thrown out 16 of 42 in 61 games; Schneider has thrown out 14 of 32 in 55 games; Rodriguez 16 of 43 in 68 games. Jason Kendall has allowed two more stolen bases than Yadier, but thrown out 10 more runners. All those guys have better caught-stealing percentages than Yadier, as does Jose Molina, who has nailed 23 of 48.

You could make the case that Yadier is the best defensive catcher in the majors (or, even better, in the NL). I don't see anything that indicates he's in a class by himself.

73. Craig K Posted: July 06, 2008 at 05:05 PM (#2845902)

He might have a good arm but his D behind the plate was horrible in the series he played against the Mets and Card fans were complaining about it. And realistically, that's a strong position for the NL. Molina is good but is he better than McCann, Martin, or Soto? No.

Yeah; I guess it's just a question of how much offense you're willing to give up for how much defense.

74. Craig K Posted: July 06, 2008 at 05:10 PM (#2845911)

You could make the case that Yadier is the best defensive catcher in the majors (or, even better, in the NL). I don't see anything that indicates he's in a class by himself.

That's the problem; they've all got raw stolen base attempt and pickoff numbers, but how do you adjust for the fact that no one's running on him? I mean, technically, Joe McHowitzerArm could only have thrown out one of two baserunners, but he's not among the league leaders in CS because nobody runs on him; Kendall, I-Rod, and Schneider are all up there in CS because they've all got noodle arms and everyone and their dog runs on them. Don't know about Navarro.

75. Brandon in MO (Fire Trey Hillman) Posted: July 06, 2008 at 05:13 PM (#2845913)

maybe Martin got picked since they couldn't think of another Dodger to put on the team.

76. davoarid in MN Posted: July 06, 2008 at 05:13 PM (#2845914)

The Nationals need a representative, like it or not, heh.

That was Rauch's spot!

Oh, and does this make Cristian Guzman the worst multiple All-Star in MLB history?

77. retro-shiite Posted: July 06, 2008 at 05:13 PM (#2845915)

There's a lot more to walking than pitchers fearing power. Pitchers weren't stupidly walking Rickey and Eddie Yost because they were scared of extra base hits.

Yes. Fukudome draws walks because he has an insanely good eye, not because pitchers are working around him.

Not that I think he's a particularly good ASG selection.

78. vortex of dissipation Posted: July 06, 2008 at 05:15 PM (#2845917)

Oh, and does this make Cristian Guzman the worst multiple All-Star in MLB history?

Ellie Rodriguez? Dave Chalk?

79. Stately, Plump Buck Mulligan Posted: July 06, 2008 at 05:16 PM (#2845919)

Nice to see Quentin make it, although Dye has almost been just as good.

As a White Sox fan, I really don't understand how they could take Crede instead of Danks, who has been awesome. I guess his relatively few wins (6, now that he just beat Harden and the A's) hurt him.

80. retro-shiite Posted: July 06, 2008 at 05:18 PM (#2845920)

Sandy Alomar Jr has to be the worst 6-time all star; hell, he's probably the worst 3-time all star.

81. Pops Freshenmeyer Posted: July 06, 2008 at 05:18 PM (#2845921)

how do you adjust for the fact that no one's running on him?

Yadier is second in the majors in stolen bases allowed per game (behind John Buck)

EDIT: limited to players qualifying for the batting title.

82. Softball-Playing Human Refuses to Be Walked Posted: July 06, 2008 at 05:18 PM (#2845922)

Oh, and does this make Cristian Guzman the worst multiple All-Star in MLB history?

Ellie Rodriguez has to be in the conversation. He made his first AS team in 1969 hitting .252/.339/.344.

83. Craig K Posted: July 06, 2008 at 05:18 PM (#2845923)

Oh, and does this make Cristian Guzman the worst multiple All-Star in MLB history?

Hi.

84. Stately, Plump Buck Mulligan Posted: July 06, 2008 at 05:18 PM (#2845924)

That's the problem; they've all got raw stolen base attempt and pickoff numbers, but how do you adjust for the fact that no one's running on him? I mean, technically, Joe McHowitzerArm could only have thrown out one of two baserunners, but he's not among the league leaders in CS because nobody runs on him; Kendall, I-Rod, and Schneider are all up there in CS because they've all got noodle arms and everyone and their dog runs on them. Don't know about Navarro.

Don't you just compute bases allowed (defined as passed balls + stolen bases against + errors, maybe) per 9 innings?

85. Metman died today. Or yesterday maybe, Posted: July 06, 2008 at 05:21 PM (#2845927)

Pat Burrell should just go ahead and change his name to Tim Salmon. What a screw job.

86. The Mets make Russlan sad Posted: July 06, 2008 at 05:21 PM (#2845928)

Guzman is the worst SS in his division and he's an All-Star. That's a team having a bad year.

87. Boots Day Posted: July 06, 2008 at 05:28 PM (#2845936)

Kendall, I-Rod, and Schneider are all up there in CS because they've all got noodle arms and everyone and their dog runs on them.

Here are some numbers:

Kendall sees one SB attempt every 14.8 innings
I-Rod sees one SB attempt every 13.7 innings
Schneider sees on SB attempt every 14.7 innings
Yadier sees one SB attempt every 16.6 innings
Ausmus sees one SB attempt every 17.7 innings
Kelly Shoppach sees one SB atttempt every 19.5 innings

The catchers who really get stolen on a lot are people like AJ Pierzynski (one attempt every 8.4 innings) and Ramon Hernandez (one attempt every 7.9 innings). The difference between Yadier and someone like Brian Schneider is about one fewer stolen-base attempt every four games.

88. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: July 06, 2008 at 05:35 PM (#2845947)

The guy on the Cards with the arm is that fella Ankiel.

He throws like Cubs fans THINK Fukudome does.

89. Brandon in MO (Fire Trey Hillman) Posted: July 06, 2008 at 05:36 PM (#2845949)

does this make Cristian Guzman the worst multiple All-Star in MLB history?

Where does Tony Batista rank on this?

Granted, he hit .269/.340/.522 with 19 HR before the game in 2002, and .217/.276/.388 with 12 HR after it.

And he hit .289/.328/.571 with 24 HR before the 2000 game, and .234/.284/.460 with 17 HR after it.

So maybe Batista deserves some slack.

90. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: July 06, 2008 at 05:37 PM (#2845950)

"Molina is good but is he better than McCann, Martin, or Soto? No."

The more interesting question is whether his defensive edge puts him ahead of Ryan Doumit, who's absolutely hitting the #### out of the ball this year.

"Pat Burrell should just go ahead and change his name to Tim Salmon. What a screw job."

I think he should've made it, but he'd help his case a lot if he had a defensive setting other than "statue" or "corpse".

91. Boots Day Posted: July 06, 2008 at 05:39 PM (#2845954)

By the way, the NL sure has got some young catchers, doesn't it? Doing that research, I was surprised to see that Yadier is still only 25. McCann is 24, Soto 25, Russell Martin 25.

Chris Iannetta is 25 and is hitting .276/.370/.532, and can't even get in the conversation.

92. Pujols Shot Ya Posted: July 06, 2008 at 05:39 PM (#2845955)

What I don't get is why Player X made it when player Y has been better at a completely different position. If you're best 32 players are first basemen, you select 32 first basemen. Jeez, these coaches, players and fans are stoopid.

93. Brandon in MO (Fire Trey Hillman) Posted: July 06, 2008 at 05:44 PM (#2845961)

so, were the players told that Pujols wasn't picked in the voting? or did they really pick Gonzalez over Pujols?

94. Biff. You know, for kids! Posted: July 06, 2008 at 05:51 PM (#2845971)

He made his first AS team in 1969 hitting .252/.339/.344.

Better than Varitek!

95. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: July 06, 2008 at 05:51 PM (#2845972)

"Hey, a Pirate kept Chipper out of the All Star game in 1999."

No, the manager (Bochy?) kept Chipper out of the All Star game in 1999. Kendall was a lock to be the Pirates' rep until he blew out his ankle the week before the game. Instead of taking one of the other qualified Pirates (like Giles: .313/.403/.577 in the first half, or Young: .312/.407/.511 with a plus glove in the first half, or even Ritchie, who was 9-6 with a 3.92 ERA at the break, and finished at 15-9 and 3.49), they went with Sprague.

Christ, at least Larry made five ASGs (six counting this year's). Giles had six seasons with an OPS over .900 - and only two All Star slots. How fair is that ####?

96. Misirlou hasn't payed the phone bill in 300 years Posted: July 06, 2008 at 06:07 PM (#2845991)

I know guys have done the reverse, make it as a starter then later as a reliever,

Like Kerry Wood.

Sandy Alomar Jr has to be the worst 6-time all star; hell, he's probably the worst 3-time all star.

No kidding. Alomar's games played and OPS+ in his 6 All Star seasons (best to worst):

1997 - 125 G 128 OPS+
1990 - 132 G 108 OPS+
1996 - 127 G 75 OPS+
1992 - 89 G 74 OPS+
1998 - 117 G 59 OPS+
1991 - 51 G 47 OPS+

97. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: July 06, 2008 at 06:19 PM (#2846005)

Just to rant a little more about slights past, since #95 got me going:

In 2002, Brian Giles was hitting .299/.426/.612 at the break. Seven corner outfielders made the All Star team (Bonds, Vlad, and Sosa starting, with Berkman, Dunn, Luis Gonzalez, and Shawn Green as reserves). Giles did not, even though he was outhitting the last three by significant amounts - in Gonzalez's case, by almost 150 points of OPS, before accounting for park factors.

For 2002 as a whole, Giles hit .298/.450/.622. He finished 13th in MVP voting, behind six other corner outfielders, all of whom (apart from Bonds), he outhit - several by significant margins.

As such, IMO, Larry Jones can shut up and get in line.

98. Brandon in MO (Fire Trey Hillman) Posted: July 06, 2008 at 06:23 PM (#2846015)

For reference

Jose Guillen: .274/.300/.469, 101 OPS+ (3rd best OPS+ of a non-AS Royal)
Evan Longoria: .281/.351/.529, 136 OPS+ (best OPS+ of a non-AS Ray)
Jason Giambi: .259/.395/.543, 150 OPS+ (best OPS+ of a non-AS Yankee)
Brian Roberts: .293/.371/.485, 128 OPS+ (second best OPS+ of a non-AS Oriole)
Jermaine Dye: .308/.362/.558, 140 OPS+ (best OPS+ of a non-AS White Sox)

One of these players is not like the others.. one of these players does not belong

99. retro-shiite Posted: July 06, 2008 at 06:28 PM (#2846020)

He throws like Cubs fans THINK Fukudome does.

Which Cub fans are these? Fukudome throws well. Ankiel throws really, really well.

100. SouthSideRyan Posted: July 06, 2008 at 06:46 PM (#2846041)

Yeah, I'm with #90, Yadier is the 5th best catcher in the NL.

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