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Tuesday, August 18, 2009

Tim Marchman: Brian Bannister should be your favorite player

Even if he has Pugh!.....................................................................(on his similarity list)

Yesterday I suggested that there are actually some people in uniform who find defensive statistics credible. Today I talked to Brian Bannister, who’s famously passionate about sabermetrics, about them. He really does have an excellent grasp of statistics in general, much more so than your average writer (actual quote: “Baseball is a game of regression to the mean") and I thought this bit of our conversation might be relevant.

..."I think it’s important to look at all three of the metrics—plus/minus, John Dewan’s plus/minus, UZR and there’s another one. There are three that are the main ones and I think whether you buy into it or not that what they’re doing with Sportvision—what’s the one going in San Francisco?—they just installed it, they have Pitch/FX, it works, its a great system. They’ve been messing with Hit/FX, that’s going to come out soon and I believe Sportvision is what it’s called, but they installed it in San Francisco, so pretty much from now on as soon as they get that established, whether you buy into the stats or not, now it’s going to actually be measured. I mean they’ll measure it from the moment the ball is hit, how much ground you cover and be able to compare you to everyone in the league, so I think that’ll end all debate as to how you are as a fielder. I think for now the lines are still a little blurry. I think they do a good job of going through and analyzing every play, but I think the machine will be able to break it down better once that’s established.”

Repoz Posted: August 18, 2009 at 06:49 PM | 30 comment(s)
  Related News: GeneralSabermetricsProjectionsKansas City

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   1. Hugh Jorgan  Posted: August 18, 2009 at 07:24 PM (#3297328)
I think it’s important to look at all three of the metrics—plus/minus, John Dewan’s plus/minus, UZR and there’s another one.

Uh, that makes four if you add "another one?" Isn't one basis of sabermetrics the ability to add? Also, was it me and my Aussie english or was that quote hard to read/understand overall?
   2. Dedicated to Esoteric but he wasn't listening  Posted: August 18, 2009 at 07:27 PM (#3297343)
Jesus Hugh, you really have to work hard to be that much of an ass. For the record, "John Dewan's plus/minus" was Bannister's clarification of "plus/minus" that he first mentioned (ascribing it to its proper author), leaving three metrics: plus/minus, UZR, and "another one."

And the quote wasn't hard to read.
   3. AROM  Posted: August 18, 2009 at 07:32 PM (#3297351)
I'd guess he's talking about Pinto's PMR.
   4. Steve Treder  Posted: August 18, 2009 at 07:37 PM (#3297369)
Jesus Hugh, you really have to work hard to be that much of an ass.

Seconded.
   5. SoSHially Unacceptable  Posted: August 18, 2009 at 07:40 PM (#3297379)
You guys are both wrong. Hugh doesn't have to work at it at all. He's a born ass. :-)
   6. Hugh Jorgan  Posted: August 18, 2009 at 07:51 PM (#3297397)
2, 4, and 5...geez that's a bit harsh. I just read it wrong, you blokes need to lighten up.
   7. Baseball Analyst  Posted: August 18, 2009 at 08:16 PM (#3297440)
Today I talked to Brian Bannister, who’s famously passionate about sabermetrics, about them.


Nice sentence, Professional Writer Marchman.
   8. Pasta-diving Jeter (jmac66)  Posted: August 18, 2009 at 08:32 PM (#3297466)
Hey Bannister--get your slide rule out of your spreadsheet and pitch a game sometime

(oh..wait a minute)
   9. Steve Balboni's Personal Trainer  Posted: August 18, 2009 at 09:10 PM (#3297556)
What a great start to this thread - those first eight comments are pretty much about grammar...not the fact that there is a big-league pitcher who is more fluent in sabermetrics than most of the posters on this website.

My two cents - I'd love to have him on my team (Red Sox), partly because he's a useful pitcher, and partly because he would give the most meaningful sounds bites in MLB history.
   10. JJ1986  Posted: August 18, 2009 at 09:36 PM (#3297604)
I'd rather have Ambiorix Burgos.
   11. ekogan  Posted: August 18, 2009 at 09:45 PM (#3297616)
I'd love to have him on my team (Red Sox)

I've heard that the Royals were shopping him before the trade deadline.
I guess they don't believe that his success is sustainable.
   12. Russlan wants Pedro to be a Met again  Posted: August 18, 2009 at 09:51 PM (#3297623)
I'd rather have Ambiorix Burgos.

Ugh. I loved that trade at the time and think Burgos would have been a good pitcher if he weren't psycho. I still don't know how Bannister has been decent in the AL. He had less-than mediocre stuff and horrible command as a Met.
   13. Crispix Attacks is in the best shape of his life.  Posted: August 18, 2009 at 09:52 PM (#3297624)
They’ve been messing with Hit/FX, that’s going to come out soon and I believe Sportvision is what it’s called, but they installed it in San Francisco, so pretty much from now on as soon as they get that established, whether you buy into the stats or not, now it’s going to actually be measured.


What the hell kind of run-on sentence is this, Brian? What exactly does "it" refer to in the last clause? Which "stats" are you referring to people "buying into"? Geez, didn't you even have prepared remarks?
   14. Hugh Jorgan  Posted: August 18, 2009 at 10:31 PM (#3297647)
those first eight comments are pretty much about grammar

Well in my very weak defense I read this

Today I talked to Brian Bannister, who’s famously passionate about sabermetrics, about them.

then the odd bit about plus/minus, Dewans plus/minus and decided to take the piss out of it.
Unfortunately esoteric, treder and soshially got all high flaluten agro about it all and the humour was definitely lost in translation.

Your point about Bannister though is seconded, I reckon he'd be a great asset and it's nice to see a player who's interested in the more detailed stats than the standard stuff.
   15. Obama Bomaye  Posted: August 18, 2009 at 10:36 PM (#3297651)
Jeez Hugh, you're the worst kind of stereotype.
   16. Phil Coorey Needs To Know How To Kill A Cat  Posted: August 18, 2009 at 10:39 PM (#3297654)
Go easy on Hugh - it is a big week this week in Australia for the cricket - we are ####### on edge.
   17. Kyle C welcomes back our OBP Savior  Posted: August 18, 2009 at 10:40 PM (#3297656)
What the hell kind of run-on sentence is this, Brian? What exactly does "it" refer to in the last clause? Which "stats" are you referring to people "buying into"? Geez, didn't you even have prepared remarks?


Good thing Brian is a stathead and thus a virgin, otherwise we'd have to take away his children.
   18. SoSHially Unacceptable  Posted: August 18, 2009 at 10:40 PM (#3297657)
Unfortunately esoteric, treder and soshially got all high flaluten agro about it all and the humour was definitely lost in translation.


Likewise, the little sideways smiley face I used must have gotten lost in the English to Aussie translation.
   19. Crispix Attacks is in the best shape of his life.  Posted: August 18, 2009 at 10:46 PM (#3297663)
UP THE POMS
   20. Phil Coorey Needs To Know How To Kill A Cat  Posted: August 18, 2009 at 11:01 PM (#3297671)
UP THE POMS


If Australia don't pick Stu Clark I will be screaming UP THE POMS as well...
   21. Hugh Jorgan  Posted: August 18, 2009 at 11:12 PM (#3297674)
Likewise, the little sideways smiley face I used must have gotten lost in the English to Aussie translation

Sorry mate, I buggered it up all 'round, its been a long morning at work.

If Australia don't pick Stu Clark I will be screaming UP THE POMS as well...

Now Phil if they don't pick Clark every one of those selectors should be axed immediately. Also,Phil you should be a little more relaxed these days as you don't have to watch Wakefield down the stretch...
   22. Tim Marchman  Posted: August 18, 2009 at 11:19 PM (#3297680)
Man, 'Baseball Analyst' is right, that certainly was one hideous sentence I wrote. I'll fire my copyeditor.

More generally, in re: grammar, Bannister is more than fine. You really wouldn't believe what you get when you transcribe interviews if you haven't done it a lot. If it looks bad that's 100% my fault, as I just posted some working notes rather than cleaning it up.

On a side note, though, this raises an interesting point. Fear of coming off as flummoxed, something people are especially prone to when they're actually thinking out loud about what they're talking about rather than just giving rehearsed answers, is a LOT of why so many guys talk like Nuke LaLoosh. Carlos Quentin is kind of the opposite of Bannister in this—he's also not big on the LaLoosh stuff, but his solution is just to avoid talking as much as possible.
   23. STEROIDS!!!!!  Posted: August 18, 2009 at 11:44 PM (#3297691)
How does Kansas City manage Greinke, Bannister, James, Poz, Neyer and Rany, etc. ... and yet a GM that seems infatuated with <300 OBP hitters?
   24. Ron Johnson  Posted: August 19, 2009 at 12:05 AM (#3297705)
#22, I mean this seriously. The world would be a better place if more people took your attitude. Thanks for the clarification.

And I know what you mean by the copy editor. Sometimes I not english so good myself.
   25. North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan  Posted: August 19, 2009 at 01:23 AM (#3297731)
Bannister really has to become a GM when he's done with his playing career.
   26. Steve Parris, Je t'aime (M. Valentin)  Posted: August 19, 2009 at 08:41 AM (#3297886)
Bannister really has to become a GM when he's done with his playing career.

Just about to say this. In fact, I'd sign him to his next contract, hoping he retires with my team and then get him primed for management.
   27. The Buddy Biancalana Hit Counter  Posted: August 19, 2009 at 09:43 AM (#3297951)
I've heard that the Royals were shopping him before the trade deadline.
I guess they don't believe that his success is sustainable.


It's probably not sustainable with that defense behind him.
   28. Superunknown Gary Geiger Counter  Posted: August 19, 2009 at 10:03 AM (#3297971)
Go easy on Hugh - it is a big week this week in Australia for the cricket - we are ####### on edge.

Are the Ashes still going on?
   29. tjm1  Posted: August 19, 2009 at 10:11 AM (#3297992)
Bannister graduated cum laude from USC in fine arts. I wasn't surprised when I looked him up to see that he earned his degree from a well-regarded university, or that he was a walk-on, which means he was probably admitted primarily on the basis of his academic ability, but I was really surprised that he was an art major.

Funny thing is, Joe Girardi, who has an engineering degree from Northwestern, would never give this much credence to something like defensive stats in an interview.
   30. Phil Coorey Needs To Know How To Kill A Cat  Posted: August 20, 2009 at 03:30 AM (#3299116)
Are the Ashes still going on?


Last test starts tonight - should be a cracker jack game as England need a result to get back the Ashes - attacking cricket all the way.
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