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Thursday, July 17, 2008

Walkoff Walk: Willie Mays Is Everybody’s Awesome Grandpa

Sorry I missed this session of the Costas Now show...but once The Hirdt Sports Bureau got up and started doing his act, it was off to quirky MP3’sville.

Mays and Aaron were both asked (by audience member and actor Robert Wuhl) if they had ever taken any performance-enhancing drugs in their careers, specifically about something called “red juice” (allegedly amphetamines). Aaron pointedly answered no and denied ever seeing anyone take anything; he joked that they weren’t getting paid enough to afford anything like that. He then went off on a tangent about players drinking too much back in his day, but that was off point. Mays had a far more interesting answer. No, he said, he never needed to take anything, referring to his “32 inch waist and 189 pound body” that he kept for 20 years. He did admit to seeing a doctor and asking for vitamins, stating a need to “keep going”, and when the doctor produced something for him to drink, he didn’t ask what was in there. Was Willie Mays juicing? Probably not. Does it matter? Definitely not. Willie and the audience laughed the matter off.

Repoz Posted: July 17, 2008 at 09:51 AM | 24 comment(s)
Related News: General, History, Hall of Fame, Television, Steroids

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1. Zuvella! Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:10 AM (#2862098)

Then Josh Hamilton, who was in the audience, proceeded to ask Willie Mays a question ("Who was the hardest thrower you ever faced?"). Mays turned his back to the young slugger in response. Hamilton awkwardly sat down. And another person asked Hank Aaron a question.

2. NJ in DC (Now with Law School!!!) Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:21 AM (#2862108)

Re: 1

Does anyone know what that was about yet?

3. Dan Szymborski Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:22 AM (#2862109)

Aaron pointedly answered no and denied ever seeing anyone take anything; he joked that they weren’t getting paid enough to afford anything like that.

So, I guess he lied in his autobiography when he said he tried amphetamines in 1968. Frankly, that's an evasive answer and coupled with claiming he never saw anyone take amps, a downright lie.

Was Willie Mays juicing? Probably not. Does it matter? Definitely not.

As I said, there's a section of the public that cares about steroids only so that their childhood favorites aren't ever eclipsed by those mean ol' selfish players of today. If it simply doesn't matter if a guy that hit 660 home runs took steroids, how the hell can it matter if a player that hit 583 home runs did?

4. Van Lingle Mungo Jerry Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:25 AM (#2862110)

Perhaps, like Charles Barkley, he was misquoted.

5. Templeusox has Red-State Street Cred Posted: July 17, 2008 at 10:56 AM (#2862133)

Mays had a far more interesting answer. No, he said, he never needed to take anything, referring to his “32 inch waist and 189 pound body” that he kept for 20 years.

The line break in the quoted text after the words "32 inch" makes for some good suspense.

6. Cooperstown Schtick Posted: July 17, 2008 at 11:06 AM (#2862146)

The line break in the quoted text after the words "32 inch" makes for some good suspense.

Makes me wish I was reading it on your monitor.

7. McCoy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 11:11 AM (#2862150)

Apparently Aaron has a short memory since he admitted to taking greenies in his own autobiography.

Mays answer is by now a classic Bondsian excuse, yet the writer and probably most bonds-haters are going to shrug it off and not change their view of Mays. It is amazing what partial admittance 30 years laters will not do to your legacy.

8. Zuvella! Posted: July 17, 2008 at 11:16 AM (#2862157)

It is amazing what partial admittance 30 years laters will not do to your legacy.

but also, nobody cares about greenies, nobody cares about speed. Not saying it's right, but even if it came out that Mays was a speed freak, do you think anyone would care?

9. McCoy Posted: July 17, 2008 at 11:55 AM (#2862193)

25 to 30 years they sure did care about that stuff, nowadays no.

As for Willie Mays and being a speed freak, if it was true I think it would be a pretty big deal in the online community, everywhere else no.

10. Elvis Posted: July 17, 2008 at 12:19 PM (#2862214)

In the early 80s cocaine trials, John Milner testified that he got the Red Juice from Willie Mays. The two were teammates in '72 and '73 when Mays was at the end of his career and Milner was just starting.

11. Wally Moses, Isolated Power Broker (GGC) Posted: July 17, 2008 at 12:29 PM (#2862221)

According to Jim Willoughby, the red juice was around in '71.

12. Red Juice Posted: July 17, 2008 at 12:48 PM (#2862243)

According to Jim Willoughby, the red juice was around in '71.

great link

It's a treat for any player when he first makes the majors. In Doug Hornig's The Boys of October, Willoughby recalled arriving in the dugout for his first major league game. There were two coolers. One had water, but the other one had "red juice," a liquid amphetamine concoction. Willow tried to take a drink from the wrong cooler and was quickly chastised. "Red juice" was for veterans; not rookies. He appeared in two September games for San Francisco; the first was a three-inning start against Houston, which he lost.

13. DCA Posted: July 17, 2008 at 12:52 PM (#2862249)

The Onion actually has a good baseball article today.

14. Fred C. Dobbs Posted: July 17, 2008 at 12:53 PM (#2862251)

Serious question- haven't there long been rumors of Aaron's reliance on some form of speed over the years? Any actual evidence?

15. Moscow In The Bleachers Posted: July 17, 2008 at 12:54 PM (#2862253)

As for Willie Mays and being a speed freak, if it was true I think it would be a pretty big deal in the online community...

Which of course means absolutely nothing. If it were up to the "online community" here, we'd likely be looking forward to President Ron Paul in 2009.

everywhere else no.

As Sonny said in A Bronx Tale: Nobody cares.

16. kevin Posted: July 17, 2008 at 12:56 PM (#2862254)

Mays = Not Aging Gracefully

17. Red Juice Posted: July 17, 2008 at 01:11 PM (#2862269)

so who do you think made the red juice? was it an employ of the team, like say a trainer, or just one of the players who mixed the concoction? Before you answer, probably one of the players, remember The Carolina Panthers team trainer. Radomisky was an employ of the Mets. McNamee worked for two clubs. We heard stories of that Marlins or Reds trainer, i forget which team, that Senator Mitchell interviewed a couple of times, then ignored ...

It amazes me how MLB teams have been given a virtual "mulligan" in this whole epidemic. Wasn't it their scouts, routinely telling kids, you need to bulk up? No MLB team exec ever looked into those coolers. No media member either?

the hypocrisy.

any clues from some of you old timers here .. who made the juice?

18. Chuck Van Den Corput Posted: July 17, 2008 at 02:56 PM (#2862407)

who made the juice?

Abraham

19. B. Selig Posted: July 17, 2008 at 03:44 PM (#2862484)

Does anyone know what that was about yet?

Posnanski doesn't know if it was a snub, but he wrote about it.

20. Alan S Posted: July 17, 2008 at 04:20 PM (#2862536)

It gets said every time Posnanski is mentioned in a thread here, but he is awesome. Out of the dozens and dozens of sports writers working for NY papers, none compare to him at all.

21. ellsbury my heart at wounded knee Posted: July 17, 2008 at 04:42 PM (#2862574)

It gets said every time Posnanski is mentioned in a thread here, but he is awesome. Out of the dozens and dozens of sports writers working for NY papers, none compare to him at all.

To further the Posnanski-jack, I'd say that the Poz is likely the best baseball writer (maybe best sports writer, period) working today. I've never read anything of his, be it a blog entry or newspaper article, that wasn't exceptional.

22. Walt Davis Posted: July 17, 2008 at 06:42 PM (#2862685)

who made the juice?

Abraham

Onan?

23. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: July 17, 2008 at 07:28 PM (#2862755)

so who do you think made the red juice? was it an employ of the team, like say a trainer, or just one of the players who mixed the concoction? Before you answer, probably one of the players, remember The Carolina Panthers team trainer. Radomisky was an employ of the Mets. McNamee worked for two clubs. We heard stories of that Marlins or Reds trainer, i forget which team, that Senator Mitchell interviewed a couple of times, then ignored ...

That was Reds trainer Larry Starr. They asked Starr if Bonds or Sheffield or Pete Rose (!) had used steroids. But he didn't/wouldn't name names, and so there was no room in the Mitchell Report's 361 pages to squeeze in Starr's information about baseball's prior awareness of the problem.

Starr was openly complaining about steroids in 1988. Including at a meeting between the owners group and the players' association, both of whom did the "if only we had known" bit. Starr and other trainers directly asked the Commissioner's office to test for steroids.

As for Willie Mays, it's just too bad he couldn't be 40 years younger but otherwise doing the exact same things today (using, sharing, lying). It'd be a treat to see our favorite posters wishing for Prisoner Mays' punitive ass-raping.

24. Dan Szymborski Posted: July 17, 2008 at 07:59 PM (#2862814)

They asked Starr if Bonds or Sheffield or Pete Rose (!) had used steroids. But he didn't/wouldn't name names, and so there was no room in the Mitchell Report's 361 pages to squeeze in Starr's information about baseball's prior awareness of the problem.

There's actually more circumstantial evidence that Pete Rose through steroids than Sammy Sosa did - if Sammy Sosa had admitted he used amphetamines and then let a steroid dealer live in his house for free for years, the outrage against Sosa would've been 20 times what it is now.

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Walkoff Walk: Willie Mays Is Everybody’s Awesome Grandpa

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