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Perhaps not, but I'm not going to be proclaiming their awesomeness when they can't even reach their rather modest standard.
wow.
This is also one of those things where you'd need to see the interaction, in terms of how Duncan treated this kid and other kids when they were face-to-face. I am sre there will be follow-ups; we will see what Duncan says.
Really? Name two.
I had no idea this happened, but I would not be up in arms.
I have to go back to through the archives from last year, I remember there were at least a couple of Pinstripe Partisans who were in the "If this is true, Wright's a jerk" camp.
I wonder how they felt about FOX replaying Youkilis' "AHHHHHHHHHH!!!! ####!!!" a couple times without toning down the audio.
EDIT: What's the purpose of hiding kids from swear words and the like? Is it simply societal convention or has anyone done anywork that shows if your kid says #### at age 5, he's going to become a delinquent. I think it kind of creates an unneccessarily awkward transition...thing...in our society where when I'm on a job interview I'm expected to act incredibly "proper", but once I'm on the job I'm expected to jump in on the conversation about wanting to #### the secretary with the nice (insert your favorite body part here).
Actually, the latter can and will get you fired close to instantly in many jobs. I know two people who lost their jobs over something far less than that, because of zero-tolerance policies they were aware of but didn't take seriously.
And nobody is going to tell me where I can insert my favorite body part, thank you very much. ;-)
Of course it can get you fired but the problem is that 9 times out of 10 it doesn't. Even in zero tolerance places. For the two people that got fired was that the very first inappropriate conversation they had at the workplace? Probably not which is why they probably thought they were safe to say what they said.
And my question is why. What is the benefit of not simply saying, "It's a play on words. They misspelled it so that people know that they think the Red Sox aren't very good." Or something along those lines.
It would also be in bad taste for him to write "what's up sexy, you are very cut it is bad that you are 15 the law is very strick about that kind of stuff but I may have to do an execption this time".
"Suck" has become a simple synonym for "stink." I'm sure that many younger folks don't even realize that it refers to fellatio. My kids were probably saying it by the time they were five, and I know that they have heard a lot worse from both of their parents. But I have to admit that I still cringe just a little when I hear a young kid casually say "you suck" to one of his/her peers. Not because it wasn't said just as often when I was their age, but because when we said it, we meant it.
Well, I cringe or object anytime my children insult one of their peers (whether it's "you suck" or "you're stupid", or "I got a better grade than you." It's not the language, but the message that bothers me, and it's contextual. At a baseball game, where people are saying this stuff, and where - I think - kids understand the playful nature of competitive rivalry, I have no problem with Duncan's message, and would have explained it to my kids as such.
I wasn't suggesting that my cringing was rational. In fact, just the opposite. I agree that it's the message and the context rather than the language that matter.
Well, 40 years ago we often meant "you're a f***ing f****t." We'd almost never say it to girls, because that would have been a good thing.
What? How can anyone survive in the kitchen culture long enough to become a chef if they gasp at the word "suck?"
Still, a MLBer has no business signing an autograph that way for a kid. If Shelley wants to playfully interact with 10 year olds he should either be a Mets (edit: read Yankee fan, for JC) fan or join the priesthood.
Uh, I disagree on the former and am offended by the latter.
You did?
When someone says "that blows", do they mean sexually or vomitorily?
Also, what does "bite me" mean?
I'm a bit surprised how "screw you" or "he's screwed" has casually entered our common lexicon. As well as anything about bending over and taking it or "getting bent".
Because when you get to the top you get to rule like a dictator and dictator tend to have idiosyncracies. I had a chef chew me out because I said "Yeah I got it" instead of "Yes chef I have it" He hated the word "Yeah" and would lecture anyone who said it. Of course I am not immune to this effect. Since getting to the top I lecture anyway who says carmel or "au jus". I'm guessing what causes this is the fact that nobody can say no to you and after ten, fifteen, twenty years of hearing something that grates on you, you finally can't take it anymore and say enough.
Re: origins of "suck" as a term for things that suck: there is the fellatio connection, but there's also a term from years back, "sucking wind": often in the phrase "your ### is sucking wind," the idea that something had a big hole in it or had been punctured and was gasping for breath in a futile manner. I think both meanings converged in the notion that something simply sucks. It doesn't necessarily suck any specific item or substance, anymore, it just sucks, like Buffalo winter weather, Jerry Hairston Jr., re-runs of the Drew Carey Show, that sort of thing.
What's the benefit of my telling him? He's got most of his life to be a cynical bastard, and years of childhood ahead of him doing the "this sucks; that sucks; everything sucks" routine. I don't see any need to rush the process.
Really, it's more the concept than the language. He roots for the Yankees, and knows the Red Sox are their rivals, but I'm more interested in him enjoying baseball and rooting for his team for now, and not worrying about whether the other team sucks.
In one case he used language that wasn't intended to have sexual overtones, but could have been (and was) interpreted as such. He thought he was safe to say what he said because he was thinking in terms of single-entendres. (The sexual meaning was a bit of a reach, IMO; but someone reached, and that's all that mattered.)
In the other case the offense was the use of the word "suck" (specifically a slight misspelling of "succotash"). I can't say there was any thought behind it at the time, though since then he's thought about learning how to spell better.
So, yeah, your entire premise that the workplace enabled their comfort with such conversation is a bit off. I wish you luck in future employment.
I love this dictionary. The earliest citation for the word suck to mean fellatio is 1928, quoted from A.W. Read's Lexical Evidence from Folk Epigraphy Western N. Amer. The first citation for "suck" in the way we are discussing it is from 1971.
Are you honestly telling me you have never heard blue language in your workplace and not had the person immediately fired?
This is the point that I was trying to make. People of Duncan's generation don't really think anything of the phrase, but a lot of sportswriters are older, and they might not understand the linguistic shift that's happened.
The greatest autograph of all time: "Avoid the clap. Jimmy Dugan."
"Your majesty is like a dose of Clap"
"I gotta go, my damn wiener kids are listening."
A few weeks ago, my 3rd child, 6 years old, is brushing her hair in front of the mirror in my bedroom as I'm reading on the bed to our 4 year old daughter. I hear her say, "Argh [Yeargh?], I can't get this ####### hair right!" I said, "What? Your what hair?" "My ####### hair," she replied. It's not staying straight." I start laughing and call out to my wife, to come down and ask her daughter about her hair. When pressed, my daughter revealed that she "heard mom say that a lot." It was very funny.
I have no idea. We never said "that blows" in my youth. We did use "blow me" however, and that was obviously not meant in the vomitorial sense.
Also, what does "bite me" mean?
That you're a Letterman fan?
Getting a sort of personalized message is better than just scribbling a name.
Yeah, that's true. If there was banter beforehand, no problem. It's hard to know. Of course, if there was, is it likely that the kid will tell his mom? No way.
Not to say anything, but parents overreact on a lot of things, especially if it means getting on the news. And of course, the media typically likes to add fuel to any fire.
And oh yeah, as a parent I would probably point out the cool aspect of the autograph. Though, 10 year olds may still tend to be rather emotional about all sorts of things. So yeah, again, Shelley should have been more careful. But if he keeps it, the kid will likely treasure the ball in future years.
Yeah, considering that the autograph is on a piece of notebook paper. Maybe Duncan should have signed it, "Hey Mom, next time spring for a baseball."
i think the biggest irony/hippocracy/stupidity is who did this: this was shelley duncan. this wasn't some kid who just made it and is adjusting to life to the big leagues. he was literally born in the stadium, grew up there, and probably got his first wood there too (read that how you want =).
if there's anyone who knows what it's like to be a ballplayer, to be around ballplayers, and to be around fans (let alone kids)...it's him.
make no mistake: he knew exactly what he was doing: making an @$$ of himself.
Right. Because people go around intentionaly making asses of themselves all the time.
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