BBTF's Game Chatter Discussion :: Indians (54-54) @ RedSox (68-41), Thursday, August 4, 2011, 7:10pm

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Thursday, August 04, 2011

Indians (54-54) @ RedSox (68-41), Thursday, August 4, 2011, 7:10pm

CLE: Justin Masterson (26, RHP, 8-7, 2.56)
BOS: Erik Bedard (32, LHP, 4-7, 3.45)

The Primer Chimp Posted: August 04, 2011 at 01:00 PM | 444 comment(s)
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1. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: August 04, 2011 at 11:07 PM (#3893016)

Erik Bedard is hilariously awkward in press conferencing.

"I just wanna do what I can and help this ball... team win."

You forgot the word ballclub?

2. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: August 04, 2011 at 11:15 PM (#3893021)

I can see why people have made claims about Bedard being soft or unclutch or whatever. He has a very open, expressive face - it just looks like you can see every feeling that's coursing through him, one after another.

"I'm happy that I struck him out." "Oh man that curve didn't go where it wanted." "Glad I touched the base just in time." "I'm worried about the next pitch."

He kind of looks like he's feeling everything the fans are feeling. I have no idea if this is the case or not - that is, if these are actual feelings or if it's just easy to misread his emotions because his face is so expressive, but he's really fascinating to watch, and I'm in the initial stages of big-fan-of-Bedardism. I hope he's, you know, good.

3. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: August 04, 2011 at 11:16 PM (#3893022)

(Or if most players are really feeling all those feelings, but Bedard is the odd one because you can see it on the tv cameras.)

4. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: August 04, 2011 at 11:20 PM (#3893023)

I was interested in whether Masterson's been able to solve his platoon split issues, and it looks like he has, but in a strange way. Masterson's still got a humongous split (40% worse OPS against vs LHP), but he's just become better overall, so that he's just astoundingly dominant against RHB (500 OPS against).

5. Phil Coorey. Posted: August 04, 2011 at 11:24 PM (#3893024)

That is just a fantastic swing from AG.

How was Bedard in the first?

6. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: August 04, 2011 at 11:25 PM (#3893025)

Masterson went back to the same high fastball against Gonzalez that got the swing and miss earlier. Gonzalez adjusted, went inside-out instead of using his full power stroke, and hit it off the wall. He's just such an intelligent hitter.

(I do realize I'm alone, here. But I have thoughts! Thoughts about baseball! This is why I have a blog, I guess.)

7. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: August 04, 2011 at 11:26 PM (#3893027)

Bedard looked good. Mostly fastballs 91-92, a couple very impressive big-breaking curveballs.

Mostly, though, it's crazy what an open book he appears to be emotionally.

8. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: August 04, 2011 at 11:28 PM (#3893029)

Did Gonzalez anticipate the no-throw, see it and then go, or just get lucky?

9. Phil Coorey. Posted: August 04, 2011 at 11:28 PM (#3893030)

That would have been a shocking hold at third - good stuff Gonzo

10. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: August 04, 2011 at 11:29 PM (#3893031)

Crawford's oppo stroke is starting to click, I think.

11. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: August 04, 2011 at 11:36 PM (#3893036)

What the #### happened there?

That's Bedard's fault first, I think. Blechh.

12. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: August 04, 2011 at 11:38 PM (#3893038)

Three medium hit grounders, one soft grounder, and two runs.

13. Repoz

Posted: August 04, 2011 at 11:38 PM (#3893039)

Well...at least Bedard passed Gene Conley in career strikeouts tonight.

There's always that.

14. FancyPantsHandle glistening with foreign substance Posted: August 04, 2011 at 11:39 PM (#3893040)

(I do realize I'm alone, here. But I have thoughts! Thoughts about baseball! This is why I have a blog, I guess.)

You are not alone
For I am here with you
Though you're far away
I am here to stay
For you are not alone
For I am here with you
Though we're far apart
You're always in my heart
For you are not alone

15. Phil Coorey. Posted: August 04, 2011 at 11:39 PM (#3893041)

Indians are belting the crap out of the ball - if bedard covers this inning is over

16. Phil Coorey. Posted: August 04, 2011 at 11:40 PM (#3893042)

as in inning would have been over at maybe just 2-1

17. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: August 04, 2011 at 11:43 PM (#3893045)

And it all started with a couple of routine bouncers that happened to find holes.

18. Benji Gil Gamesh Rises Posted: August 04, 2011 at 11:44 PM (#3893046)

Question: did Masterson throw this hard for us?

19. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: August 04, 2011 at 11:44 PM (#3893047)

In the pen, yes. From the rotation, no.

20. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: August 04, 2011 at 11:46 PM (#3893050)

The Fangraphs velocity charts show how Masterson's velocity jumped while in the pen, and have come up gradually from 2010 to 2011 in the rotation.

21. Phil Coorey. Posted: August 04, 2011 at 11:49 PM (#3893051)

I was wondering the same thing re Masterson - so thanks MCoA

22. Dan Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:02 AM (#3893054)

I realize this contradicts what you guys were saying above, but it's not Bedard's fault on that grounder in the 2nd. Gonzalez ranged WAY too far off of the bag. That was a Kevin Millar move, taking away a grounder that's right in the 2B's zone and leaving the bag. Bedard probably should have covered, but I'd assign blame around 60/40 to Gonzalez/Bedard.

23. Dan Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:03 AM (#3893056)

Maybe even 70/30

24. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:04 AM (#3893057)

Bedard's getting blipped and blooped to death. He's pitching well.

25. Dan Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:05 AM (#3893058)

I'm surprised that Bedard's getting the calls on some of these curves. They're strikes, but I'm not used to seeing pitchers get that call much.

####, another ######## soft hit.

26. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:06 AM (#3893059)

To me, it's a judgment call whether the first baseman should head for the bag, it's not a judgment call whether the pitcher should. The pitcher has to has to has to cover first when no one else is doing it.

27. Dan Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:08 AM (#3893061)

It was a routine grounder to 2nd. He ought to have headed toward first but you see pitchers stay on the mound on that play all day every day.

28. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:08 AM (#3893062)

Gotta just challenge Fukudome with a fastball. He can't hit it.

29. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:10 AM (#3893063)

It was a routine grounder to 2nd. He ought to have headed toward first but you see pitchers stay on the mound on that play all day every day.

Because the first baseman is on the bag.

My memory of the play is that Bedard did start off the mound toward first, then looked at the ball and stopped. I think he simply mistook Gonzalez for Pedroia, just for a second, and once he's stopped it was too late to keep going.

30. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:12 AM (#3893064)

Masterson's just deadly against RHB.

31. Dan Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:14 AM (#3893066)

Masterson is just filthy at this velocity.

32. Dan Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:18 AM (#3893068)

Bedard looks pretty good. It's a shame that so many balls have found holes, because people not smart enough to look beyond results are going to be stirring up #### after today.

33. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:20 AM (#3893069)

Every other time they cut to Bedard before he pitches, he gets this look like, "I am now worried about the next pitch! What if I give up a homer?"

34. Dan Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:21 AM (#3893070)

ÉriKKKKK Bédard

35. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:23 AM (#3893072)

It's my contention, based on an hour of watching, that one of the main reasons Bedard gets all this #### is that he's really uncommonly expressive on the mound.

You have your "emotional" pitchers, like Jose Valverde or Al Hrabowsky, but traditionally those guys only express things like "A strikeout - I am awesome at pitching!" and "I will strike you out and then hunt down your family and strike them out too." Bedard's an outlier.

36. Benji Gil Gamesh Rises Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:27 AM (#3893073)

Reddick would have caught that.

37. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:27 AM (#3893074)

Reddick is so freaking strong. That was not off the sweet spot - it sounded like it was a little down toward the handle.

38. Dan Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:28 AM (#3893075)

Reddick is a ####### monster.

39. Benji Gil Gamesh Rises Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:30 AM (#3893076)

It's my contention, based on an hour of watching, that one of the main reasons Bedard gets all this #### is that he's really uncommonly expressive on the mound.

Well, pretty good chance that carries over into how he carries himself off the mound too, right?

40. Dan Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:32 AM (#3893078)

Reddick is going to be really, really good after he's seen the pitchers in the league more and after he's gotten more reps in Fenway's RF. He makes some good plays but gets some bad reads, but Drew was very tentative in RF in his first season playing defense at Fenway as well.

41. Dan Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:37 AM (#3893079)

Impressive that Bedard hasn't walked anybody after his control issues last Friday.

42. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:41 AM (#3893083)

Surprised to hear Masterson doesn't have any double-digit K games this year.

43. Dan Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:44 AM (#3893084)

Score another run and get Bedard a win!

44. Biff, highly-regarded young guy Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:48 AM (#3893089)

I just got home. How did Bedard look? Lots of hits but no walks...

45. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:49 AM (#3893090)

70 pitches? That's a very quick hook - do the Sox think Bedard still needs to stretch out after his DL stint?

46. Dan Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:49 AM (#3893091)

He looked great, Biff. Almost all of the hits were seeing eye grounders and soft bloops.

47. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:49 AM (#3893092)

I just got home. How did Bedard look? Lots of hits but no walks...

Looked very good. Not dominant, but good. Hit-unlucky, no question.

48. Biff, highly-regarded young guy Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:50 AM (#3893093)

Aceves was such a huge pickup for this team. Never mind the fact that his ERA will almost certainly regress...when was the last time the Red Sox had a true long reliever? Julian ######' Tavarez? And he wasn't really that good.

49. Dan Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:50 AM (#3893094)

Yes, but the pitch count they gave before the game was 75-80, so I figured they'd at least let him start the 6th inning.

Ivan Nova just threw a wild pitch on a pitchout.

50. Biff, highly-regarded young guy Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:51 AM (#3893096)

Thanks for the info guys. Good to hear, especially after his control issues last Friday and still being just off the DL.

51. Dan Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:54 AM (#3893097)

That was a meaty, meaty meatball.

52. Biff, highly-regarded young guy Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:54 AM (#3893098)

They should leave Morales in to see if they keep going deeper and deeper to center field.

53. Dan Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:56 AM (#3893099)

Can we go back and get that 6th inning of Bedard instead now?

54. Benji Gil Gamesh Rises Posted: August 05, 2011 at 12:59 AM (#3893102)

55. Hugh Jorgan Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:02 AM (#3893104)

And the Morales experiment of August 4th 2011 ends with a thud....

Shame they were so strict with Bedard, it was nice to hear he had pretty good stuff. A good sign going forward for the playoffs.

56. Darren

Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:05 AM (#3893105)

I figured I'd find a lot more rending of garments over the insertion of Morales into a tie game. What gives?

57. Mattbert Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:05 AM (#3893106)

Yes, but the pitch count they gave before the game was 75-80, so I figured they'd at least let him start the 6th inning.

Oh, good. I just checked in too and was about to make the "Who had 'first start' in the Erik Bedard injury pool?" joke.

I took Kidbert to her first ballgame this afternoon. We sat right next to the ray tank in right-center at the Trop. That place ... yes, it kind of sucks ... but it's not as bad as you might think. It is definitely a replacement level venue for baseball, but it's not, like, actively unpleasant.

58. Mattbert Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:07 AM (#3893108)

I figured I'd find a lot more rending of garments over the insertion of Morales into a tie game. What gives?

Well, if you ignore the unfortunate incident just transpired...he's actually been pretty good for the Sox.

59. Phil Coorey. Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:10 AM (#3893110)

Got to see a fun game as well, Mattbert

60. Darren

Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:12 AM (#3893112)

Well, if you ignore the unfortunate incident just transpired...he's actually been pretty good for the Sox.

Yeah, but that's been a few innings versus his long history of mediocrity. I'd rather see Albers, Aceves, or Wheeler there. But Francona is trying to match up.

61. Dan Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:14 AM (#3893114)

I think Francona is putting both WIlliams and Morales in situations they don't belong in because he is attempting to figure out (and help the FO figure out) which one to keep on the roster when Lowrie is activated. Both of them have pitched in tie games in the past week.

62. Darren

Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:14 AM (#3893115)

Let's go back in time and imagine that the Sox signed Holliday instead of Lackey. Ahhhh.

63. Phil Coorey. Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:15 AM (#3893116)

I figured I'd find a lot more rending of garments over the insertion of Morales into a tie game. What gives?

I was in a cafe and primer for some reason won't work on my iphone - I can read, just can't log in

64. Darren

Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:17 AM (#3893117)

I think Francona is putting both WIlliams and Morales in situations they don't belong in because he is attempting to figure out (and help the FO figure out) which one to keep on the roster when Lowrie is activated. Both of them have pitched in tie games in the past week.

Reminds of 07 when he kept going to Gagne in close games.

Why would we want either of these guys pitching meaningful innings... ever?

65. Phil Coorey. Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:18 AM (#3893118)

Crawford got to a 3-2 count - wow - just ####### wow

66. Darren

Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:19 AM (#3893119)

What's Crawford's OBP now--about .275?

67. Dan Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:19 AM (#3893120)

Crawford got to a 3-2 count - wow - just ####### wow

Don't worry, he still managed to make a weak out.

68. Dan Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:20 AM (#3893121)

Crawford got to a 3-2 count - wow - just ####### wow

Don't worry, he still managed to make a weak out. Well a would've been out.

Wow, they're not going to a lefty hereto face Reddick?

69. Biff, highly-regarded young guy Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:20 AM (#3893123)

Reddick trying to figure out how he didn't get a hit off of that.

70. Phil Coorey. Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:20 AM (#3893124)

reddick just centres the ball every freaking time it seems

71. Mattbert Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:20 AM (#3893125)

Yeah, but that's been a few innings versus his long history of mediocrity.

I take your point, but I give more latitude to the Hot Hand approach when it comes to the bullpen. Relievers with long histories of mediocrity suddenly step forward and have nice seasons all the time. It's not like Albers, for example, was any great shakes until this year.

72. Dan Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:21 AM (#3893126)

What's Crawford's OBP now--about .275?

.277, but don't worry, Holliday's is only at .418.

73. Biff, highly-regarded young guy Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:22 AM (#3893127)

Biff, thanks one more time for the Porcupine Tree recommendation. They're really really growing on me. In Absentia is great stuff, still enjoying the hell out of The Incident, and I just d/l Lightbulb Sun and Deadwing too.

Lightbulb Sun is actually my favorite of theirs, to me it marks the perfect transition from their more poppy stuff to the more proggy stuff. I still haven't really let The Incident grow on me. It sometimes takes me a while to give CDs a full chance.

74. Darren

Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:23 AM (#3893128)

I take your point, but I give more latitude to the Hot Hand approach when it comes to the bullpen. Relievers with long histories of mediocrity suddenly step forward and have nice seasons all the time. It's not like Albers, for example, was any great shakes until this year.

I take your point, but Albers has spent all season showing he is good now. I think it's pretty likely that Morales is still the same guy he ever was.

75. Dan Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:23 AM (#3893129)

Really would've been nice to bat Salty for Varitek there. Sigh.

76. Darren

Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:24 AM (#3893130)

.277, but don't worry, Holliday's is only at .418.

Oh phew.

77. Darren

Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:25 AM (#3893131)

I know I shouldn't be surprised but I hate when the Red Sox season shifts into exhibition mode.

78. Dan Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:25 AM (#3893132)

Holliday has 5.0 fWAR as compared to Crawford's 0.2

79. Dan Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:26 AM (#3893133)

I think Andrew Miller is going to end up as the lefty reliever of choice.

80. Biff, highly-regarded young guy Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:27 AM (#3893134)

The 1-2 to Carrera looked pretty good to me, but you're never going to get that call when the hitter spins away like that.

81. Darren

Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:27 AM (#3893135)

Holliday has 5.0 fWAR as compared to Crawford's 0.2

Yeah, but we had Cameron last year so there.

82. Dan Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:29 AM (#3893136)

We had Cameron this year too.

83. Mattbert Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:32 AM (#3893138)

I think it's pretty likely that Morales is still the same guy he ever was.

You are probably right. I had been indulging in some hopeful thinking based on his improved (though admittedly still not particularly good) walk rate. I think he's just fine as the 11th guy in the pen, but yeah it would've been nice if Theo had swung a deal for a good LH reliever at the deadline.

I wonder if they'll ever give Oki another shot. He's been lights out in Pawtucket.

84. Mattbert Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:33 AM (#3893139)

I think Andrew Miller is going to end up as the lefty reliever of choice.

Or this too.

85. Darren

Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:34 AM (#3893140)

I wonder if they'll ever give Oki another shot. He's been lights out in Pawtucket.

Oki, Atchison, and Bard have all been very good at AAA. But when you're the Red Sox, guys struggling on other MLB teams are far more attractive than guys doing well in your minor league system.

86. Biff, highly-regarded young guy Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:34 AM (#3893141)

I wonder if they'll ever give Oki another shot. He's been lights out in Pawtucket.

I can't remember where I read this (SOSH probably), but supposedly Oki doesn't want to be called back up to the Red Sox.

87. Darren

Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:35 AM (#3893142)

Don't worry about losing--the White Sox will surely beat the Yanks tonight.

88. Dan Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:36 AM (#3893143)

Well, Miller WAS looking good. I still think he's shown more potential in this inning than Morales or Williams have really shown (especially since it's his first relief appearance of the season after being a starter).

89. Srul Itza Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:38 AM (#3893145)

The Sox have decided to spot the Indians a 3 run lead in the seventh, so it can be extra painful when they come back.

90. Benji Gil Gamesh Rises Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:39 AM (#3893146)

I still haven't really let The Incident grow on me. It sometimes takes me a while to give CDs a full chance.

It was the first of theirs I listened to, which guarantees I received it differently. But Time Flies and Drawing the Line and a few others grabbed me immediately, which helped a lot.

Meanwhile, thank goodness it's the 7th inning, given that we need runs.

91. Dan Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:40 AM (#3893148)

Really, really looking to Lowrie's return.

92. Dan Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:43 AM (#3893150)

looking forward to, that should say.

93. Dan Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:44 AM (#3893151)

NOT looking forward to Rafael Perez facing Crawford followed by Reddick being lifted for McDonald next inning however.

94. Biff, highly-regarded young guy Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:47 AM (#3893153)

It was the first of theirs I listened to, which guarantees I received it differently. But Time Flies and Drawing the Line and a few others grabbed me immediately, which helped a lot.

I like Drawing the Line quite a bit, but Time Flies doesn't really do it for me. I think I'm comparing it to their other 10+ minute songs (Buying New Soul, The Sky Moves Sideways, Russia on Ice, Arriving Somewhere But Not Here, Anesthetize) and finding it wanting in comparison.

(Side note - you probably haven't heard Buying New Soul. It's pretty incredible and it's not even on any of their LPs.)

95. Dan Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:49 AM (#3893155)

Does any team actually play the Yankees tough?

96. Darren

Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:51 AM (#3893156)

The Yankees are amazing. They have their years when they're great and then they have years where the make obvious blunders and/or get a rash of injuries, and in those years... they're also great.

97. Dan Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:54 AM (#3893158)

Is it smart or pathetic that Varitek doesn't even bother trying to throw out base stealers anymore?

98. Biff, highly-regarded young guy Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:54 AM (#3893159)

I refuse to believe Colon and Garcia will be good in the playoffs. I just won't accept that.

I just poured a Unibroue Maudite in honor of the first start by our new French Canadian tonight.

99. Darren

Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:57 AM (#3893161)

I refuse to believe Colon and Garcia will be good in the playoffs. I just won't accept that.

But the damage is done. They've carried them into a virtually assured playoff berth. Once they get there, anything can happen.

100. Benji Gil Gamesh Rises Posted: August 05, 2011 at 01:57 AM (#3893162)

Do I want the version of Buying New Soul on Arriving Somewhere or "Recordings"? The latter is 10+ minutes, the former (live?) only ~7.

I'm actually shocked that I've listened to and enjoyed a 17-minute song (Anesthetize) as many times as I have. :)

The only good thing about this game (other than Bedard looking good) is that it has felt like we have no chance for several innings now, so a comeback win will be an extremely pleasant surprise.

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Thursday, August 04, 2011

Indians (54-54) @ RedSox (68-41), Thursday, August 4, 2011, 7:10pm

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