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Hall of Merit
— A Look at Baseball's All-Time Best

Monday, May 17, 2004

1926 Ballot

The 1926 Ballot. Top Newbies:

***1926 (May 16)—elect 2
WS W3 Rookie Name-Pos (Died)
294 80.3 1910 Joe Jackson-LF/RF (1951)
247 73.1 1908 Eddie Cicotte-P (1969)
289 59.0 1907 Larry Doyle-2b (1974)
202 51.8 1908 Gavvy Cravath-RF (1963)
174 43.1 1911 Claude Hendrix-P (1944)
171 43.1 1908 Buck Herzog-2b/3b/SS (1953)
148 51.6 1912 Ray Chapman-SS (1920)
191 35.7 1908 Fred Merkle-1b (1956)
127 46.5 1905 George McBride-SS (1973)
175 36.6 1914 Benny Kauff-CF (1961)
160 34.4 1910 Fred Luderus-1b (1961)
152 33.4 1912 Buck Weaver-SS/3b (1956)
123 36.4 1915 Happy Felsch-CF (1964)
129 35.8 1913 Dick Rudolph-P (1949)
089 19.5 1910 Bill Rariden-C (1942)

Does anyone have the list of newly eligible Negro Leaguers?

Don’t forget you can impose a one-year protest based on character issues, by not including players you otherwise would have voted for.

Joey Numbaz (Scruff) Posted: May 17, 2004 at 09:23 AM | 209 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
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   201. Patrick W Posted: May 26, 2004 at 06:03 PM (#645531)
but since Cooperstown has no intention of not voting in any more players

John, you have more faith in the 'new & improved!!' veteran's committee than I do. My guess is Santo won't make it next year, just like he (or anyone else) didn't in 2003.
   202. sunnyday2 Posted: May 26, 2004 at 06:11 PM (#645554)
I'm with jimd, there is lots of room for '70s and '80s guys.

As for Pearce and the quota, we cannot hold a spot open for an extra guy in 1980. The question is whether Pearce or (say) Van Haltren are more worthy today (or in 1932). (Pearce--second best player for a 15 year period, or Van Haltren--third or fourth best CF of his.)
   203. John (You Can Call Me Grandma) Murphy Posted: May 26, 2004 at 06:20 PM (#645575)
John, you have more faith in the 'new & improved!!' veteran's committee than I do.

Actually, I don't, but at least they're attempting to induct more players.

My guess is Santo won't make it next year, just like he (or anyone else) didn't in 2003.

Sadly, I think you're right. Instead of electing all of Frankie Frisch's buddies, we now elect nobody. Brilliant.
   204. jimd Posted: May 26, 2004 at 08:51 PM (#645828)
jimd, how have you accounted for the Negro Leagues in you guestimating?

My guesstimate assumes that they compete with their white contemporaries for the 25 slots or so available during each of the decades they are active. An alternative model would be to determine how many major-league "teams" worth of talent they represent during each decade and factor that in (like I factored 8 extra teams for both the 1970's/1980's). I have no confidence in my ability to guesstimate that for the Negro Leagues and will leave it to others with a better handle on their quality vis-a-vis the AL/NL.

Running with DavidFoss' suggestion of treating them as a third Major League of 8 teams from 1910-1950 yields as follows:

Rough guesstimate: 228 x 15 / 155 = 22.1

My problem with this is that it treats the era as equivalent to the 1970's/1980's and treats the 1950's and 1960's as "contraction decades" more extreme than the 1890's are treated by Patrick's suggestion. (22 slots for the 50's but 33 for the 40's and before? Doesn't work for me, but others may allocate slots across time differently.)

IAC, these are very rough guesstimates, but they do help us to determine whether a decade is over- or under-represented just like the by-position updates help for positional balance.
   205. Chris Cobb Posted: May 26, 2004 at 10:06 PM (#645900)
My guesstimate assumes that they compete with their white contemporaries for the 25 slots or so available during each of the decades they are active. An alternative model would be to determine how many major-league "teams" worth of talent they represent during each decade and factor that in (like I factored 8 extra teams for both the 1970's/1980's).

Joe would have to provide the details, but I believe there is a much more modest version of what DavidFoss suggests built in to the revised election schedule: it's more like a one-to-two team addition phased in from 1920 to 1960 or something like that, so that it's as if the 1960 expansion arrived at some point during the 1940s.

This would pull the "16-team" decade quota down a little bit, but probably no lower than 24, I'd guess. Howie's seasonal counts suggests that we're pretty close to an 1880s quota, then. I'm not advocating that we close the book on the 1880s by any means, but caution with candidates from that period is indicated.
   206. John (You Can Call Me Grandma) Murphy Posted: May 26, 2004 at 10:28 PM (#645928)
I'm not advocating that we close the book on the 1880s by any means, but caution with candidates from that period is indicated.

Charley Jones is the only player who played a prominent part during the 1880s still on my ballot so I agree with you, Chris.
   207. DavidFoss Posted: May 26, 2004 at 11:16 PM (#646005)
Ah... checked the "Number of Electees by Year" thread and it was assumed that the Negro Leagues had a certain quantity of teams associated with it. I was just asking a question, I wasn't really making a suggestion.

Its really going to be interesting how we elect players from the 20-30's then. If its considered a roughly 18-20 team decade and there are all sorts of famous Negro Leaguers to go along with over-represented-in-Cooperstown decades as well.

I mean at Catcher alone we have Santop, Mackey, Gibson, Cochrane, Hartnett, Dickey... plus maybe Lombardi... and I'm probably forgetting somebody.

I'm not really hardcore on the quotas... just want a general idea of representation... perhaps this Catcher deluge makes up for the dearth of candidates in the decades before.

Anyhow, its going to be fun.
   208. jimd Posted: May 26, 2004 at 11:16 PM (#646006)
Used to calculate the guesstimate is the "number of seasons as a regular" (15).

This does not include the token seasons that Howie uses and that are often found at the beginning and end of HOMer careers from this era. My count has an average of 10 HOMers playing as regulars each year from 1873-78, 20 each year from 1881-88, and 17 from 1895-08 (plus or minus one every year except 1901). There's a spike of 24 in 1890 but that season is the last hurrah for a number of 1880's players (White, Hines, Radbourn, with Gore, Richardson, Keefe having one more real season left) and the beginning for a number of 1890's players (Davis, Burkett, Nichols, Rusie, Delahanty, Hamilton are in their first or second year as a regular).

If the 80's are full, then the 90's and 00's are only about 3 players behind.
   209. Chris Cobb Posted: May 27, 2004 at 02:11 AM (#646859)
If the 80's are full, then the 90's and 00's are only about 3 players behind.

That's pretty much the way I see it. I'd say 1-2 more from the 80s and 4-6 from the 90s and the 00s.

Its really going to be interesting how we elect players from the 20-30's then. If its considered a roughly 18-20 team decade and there are all sorts of famous Negro Leaguers to go along with over-represented-in-Cooperstown decades as well.

It's not considered 18-20, more like 16-18. I did a study a while back (don't have the exact figures handy now), looking at HoFers who became eligible between 1920 and 1960, and we're going to be electing considerably fewer during that era than have been selected to Cooperstown from that era so far.
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