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Sunday, October 21, 2007

Cal Ripken, Jr.

Eligible in 2007.

John (You Can Call Me Grandma) Murphy Posted: October 21, 2007 at 07:57 PM | 14 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
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   1. John (You Can Call Me Grandma) Murphy Posted: October 21, 2007 at 08:01 PM (#2586439)
The #1 HoM inductee of 2007.
   2. sunnyday2 Posted: October 21, 2007 at 08:43 PM (#2586506)
Head to head Ripken is better than Gwynn (on WS) in 12 seasons, Gwynn is better in 8. Totals are 427 and 398. Peaks are

Ripken 37-35-34 rate 23.6
Gwynn 39-35-30 rate 26.9

But was Gwynn's 1997 (39) really better than Cal's 1984 (37). Was Gwynn's 1997 really better than Gwynn's 1984 (35)? Was Cal's '84 better than Gwynn's? So many questions. But I don't see any doubt that '84 was Ripken's best year.

And I don't think you can make the case that Gwynn was better than Cal, but they are closer than I remembered.
   3. karlmagnus Posted: October 21, 2007 at 08:49 PM (#2586511)
Unlike Ozzie Smith, this guy will be top of my ballot. Fielding matters, but 25 points difference in OPS+ matters more.
   4. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: October 22, 2007 at 03:36 AM (#2588178)
He played in a lot of games in a row.
   5. Chris Cobb Posted: October 22, 2007 at 03:37 AM (#2588190)
An easy #1, even against strong competition in 2007.
   6. David Concepcion de la Desviacion Estandar (Dan R) Posted: October 22, 2007 at 03:38 AM (#2588195)
Inner circle; should be unanimous.
   7. Juan V Posted: October 22, 2007 at 03:42 AM (#2588221)
Inner circle; should be unanimous.


karlmagnus is on board, but I don't know if yest will get in...
   8. John (You Can Call Me Grandma) Murphy Posted: October 22, 2007 at 05:42 PM (#2588948)
karlmagnus is on board, but I don't know if yest will get in...


Odds are yest will go with the guy with the higher BA. However, yest does surprise me occasionally.
   9. Yeaarrgghhhh Posted: October 22, 2007 at 05:59 PM (#2588982)
But I don't see any doubt that '84 was Ripken's best year.

What about 1991?
   10. The District Attorney Posted: October 22, 2007 at 06:10 PM (#2589010)
Ripken's defense was fantastic in '84. You all kno whow to quantify it much better than I do, but I'd imagine that is one of the better non-Ozzie defensive seasons ever. At SS, I'd certainly think that outweighs a few OPS+ points.
   11. David Concepcion de la Desviacion Estandar (Dan R) Posted: October 22, 2007 at 06:41 PM (#2589067)
My numbers have Ripken's fielding as just as good in 1991 as in '83-'84 (Chris Dial's Zone Rating data give it a monster +25). The three years are all among the greatest ever by a SS, but the '91 seems clearly the best of the lot to me, a Wagner/Vaughan/Jennings-type season.
   12. Paul Wendt Posted: October 23, 2007 at 01:35 PM (#2590028)
How does a man put up another monster season in the field at shortstop 7-8 years after?
How low are the 19885-90 dips?
Do minor hurts explain most of the variability in fielder ratings, for players without major hurts or position changes?
   13. David Concepcion de la Desviacion Estandar (Dan R) Posted: October 23, 2007 at 02:03 PM (#2590065)
Dial has Ripken as being an outstanding fielder every year he played SS except 1987, when he was merely above average. I suppose it does call the numbers into question a bit that he gets a +11 the year before he was moved to 3B.
   14. Yeaarrgghhhh Posted: October 23, 2007 at 02:13 PM (#2590083)
How does a man put up another monster season in the field at shortstop 7-8 years after?
How low are the 19885-90 dips?
Do minor hurts explain most of the variability in fielder ratings, for players without major hurts or position changes?


Not sure what you mean. I'm not aware of any evidence that his fielding declined from 1985-1990. The point is simply that he was just as good in 91 as he was in 83-84.

Dial has Ripken as being an outstanding fielder every year he played SS except 1987, when he was merely above average. I suppose it does call the numbers into question a bit that he gets a +11 the year before he was moved to 3B.

I dunno...IIRC, he was one of the best 3B in the league after he moved, so it's certainly possible that he was still an above average SS before the move.

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