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Hall of Merit
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Tuesday, January 11, 2005

Frankie Frisch

Great player. Lousy voter.

John (You Can Call Me Grandma) Murphy Posted: January 11, 2005 at 02:43 AM | 15 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
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   1. John (You Can Call Me Grandma) Murphy Posted: January 11, 2005 at 02:55 AM (#1071127)
hot topics
   2. DavidFoss Posted: January 11, 2005 at 02:59 AM (#1071130)
He doesn't join the HOF's VC for another 20-odd years, no? Does the HOF even have a VC, yet? :-)
   3. jimd Posted: January 11, 2005 at 04:41 AM (#1071396)
HOF VC picks as of 1943:
37 Morgan Bulkeley
37 Ban Johnson
37 Connie Mack
37 John McGraw
37 George Wright
38 Alexander Cartwright
38 Henry Chadwick
39 Cap Anson
39 Charlie Comiskey
39 Candy Cummings
39 Buck Ewing
39 Charley Radbourn
39 Al Spalding
   4. KJOK Posted: January 11, 2005 at 07:57 AM (#1071801)
I have a hard time seeing him as much better than Joe Sewell:

OWP:
Frisch - .560
Sewell - .549

Runs Created Above Position:
Sewell - 346
Frisch - 291

Plate Appearances:
Frisch - 10100
Sewell - 8330

Defense
Frisch - 2B, EXCELLENT
Sewell - SS, VERY GOOD

Maybe just a slight edge to Frisch, but Sewell can't be far behind.
   5. Ardo Posted: January 11, 2005 at 07:23 PM (#1072687)
KJOK,

With Dobie Moore, Dick Lundy, and part of John Beckwith's career added, Sewell's RCAP takes a tumble - and Frisch is better in OWP, PA, and defense. I still believe that Sewell belongs in the HoM, but Frisch is a full step ahead of Sewell.
   6. DavidFoss Posted: January 11, 2005 at 07:36 PM (#1072720)
Frisch also suffers somewhat in RCAP by sharing a league with Hornsby. Frisch leads in RCAA by about 180 to 130 or so (sorry no exact numbers, here).

Still, RCAA isn't going to tell the full story because Sewell did play a more defensive position.

Frisch has nice peak with some 30+ WS seasons, a lengthy career, and was an A+ fielder but he's quite a bit below some other 2B we've had recently. He's not near Collins, Hornsby or even Gehringer. A Lazzeri/Herman comparison might be fruitful, here.
   7. Rick A. Posted: January 11, 2005 at 09:39 PM (#1073058)
but he's quite a bit below some other 2B we've had recently. He's not near Collins, Hornsby or even Gehringer.

Yes, but how many times have we read that Gehrig, Foxx and Greenberg aren't the standard for the Hall of Merit. The same can be said for Collins and Hornsby. At first glance Frisch will be high on my ballot. (Haven't looked at any of the Negro Leaguers newly eligible this year yet)
   8. DavidFoss Posted: January 11, 2005 at 09:54 PM (#1073107)
Yes, but how many times have we read that Gehrig, Foxx and Greenberg aren't the standard for the Hall of Merit. The same can be said for Collins and Hornsby. At first glance Frisch will be high on my ballot. (Haven't looked at any of the Negro Leaguers newly eligible this year yet)

True... he'll make my top five easily.

On a side note... is Frisch the only non-Yankee to play in 8 World Series?
   9. PhillyBooster Posted: January 11, 2005 at 10:39 PM (#1073246)
I think so.

There are a bunch of 1950s era Dodgers with 7 (Carl Furillo, Pee Wee Reese, Gil Hodges), but it looks like even though Brooklyn/LA won 10 pennants in 20 years (1947-1966), no one player was on more than seven of these teams.
   10. Mark Shirk (jsch) Posted: January 11, 2005 at 10:52 PM (#1073296)
As of 1943 it doesnt' look like the VC has done too terrible a job. Morgan Bulkeley and Candy Cummings are Frischesque, but the rest are alright. Especially when you consider that they were tasked with managerial/founding father selections as well.
   11. jimd Posted: January 11, 2005 at 11:08 PM (#1073345)
is Frisch the only non-Yankee to play in 8 World Series

King Kelly and Jim O'Rourke each played on 8 pennant winners. If there had been a World Series every year, they might have equaled it.

Kelly (1880,81,82,85,86,90P,91,92)
O'Rourke (1873,74,75,77,78,79,88,89)
   12. jimd Posted: January 11, 2005 at 11:27 PM (#1073407)
Especially when you consider that they were tasked with managerial/founding father selections as well.

The VC was Landis, the league presidents, and some other front office people (this was mentioned on another thread). I don't think it was that they were "tasked" so much as that that was who they were comfortable selecting.

1937 VC Meeting:
"Well, we have to elect Ban Johnson."
"Agreed. Who was the first NL President?"
"Some guy named Bulkeley. Never heard of him."
"Oh he was a US Senator back in the Oughts."
"President of Aetna Insurance, too."
"Good. Very good."
"Managers?"
"Mack and McGraw."
"Agreed."
"I heard that an old ballplayer, George Wright, just died recently. He was 90."
"Never heard of him either."
"Connie said he was very good back in the day."
"Good enough for me. Are we agreed?"
   13. Cblau Posted: February 07, 2005 at 03:12 AM (#1129364)
Ran across this item today. In 1957, he said Stan Musial should be put in the Hall of Fame immediately. At least he pushed someone who was qualified, for once.
   14. John (You Can Call Me Grandma) Murphy Posted: February 07, 2005 at 04:23 AM (#1129578)
LOL
   15. Paul Wendt Posted: February 08, 2005 at 02:35 AM (#1131247)
iirc, George Wright was included in planning or consultation for the Hall, the Museum, or the Centennial, and was elected to the Hall in his lifetime (d. 1937-08-21). Deacon White (d. 1939-07-07) was not and was not.

Wright was on the Mills Commission, so he signed on to Abner Doubleday and William Cooper's Town in 1908.

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