Here you go, Paul!

Thanks, John!

For now here is a copy of the message that I sent to the Yahoo Group this noon hour. It concerns graphs with discussion. The graphs are derived from the raw data that has been discussed here and there this fortnight, mainly in the Election Results threads. Later, perhaps today, I will gather some of those items here.

======

Graphs files uploaded to HallofMerit

Folks,

In the "Files" section of our site at Yahoo Groups
http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/HallofMerit/files
subsection "Graphs", I have recently posted five articles, including
two this noon that are listed first below.

Paul Wendt


PeakSupport.doc
(graph with discussion) (by candidate) Peak electoral support for all
candidate to 1998 classified as first ballot, quasi-first ballot, and
slower election, or unelected

FirstQuasifirst.doc
(graphs with discussion) (by election) Timing of first-ballot and
quasi-first ballot candidates by election year

electoral.careers.20yr.pdf
tracking candidates by election (illustration with 20yr data) :
featuring Jones, Browning, Ryan, Duffy, Van Haltren, Beckley ; plus
Leach, Bresnahan, Welch and others

electoral.careers.annual.doc
tracking candidates by election (illustrations with annual data) :
Fred Dunlap's advance; Pike, Brown, Kiner, and Keller show Browning,
Jones, and Cravath how to get in

pitcher.seasons.doc
(illustration, no HOM content) Down With Uberstats! two-dimensional
perspective on all pitching seasons for Hippo Vaughn, Wilbur Cooper,
Eppa Rixey

Here are the catalog entries in "Files" for three items recently posted by David Foss --two data files and one graph derived from the data.
(In order to use yahoo groups Files, one must Register once and Sign In on each visit or permanently.)


text/text
1999HOM_CandidateVotesPerYear.txt
Yearly Rank and Point totals for candidates 341 KB davidrfoss
Offline Invite to Yahoo! 360° May 31, 2007

text/text
1999HOM_SumCandidateVotes.txt
Sum of Candidates Point Totals (checked against Rick A's data) 18 KB davidrfoss
Offline Invite to Yahoo! 360° May 31, 2007

image/ 19CentSluggersVotingRanks.png
Graph of Balloting Results for Beckley, VanHaltren, Ryan, Browning, Duffy & Jones

These candidates never played in the major leagues, from 1871, and garnered at least one #15 vote through 1998. There are 47: Creighton before 1871 and 46 so-called Negro Leaguers.



I intend this to be complete and suppose it to be in error at least once.

Some baseball databases include some of these players. For example, the baseball-databank underlying baseball-reference includes all Hall of Fame members, and they have bb-ref "Recognition Pages". In turn that covers every HOMer except Beckwith, right?

That is Newt Allen, Ray Brown, Grant & Judy Johnson, Hilton Smith, Ben Taylor, Jules Thomas, Joe Williams, Jud Wilson, Bill Wright.

Artie Wilson, Bus Clarkson, Quincey Trouppe, and Willard Brown played in the majors briefly around 1950.

#4
I intend this to be complete and suppose it to be in error at least once.

add Leroy Matlock, making 48 among 421 HOM "candidates" (players named on at least one ballot 1898-1998)

Some baseball databases include some of these players. For example, the baseball-databank underlying baseball-reference includes all Hall of Fame members, and they have bb-ref "Recognition Pages". In turn that covers every HOMer except Beckwith, right?

make that Beckwith, Johnson, and Moore

23 of the 48 are not in the (Lahman) Baseball Database. I have added those 23 and the remaining 9 finalists for 2006 HOF election to my copy. Here is a list where the first two columns indicate HOM status.



The numeric ID in the database ('lahmanID') is designed to be a natural number less than 65536, I think. The negative numbers are not recommended but they do help keep track.

Most games played, no votes for Hall of Merit
- Bill Buckner.
Steve Finley has "outplayed" him and will probably take his crown in six years.

Most innings pitched, no votes for Hall of Merit.
- Sam Jones.
only Clemens, Maddux, Glavine, and Dennis Martinez have "outpitched" him, soon to be joined by Randy Johnson.


Leaders among everyone eligible for the Hall of Merit.
- Rusty Staub.
only Henderson, Murray, Ripken, and Winfield have "outplayed" him, soon to be joined by Barry Bonds.

- Nolan Ryan, who will soon return the crown to Bobby Mathews


Soon I will upload a complete HOM table.

For 32 persons who are not in the (Lahman) Baseball Database 5.4 --23 HOM candidates through 1998 and 9 HOF candidates for 2006-- here is the data I have gathered from encyclopedic websites for most of the biographical fields in lahman5.4.
some Master data for non-mlb players

Several nonstandard fields precede the player names.
- the faux ID, -1 to -32
- career begin and end years (2 fields). This is irregular because only some are limited to major black teams, only some are limited to playing rather than managing.
- HOM status (3 fields): year Eligible and two indicators, one for HOMers (members) and one for everyone named on at least one ballot (candidates including HOMers).

Standard fields begin with the player names.
- name fields (5), weight/height/bats/throws (4), birth date and place (6), death date and place (6)

nonstandard and standard fields may be called "non-Master" and "Master".
"Standard fields" are a selection from the lahman5.4 Master table.

Most innings pitched, no votes for Hall of Merit.
- Sam Jones.
only Clemens, Maddux, Glavine, and Dennis Martinez have "outpitched" him, soon to be joined by Randy Johnson.

I would be surprised if Dennis Martinez doesn't take that title from Sam Jones.

Soon I will upload a complete HOM table.

This is "complete" in identifying all of the HOM candidates (appeared on at least one ballot through 1999) adequately for use within the lahman5.4 database or a custom edition of the baseball-databank (baseball-databank.org). Its HOM scope is exceptionally limited: no election data except the identification of all-time through 1999 candidates and members.

--
basic plus HOM table compatible with lahman5.4 database
HOM table compatible with lahman5.4 database

csv format
427 records, one for each player who appeared on a Hall of Merit ballot through 1999
8 fields:

lahmanID - for the first 23 records, a small negative number that may be called the wendtID for those HOM candidates who are not included in the lahman5.4 database; for the remaining 404 records, a positive number between 1 and 18000-odd that matches 'lahmanID' in the Master table of the lahman5.4 database and so makes this table compatible with the database
HOMmember - indicator for HOM members through 1999, equal to '1' for the 207 members, '0' for the 220 others candidates
HOMballot - indicator for appearance on HOM ballot through 1999, uniformly equal to '1' and thus redundant
nameLast
nameFirst
Games
InningsX3(outs)
debutYear

The last five fields are derived from the lahman5.4 data, hence redundant if you will integrate this table with the database; otherwise they make the table somewhat valuable.
The third of eight fields/columns is also redundant because it is uniformly '1'.

That is, within lahman5.4 and without redundancy, you need only the first two fields or columns of this table
and you need to extend the Master table with some data for non-mlb players (see #8), or at absolute minimum {lahmanID, nameLast, nameFirst} from the first 23 records or rows of this table.

Note, 'nameLast' and 'nameFirst' in this table match lahman5.4 (and the SABR Biographical Research Committee, subject to lag and human error); they are derived from that database using its Master table. They do not always match the name data in files David Foss has uploaded to the HallofMerit yahoogroups.com website. Those files use the names that appear in the annual HOM "Results" with a few exceptions such as consistent use of 'J.' in 'George J. Burns'.

Overview of standard biographical data missing in "some Master data for non-mlb players" (#8).

BirthYear - Carlos Moran, Jules Thomas
others, month/day - Bill Monroe, Georgge Stovey

BirthCountry - Moran, Bruce Petway, Thomas [Cuba, USA, USA, i suppose]
others, city - Monroe, Tetelo Vargas

DeathYear - Moran, Thomas

DeathCountry - Moran, Petway, Thomas
others, city - Monroe

Weight - Creighton, Donaldson, Monroe, Moran, Petway, C.I. Taylor, Thomas, Vargas

Height - same plus Stovey

Throwing hand - Donaldson, Moran, Petway, C.I. Taylor, Thomas, Vargas

Batting hand - same plus Creighton (RHP), Redding (RHP)

Given name - Leroy Matlock, Moran, Thomas

Nickname - Pass, but I welcome information that someone's baseball name (the first name in reference books and articles) was not used

Sources examined:
- NBHOFM candidate biographies
- Wikipedia
- Bullpen Wiki (baseball-reference)
- SABR, Nineteenth Century Stars and Baseball's First Stars

There are a few discrepancies that I noted, not worth enumerating in this format.

Since posting the table and writing #8, I have added from the SABR biographies Fowler 5'7 155 and Stovey 165

Moments ago, I wrote in a lighter vein at "2000 Ballot":
Or simply visit agatetype and imagine, next decade you too may have a personal baseball research website. Gary A. on the web (1929 ANL)
Gary A. on the web (1929 ANL)
;-)

Well, there "bill monroe" is now second from the top of the list of recent posts. The "post" includes photo image of his obituary from Chattanooga TN published in Chicago Defender.
William S. Monroe "Monie" d 1915-03-16

This table supercedes #11
HOM data compatible with lahman5.4 database

It doesn't include the redundant mlb playing data (career games played, innings pitched) but includes more data on HOM status. It should be sufficient to use in conjunction with the HOM electoral details posted by DavidFoss to the yahoo group.

Someone who integrates this table with the database and uses it to analyse the playing records of HOM candidates or members of "frontloggers" (jimd) might discover another misidentification such as the "wrong Billy Williams" and I will be grateful for any corrections.

Here is the description of fields copied from my desktop copy. '+' marks fields that are redundant if you use this table with the lahman5.4 database and the HOM electoral details. '-' marks the independent fields.

That is a Candidates table for a Hall of Merit mini-database compatible with lahman5.4. This one table includes database IDs for everyone who has ever received a vote and it includes the HOM names that identifies them in the electoral detail file --enough for any skilful lahman5.x user to link the electoral detail with that baseball database.

I had expected to push that project further mid-week, in conjunction with the update of electoral detail data that David Foss uploads to the yahoo group Files. Now I expect to resume it after the 2001 or the 2002 cycle, providing Candidates, Elections, and Points tables with a few useful queries. Anyone who uses the posted table or has a suggestion for this project, you are welcome to use eddress pwendt at fas.harvard.edu. I plan soon to rehabilitate the one generally used in the past for baseball, now overfull.

Frontlog 2000: 47 ballots cast. Ryan got 39 #1's. Obviously qualified.
Is there a 2nd one? Gossage got 27 #1+#2's. There were also 3 miscellaneous #1's.
So Gossage received between 24 and 27 frontlog votes and so is also in (perhaps just barely).

Examination of the 3 miscellaneous #1's is not necessary to determine frontlog status this election.
However, such an exam would show only one of the three voted a frontlogger #2 (Ryan).
So the actual count is 42-5 Ryan and 27-20 Gossage.

Thanks, jimd.

Gossage, Morris and Hough are the new "candidates" to be represented by new rows in the table. Pesky, Oliver, and Tenace (also marked "n/e" by the ballot counting robot) are "off and on".

Nolan Ryan is a quasi-first ballot member, Gossage a first ballot, and Fingers an ordinary member.

Much thanks! I'm going back in time to start building my PHoM, and this is of great help.

Classification of Hall of Merit members

<u>"Negro Leagues"</u>
I think we have 24 who did not play in the majors plus Trouppe, Willard Brown, Paige, Irvin and some with mainly major league careers.

<u>fielding position</u>
98. Howie Menckel Posted: April 22, 2007 at 10:29 PM (#2342701)
HOM by pct at position, thru 1997

OF taking a bigger lead over SP

If 65 pct is your cutoff, then we have elected 13 Cs, 14 1Bs, 16 2Bs, 10 3Bs, 17 SSs, 56 OFs, 54 Ps.
If 50 pct is your cutoff, then we have elected 13 Cs, 16 1Bs, 16 2Bs, 13 3Bs, 18 SSs, 60 OFs, 54 Ps.

HOM batters by percentage of games played at position (min. 10 pct GP at a position, otherwise it's not listed and not tallied)

Howie,

Do the percentages include play outside the majors for anyone else, beyond the 24 plus 4?
For example, do you rely on major league careers to classify Minnie Minoso, Lip Pike, and anyone with consensus minor league credit?

Does the list of pitchers end at 20% (Ruth), no one in the 10-19% range?

Among 77 players listed in The Negro League Home Page directory of links to HOM discussion, 52 have received at least one vote and these 25 have not. Did any of the 25 appear in the majors?

Andy Cooper
Buck O’Neil
Chaney White
Chet Brewer
Chino Smith
Clint Thomas
Connie Johnson
Dave Brown
David Malarcher
Double Duty Radcliffe
George Shively
Heavy Johnson
Jimmy Lyons
Leon Day
Luis Marquezr
Marvin Williams
Max Manning
Nip Winters
Pee Wee Butts
Pelayo Chacon
Piper Davis
Ray Dandridge
Sam Bankhead
Sammy T. Hughes
Slim Jones

Cooper, Day, and Dandridge are in the lahman5.4 database as Hall of Fame members.

These three players have received at least one vote but are not listed in that directory (nor in the one for discussion of five Latino players including Carlos Moran, where Vargas probably should be listed). None of the three played in the majors so they are not in the database, only in my extension discussed here.

Bud Fowler
George Stovey
Tetelo Vargas

C Johnson and Marquez played big league ball.

update of #12
After entering death data for Bill Monroe (above) and everything I could find in Riley's Encyclopedia (mainly Petway, C.I. Taylor, Vargas) these are the remaining blanks in the biographical and vital data for candidates who did not play in the majors and are not in the Hall of Fame (all but CREIGHTON from the "Negro Leagues"). There is also some conflicting data, which is impractical to list.

<u>BirthYear</u> - Carlos Moran, Jules Thomas
<u>others, month/day</u> - Bill Monroe, George Stovey

<u>BirthCity</u> - Monroe, Moran, Thomas

<u>DeathYear</u> - Moran, Thomas

<u>DeathCity</u> - Moran, Thomas

<u>Weight</u> - CREIGHTON, Donaldson, Monroe, Moran, Thomas
<u>Height</u> - same plus Stovey

<u>Throwing hand</u> - Donaldson, Moran
<u>Batting hand</u> - CREIGHTON, Donaldson

<u>Given name</u> - Leroy Matlock, Moran, Thomas

Riley says Thomas "was one of the biggest men in baseball and his great bulk made him a good power hitter . . ." but gives no estimate.
Riley lists the name "Thomas, Jack (Jules, Jule, Home Run)" but I have not entered Jack as a given name.

Paul, I do not currently list anyone in the 10 pct to 20 pct range as a pitcher, no.

I believe I adjusted Pike to account for pre-NA play, and Dickey Pearce, etc.
Same for players with minor league credit.
But I may have missed a few.

Again, all suggestions welcomed. Surely at least a few need to be refined...

Winfield and Whitaker - first ballot members

Randolph - neither first, quasifirst, nor frontlog

--
Howie,
Because of rounding down and setting a threshold at 10%, the share of career by fielding position sums to 80% (Torriente and Mackey) to 100%. Right? This is not a criticism but an check for clerical errors. Very incomplete but only 80% stands out as a lower sum than I expected.

With 28 #1 votes of 47 cast, Winfield is an obvious "frontlogger".

With 8 #1 votes and 17 #2 votes, Whitaker has potential.
Examination of the ballots shows that 16 of his 17 #2 votes also had Winfield as #1.
So Whitaker has 8+16 frontlog votes out of 47 cast. Just barely qualified at 24-23.

Since I bothered to check, note that Winfield received 8 additional frontlog votes as #2 to Whitaker. Final tally 36-11.

Just noodling around with the HOM voting data through 1999 from the Y!groups site....

I thought I'd split the vote-getters into NgL candidates and MLB candidates. For this exercise, Doby, Campy, guys like that are MLB. Clarkson, Irvin, Rogan, guys like that are NgLers.

Anyway, I broke them out and figured a few averages and stuff to see if there was anything to see. Here's the aggregate totals



By the by, I didn't include Estalella and Arlett here.

I thought the results were overall not too exciting, but there might be a hint of something interesting.
-We've elected 51% of NgLers who have gotten a vote, and 49% of MLBs.
-The typical elected NGL player spends three more years on the ballot than the typical MLB electee, but non-HOMer NGLs get almost five fewer years in the backlog.
-En toto, NGL candidates do a little better per ballot, but frontlog/electees do a little worse.
-On average, MLBs get two more slots on the ballot than do NGLs, and while the frontlog/electees have the same highest ranking (on average), the backloggers do nearly five spots worse.

Some additional information. We could estimate the MLB and NGL populations at 16,000 and 4,000 each, which would make 20,000 players (I know there are problems with both these numbers...). If so, 2.3% of MLBs make a ballot, and 1.4% of NGLs make a ballot. 1.1% of MLBs are HOMers; 0.7% of NGLs are HOMers. These seeming disparities may not be real disparites given that a larger percentage of the NGL population may have been transient players who played but a handful of games, compared with similar numbers of MLBs who did the same, but it's worth noting them anyway.

Anyway, at a birds-eye view of the election data, it looks like:
-we may (or may not?) cast our net a little wider over the MLB guys than the NGL guys
-when NGL candidates arrive, the electorate takes them very seriously (as or nearly as seriously as the MLB guys, as instructed in the constitution)
-in taking NGL candidates very seriously, the electorate tends to have strong support for frontlog/NB candidates, though not necessarily as strong as for MLBs
-that the electorate may be slightly quicker to dismiss a NGLer in the backlog and may not support them quite as firmly as the backlog MLB guys.

This is my review at the first blush. There are, however, important things I didn't look at.
-I didn't compare NGL candidats to only those in their own chronological cohorts.
-I didn't adjust ballot rankings or points based on the number of available points or the number of candidates appearing on a ballot in a given election.
-I didn't adjust in any way for latter-day MLB candidates having less total opportunity to appear on ballots than the older NGL candidates.
-I didn't adjust for number of elect-me slots on the ballot or, for that matter, make any attempt to qualify a player's support by examining the nubmer of elect-mes he got.
-Small samples, especially on the NGL side.

If anyone else wants to go into further depth, I'll be happy to share my spreadsheets with you. I bet you'll find that some of the very small disparities I found may well disappear (or maybe even heighten?) do to some or all of the above-mentioned factors.

I'll check eventually on that "80 pct," Paul. Seems a little low. There are times with NeLers where I set aside 10 pct or so on the sense that the guy played all over on occasion. Thanks.

2001 and 2002 are straightforward.
One elected incumbent, neither on the quasifirst ballot nor from the frontlog (Randolph, then Stieb).
Two men elected on the first ballot, hence also frontlog.

Through 2002,
I have 219 HOMers, 119 first ballot, 30 quasifirst ballot (sum 149), 105 frontlog.
The number of candidates is now 438, precisely half elected and half not.

2001 and 2002 are straightforward.
One elected incumbent, neither on the quasifirst ballot nor from the frontlog (Randolph, then Stieb).
Two men elected on the first ballot, hence also frontlog.

False. Neither quasi-first nor first ballot implies frontlog

2001
- backlog Randolph
- first/qf Winfield, Whitaker
2002
- backlog Stieb
-first/qf Trammell Smith
2003
- backlog Jones
- first/qf Murray, Sandberg
2004
- backlog Bresnahan
- first/qf Molitor, Ecklersley
2005
- backlog Browning, Dawson
- first/qf Boggs
2006
- backlog Oms, Nettles
- first/qf Clark
2007
- backlog
- first/qf Ripken, Gwynn, McGwire

In seven years that is 8 players elected from the backlog;
13 elected on the first ballot ("first or quasi-first" but none is merely quasi-first).

jimd,
How many of those thirteen are "frontlog" rather than "midlog"?


Through 2002,
I have 219 HOMers, 119 first ballot, 30 quasifirst ballot (sum 149), 105 frontlog.
The number of candidates is now 438, precisely half elected and half not.

Through 2007,
234 HOMers; 128 first ballot, 30 quasifirst ballot (sum 158); <small>and I don't know the frontlog count</small>

Is this table in the Yahoo group? If not, could someone please upload it?

I suppose that none of this data bears on the 2008 election. Right?

See article #2 in this thread re Files/Graphs.
See the '1999' and '2004' files posted by David Foss.

I plan to post more data and analysis of HOM elections, maybe of HOM membersj too, during late January (between semesters with light workload) and around Christmas/NewYear's (holiday with heavy workload). I understand that David Foss too will update election data after 2008. Maybe he will also extend? Some participants who maintain data on HOM members plan to take a second look at everything after 2008. Howie Menckel has said so regarding career-shares by fielding position, at least for early white players and segregation-era black players. I expect to provide helpful data on the three outfield positions where feasible (MLB, maybe some 1860s). Others or Howie again probably have the same intention regarding some classifications of careers or allocations of career-shares by decade, club, city, league, etc.

My working files of election data include identification of jimd's frontlog as well as first ballot HOMers and my quasi-first ballot HOMers. (The recently named 'midlog' is ^(first or quasi-first) and not frontlog^.) My inquiry in #29 is in preparation for updating and posting after the 2008 election.

How many of those thirteen are "frontlog" rather than "midlog"?

All but Clark. Whitaker just barely made it (see post #25 above).

See "The Hall of Merit and Fame" by Joe Posnanski (December 28).

This Curiously Long Post compliments the Hall of Merit. "... The last week or so, I’ve been exploring this concept by comparing the players in the Baseball Hall of Fame with the best available counterweight, which is the Baseball Think Factory Hall of Merit. I’m a very big fan of the Hall of Merit, ...".

Posnanski gives these counts by category, which fit the official counts 231 Hall of Fame players and 237 Hall of Merit members.
>>
Best I can tell:
– There are 181 players in BOTH the Fame and the Merit.
– There are roughly 50 players in the Fame who are not in the Merit.*
– There are 56 players in the Merit who are not in the Fame.
<<

At the Hall of Merit we count Hall of Fame members whom that institution calls "Players" and HOF members whom we have elected (now five: George Wright, Al Spalding, Clark Griffith, John McGraw, and Rube Foster). By our convention the correct counts are <180, 56, 57>. For anyone who counts HOF "Players" only, the correct numbers are <175, 56, 62>.

The Halls of Merit and Fame were first in phase after the BBWAA election of Goose Gossage two years ago, which completed the 2008 cycle. Then the HOM election schedule changed from once every three weeks to once a year. The corresponding counts were 177 Hall of Merit members in the Hall of Fame, 55 in the Fame only, and 57 in the Merit only. With the 2009 cycle, Jim Rice joined the "Fame only"; Reggie Smith replaced Joe Gordon in the "Merit only".

During year 2008, the Hall of Merit ranked the 57 "Merit only" players within four groups defined by Cooperstown jurisdictions. Here are the current 56 "Fame only" players in the same four groups, with links to our four ranking elections results.

Group 1 - Still Under BBWAA Jurisdiction [as I write; back in 2008 we anticipated the 2009 cycle]
HOM ranking of 12 "Merit only" players

(1 "Fame only" player)
debut
1984 Kirby Puckett

Group 2 - Hall of Fame players jurisdiction
HOM ranking of 12 "Merit only" players (Today Reggie Smith would be included.)

(10 "Fame only" players)
debut
1976 Bruce Sutter
1974 Jim Rice
1965 Catfish Hunter
1964 Tony Perez
1961 Lou Brock
1958 Orlando Cepeda
1956 Bill Mazeroski
1956 Luis Aparicio
1945 Red Schoendienst
1943 George Kell

Group 3 - "Pre-1943" Veterans Committee jurisdiction (They elected Joe Gordon at their last meeting.)
HOM ranking of 21 "Merit only" players

(39 "Fame only" players)
debut
1941 Phil Rizzuto
1931 Ernie Lombardi
1930 Dizzy Dean
1930 Lefty Gomez
1929 Rick Ferrell
1928 Chuck Klein
1927 Lloyd Waner
1926 Tony Lazzeri
1924 Earle Combs
1924 Chick Hafey
1924 Freddie Lindstrom
1923 Heinie Manush
1923 Hack Wilson
1922 Jim Bottomley
1922 Travis Jackson
1921 Kiki Cuyler
1920 Pie Traynor
1918 Jesse Haines
1918 Waite Hoyt
1917 Ross Youngs
1916 Burleigh Grimes
1915 Dave Bancroft
1915 George Kelly
1915 Sam Rice
1912 Rabbit Maranville
1912 Herb Pennock
1912 Ray Schalk
1909 Harry Hooper
1908 Rube Marquard
1903 Chief Bender
1902 Johnny Evers
1902 Addie Joss
1902 Joe Tinker
1899 Jack Chesbro
1898 Frank Chance
1898 Vic Willis
1888 Hugh Duffy
1884 Tommy McCarthy
1880 Mickey Welch

Group 4 - not eligible
HOM ranking of 12 "Merit only" players

(6 "Fame only" players)
Andy Cooper
Ray Dandridge
Leon Day
Judy Johnson
Hilton Smith
Ben Taylor

All six played in the Negro Leagues. Perhaps Addie Joss should be here rather than in Group 3. He played in nine major league seasons only, 1902-1910. If he were not in the Hall of Fame now, he would not be eligible for nomination to the pre-1943 veterans committee ballot.

On the other side of the ledger Group 4 comprises six Negro Leagues players, four early players, Joe Jackson and Pete Rose.

Hey guys - we made the big time! The Joe Posnanski article referenced above by Paul can be found on Sports Illustrated's website. http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/writers/joe_posnanski/12/29/hall.of.merit/index.html

did anyone else find it funny that they put a Roger Maris picture on considering he never got a vote here?

That almost gets me to follow the link!

better Maris than Morris
better than Johnny Vandermeer or Johnny Sain, too, but Yankees
Johnny Murphy and "Joe D" would be fitting.

Here is the revised Halls of Merit and Fame comparative count. See #33 for lists and links.
181 players honored by both halls, including five Cooperstown managers or pioneers & executives
56 "Fame only" players: Hall of Fame members classified as "Players" who are not in the Hall of Merit
59 "Merit only" players: Hall of Merit members who are not in the Hall of Fame

Group 1 - Still Under BBWAA Jurisdiction [for 2010]
(1 "Fame only" player)
(12 "Merit only" players) => 14 after HOM election of Larkin, Alomar and Martinez; HOF election of Dawson

Group 2 - Hall of Fame players jurisdiction
(10 "Fame only" players)
(12 "Merit only" players) => 13 after HOM election of Reggie Smith

Group 3 - "Pre-1943" Veterans Committee jurisdiction
(39 "Fame only" players)
(21 "Merit only" players) => 20 after HOF election of Joe Gordon

Group 4 - not eligible
(6 "Fame only" players)
(12 "Merit only" players)

(trivia alert) Here is a list of very dry droughts by fielding position:
zero major league fielding games by any Hall of Merit member (1871-1999)

1894-95, 98-99, 1916-21 - catcher

1945 - catcher, 2b, cf

1969 - ss

1995 - cf

1996, starting pitcher

1994-99 - catcher

Obviously the 1990's ones will fill, and 1945 is because of the war. So it's just the old-time catchers and SS in 1969--although hopefully my campaign for Dagoberto Campaneris will change that.