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Monday, March 16, 2009

Robin Ventura

Eligible in 2010.

John (You Can Call Me Grandma) Murphy Posted: March 16, 2009 at 12:37 PM | 29 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
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   1. John (You Can Call Me Grandma) Murphy Posted: March 16, 2009 at 01:02 PM (#3104424)
Holy grand-slam single, Batman!
   2. DL from MN Posted: March 16, 2009 at 03:19 PM (#3104579)
Lands in the off-ballot 3B glut in the mix with Cey, Elliott, Bell and ahead of Bando, Traynor. A little more bat and a little less glove than Buddy Bell.
   3. Home Run Teal & Black Black Black Gone! Posted: March 16, 2009 at 03:40 PM (#3104602)
HOM lurker; no chance for Ventura, right? I mean, nobody feared him.

Especially not Nolan Ryan.
   4. Dewey, Soupuss Not Doomed to Succeed Posted: March 16, 2009 at 03:42 PM (#3104606)
Poor Robin Ventura.

Good hitter, good defensive player, by all accounts a really nice guy, but all anyone will ever remember is his "fight" with Nolan Ryan.
   5. zack Posted: March 16, 2009 at 03:45 PM (#3104610)
And the grand slams.
   6. Cowboy Popup Posted: March 16, 2009 at 03:47 PM (#3104616)
I'll always remember him jumping on the rolled up tarp in Tampa to catch that pop-up. That was awesome. His Piazza baserunning impression is also immortal in my mind.
   7. SoSH U at work Posted: March 16, 2009 at 03:49 PM (#3104619)
The first thing I'll remember is the 18 grand slams (plus the bases-loaded single), a remarkable figure for a guy with fewer than 300 career homers.

Then I'll remember the fight.
   8. Shooty Survived the Shutdown of '14! Posted: March 16, 2009 at 03:57 PM (#3104631)
I'll actually remember him for his 58 game hitting streak at Okie State. That was the first I'd heard of him.
   9. RJ in TO Posted: March 16, 2009 at 04:00 PM (#3104636)
I'll actually remember him for his 58 game hitting streak at Okie State. That was the first I'd heard of him.

I'll remember him for (apart from the previously mentioned pummeling suffered at the hands of Nolan Ryan) his 0 for 41 rookie slump.
   10. David Concepcion de la Desviacion Estandar (Dan R) Posted: March 17, 2009 at 01:27 AM (#3105172)
Very underrated--one of the top-fielding 3B evar, and a very strong hitter; he gets my retroactive 1999 NL MVP vote--but not quite HoM material. Nettles only barely got in, and he had 4 full seasons' worth of play on Ventura.
   11. JoeC Posted: March 17, 2009 at 02:06 AM (#3105196)
I'll remember him for many, many things, but first for this game. Some of us were still going to bed with a transistor radio under our pillows even into the 90's....
   12. Paul Wendt Posted: March 19, 2009 at 04:14 AM (#3108085)
I remember him for his one-ninth share in nine homeruns by people whose names begin 'T' and 'V': Thomas, Tartabull, Ventura, Vaughn and Valentin (three by Frank Thomas, two each by Mo Vaughn and John Valentin).
   13. Gold Star - just Gold Star Posted: March 19, 2009 at 04:22 AM (#3108093)
I'll always remember Robin for this game, which was one of the most emotional for the Dodgers in a long while. It was two days after the Lo Duca-Mota/Penny-Choi trade, and the night before, the team had lost with Darren Dreifort as set-up man.
   14. DCW3 Posted: March 21, 2009 at 10:04 PM (#3110064)
I'll remember him for many, many things, but first for this game. Some of us were still going to bed with a transistor radio under our pillows even into the 90's....

Hey, I was at that game. Only game I've ever been to in Chicago.
   15. TVerik, the gum-snappin' hairdresser Posted: March 21, 2009 at 10:07 PM (#3110067)
I'm still a little bit stunned that the Yankees managed to trade him for a few semi-useful parts to the Dodgers.
   16. Jeff K. Posted: March 21, 2009 at 10:18 PM (#3110070)
Yeah, Ventura is the prime example of a guy I looked at near the end of his career and said \"####, I really didn't give him the credit he was due." He wouldn't be an embarrassment to the Hall, not that he should or will (sans steroid nonsense) go in. But still, if you had told me in 2000 that I'd say that now, I'd have thought you were funnin' me.
   17. Ray (RDP) Posted: March 21, 2009 at 10:25 PM (#3110075)
Very good player, but comes up a bit short on offense for the HoM. Had he gotten in a few hundred more games, he'd be a really tough case.
   18. David Concepcion de la Desviacion Estandar (Dan R) Posted: March 22, 2009 at 02:38 AM (#3110265)
Had he gotten in a few hundred more games, he'dve been Graig Nettles.
   19. AROM Posted: March 22, 2009 at 03:59 AM (#3110361)
57.6 wins above replacement. It just depends where you draw the line on him. I've got him a bit below Darrel Evans, a bit above Jimmy Wynn, 6 wins below Nettles. He's also slightly behind other 3B Buddy Bell and Sal Bando.
   20. Paul Wendt Posted: October 13, 2009 at 04:14 AM (#3350631)
Are you the author Sean Smith?

I see that WAR rates Nettles, (Killebrew), (Allen), Bell, and Bando all tied up at 61, rounding to the nearest win. From 58 down to 50 covers Boyer, Rolen, Evans, Ventura, Hack, Collins, Elliott, Cey, Leach, and (Perez). Those 15 players all rank 98 to 165 among "position players"; the thirdbasemen ahead of them seem to be Schmidt, Matthews, Boggs, Brett, (Rose), (Molitor), Chipper Jones, Brooks Robinson, (Edgar), Santo, and Baker. Here I've tried to name all the part-career 3b who moved to easier roles but none of the catchers and shortstops who moved to third.

Brooks Robinson and Heinie Groh seem to be the big disagreements with Hall of Merit ranking, passing over blackball and the early days.
   21. Howie Menckel Posted: November 10, 2009 at 04:40 AM (#3383738)
I've been a big fan of Bob Elliott, who is 124 OPS+ in 8190 PA (did play every day thru the war-ravaged NL 1943-45...).

Ventura is 114 OPS+ 8271 PA.

Elliott split his time between 3B and OF, but I remember a poster showing some evidence that it looks as if Elliott was versatile so you could put him where you needed him. Ventura, of course, has more defensive value regardless.

Ron Cey, a guy who hovers at the edge of ballot for me, is 121 in 8344 PA, and I like his defense better than the "Penguin" name suggests but not as much as Ventura's.

Buddy Bell, 109 in 10000 PA, also a good glove and lasted longer but not quite the hitter overall.

Ken Boyer staggered into the bottom of the HOM at 116 OPS+ and 7455 PA, with a prime argument.

Throw in in-season durability, league quality, etc, and toss 'em all in a blender. It's tough....
   22. Jeff K. Posted: November 10, 2009 at 05:24 AM (#3383770)
Had he gotten in a few hundred more games, he'dve been Graig Nettles.

But then who would Graig Nettles be?
   23. asinwreck Posted: November 10, 2009 at 05:32 AM (#3383773)
I will remember Ventura for hitting grand slams. And for getting picked up like a doll by Frank Thomas after one blast.
   24. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: November 10, 2009 at 06:13 AM (#3383803)
But then who would Graig Nettles be?

According to the internet, Craig Nettles.
   25. Avoid running at all times.-S. Paige Posted: November 10, 2009 at 06:35 AM (#3383815)
I remember Ventura had a remarkable college baseball career. He had a hitting streak record during his freshmen year. For some reason I remember when he was drafted and his first year in the majors. There was quite a bit of hype around him.
   26. Jeff K. Posted: November 10, 2009 at 07:10 AM (#3383826)
Ventura was on Team USA '88 (Seoul?) as well, wasn't he? With Ben McDonald, Jeff Juden, Frank Thomas, Jim Abbott?
   27. DL from MN Posted: November 10, 2009 at 04:23 PM (#3383993)
He went straight to AA, then to a fall callup in the majors. I don't think there's minor league credit here.
   28. AJMcCringleberry Posted: November 10, 2009 at 04:54 PM (#3384021)
I'm giving him a 20 point bonus for the Grand Slam Single which will put him first on my ballot. Ok, I'm kidding, but I love Ventura. I nearly hit the ceiling when he hit that shot.

He'll be close, but most likely off ballot.
   29. Jeff K. Posted: November 11, 2009 at 12:01 AM (#3384415)
To answer my own question, Ventura/McDonald/Abbott were all members of the '88 Olympic team, Thomas was on Team USA in 1987 but not in the Olympics, and Juden was never on team USA.

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