Wednesday, December 12, 2012
2013 Results: Bonds, Clemens, Piazza and Biggio are elected to the Hall of Merit!
(bbtf)
Barry Bonds, Roger Clemens, Mike Piazza and Craig Biggio have been elected to the Hall of Merit!
The timing for our first year electing 4 candidates could not have worked out better, since class of 2013 is the strongest in terms of electees that we’ve ever had. The top of the 1934 ballot included Ty Cobb, Tris Speaker, Eddie Collins, Pop Lloyd, Smokey Joe Williams and Cristobal Torriente, but only 2 were elected.
Bonds and Clemens were each unanimous at 1 and 2. I believe that’s the first ...
Read More...
Reader Comments and Retorts
Go to end of page
Statements posted here are those of our readers and do not represent the BaseballThinkFactory. Names are provided by the poster and are not verified. We ask that posters follow our submission policy. Please report any inappropriate comments.
Page 1 of 5 pages
1 2 3 4 5 >I don't believe it matters on any cosmic scale, but if Dominicans don't count as black, then I'm not sure why a Puerto Rican would. In this case, both are of some African descent - but that would wreck the argument.
.(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address)
Ty Wigginton is not HOF-worthy.
At the moment, CC's Hall resume is more complete than Fielder's. Howard's probably as close or closer (based on his existing support within the BBWAA).
That is one bizarre FA.
What about Willie Bloomquist? The scrappy reputation should have given it away, but I was stunned the first time when I discovered he was a caucasian feller.
"Council fills planning and zoning vacancy, housing still has pair of vacancies"
and
"Vote for the Cutest Baby"
The article was actually provided by Gatehouse News Service, which appears to offer entire prefab newspaper sections.
The actual author works for the Hannibal, Mo., Courier-Post.
Anyway, my point is that this isn't from a major news source and probably isn't worth the time it takes to disagree with it. And it definitely isn't worth the time I spent determining exactly where it came from.
I like statistics as much as the next guy, but...black players are a minority (in MLB), so it makes sense that there aren't as many in the HoF. Besides, I think that Negro League induction thing (sorry, wikipedia is down) was a bit much.
Well I'd say this man is the finest writer to ever come out of Hannibal, Missouri.
Am I missing something, or does TFE endorse at least an informal, race-based quota system?
And, Willie McGee?
"Well I'd say this man is the finest writer to ever come out of Hannibal, Missouri."
well played....
Is there a large black population of Bloomquists of which I'm unaware?
I don't know there's a large any kind of large population of Bloomquists. But Willies have tended to be less me in hue.
And I'm not really claiming my assumption was logical, just that it existed.
Maybe he really meant Khalil Greene.
*Of the ball players mentioned, Raines is worthy.
Even Willie's confused.
Well I'd say this man is the finest writer to ever come out of Hannibal, Missouri.
Yeah, that Clemens guy was just a flash in the pan.
Hey, we've already seen people say it won't look good if no steroid users go in.
Ugh, Willie McGee?
Yes, we need to start conserving our players or the Soviets will win!
Having said that, this section:
...says more about the writer than the state of baseball.
Not to mention Jim Rice and Barry Larkin are recent inductees.
Hrm...nuclear holocaust vs meaningless statistic...I'll be honest with you I could use a good nuclear holocaust...No, I think I'll just go with the meaningless statistic
not to mention Dawson, Rickey, Gwynn, Murray, Ozzie, Winfield, and Puckett
While still ignoring two other fellas in the same time frame.
*Is it two? You don't realize how much you rely on Wikipedia until it isn't there
CC Sabathia
CC Sabathia
I hadn't really thought of it but Fielder and CC, for sure. I think Jimmy Rollins has an outside shot. Is Derek Jeter not black? Or, to paraphrase Archer, is he just "blackish?". And of course, a guy like Jeter is almost Faulknerian in the illustration of just how ###### up we are when thinking about race.
I wish I had thought of it. (-:
Neither of them is hit by the bus, though CC's closing in on that status.
Howard could put one together (more Rice-like than Murrayian, based on his love from the BBWAA), as could Rollins. And Justin Upton and Matt Kemp have HoF caliber-talent, though both are obviously miles away from the distinction.
Season 3 starts Thursday!
So, "gray"?
Got to be at least 50.
In addition to the ones mentioned so far in the comments, we've got Griffey and Frank Thomas coming up who should be certain steroids-free first ballot guys.
Lofton, Sheffield, Reggie Smith, Dick Allen, Willie Randolph, Jimmy Wynn, Willie Davis...
Barry Bonds and Ken Griffey Jr. could go in the hall and with their dads...
Chet Lemon, Vada Pinson, Ellis Burks, Mike Cameron, Darryl Strawberry, George Foster, Devon White, Ken Singleton, Amos Otis, Eric Davis, Cecil Cooper, Ray Durham, Dusty Baker, Bill Madlock, Dave Parker, Harold Baines...
Harder to find pitchers, but Dwight Gooden is there, and Vida Blue to go with Lee Smith.
He's got a chance as long as he keeps putting big seasons up. There aren't many active players who are HOF locks. Pujols, Jeter, Chipper, Halladay, Rivera, and Thome are about it. A-Roid has the obvious problem. Everyone else I can find some reason to expect the writers not to vote for him. Some more than that will obviously put up HOF numbers and some others will get voted in for whatever reason, but I only see 6 locks right now among active players.
The writers' voting patterns are fairly easy to figure out. They boil down to shape of performance -- things like wins and RBIs vs. ERA+ or OPS+ -- rather than race of the player.
Depending on whether he's considered active, I think Vlad is close to a lock. Might take him a few years, but I can't see him getting left out.
Even if/when Halladay gets his 200th win, he's going to be a bit of a hard sell because until a year or two ago, he never really "felt like" a Hall of Famer. It's his late-career peak that's pushing him over the top, and late-career peaks are often ignored by the Hall. Halladay is lucky he threw that playoff no-no - I think that was the first time that sportswriters really took notice of him as an all-time great.
Hopefully, of course, Halladay cranks out another 4-8 years of good pitching and makes all this academic.
EDIT: And I agree with SoSH that Vlad is a lock, barring steroid revelations. His WAR figures are low for a HoFer because of poor ratings for his baserunning and defense, but he's perceived as an excellent all-around player. Plus, those batting averages.
It's more about "African American" than "black" - the two terms aren't really interchangeable, even though they're often used that way. Puerto Rico is a US territory whose residents are US citizens, and the Dominican Republic is not.
I.e. Damaso Marte is not an "African-American" not because his skin is insufficiently dusky, but rather because he's not an American of any sort.
Which half of Jeter can't go to his left, the black half or the right half?
I.e. Damaso Marte is not an "African-American" not because his skin is insufficiently dusky, but rather because he's not an American of any sort.
Right, but the only reason to worry about race at all is if you think there's some sort of discrimination going on. And, it doesn't pass the smell test to me that the white "baseball establishment" doesn't like blacks (for some unknown reason) except if the speak Spanish, and weren't born here. That's an odd sort of racism.
don't waste your time. there are too many guys here who absolutely refuse to understand that when americans of Negro descent say "african-american" it means people of african Negro descent who are born in america. the united states of america. not anywhere else. well, maybe from the canada part of america.
it is not skin color, it is ethnic heritage.
sort of like people whose religious beliefs are atheists, but they say they are "jewish" because it is their ethnicity. now folks like me who thought jewish was a religion just might could be a little startled to hear "jewish atheist" but hey, i got over it. and youse who are yelling that Black is Black need to get over it too.
i get tired of the "not Black enough" crap because some people have a little too much White/NA/Asian blood for some other peoples' prejudices
and speaking of prejudice, where is gary sheffield's name? he certainly has more business in the HOF than willie mcgee - and gary his own self ain't exactly All The Way Black
interesting that the anti steroid zealots pay no attention to fred mcgriff, who you'd think they'd pimp as an example of a Guy Who Did Things The Right Way
Page 1 of 5 pages
1 2 3 4 5 >You must be Registered and Logged In to post comments.