Go to end of page
Statements posted here are those of our readers and do not represent the BaseballThinkFactory. Names are provided by the poster and are not verified. We ask that posters follow our submission policy. Please report any inappropriate comments.
They actually got decent production from the two guys who were basically the fifth starter--a total of 25 starts at about a 100 ERA+. On the other hand they add up to 0 WAR, which I don't fully understand.
As a team, the Reds minus Nelson and Carroll had about 11% of their runs as unearned. Nelson and Carroll were at 25%, mostly because of Carroll's 44 R/32 ER. So their RA+ is probably around 89, not 100.
My perception is that since people don't can't now what someone else feels, unless you see a visible injury, people tend to think the other person is faking it (hell I think faking being hurt or sick is the first consciously dishonest act most kids commit) - and athletes are really bad- partly I think because the idea of a career sapping invisible injury scares the crap out of them, they'd prefer to think the other guy is faking it.
Personally I don't think pro athletes fake injury* or malinger** to get out of playing or to excuse poor performance, I think they are far mote likely to deny or minimize an injury, if a guy says he's hurt or sick, the odds are overwhelming that he is in fact hurt and you should take it at face value.
I don't think we can single out the Reds as the most heinous of those who imperiled pitchers' (particularly young pitchers') arms during the "Dark Ages." That was a baseball-wide phenomenon, fueled by the strike zone change. The Reds actually had fewer high-IP pitchers than just about anyone in the original time frame (just a couple of pitchers in the Top Ten in IP from 1963-69--and both of those #10).
--Pat Zachry's 128 ERA+ was the best among Reds starters and he became the ROY at age 24. He entered the rotation on May 9th and started a few times on two or three days rest.
Baseball players are no different from people who work in other walks of life. There are always people who call in sick at the drop of a hat and will create any excuse to not have to go to work.
With reduced salaries and lack of free agency, was the cost/benefit analysis just that much different in the 1970s? What did expert medical advice and procedures cost compared to a player's salary at the time?
#9 Well no. I think a lot of people carping about the babying of today's pitchers simply don't understand the state of pitcher health in the 60s.
How many pitchers have come back from a major shoulder injury to keep pitching for years afterward?
A list of late 60s/early 70s pitchers who had long and successful careers free of major injuries doesn't tell us anything about the overall state of pitcher health back then. There certainly are pitchers who debuted in the decades since who had long and successful careers free of major injuries. You have to look at how many pitchers did get hurt.
I don't think the number of pitchers getting hurt was much, or any, different in 1974 than in 2014.
Actually, they are completely different. They go through a multi-year, multi-step weeding-out process that is unbelievably good at separating wheat from chaff. The guys who "call in sick at the drop of a hat" or fold under pressure or any of the other nice-sounding-but-largely-without-substance cliches might exist, but they don't get to the majors.
Yes, every one of the Yankees was wrong about Pavano, as were all the coaches and members of the front office staff. They were all wrong. That injury to his buttocks was a real killer.
Round earth model? What does that have to do with an allegation that a player might just be jaking it. My goodness, that's such an outrageous claim.
I think it's naive to think that no athletes are capable of malingering or faking injuries.
First off, my understanding was that Nolan was mostly being second-guessed by Sparky Anderson and the front office, and not by his teammates. In contrast, Pavano was being questioned by many of his own teammates, along with the manager and the front office.
Research is showing more and more evidence that MRI diagnosis and pain frequently don't correlate. When you have a pitcher with pain you do generally find a cuff tear, bone spur, labral tear or whatever. But if you MRI a bunch of healthy pitchers as a control group you find a similar set of MRI findings.
The MRI lies every time it shows a possible injury on a player who can keep playing.
Shutting a guy down who is playing effectively in order to prevent an injury that may or may not be preventable is a very risky strategy. You could easily deprive a guy of a huge chunk of his lifetime income for no real benefit.
You must be Registered and Logged In to post comments.
Login to Join (9 members)
Page rendered in 0.6125 seconds, 54 querie(s) executed