apophasis

I'm not saying Samson is an ironic name for someone who's 5'2", but....

I am comfortable saying that Miami is not a sports town.

It's funny. The Marlins were actually 18th in attendance last year. Even though they had only half a season or so before they went all Loria and dumped everybody. That might indicate there's potential for a fanbase there.

Right now, all fans hear is whining and double-talk. Saying that the team is better off now because it has improved its farm system doesn't play at all in "win-centric" South Florida.

Show me a region of the country that isn't "win-centric" ... whatever the hell that means.

It's funny. The Marlins were actually 18th in attendance last year. Even though they had only half a season or so before they went all Loria and dumped everybody. That might indicate there's potential for a fanbase there.

Is 18th out of 30 in attendance in a year when you christen a ballpark something to be proud of? I bought tickets to two games in early September and paid less than $10 per seat on StubHub for field level seats.

I bought tickets to two games in early September and paid less than $10 per seat on StubHub for field level seats.

Would it have been that much more in most other ballparks, weren't there plenty of cheap seats in NYS available last year?

Would it have been that much more in most other ballparks, weren't there plenty of cheap seats in NYS available last year?

Sure, but NYS and Citi opened in '09.

BREAKING: 09:45 @joecapMARLINS: No lie: #Marlins president David Samson and Jose Reyes shared a hug http://shar.es/eG0Pz via @sharethis

Anti-disingenuosity fevah!

Show me a region of the country that isn't "win-centric" ... whatever the hell that means.

Wrigley Field.

It's funny. The Marlins were actually 18th in attendance last year. Even though they had only half a season or so before they went all Loria and dumped everybody. That might indicate there's potential for a fanbase there.

The tickets for the second half were already sold by the dumpoff. If only MLB reported actual attendance instead of inflating the count with no-shows, we'd see the reality here.

And yes, 18th in a new stadium year is downright horribly embarrassing.

What's the usual boost in attendance due to a stadium? The Marlins went from perennial bottom-three to 18th, a nine-spot jump at worst.

And yes, 18th in a new stadium year is downright horribly embarrassing.

I agree, but not based on the raw ranking, but based upon the history, the Marlins have proven that they can get 3mil in attendance, the fact that a new stadium, and a team that generated positive reviews going into the season could only muster 2.2mil has to be disappointing. If they get to 3mil, they might have broke into the top 10 in attendance.

Show me a region of the country that isn't "win-centric" ... whatever the hell that means.

I suppose the Air Canada Centre isn't part of the country. Neither was Maple Leaf Gardens, when they sold out every game they played through the 70s, 80s, and 90s without a cup to show for it.

I suppose the Air Canada Centre isn't part of the country. Neither was Maple Leaf Gardens, when they sold out every game they played through the 70s, 80s, and 90s without a cup to show for it.

Everybody is probably scared of being the one who gives up their season ticket just before the Maple Leafs turns good and win it all.

What's the usual boost in attendance due to a stadium? The Marlins went from perennial bottom-three to 18th, a nine-spot jump at worst.

Looking at teams with new stadiums from 2000 to now, leaving out the New York teams and the Cardinals, with rough numbers:

Houston +300K
Nationals +350K
Tigers +400K
Reds +500K
Marlins +700K
Pirates +700K
Twins +800K
Phillies +950K
Padres +1 million
Brewers +1.3 million
Giants +1.3 million

The Marlins gains, in absolute numbers, were at about the median. The big thing is that they started from a very low base.

That Padres team improved by 23 wins, and Giants were coming off of a 97-win season and moved out of a famously unpleasant ballpark. The real outlier are the Brewers. The team declined by 5 wins (73 to 68), and yet they had a huge attendance gain.

apophasis

Not to be confused with Apophis.

I'm not saying Loria's more of a crook than Madoff.

The Marlins had the largest attendance increase in MLB last season, 8628 per game, and I think they were up around 11,000 per game when they gave up on the season. Loria doesn't seem to understand that building the fan base is a multi-year process that gets short circuited when he pulls the plug.

Show me a region of the country that isn't "win-centric" ... whatever the hell that means.

Wrigley Field.

To a point. Even Cubs fans aren't that gullible.

I've noted that I've been making pilgrimages to Wrigley most summers since 1986, because 750 miles isn't so far.

I think it was about 5 years ago that a few fans had placards in the bleachers that said something like "This is our year."

To which even the 20-somethings asked, "our year for WHAT?"