I know Young is bad, but it's only $750K.

Cloudy with a chance of ugly.

I knew Houston was moving to the AL and needed to get a DH, but I didn't know Philly was as well.

I think this is a good deal for the Phils, in all honesty. He can certainly be worth the $750K. Filler is filler, but he's a tick above average for "filler", no?

I will be happy if Young outproduces each Mets outfielder this season. Not that long a shot actually.

As soon as I typed "st", "stupid ideas" popped up. And yet there don't seem to be any other articles in the "stupid ideas" newsbeat.

What are the Phillies going to do with all these outfielders? Each of them has only one skill, as Edmundo has pointed out in two threads already. And why does Delmon Young look as old as Juan Pierre?

Young is only 27. Who in the world imagined this would be his first free agent contract, considering his top 3 prospect rank by Baseball America each year from 2004-2007?

Until the fates prove it's not happening, every time Delmon Young comes up I will announce that he is on an march to 2000 hits and very little value. He's got to be a bit worried that he's gotten such a mediocre contract, especially after his big ALCS and World Series,, so he's working hard. This is his age-27 year. He's primed to have a (relatively) big year -- a .295 average, a SLG-heavy OPS+ in the 110 range, 90-100 RBIs. That's going to get him a three-year deal somewhere stupid, and at the end of that he'll be 31 with 1600 hits and 4 WAR. By then he'll be a crafty veteran who overcame his earlier slackitude (so the story will go), which will mean several years as a part-timer and the 400 extra hits he needs. It's going to happen!

#7 AAA at 19. But still a .303 OBP is something of a red flag.

the phillies need offense, and there is a not-insignificant possibility that young could be a really good hitter for them.

I guess buying low is usually good, and this is certainly that.

With Mayberry, Revere, Young, Rollins, Howard and Brown the Phillies could have a lineup of six black guys (one of them DH). That seems notable in this day and age.

Worst OPS ever, 2000 career hits

1. Larry Bowa - 71
2. Omar Vizquel - 82
2. Luis Aparacio - 82
2. Rabbit Maranville - 82
5. Orlando Cabrera - 84
5. Bill Mazeroski - 84
7. Juan Pierre - 85
7. Frank White - 85
9. Ozzie Smith - 87
10.Garry Templeton - 87

The worst corner outfielder is BJ Surhoff at 98, and he spent a lot of time at catcher. Next is Garret Anderson at 102.

I believe in you Delmon.

I thought he was much older then this, had no idea he is younger then me.

Filler is filler, but he's a tick above average for "filler", no?

Nope. Young has been above replacement level for only one season in his career. He can't field, he doesn't run, and he hits like a middle infielder. Darin Ruf would surely, surely deserve playing time ahead of him, as would a number of other players in the Phillies system whom I've never heard of. Young is terrible.

Now, Young was kind of good for a season once, and he was once a great prospect. But based on his actual results, Young gives you nothing that a couple dozen guys in AA and AAA can't provide without the baggage and at half the price.

#14 - Thanks, I was genuinely curious. Seemed decent enough, but I hear they may be considering playing him RF regularly. Ouch.

I retract. This is awful!

#13 His age is what made him such a hot prospect. Pretty clearly could handle AA at 19.

Even here there was a warning sign. Only 20 UIBB in 330 AB. Still, you can live with a line of .336/.386/.582 and 25 SB in 84 games.

And look what Craig just posted

I have no sources on this other than my eyeballs, but Delmon Young looks like a guy who has totally let himself go physically. He looks 35 because he's got a fat gut and a couple chins. His "five tool" talent has reduced down to maybe two or three over his career.

I must have been mis-rememberizing some tweets from a week or so ago that the Nationals had (inexplicably) signed Young to a minor league deal.

I can't tell you how happy I am to be wrong about this!

Was Delmon Young a legitimate #1 overall talent when he was drafted, or was he never really that good?

#18 - That must run in the family. His big brother, Dmitri the diabetic, was seen in the off-season leading to his final stint with the Nats imbibing heartily in alcoholic beverages. I understand that this is a big no-no for his diabetic condition. Dmitri definitely went from "almost svelt" the prior season to looking like Santa Claus by the following season.

Was Delmon Young a legitimate #1 overall talent when he was drafted, or was he never really that good?

Young's minor league track record is fantastic, at least to start. He debuted straight into the Sally League at 18 and hit 388/538. The Rays jumped him a level to AA, where he hit 386/582 in a half-season at 19 before being promoted to AAA. His promotion to AAA perhaps signals the birth of the statistical Delm_n we all know, as he hit only 303/447. Still, for the 19-year-old in the International League, that's not bad. Room to grow. He was better the next year (341/474). Then came the major league career.

#18 - That must run in the family. His big brother, Dmitri the diabetic, was seen in the off-season leading to his final stint with the Nats imbibing heartily in alcoholic beverages. I understand that this is a big no-no for his diabetic condition. Dmitri definitely went from "almost svelt" the prior season to looking like Santa Claus by the following season.

In fairness to Dmitri, he got that #### pretty well under control once he was out of baseball.

Better late than never.

This signing gets even dumber:

Amaro: Hope is Young will be everyday RF. Then says he may start year on DL.

Hope is that Young starts season on DL.

The 2002-04 #1 picks have combined for 0.3 WAR. Ouch!

My favorite "boy, he got fat story" about any baseball player still remains Kevin Mitchell late in his career (Indians, I think?) breaking a training bike because he tried to pop a wheelie on it.

I must have been mis-rememberizing some tweets from a week or so ago that the Nationals had (inexplicably) signed Young to a minor league deal.

I think they signed Delwyn Young.

Was Delmon Young a legitimate #1 overall talent when he was drafted, or was he never really that good?

He was 9th in OPS in the Sallie League at age 18, everyone above him was older, just 2 other teens, Milledge and Ian Stewart
2 other guys whose eventual MLB performances were disappointing.

Then the next year he was awesome in AA at age 19, second in OPS in the Southern League, right behind Hermida...

I think that prospects are usually judged relative to their "cohort," but that the quality of cohorts can vary- the best guy in one year's cohort may be no better than another year's 5th through 10th...
I think Delmon Young at the time may have been the best guy in his cohort, but maybe just due to random fluctuation, his cohort just happened to be unusually weak, something not evident until one guy after another in that cohort failed to meet expectations-

looking at the Sallie League and Southern League leaders for young guys with production comparable to Young you get a lot of that, Milledge, Stewart, Hermida, Chris Young (hitter not pitcher)
plus you see that he never really developed from the day he entered pro ball, K/BB stagnant, never developed any power beyond what he came into the Sallie League with.

If he'd played MLB from age 18, I'm sure his stat lines would look just like most of his MLB career- he was almost an MLB caliber hitter at ages 18/19, trouble is that for most of his MLB career he's been just that, almost an MLB caliber hitter

I think Delmon Young at the time may have been the best guy in his cohort, but maybe just due to random fluctuation, his cohort just happened to be unusually weak, something not evident until one guy after another in that cohort failed to meet expectations-

Did it? The BA 2006 list that Young topped includes Justin Upton (#2), Justin Verlander (#8), Matt Cain (#10) and Prince Fielder (#11).

The 2002 top 10 has a bunch of duds as well (Burroughs #4, Cruz #6, Henson #9). Just eyeballing, 2006 looks pretty normal to me.

_elm_n is a horrendously terrible player. He has two-skills: a strong, accurate arm AND the ability to hit left-handed pitchers who can't throw faster than 86 mph. He makes Raul Ibanez look like Geraldo Parra in the corner outfield as he takes terrible routes and avoids the warning track like the plague. Perhaps the only redeeming thing about _elm_n from his time in MN is that I had multiple friends whose girlfriends bumped into him at Twilight movies. As in, he saw the same Twilight movie more than once. For some reason, that completely cracks me up.

Maybe he was there to prey on teenage girls, which would be less funny.

Who in the world imagined this would be his first free agent contract, considering his top 3 prospect rank by Baseball America each year from 2004-2007?

I have been wrong on many many prospects as we all have, but I didn't think Young was going to be much in the majors. Too much hackin'. I was surprised everyone one was so willing to look past that, but he had a shiny batting average and Baseball America was still trying to fight the OBP war at the time.

Worst OPS ever, 2000 career hits

1. Larry Bowa - 71
2. Omar Vizquel - 82
2. Luis Aparacio - 82
2. Rabbit Maranville - 82
5. Orlando Cabrera - 84
5. Bill Mazeroski - 84
7. Juan Pierre - 85
7. Frank White - 85
9. Ozzie Smith - 87
10.Garry Templeton - 87

A little respect - there are 4 Hall of Famers on that list. Hopefully, only 4.

Amaro: Hope is Young will be everyday RF.

2000 hits. I'm tellin ya!

I have no sources on this other than my eyeballs, but Delmon Young looks like a guy who has totally let himself go physically. He looks 35 because he's got a fat gut and a couple chins.

This is part of what makes me hopeful for him having a long and unproductive career. He's still young enough to be scared straight and become a near-cromulent ballplayer, but not young enough to actually reclaim some of the tools lost to time and Big Macs.

Worst OPS ever, 2000 career hits

That list is missing a few, for some reason. This is everyone with 50% of his time at RF/LF/1B/DH with 2000 hits and an OPS+ of 105 or lower.



Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Play Index Tool Used
Generated 1/22/2013.

EDIT: I can see Young as having the second half of Ruben Sierra's career -- 254/305/428 and 992 hits. That leaves Delmon 53 hits short of 2000. Give him a little more average and fewer walks and he gets very close to the magic number.

The 2002 World junior Championships were in my hometown (Sherbrooke, Quebec) and the US team was loaded with prospects that were about to be drafted, with Young and Milledge the two stars. Looking back now, that team was loaded with future busts: among hitters, Ian Stewart and Jarrod Saltalamacchia are the best. Chris Lubanski was a major bust. Among pitchers, Chad Billingsley and Ian Kennedy did well, but Jeff Allison is a terrible story.

As far as I know, only two other players reached the majors, both from Canada: Adam Loewen and Chris Leroux. Yulieski Gourriel is very good in Cuba I believe. Japan and DR did not participate. I don't recognize any names from South Korea, Venezuela and Panama.

and at the end of that he'll be 31 with 1600 hits and 4 WAR. By then he'll be a crafty veteran who overcame his earlier slackitude (so the story will go), which will mean several years as a part-timer and the 400 extra hits he needs. It's going to happen!

The gold standard for this is Doc Cramer: 2700 hits, 4.2 WAR. The next lowest WAR for 2000+ hits is Charlie Grim with 2300 hits and 10.6 WAR. The next worst WAR for 2700+ its is 11.8 for Bill Buckner

This is not so bad. It's not like the signed Jeremy Hermida for $4M. They are taking a flier on a guy who hasn't lived up to expectations and basically paying league minimum. Good gamble.

It's an exaggeration - but not much of one, IMO - to say that what happened to Delmon Young was Elijah Dukes.

Young and Dukes were teammates at Charleston in 2004 until Dukes was promoted (somewhat mysteriously, since he wasn't playing particularly well) to Bakersfield in mid-season. In 2005 they were teammates again at Montgomery; this time it was Young that was promoted in mid-season and Dukes who stayed behind even though Dukes was probably deserving of a promotion as well, certainly more so than a year earlier. In 2006 Young and Dukes were together again in Durham, along with BJ Upton, and on the field the three of them were (a) inseparable and (b) completely separated from the rest of their teammates. I attended about 30 games in Durham that year and it was obvious that Young, Dukes, and Upton were going their own way. All three of them had off-the-field issues in Durham (and that's not even considering what happened on the field with Young). It got to a point where at the end of the year Bulls' management reportedly insisted on a housecleaning and assurances that they'd never have that type of situation again; the Rays nearly lost the affiliation.

-- MWE

Amaro: Hope is Young will be everyday RF. Then says he may start year on DL.

And some people keep defending Amaro.

I don't care if he signed for a ham sandwich and offered to wash Amaro's car 3 times a week. Starting Young in RF every day is asinine and thought process that led to this decision is/was asinine. I hope he gets 500 ABs this year so I can read a steady stream of articles about how his veteran presence helped stabilize the youngsters in the OF... all the while seeing only passing mention of his .290 OBP.

Asinine.

My favorite "boy, he got fat story" about any baseball player still remains Kevin Mitchell late in his career (Indians, I think?)

Your story checks out.

_elm_n is a horrendously terrible player.

I scanned the first comments hoping someone would use this name. Too bad it didn't catch on here, I find it funny. Yes, its just a ripoff of _ason Kidd, but it works.

Horrendously terrible, but still preferred over Brown, who is a monumental bust. And sadly, Young would be, by far, the best outfielder on the Mets.

I don't care if he signed for a ham sandwich and offered to wash Amaro's car 3 times a week.

Delmon Young just earned a spot on my ballclub!

Young would be, by far, the best outfielder on the Mets.

Lucas Duda has more offensive upside and is as bad on D. I'd prefer him to Delmon.

Benji, I want to see Brown healthy and given a real shot before I declare him a bust. If there was ever a year to find out, it's this one, but Amaro is behaving as though he agrees with you.

We might see the all under-100 OPS+ OF this year, with cumulative below average defense. Uncle Chollie has not shown the ability to maximize the talents of limited players. This team is the antithesis of a throw 'em out there and let 'em play team that UC handles best.

a strong, accurate arm

I saw him throw his ten-bouncer in the playoffs last year and I think the arm is shot now. He's a RH pinch hitter.

We might see the all under-100 OPS+ OF this year, with cumulative below average defense. Uncle Chollie has not shown the ability to maximize the talents of limited players. This team is the antithesis of a throw 'em out there and let 'em play team that UC handles best.

Who was the manager who won all those games with the Tigers platooning at almost every position? Can we get him in as a coach specializing in playing time optimization?

Oh, it was Billy Martin. Never mind.

I saw him throw his ten-bouncer in the playoffs last year and I think the arm is shot now. He's a RH pinch hitter.

"Delmon Young, Zero Tool Player"

Delmon Young has played in the majors for 5 1/2 seasons. Career totals:

FanGraphs: 0.8 WAR
B-R: -3.1 WAR