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    • Friday, May 17, 2013

    Pregame: Hurdle discusses the role of pitcher / hitter matchups in lineup construction - Bucs Dugout

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    posted 6 days ago by Jim Furtado to clint hurdle, defense, pirates, sabermetrics  |  2 comment(s)

    Good stuff. Take a look.

    Reader Comments and Retorts

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    Statements posted here are those of our readers and do not represent the BaseballThinkFactory. Names are provided by the poster and are not verified. We ask that posters follow our submission policy. Please report any inappropriate comments.

    1. Mike Emeigh  posted on November 29, 2012 at 09:58 PM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    This is better than 3/$25M, but not all that much.

    I don't see what Martin brings that the Pirates don't already have in McKenry.

    -- MWE
    2. SG posted on November 29, 2012 at 10:01 PM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    It really depends how much stock you put in the pitch-framing work that shows Martin being one of the best in MLB. That may add a win or so to his value beyond the traditional offense and defense.

    I wouldn't have signed him for more than one year if I was the Yankees, but I'm surprised he settled for two years so quickly. He probably could have gotten more if he waited, although I guess his agent would know that better than me.
    3. Jose Can Still Seabiscuit posted on November 29, 2012 at 10:06 PM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    I don't know if the numbers back it up but Martin seemed to have an awful lot of big hits forthe Yankees the last two years.
    4. Matt Clement of Alexandria posted on November 29, 2012 at 10:26 PM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    I don't see what Martin brings that the Pirates don't already have in McKenry.
    Thousands of PAs of major league cromulence as opposed to 250, I think is the big one. If McKenry's as good as he played in a half season in Pittsburgh, this is dumb. If McKenry is the future backup C that his minor league numbers projected, then the Pirates got the major league catcher they were lacking.
    5. charityslave is thinking about baseball posted on November 29, 2012 at 10:28 PM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    Alright! They're reuniting the Martin/Burnett battery.
    6. The District Attorney posted on November 29, 2012 at 10:40 PM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    So who's catching for the Yanks?
    7. Crispix Attacks 2: Swag Airlines posted on November 29, 2012 at 10:46 PM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    Rod Barajas is available.
    8. bookbook posted on November 29, 2012 at 10:46 PM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    Olivo is available.
    9. Tom Cervo, backup catcher posted on November 29, 2012 at 10:47 PM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    Alfonso Soriano is available.
    10. Crispix Attacks 2: Swag Airlines posted on November 29, 2012 at 10:49 PM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    Koyie Hill is available.
    11. Srul Itza posted on November 29, 2012 at 10:51 PM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    Time for Jorge to make a comeback. If Pettitte can take a year off and come back, why not him?
    12. Nasty Nate posted on November 29, 2012 at 10:51 PM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    So who's catching for the Yanks?


    A Jo Girardi and Mo Rivera platoon natch
    13. Srul Itza posted on November 29, 2012 at 10:56 PM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    Girardi as player-coach would be AWESOME!
    14. PreservedFish posted on November 29, 2012 at 11:01 PM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    I think Jeter slots in perfectly at catcher.
    15. Mike Emeigh  posted on November 29, 2012 at 11:08 PM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    If McKenry's as good as he played in a half season in Pittsburgh, this is dumb.


    Or if Martin was as bad as he was for five months in New York in 2012 - or if he's as bad as he was against everyone but the Rays and Red Sox. And I think both of those are close to the truth about where Russell Martin is right now. I'd rather they'd have signed David Ross to the deal he got from the Red Sox.

    -- MWE
    16. The Yankee Clapper posted on November 29, 2012 at 11:11 PM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    Some combination of Francisco Cervelli, Chris Stewart & Austine Romine wouldn't be the worst catching in the league (said without actually researching) but the Yanks will probably try to improve a bit, although the free agent options don't appear that great.
    17. Russlan is fond of Dillon Gee posted on November 29, 2012 at 11:59 PM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    AJ Pierzynski is a free agent. He was really good last year so he's probably going to get a two or three year deal from someone.
    18. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) posted on November 30, 2012 at 12:41 AM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    Well, that sucks.
    19. PreservedFish posted on November 30, 2012 at 12:46 AM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    Or if Martin was as bad as he was for five months in New York in 2012 - or if he's as bad as he was against everyone but the Rays and Red Sox. And I think both of those are close to the truth about where Russell Martin is right now.


    Martin's last four years of OPS+ run 88, 86, 95, 92 - extremely consistent - I have no idea why you'd bother to parse his numbers out so bizarrely.
    20. Tuque  posted on November 30, 2012 at 01:17 AM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    AJ Pierzynski is phenomenally durable.
    21. Steve Balboni's Personal Trainer posted on November 30, 2012 at 01:23 AM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    Ross at his 2 yr/$6.2m salary is a better sign than this deal.
    22. YR Misses Reggie Bars posted on November 30, 2012 at 01:36 AM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    I like Martin quite a bit and am sad to see him leave the Yankees. I have no idea what the Yankees' "Plan B" is now. Austin Romine losing a year of development time is unfortunate given the opportunity in front of him.
    23. Bruce Markusen posted on November 30, 2012 at 01:43 AM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    The logical move for the Yankees would be to sign Pierzynski on a one-year deal (if he's willing) and platoon him with either Romine or Stewart. AJ can still hit, would be a good fit for Yankee Stadium, and would buy some time until Romine is ready to move into the starting role.
    24. Random Transaction Generator posted on November 30, 2012 at 02:25 AM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    The logical move for the Yankees would be to sign Pierzynski on a one-year deal


    A.J. Pierzynski on the Yankees?

    That's like a black hole for absorbing hate...
    25. Jim (jimmuscomp) posted on November 30, 2012 at 02:41 AM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    #24 - HA! Well played.
    26. Erix posted on November 30, 2012 at 02:51 AM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    So who's catching for the Yanks?


    Who else but Octavio Dotel!?
    27. Greg (U)K posted on November 30, 2012 at 05:14 AM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    So the Pirates beat out the Yankees in a bidding war. I assume because the Yankees weren't 100% determined, but still, fun to see.
    28. Flynn posted on November 30, 2012 at 05:26 AM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    Wright has signed with the Mets.
    29. Jose Can Still Seabiscuit posted on November 30, 2012 at 06:59 AM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    I'll assume Mike Napolis agent doesn't mind the fact that the Yanks have an opening at catcher.
    30. Avoid running at all times.-S. Paige posted on November 30, 2012 at 07:23 AM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    I'll assume Mike Napolis agent doesn't mind the fact that the Yanks have an opening at catcher.


    Girardi as manager means the Yanks are going to go defense-first at that position for as long as he's there.
    31. bobm posted on November 30, 2012 at 10:25 AM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    [3] I don't know if the numbers back it up but Martin seemed to have an awful lot of big hits for the Yankees the last two years.

    Spanning Multiple Seasons or entire Careers, Playing for the NYY, From 2011 to 2012, (requiring PA>=300), sorted by greatest wpa_clutch

                                      
Rk              Player Clutch   PA
1       Russell Martin    1.9  961
2          Raul Ibanez    1.1  425
3        Eduardo Nunez    0.5  438
4          Derek Jeter   -0.3 1347
5         Jorge Posada   -0.5  387
6        Brett Gardner   -0.6  625
7          Eric Chavez   -0.9  488
8         Nick Swisher   -1.0 1259
9        Robinson Cano   -1.1 1378
10       Mark Teixeira   -1.1 1208
11        Andruw Jones   -1.4  491
12      Alex Rodriguez   -1.6  957
13   Curtis Granderson   -2.4 1375
    32. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) posted on November 30, 2012 at 10:29 AM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    Martin's last four years of OPS+ run 88, 86, 95, 92 - extremely consistent - I have no idea why you'd bother to parse his numbers out so bizarrely.


    His BA is dropping, and his Ks are increasing. For a catcher going into his 30s, those are ominous signs.
    33. micker17 posted on November 30, 2012 at 12:23 PM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    What is the motivation for the Pirates spending this type of $ on such a modest ballplayer, especially when they have a younger better player (or at least as good) at the same position on their roster? Pirate fans help me out.
    34. haven posted on November 30, 2012 at 12:25 PM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    especially when they have a younger better player (or at least as good)

    they don't believe this is in any way true
    35. micker17 posted on November 30, 2012 at 12:30 PM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    Thanks haven, because I'm trying to understand this move. Is that the feeling about McKenry? As a Pirate fan, do you think this is a wise expenditure of limited resourses?
    36. SG posted on November 30, 2012 at 12:35 PM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    McKenry's got a career line of .224/.298/.383 and is going to be 28 next year. I'm having a hard time with this notion that he's as good as Martin.
    37. Nasty Nate posted on November 30, 2012 at 12:36 PM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    especially when they have a younger better player (or at least as good)


    they don't believe this is in any way true


    well, they probably believe he is younger...
    38. micker17 posted on November 30, 2012 at 12:50 PM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    I took a peak at McKenry's minor league stats and they sure look pretty good. I guess my point is that the Pirates have been awful for 20 years; how does blowing your wad on a short term veteran for a slight upgrade help achieve the goal of building a championship franchise?
    39. JJ1986 posted on November 30, 2012 at 01:14 PM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    I assume they're signing him mostly to help their pitchers.
    40. just plain joe posted on November 30, 2012 at 02:02 PM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    Girardi as manager means the Yanks are going to go defense-first at that position for as long as he's there.


    Is that the same Girardi who used Jorge Posada behind the plate until Posada was forbidden by the doctors to catch any longer?
    41. haven posted on November 30, 2012 at 02:34 PM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    I assume they're signing him mostly to help their pitchers.

    This too....

    But I think it is really more about thinking Sanchez isn't ready, watching McHenry wear down and feeling he can't handle starters innings and having nothing else remotely ready at the position in the system.

    It's two years so it isn't a killer. I don't particularly like the move, but some of my friends are ecstatic so the Pirates are also seeming to get a bump with "average" fans.
    42. PASTE Thinks This Trout Kid Might Be OK (Zeth) posted on November 30, 2012 at 03:35 PM #  hit 0 | hit 0

    What is the motivation for the Pirates spending this type of $ on such a modest ballplayer, especially when they have a younger better player (or at least as good) at the same position on their roster? Pirate fans help me out.


    The Pirates have to give some money to somebody this winter, but would rather not commit very much of it. That plus the organization's perception that McKenry isn't a major league starter (they are probably right about this) equals the Martin signing. It's a waste of money, but for PR reasons they have to waste a few million bucks on some free agent or another. They have to be able to point to somebody and say "we're trying to compete, honest, here's our big acquisition for the winter!"

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