I love me some 30 for 30.

Yeah, for all the crap that ESPN has put out in the last 15 years, 30 for 30 has been consistently solid. Kind of frustrating to know that they can do this kind of thing when they put their mind to it, but choose to populate Sportscenter, BBTN, and most of the rest of their schedule with blithering, catchphrase-spouting talking heads and semi-literate ex-jocks.

I really enjoyed "The Pony Express" and "The Best That Never Was" and loved "The Two Escobars." Didn't think that highly of "The U," which I found unoriginal, uninsightful and self-congratulatory. But this is certainly one of the more worthwhile projects ESPN has launched in the last 20 years, so kudos to them for it.

Credit where credit is due: ESPN has by and large done a wonderful job with "30 for 30." The Marcus Dupree doc was the high point for me.

"Once Brothers" - Vlade Divac and the late Drazen Petrovic - should have been released in theaters. You don't need to know anything about basketball to be moved to tears by that 30/30 story.

Usually the better you know the real story, the more you grimace when someone comes along and tries and fails to explain it. Not this time.

just as a heads up, netflix has added the original 30 for 30 films (plus a few of the other ones that were produced in the interim) to their instant streaming catalog.


none of the films announced in this article seem like they will be in the same league as the two escobars or once brothers, or from an entertainment pov, pony excess or winning time.

judging by the synopses in the article, i'll probably be most interested in "broke" and "you don't know bo". "there's no place like home" sounds terrible. "9.79" and "ghosts of ole miss" oculd be good, and i'm not really familiar with the events described in "benji", but that one sounds interesting, as well.

Of course, not all the 30 for 30 docs are home runs--that's pretty much impossible--but the number of them which have been truly excellent is impressive.

The 9.79 one could be good. The only guy who wasn't cheating or at least has never gotten caught for cheating was the guy who finished in last place in that race. Should be an interesing story.

That one and broke look to be the only ones I'd be interested in watching.

The Ben Wilson story was HUGE news in Chicago at the time and for years after, and went far beyond sports in its impact. The prototypical senseless act of violence over absolutely nothing.

Different strokes for different folks, I guess. I loved "the U.". It was one of my favorite episodes, right up there with "the two escobars" and "pony express.".

Bo redefined the role of the athlete in the pop cultural conversation

Bo was certainly big but if you're going to credit any individual, surely it's Jordan (and Spike Lee).

Bo redefined the role of the athlete in the pop cultural conversation

Bo was certainly big but if you're going to credit any individual, surely it's Jordan (and Spike Lee).

Did the Steve Bartman one ever come out?

Different strokes for different folks, I guess. I loved "the U.

I guess it depends what you mean by "loved"--it was unintentionally but brutally honest in depicting what a loathsome, despicable program that school had

Pork-face Satan (Jimmy Johnson) was his own despicable self

Did the Steve Bartman one ever come out?

Yeah, it was last year, I believe. It probably is available on Netflix. I know ESPN is adding those to Netflix.

I guess it depends what you mean by "loved"--it was unintentionally but brutally honest in depicting what a loathsome, despicable program that school had

I think this is accurate, and I think the "unintentionally" here is part of what put me off the documentary. Here's my impression of "The U:"

"Miami was bad for a long time. Then they hired Howard Schnellenberger, and he recruited good players. The good players were good, and the team was good. They also did a lot of things that annoyed a lot of people. THE U! THE U! THE U!"

There was little attempt at explaining the team's success beyond airing a lot of interviews where players just said, "We were really good." As I said, I found it pretty uninsightful.

I found the documentary's treatment of the players' shenanigans somewhat troublesome. Look, I don't care if a bunch of 18-22-year-old kids in the 80's and early 90's danced around after big plays or pulled out fake six shooters and fired them or ran all the way down the tunnel after a TD. Who cares? I mean, I'm white, but I'm not that white.

But I was awfully put off by the way the Miami alums talked about that Cotton Bowl victory over Texas, specifically the UT player one of them knocked unconscious. There was a lot of guffawing and light-hearted banter about how awesome it was that they knocked a kid unconscious, and it was totally cool, because Texas said mean things about Miami before the game. It's one thing for a bunch of college football players to say things like that, but it's another thing altogether when those kids are in their late 30's and early 40's and the event is 20 years in the past.

All of which would be fine, as it's a documentary and the players said what they said. But there's little evidence in the documentary that the people behind the camera find any of this objectionable. Certainly giving over the last minute or two of the film to a dozen alums so they can make the U hand signal and say "The U" doesn't seem to indicate that the director thought there was much wrong with what Miami did.

The Navratilova/Evert one was godawful boring. It's the only one that I turned off.

"June 17, 1994", "The Two Escobars", "The Pony Express", and the Divac/Petrovich one were all riveting stuff.

The Gretzky Trade and the Terry Fox one were too close to my heart for me to judge properly.

Funny enough, I never got a chance to see the baseball ones entirely (Jordan on the bus, Roto, 2004 Red Sox, Steinbrenner).

I bought the DVD set for my dad a year ago. I don't think he's watched them yet. I might swipe it from him when I visit next time...

Edit: Oh, and the Reggie Miller/Knicks started off well, but didn't hold me interest enough for me to really recommend it.

I saw most of the Miller one as well, and it was well done, but was not convinced it would attract the casual fan. The draft-day stuff and Cheryl Miller stuff was good, but the theme was not as profound as the best ones.

not the directors fault, of course....

Credit where credit is due: ESPN has by and large done a wonderful job with "30 for 30." The Marcus Dupree doc was the high point for me.

I'm sure Dayn has read it, but if you haven't read Willie Morris' "The Courting of Marcus Dupree," you're missing out.

I'm sure Dayn has read it, but if you haven't read Willie Morris' "The Courting of Marcus Dupree," you're missing out.

excellent book--one of many by Willie--his short time as editor of Harper's (~1967-71) was the absolute height of that magazine

I'm sure Dayn has read it, but if you haven't read Willie Morris' "The Courting of Marcus Dupree," you're missing out.

thirded. I was a teenager when I read this and thought it was great then.

Edit: Oh, and the Reggie Miller/Knicks started off well, but didn't hold me interest enough for me to really recommend it.

I saw most of the Miller one as well, and it was well done, but was not convinced it would attract the casual fan. The draft-day stuff and Cheryl Miller stuff was good, but the theme was not as profound as the best ones.

not the directors fault, of course....

i thought the miller doc was hilarious, and i felt the best part about it was that the emotions of the subjects came right through the television. i could feel reggie miller's enthusiasm, and john starks's seething hatred of it, and spike lee's utterly dismissive contempt for miller.

the biggest issue i had with that film was that it completely ignored the fact that neither team won anything of consequence during that era. it was a great little side story, but it didn't present itself as a side story.

it was still one of my favorites though.

Did the Steve Bartman one ever come out?

Yeah, it was last year, I believe. It probably is available on Netflix. I know ESPN is adding those to Netflix.

I recommend it. The job they did in recreating what happened, including some really fascinating behind-the-scenes footage of what happened to Bartman still at the game, but after the play, is terrific.

And since no one's mentioned it - the one on the Fab 5 at Michigan is worth a watch as well. I'm not well-versed enough to know whether it overplays the impact that they had on culture as a whole, but the story of how the team came together, and how it came apart, is nicely told.

Funny enough, I never got a chance to see the baseball ones entirely (Jordan on the bus, Roto, 2004 Red Sox, Steinbrenner).

They're pretty much all bad. The 2004 Red Sox doc and the Steinbrenner doc are by far the worst ones in the series. Jordan on the Bus should have been excellent, but goes nowhere. I missed the roto one, heard mixed things. Bartman was very good, so that's one good baseball doc. I have high hopes for Bo.

Bill Simmons, weirdly, seems to be kind of an excellent curator of sports writing and filmmaking. Grantland has hired a whole bunch of good writers, and a huge percentage of the best sportswriting of the last year was written on Grantland. 30 for 30 likewise. I'm sick of his just-us-bros-here sportswriting voice, but I've got to give him credit for this stuff.

The Roto one (Silly Little Game) was meant to be mock-heroic and was presented in a tongue-in-cheek style, but some felt it was self-indulgent.

just as a heads up, netflix has added the original 30 for 30 films (plus a few of the other ones that were produced in the interim) to their instant streaming catalog.

Just watched "The Band That Wouldn't Die" last night. The band director looked really familiar and it kept bugging me til I realized he is also in the doc "Becoming Elmo" about the puppeteer behind Elmo on Sesame Street (Kevin Clash) that I watched a few weeks ago - he's the guy at the Baltimore TV station that gives Kevin his first break.

Marcus Dupree (Best that Never Was), Once Brothers (Drazen Petrovic and Vlade Divac) and The Two Escobars are by far the best.

The baseball ones have been by far my least favorites. Jordan Rides the Bus interminably boring, the fantasy baseball one was terrible because they tried to make it funny, Four Days in October was okay, but the material has been covered so much. I haven't seen the Bartman or Steinbrenner ones -they're in my Netflix queue though.

"House of Steinbrenner" is nauseating. I couldn't even finish it.

they interviewed the espn guy tasked to track down bartman. he hated it but kept at until he got to bartman in a parking lot

agreed with uccf that the zapruder type film of the wrigley stands following the incident is great.

the guy who was right there with bartman in going for the ball is ridiculously amusing in the very casual way he admits he did the same thing and that he immediately disavowed doing anything when at the game and fingered bartman.

Awful Announcing's ideas for 30 for 30 docs.

I'd watch a good doc about the early Bill James days or the death of the Expos.

"Miami was bad for a long time. Then they hired Howard Schnellenberger, and he recruited good players. The good players were good, and the team was good. They also did a lot of things that annoyed a lot of people. THE U! THE U! THE U!"

There was little attempt at explaining the team's success beyond airing a lot of interviews where players just said, "We were really good." As I said, I found it pretty uninsightful.

I'm still going to disagree. I thought that the first part of the film did a very good job of documenting why Schnellenberger was able to turn the program around. They mentioned his focus on recruiting in the state of Florida up through the Tampa-Daytona corridor (which they referred to as "the state of Miami") and especially within the city of Miami. They shared stories of his willingness to go into the ethnic neighborhoods and his pitch to the local kids of basically turning the Hurricanes into an all-Miami All-Star team. And they mentioned the significance of having the parents and high school fans turn out for the college games as a way to boost attendance and fan intensity. It seemed very clear to me why Schnellenberger was able to turn things around, even if later coaches got away from that blueprint.

They're pretty much all bad. The 2004 Red Sox doc and the Steinbrenner doc are by far the worst ones in the series. Jordan on the Bus should have been excellent, but goes nowhere. I missed the roto one, heard mixed things. Bartman was very good, so that's one good baseball doc. I have high hopes for Bo.

I agree with this one. The Jordan one was okay, if I little boring. The roto one was fun, though not as good as the other humorous doc about the USFL. But I found the Red Sox and Steinbrenner films to be unwatchable. I couldn't finish either one. Way too much fawning over the subjects. And in the case of the Red Sox, I didn't feel I was learning anything I hadn't known when I watched the games the first time around.

A 30-for-30 doc detailing the rise and fall of Barry Halper's reputation would be cool.

The Mike Tyson one - One Night In Vegas - was totally unwatchable. I couldn't get past the first ten minutes of poetry slamming and faux comic book art.

Otherwise I loved the first batch of 30 For 30 films, particularly June 17, 1994 and The Two Escobars.

I'll add my voice to those who loved the Two Escobars and thought the Red Sox one (Four Days in October) was awful. That one was clearly Simmons just saying "it's my idea so I'm doing something I want to do."

I will say that I hate basketball but the Reggie Miller one was in my opinion the best of the bunch. You really felt like you were in it as it happened.

I know a lot of people disagree, but the Magic one just had too much Magic Johnson in it. I mean it simply was not dispassionate enough with Magic himself narrating the whole damned thing.

I'd watch a good doc about the early Bill James days or the death of the Expos.

I'd LOVE to see the death of the Expos, especially a "where are they now" follow-up at the end.
(Like Brad Wilkerson being the last man to wear an official Montreal Expos jersey in competitive action, on the Japan tour in the off-season.)

I'd also like to see an outsider come into Toronto and do a doc about the unbreakable Toronto Maple Leaf fan support. I don't think anyone can really understand how crazy it is that such an unsuccessful franchise (40+ years without a title, 7 years without the playoffs, and only 9 seasons with more than 50% wins in the past 50) can still pull huge attendance/TV/merchandise numbers. Other legendary teams (Canadiens, Yankees, Red Sox) had down periods, but not the Leafs.

How about a "odd nation sport" collection, like the Israeli ice hockey team, the Canadian cricket team, and the British baseball league?

I know a lot of people disagree, but the Magic one just had too much Magic Johnson in it. I mean it simply was not dispassionate enough with Magic himself narrating the whole damned thing.

As one of the most famous moments in televised sports history, I was surprised at how flat that doc seemed to be. I agree that Magic talking about Magic really took away from any critical look at him and those around him.

Just went and watched "The Two Escobars" because of the comments in this thread. You guys weren't kidding.

the biggest issue i had with that film was that it completely ignored the fact that neither team won anything of consequence during that era.

They kinda did when Reggie ends with "now if only we'd won in the Conference Finals." I think my wife busted out laughing at that point. But that was probably the most entertaining of the non-heart-tugging docs.

30 for 30, the Jeff francoeur story.

The Red Sox one is just awful - it's an automatic fast forward when Simmons is on screen in the bar. Just a waste of time.

The Two Escobars is just stunning , it's one the best documentaries, I've ever seen in any genre.

One that hasn't been mentioned which I loved was the Matt Hoffman one - I had to look up while I was watching it , to make sure he wasn't dead - really great stuff.

The OJ Simpson one is freakishly well edited and great - the Reggie Miller one rounds out my favourite 3.

A 30 for 30 on the Pittsburgh drug trials could be interesting. It's not something that got an inordinate amount of coverage at the time, and I'm assuming most of the principals are still alive and have some perspective on it based on the ensuing 20 years.

Game 6 of the 2011 World Series also deserves its own documentary, but might need to marinate for a few more years.

30 for 30, the Jeff francoeur story.

That would be more like 8 for 30 wouldn't it?

30 for 30, Al Leiter's quest to defeat every team in baseball.

wouldn't mind seeing a 30 for 30 about the dysfunctional website Baseball Think Factory, with a special segment using actors to recreate the banning of kevin.

in all seriousness. the two escobars was awesome. also really liked the one about marcus dupree and the one about terry fox.

i'm glad they are on neflix, now i can go see the vlade divac one.

Not all of them are on netflix. Me and my friends couldn't find The Fab Five.

Unguarded, the doc about Chris Herron, was pretty riveting.

Also in the substance abuse genre, the Marinovich project was very entertaining as well. The story is familiar, but the ending was not at all what I expected.

Fab Five was not under the 30 for 30 umbrella

The Hartman or unguarded or the auburn and Alabama weren't either, but they are on Netflix.