And more stolen bases than Jim Rice!

The most pessimistic said, “Not at all. I’ve never thought of him in that light.”

If that guy has an inside job in baseball, and it's not as a peanut vendor, his employers really have to hope he has nothing to do with either reporting on baseball or acquiring talent for a team. Sometimes I wish they would have asked a second question following the absurd answers like that (do you think Bernie Williams is a hofer----the answer would tell you whether this person has an impossibly high standard or whether he's baseball version of an American Idol viewer)

The late part of Beltran's career is starting to resemble Moises Alou's, at least based on my memory of it. I don't think I've appreciated until now how good of a hitter Beltran was. I always understood he was a complete player but I didn't grasp how much he could do with the bat.

Beltran denies turning down a ludicrously low offer from the Royals in this story, saying he never received a concrete offer.

Beltran is (by far) the best percentage base-stealer of all time. I feel like that should give him a HoF boost in the same way that people get boosts for being the best defender ever at their position.

Beltran is (by far) the best percentage base-stealer of all time. I feel like that should give him a HoF boost in the same way that people get boosts for being the best defender ever at their position.

As with Raines' HOF candidacy, some of the gasbags will cite this as further evidence that he was a selfish ballplayer.

Beltran is (by far) the best percentage base-stealer of all time. I feel like that should give him a HoF boost in the same way that people get boosts for being the best defender ever at their position.

I'm a fan of Beltran, thinks he probably deserves it, but I do not see how those are really comparable. You are talking about at most an extra 5-10 bases a year. That isn't an additional man on base, that is an additional advanced base. Not nearly as valuable as an extra time on base or creating an additional out.

Mind you, one of the only useful uses of WPA is to come up with baserunning value for steals(since it's a decision play and not purely random, it's about the only time WPA adds any value to a conversation----and of course fangraphs doesn't keep track of that, instead going with an aggregate score for running....silly, you have a stat that is mostly useless, in the one area where it has value, you don't track.) If wpa were to track steals and steal attempts only, and it showed Beltran value there, I might jump on board with that.

I'm a fan of Beltran, thinks he probably deserves it, but I do not see how those are really comparable. You are talking about at most an extra 5-10 bases a year. That isn't an additional man on base, that is an additional advanced base. Not nearly as valuable as an extra time on base or creating an additional out.

Nothing to do with value, I just think there's a place in the Hall for players who were the absolute best at something.

repost

Nothing to do with value, I just think there's a place in the Hall for players who were the absolute best at something.

I can see that, not a fan of it, due to slippery slope issues. Best pinch hitter, best middle reliever, best dh... I don't think any of them by themselves rate a hof plaque without some other context.

Beltran is (by far) the best percentage base-stealer of all time.

This is not clear, since it depends entirely on your threshold for number of attempts. Rickey Henderson, Tim Raines, Carlos Beltran, Chase Utley, or some guy who played thirty games and went 4 for 4...any of them could be considered the best percentage base stealer of all time. Does Utley make the hall in your book becasue of his base stealing?

Nothing to do with value, I just think there's a place in the Hall for players who were the absolute best at something.

No one else in the history of baseball could sacrifice a goat like Chris Truby.

No one else in the history of baseball could sacrifice a goat like Chris Truby.

Albert Belle says hello.

I can see that, not a fan of it, due to slippery slope issues. Best pinch hitter, best middle reliever, best dh... I don't think any of them by themselves rate a hof plaque without some other context.

By way of context, I believe it's fair to say that base-stealing percentage is not the entirety of Beltran's Hall of Fame Case.

Posnanski has mentioned it repeatedly but since I doubt he will pop into this thread, this game was one of the more amazing moments I've seen on a baseball field. Naturally, with it being the Royals, despite Beltran's heroics the game ended in a loss.

Bottom of the 9th inning with the Royals down by a run in an early September 2003 game that actually meant something because the Royals were in the hunt. The team was 71-66 going into the game and were just a half game behind the Twins in the standings. It was a make up game from an earlier rainout so a Royals win would put them back into a tie for first.

Beltran draws a walk ... steals second ... steals third ... and then scores the tying run on a sacrifice fly that I truly believe was at best 180 feet away from home plate. It was just astonishing to see somebody with that kind of speed on the basepaths who knew how to use.

That isn't an additional man on base, that is an additional advanced base. Not nearly as valuable as an extra time on base or creating an additional out.

It's actually an additional advanced base, and an out on the bases, NOT made, so it's very valuable. Outs made on the basepaths are very expensive.