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Wednesday, May 01, 2013

OT: NBA Monthly Thread - May 2013

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posted 3 weeks ago by Athletic Supporter gangnam style to basketball, nba, off-topic | 1220 comment(s)

I estimate only 10-12 Primates care about straight NBA players, but with our own thread, we won’t detract from what this site is really about: gay NBA players and craft beer.

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701. PJ Martinez posted on February 18, 2013 at 02:23 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

702. Der_K posted on February 18, 2013 at 02:57 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

sixers will supposedly sign jeremy pargo for rest of the year. celts reportedly like to ink t. williams to a 10-day.

703. PJ Martinez posted on February 18, 2013 at 03:06 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

Probably won't make a big difference either way, but I like the no-risk Terrence Williams signing by Boston. Celtics are short on healthy players right now, so he may see some minutes quickly. He's young and seems pretty talented; supposedly there were questions about his attitude at his first couple NBA stops.

704. Bitter Mouse is a genre addict posted on February 18, 2013 at 03:07 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

I don't know that he belongs ni the Hall of Fame, but Maurice Cheeks will always get my vote for this.

705. smileyy posted on February 18, 2013 at 03:40 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

Is it unfair to say that if you can't get to the playoffs with Player X as your best player, then Player X isn't a HOFer?

In this case, I'm talking about Mitch Richmond.

Edit: I'm probably setting my replacement level bar way too high, given that a replacement level team is a 10-15 win team. Its unfair to set the HOF bar at 20-30 wins added, which we've seen as reserved for inner-circle guys.

Edit 2: Dear god did the Kings ever draft badly in the late 80s and early 90s. I know that was a dreadful era for talent evaluation....but still..

706. jmurph posted on February 18, 2013 at 03:46 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

The NBA Hall of Fame is weird, but I'll ask this without checking the numbers: was Mitch Richmond ever even one of the best 20 players in the league during his career? I'd be pretty surprised if he was.

707. Manny Coon posted on February 18, 2013 at 04:00 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

The NBA Hall of Fame is weird, but I'll ask this without checking the numbers: was Mitch Richmond ever even one of the best 20 players in the league during his career? I'd be pretty surprised if he was.

He was 17th win shares and 11 in PER in 96-97, so he has a strong case that one season.

Is Richmond the worst player ever to make 6 straight all-star games? He scored a lot of points, but was a pretty limited player otherwise, which is a common type of player to be overrated by the media and casual fans. He was at least a pretty efficient scorer for a guard who shot as much he did.

708. Tripon posted on February 18, 2013 at 04:24 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

I thought the NBA and college basketball was joined together, which is why you'll have some odd choices.

709. smileyy posted on February 18, 2013 at 04:29 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

[708] Its all of basketball, not just NBA and college. There is no NBA HOF. There is a separate College Basketball HOF.

710. Booey posted on February 18, 2013 at 04:36 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

There is no NBA HOF. It combines all levels of basketball. So yeah, the standards are often hard to figure out.

Edit: coke to smileyy

711. jmurph posted on February 18, 2013 at 04:45 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

There is no NBA HOF. It combines all levels of basketball.

Yep, thanks for the correction. The point stands, though: he was basically a fringe all-star for a few seasons (started one) and had two very good college seasons. I can't imagine how that would make him a hall of famer.

712. smileyy posted on February 18, 2013 at 04:50 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

Mitch Richmond's plaque would say "He scored a lot of points and was lucky enough to be on the same team as Tim Hardaway and Chris Mullin for a couple of seasons. Boy that Billy Owens trade was a stinker, wasn't it?"

713. Moses Taylor peacocks peacock posted on February 18, 2013 at 05:17 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

Re: Granger, why would the Clippers, who are trying to win now, trade for a guy who has yet to play this season and may not be the same after knee surgery? Of course the Pacers would do that, but LAC wouldn't even consider it, I'm sure.

Good point. Guess I haven't thought about when he'd be back (which is when, btw?). Also, the trade deadline being this week just totally snuck up on me.

714. PJ Martinez posted on February 18, 2013 at 06:13 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

Any day now, I think -- in fact, I believe his knee is now ready to go but he has the flu, or something. But who knows how he'll look when he comes back. And yeah, the trade deadline is right around the corner.

Will be interesting to see whether he can kick the Indy offense up a notch at all. If they could just get up around league average they might be a real threat to Miami.

715. smileyy posted on February 18, 2013 at 06:20 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

716. Into the Void posted on February 18, 2013 at 08:01 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

So the estimate is the Lakers need to go 19-9 to sneak into the playoffs. Looking at their schedule that doesn't seem at all unlikely. Despite being road heavy their March is very easy- I wouldn't be surprised to see them go 12-3 or 11-4 in it.

717. Spivey posted on February 18, 2013 at 08:02 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

I feel like Indy needs to take its shot while it can. I could be wrong, but they strike me as an ensemble team, and those are real hard to keep together, and hard to keep competitive if you have to change personnel.

I don't think there's a ton of risk here because they're main guys are young and/or in their prime. I think their issue is more about if paying these guys is going to get more than they can handle, and the Bledsoe/Granger deal helps that a lot. I'm assuming Hibbert will play better, which leaves one real hole on the team, and because of how flexible they are with Hill and George either Granger or Bledsoe could fill it.

Bledsoe I think is more valuable because of his contract, but let's not forget that Granger had a really good year last year. He also makes them really, really tall.

718. PJ Martinez posted on February 18, 2013 at 08:27 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

I don't think Granger's going anywhere because the uncertainty surrounding him probably lowers his trade value for contending teams. The only way I think Indy deals him this week is if ownership really wants to save money, and they settle for an OK prospect (someone not as good as Bledsoe) and draft picks.

Paul George has played much better at SF than at SG so far this year, but perhaps that's a sample-size mirage? In theory, he and Granger can be your wings next to Hill, and Indiana should continue to play great defense while possibly improving offensively.

They can always deal Granger in the offseason if he ends up not fitting as well as they hope.

719. smileyy posted on February 18, 2013 at 08:40 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

I think their issue is more about if paying these guys is going to get more than they can handle

Yeah, that's part of what I meant but wasn't clear about.

I'm under the impression that David West supplies a lot of essential spacing and passing to the team, and while he's not old, he's not young either.

720. andrewberg posted on February 18, 2013 at 09:36 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

George has played more SF with granger out. Granger being out moves George up their offensive pecking order, so I'm not surprised he's been better playing there. That might just be noise.

721. Publius Publicola posted on February 18, 2013 at 09:58 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

Granger isn't really a game changer. He'll help with their depth but it's not like they're going to convert from a .600 to a .700 team when he comes back.

722. PJ Martinez posted on February 18, 2013 at 11:10 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

@WojYahooNBA Three teams that league GM's on phones believe will make significant moves before trade deadline: Atlanta, Milwaukee and Phoenix.

723. PJ Martinez posted on February 19, 2013 at 12:14 AM # hit 0 | hit 0

Supposedly Phoenix wants to trade for and then extend Josh Smith, and Atlanta is reportedly interested in acquiring a young center. Seems like some form of Smith for Gortat trade has a decent chance of happening this week.

724. Into the Void posted on February 19, 2013 at 02:35 AM # hit 0 | hit 0

I have no idea what Phoenix is doing and I doubt think they do either.

725. Athletic Supporter gangnam style posted on February 19, 2013 at 05:24 AM # hit 0 | hit 0

I feel like Indy needs to take its shot while it can. I could be wrong, but they strike me as an ensemble team, and those are real hard to keep together, and hard to keep competitive if you have to change personnel.

Agree. The bottom line is that it's really hard to put together a contender unless you have a steal (from a financial/cap standpoint) on your team. This is either a pre-FA star, or a super-duper star worth a lot more than the max. And obviously the former (which right now, Indy has in George) is a ticking clock. I'm not really sure what Indy is supposed to do here though -- the other problem with an ensemble team as opposed to a stars-and-scrubs team is that it's just hard to upgrade since you don't have black holes eating minutes.

726. PJ Martinez posted on February 19, 2013 at 09:12 AM # hit 0 | hit 0

@AlexKennedyNBA The Magic and Knicks have discussed a J.J. Redick for Iman Shumpert trade. Other players (and maybe a third team) would have to be involved

727. Gold Star - just Gold Star posted on February 19, 2013 at 10:26 AM # hit 0 | hit 0

I have no idea what Phoenix is doing and I doubt think they do either.

Phoenix is in the asset-acquisition phase of the rebuild. They've got a handful of tradable assets, their own 1st-rounder and a chance at a second lottery pick if the Lakers keep struggling. This season never was about this season, but this offseason is one of the more crucial in franchise history.

BTW, I don't want them to trade for J-Smoove.

728. andrewberg posted on February 19, 2013 at 11:56 AM # hit 0 | hit 0

You could also convince me that the economics of Indiana pro sports dictate that the Pacers need to stay competitive (if not championship caliber) to make money. It seems like they're one of those teams whose arenas completely dry up when they start losing.

I agree that Smith does not make sense for Phoenix. Re-signing him is going to close up a lot of cap space for anyone who acquires him, so you better either have a bigger star already in place or a steady supporting cast around him that will help define his role.

729. Conor posted on February 19, 2013 at 12:15 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

IIRC a lot of people here vouch for The Basketball Jones podcast, but the few times I've listened to it they always say a few too many monumentally...puzzling...things. One of the guys is making a J.R. Smith All-Star/6th Man case in today's podcast...

Responding a few days after you said this, but I was just catching up on the podcast and I caught this one today. That was from the Aussie guy, right? He seems like the one who is most likely the to make a puzzling (to use your word) point. The other 3 main guys I think are really solid.

730. John M. Perkins posted on February 19, 2013 at 12:26 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

Richmond was the best player in the state of Kansas in final year at Kansas State.

731. smileyy posted on February 19, 2013 at 01:43 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

Richmond was the best player in the state of Kansas in final year at Kansas State.

I see what you did there.

You could also convince me that the economics of Indiana pro sports dictate that the Pacers need to stay competitive (if not championship caliber) to make money.

There's certainly no shame in competing, even if you're not contending. This is a business after all. What does it take for Indiana to be a title contender?

Posit: Any of the top 4 teams in each conference would become at title contender by acquiring Kevin Garnett.

732. andrewberg posted on February 19, 2013 at 01:51 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

Are there title contenders other than okc, sa, and mia now? That would mean kg turns lac, mem, nyk, ind, bkn (or chi) into contenders? I don't think the marginal gain would be much for mem, nyk, ind given their current rosters, at least not enough to make them contenders.

733. robinred

posted on February 19, 2013 at 01:58 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

Are there title contenders other than okc, sa, and mia now?

Clippers. 6th in ORTG; 7th in DRTG. Third-best player in the league, another top 10-20 guy, and a good bench.

734. NJ in NY posted on February 19, 2013 at 01:59 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

[732] Disagree on NYK. KG would definitely make them title contenders. You didn't list DEN, but KG would make them title contenders as well. I also think you're underrating LAC by leaving them off the list of title contenders (says the guy who spent all pre-season saying LAC was overhyped).

735. The District Attorney posted on February 19, 2013 at 02:06 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

Disagree on NYK. KG would definitely make them title contenders.

Plus given recent events, it would be hilarious.

736. Gold Star - just Gold Star posted on February 19, 2013 at 02:07 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

Clippers. 6th in ORTG; 7th in DRTG. Third-best player in the league, another top 15-20 guy, and a good bench.

Agreed. If not for CP3's injury (missed 12 games, lost 6), they're on the Spurs' heels for the top seed.

737. Gold Star - just Gold Star posted on February 19, 2013 at 02:09 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

Bynum's hair never fails to surprise.

738. Moses Taylor peacocks peacock posted on February 19, 2013 at 02:57 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

That would mean kg turns lac, mem, nyk, ind, bkn (or chi) into contenders? I don't think the marginal gain would be much for mem, nyk, ind given their current rosters, at least not enough to make them contenders.

I agree with NJ, the Knicks with KG are a title contender. Agree on Memphis. I think he would be more than a marginal gain for Indiana. He definitely improves the chances for the Clips and Bulls. I don't think even with KG that the Nets would be title contenders (unless Williams and Wallace instantly reverted to the peak forms).

739. andrewberg posted on February 19, 2013 at 03:02 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

Clippers. 6th in ORTG; 7th in DRTG. Third-best player in the league, another top 10-20 guy, and a good bench.

Fair enough. I'm convinced. I had them on the line in my head anyway and I suppose they're about even with SA and OKC in the West if they stay healthy.

740. madvillain posted on February 20, 2013 at 12:03 AM # hit 0 | hit 0

Couple quick things: Recent Jordan/Lebron conversation got me digging into some old Jordan Youtube clips. Anyone who hasn't seen the series "the Artistry of Michael Jordan" by HoopsEncyclopedia should go watch it now.

Can't find it right now (ugh) but someone on another forum posted a chart of threes per game verse fts per game. Extrapolating from the chart, you'll see more average threes per game than FTs in a couple more years, if things continue how they are.

741. madvillain posted on February 20, 2013 at 12:24 AM # hit 0 | hit 0

Not sure why I can't save the edited post but here is that chart:

Chart of three pointers attempted per game verse free throws attempted per game. Extrapolating from the chart, you'll see more average threes per game than FTs in a couple more years, if things continue how they are.

742. you got a STEAGLES? you're gonna need a STEAGLES. posted on February 20, 2013 at 12:59 AM # hit 0 | hit 0

@Nets_PR: #Nets now 32-0 when outscoring opponent this season

743. NJ in NY posted on February 20, 2013 at 02:53 AM # hit 0 | hit 0

Looking at some of the blogosphere's response to JJ Hickson and Kyrie Irving's recent tweets and all I can think is that Twitter is the best/worst/weirdest thing to happen to the NBA.

744. smileyy posted on February 20, 2013 at 11:23 AM # hit 0 | hit 0

[740] Thanks for that. I had forgotten just how long Jordan's arms were, and what he could do because of that.

745. Crispix Attacks 2: Swag Airlines posted on February 20, 2013 at 01:48 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

Every few days I marvel even more at the results of the 76ers involving themselves in the Dwight Howard trade. They traded Nikola Vucevic, who is a really good player. And they traded Iguodala, who is obviously Iguodala. And they traded a first round pick. And what they got was an old guy who had his worst season and then got injured, and a guy who everyone realized in November or so would never play a game for the 76ers.

At least they're only 4 games out of the playoffs!

746. Moses Taylor peacocks peacock posted on February 20, 2013 at 02:40 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

Yikes.

Former Texas forward Gary Johnson is expected to make a full recovery after fracturing his skull in a collision with an opponent during a second-division Israeli basketball game.

The 24-year-old Johnson was put in a medically induced coma but has regained consciousness, the Israel Basketball Association said Wednesday. IBA spokesman Hagai Segal said Johnson was awake and communicative.

Johnson will require some plastic surgery but should make a full recovery, Segal said.

Johnson, who plays for Hapoel Galil Elyon, was injured Tuesday when Elitzur Ramla forward Johndre Jefferson hit Johnson in the head with his elbow.

"Gary made a step-through move and when he was going up I was close enough to block the shot and I blocked it on the backboard," Jefferson told The Associated Press. "I don't know how it happened, but when I was coming down my elbow caught him in the forehead.

"When we both came down I was standing over his feet trying to tap him on his side to ask him if he was OK. He was holding his head and kind of rolling around."

Jefferson said play was delayed for about 25 minutes as trainers and coaches tended to Johnson, who rolled on the court in agony before being taken to a hospital.

"You could see the fracture, the break," said Jefferson, who went back to his team's bench to wait while officials worked on Johnson. "I just had to walk away."

747. Too Much Coffee Man posted on February 20, 2013 at 02:50 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

Adrian Wojnarowski reported that the Nuggets turned down an offer of the salary formerly known as Brandon Roy and Memphis' 1st round pick from Minnesota for Timofey Mozgov.

748. Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim

posted on February 20, 2013 at 03:06 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

You mean Denver doesn't want to pay Brandon Roy ~$7 million for the rest of this season and all of next season to do nothing? Interesting.

749. you got a STEAGLES? you're gonna need a STEAGLES. posted on February 20, 2013 at 03:24 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

Every few days I marvel even more at the results of the 76ers involving themselves in the Dwight Howard trade. They traded Nikola Vucevic, who is a really good player. And they traded Iguodala, who is obviously Iguodala. And they traded a first round pick. And what they got was an old guy who had his worst season and then got injured, and a guy who everyone realized in November or so would never play a game for the 76ers.

At least they're only 4 games out of the playoffs!

moe harkless is not exactly a zero, either.

vucevic was never getting out of collins' doghouse, anyway, so what he's doing in orlando is not entirely relevant to what he would be doing here.

and iguodala isn't exactly tearing it up with denver, either. his PER is 7th among players in their rotation, and 2 others (jordan hamilton and corey brewer) have essentially been his equal.

750. smileyy posted on February 20, 2013 at 03:27 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

[746] I'm surprised this doesn't happen more often. There are parts of the skull that are more brittle than others, and with all the elbows in a basketball game...

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Wednesday, May 01, 2013

OT: NBA Monthly Thread - May 2013

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