Yes?

No doubt RG3 is a world class athlete and has speed to burn, so there will always be conversations and comparisons to Vick and crew. He is just so much better at every thing else (reads, accuracy, ball security, etc) than any of those other prototypical running qbs, that I was as shocked as Andy to see how many times he's tucked it and ran. I hope when he gets a little more talent around him, he morphs into that Steve Young / Aaron Rodgers mold. If not he's going to have a short career.

If we are trying to compare RG3's propensity to run the ball when he can't find an open receiver, shouldn't that list of rushing attempts per game be adjusted for number of drop backs per game and also have designed QB rushes removed?

Well, it depends what you're using it for. It's a pretty good measure of how efficient and productive your passing offense is.

You're thinking of passer rating. I'm talking about (and so is that article) ESPN's "QBR."

Whoever owns Doug Martin this week is off to a good start. 26 fantasy pts and counting.

Ends with 33.40 pts in standard yahoo leagues, and much more in PPR formats.

more fun with danny watkins:

Certainly odd that Andy Reid would decide to tell us today that Danny Watkins has a "chronic" ankle and that #Eagles knew it before draft.

so, let's see, at the time of the draft, watkins was a 26 year old guard who didn't touch a football until he was 21 and had chronic ankle issues.

jesus ####### christ.

24-7 in the first half.

i can't help but be happy about it. the defense was the only adequate part of the team through the first 6 weeks, so of course, when andy reid decided to shake the team up, it was the defensive coordinator that got the axe, and not the offensive coordinator, whose unit has sucked, or the offensive line coach, whose unit has sucked, or the special teams coach, whose unit has sucked, or the defensive line coach, whose unit has sucked.

no, they were all safe coming out of the bye, and it was juan castillo who had to go.


and now i'm just smirking, because the defense has given up 24 points on 4 drives in the first half, and they probably could have gotten a perfect 28 if they hadn't left a timeout in their pocket during the 2 minute drill at the end of the half.



one other really schadenfreudey thing is that everyone on the eagles pregame show picked the eagles, because they had apparently not watched them play this season, so it should be really fun to see their despondency on the postgame show.

Jets getting curbstopped at home by the Dolphins a week after taking the Patriots to the wire. This Jeckyl/Hyde act cannot bode well for Ryan's coaching future.

Andy Reid should probably fire himself for giving up on the game with 20 minutes to go.

Andy Reid should probably fire himself for giving up on the game with 20 minutes to go.

Challenging the spot then punting is like a letter of resignation.

So, I know every fan thinks the national press underrates their team, but does today's throttling of Philly on the road (assuming it holds) move the respect-needle for the Falcons, or is the narrative out of this game "Eagles play poorly?"

It doesn't move the needle. This is yet another win over an unimpressive team by the Falcons.

It doesn't move the needle. This is yet another win over an unimpressive team by the Falcons.

That's what I assume will be the case too.

So, I know every fan thinks the national press underrates their team, but does today's throttling of Philly on the road (assuming it holds) move the respect-needle for the Falcons, or is the narrative out of this game "Eagles play poorly?"

i think the falcons are past the point where they can get any respect at all by winning a regular season game. people already know they can do that. if they want respect, they really have to make a deep run in the postseason.

That's what I assume will be the case too.

Beating the Cowboys next week probably will, even though the Cowboys aren't any good.

Allen Barra on rating QBs:

Is there such a thing as the ultimate passer rating stat? No, but there is one that works better than any other. Years ago, working on an article for my high school paper, I wrote to the NFL's leading stats expert, Bud Goode. My question was simple: What do you think are the most important stats for a quarterback to be rated by? His answer was equally simple: "Yards per pass attempt, and closely behind that one, interception percentage." A short time later, in a story for Sports Illustrated Goode wrote, "I want this on my headstone: Here lies Bud Goode. He told the world about yards per pass attempt." (Goode died in 2010; to my knowledge, his request was not honored.)

Early in 1993, working with George Ignatin, I embarked on a project to determine how good a tool yards/pass attempt really was. We calculated every pro football game played from 1958-1992. What stats correlated the best with winning? Goode was vindicated: It was yards/pass attempt, as in gross yards gained passing divided by the number of attempts.

The second most-important stat was interception percentage. The challenge was how to combine them into an easily accessible formula available to any fan.

This was finally accomplished by figuring the value, in terms of yards, of an interception. We determined this by adding all the yards gained in every possession a football team had over the course of a season as well as the average number of yards gained on punts. We also figured in the average number of yards that interceptions were returned for.

After weeks of painstaking work—painstaking for the math-deprived like me, at least—we determined that an interception was worth 49.38 yards, which rounded off nicely to 50. We called the result Adjusted Yards/Pass or AYP.

I'll show you how to figure it, starting with Green Bay's Aaron Rodgers, by anyone's standards surely one of the best passers in the NFL this decade. So far this year, Rodgers has passed for 1,979 yards in 262 attempts. He has been picked off four times, so multiplying that by 50, we get 200; subtracting that from his yards passing, we get 1,779 yards. We then divide that by the number of attempts, 262, and get an AYP of 6.79.

But Rodgers's AYP isn't the most impressive in the league. So far that honor goes to the Washington Redskin's sensational rookie Robert Griffin III who, in seven games, has gained 1601 yards in 189 attempts for a sensational 8.47 yards/attempt. And he has done it while throwing just three interceptions. So, subtracting 150 yards from RG3's gross yards passing, we get 1451 yards, which divided by 189 is an impressive 7.67 YPA.

Why are the Redskins only 3-4? Because their defense has allowed 200 points, the highest of any team in their conference and 30th out of 32 teams in the entire league. They have also allowed 8.0 yards per attempt this year, 27th in the league.

(By the way, No.'s 2 and 3 in AYP are the Mannings, Peyton at 7.08 and Eli, 7.02.),

http://www.theatlantic.com/entertainment/archive/2012/10/finally-an-effective-way-to-rank-nfl-quarterbacks/264154/

I wouldn't be shocked only two of Atlanta's opponents end up with winning records (Giants and Denver). Beating the Giants would be worth a lot of credit, but really they just have a weak schedule and need to win some playoff games.

Finally an effective way? People have been using AY/A for years.

No eagles suck. FO which has historically loved Reid's teams, had the eagles ranked 20 in dvoa coming into today.

No eagles suck. FO which has historically loved Reid's teams, had the eagles ranked 20 in dvoa coming into today.

the special teams have been horrible -- both the return teams and the coverage teams -- the offense has turned the ball over at a horrendous rate, and while the defense has been decent (prior to today, anyway), the thing they share in common with both the offense and the special teams is a complete lack of big plays. they don't get sacks, they don't get interceptions, they don't force funmbles.

this is truly a terrible team to have to watch play every week.


and to pile awful on top of awful, because lurie has mandated that reid make the playoffs this year, he has no incentive to put foles in the game to at least see if there's anything there going into next offseason. they're going to have to draft a QB anyway, but it'd be nice to know whether it's necessary to trade up into the top 5 to get the best one in the draft, or whether they can just pluck one in the 3rd or 4th round as a project.

So, is Tony Romo just a terrible, terrible QB?

RGIII didn't have a good game, but it was mostly because his receivers suck dog ####. If they had a decent receiver corp, they're going to the playoffs with a chance to win the division.

oh, and ray didinger brought up something in the postgame:

there are no career eagles left on the team. mcnabb is gone, westbrook is gone, dawkins is gone, akers is gone, thomas (and runyan) are gone, trotter is gone. those are guys who were drafted by the eagles, who became starters with the eagles, and who were leaders during the team's run in the early/mid aughts.

but now? vick is a mercenary. babin is a mercenary. ryans is a mercenary. nnamdi is a mercenary. and while those are some of the better players on the team, they are also guys who have no connection to the organization.

what that comes down to is a failure on draft day. because the eagles have missed on so many early round picks for so many years, there's no core of homegrown veterans to keep the team grounded and on the same page. 2010 and 2011 were complete ############. at least in 08 and 09 you came up with maclin, mccoy and jackson, but 2010 and 11? all you have are two awful safeties (coleman and allen), a pair of decent players who are 5th on the depth chart (brandon graham and riley cooper), and a kicker. and then going back to 07, 06, and 05, you're looking at kevin kolb, victor abiamiri, stewart bradley, broderick bunkley, winston justice, chris gocong, mike patterson, reggie brown, matt mccoy, and ryan moats. that's 10 guys drafted in the first 3 rounds, 6, 7, and 8 years ago, and of the 10 names, none are impact players and none are currently on the roster.

that's 5 of the last 8 drafts which are Ds *at best*, and then two others which really aren't that great, either.

i won't say that you can't win that way, because i was expecting this team to win that way this year, but they would really have a much easier task if they hadn't busted in so many drafts.

ted thompson made a poor decision in letting cullen jenkins go but cullen has to be wondering what in the h8ll he has gotten himself into

Steagles, you said in your beginning paragraph that there are no career Eagles left, and then mention Maclin, McCoy and Jackson. Those three are a good base for your offense.

RGIII didn't have a good game, but it was mostly because his receivers suck dog ####. If they had a decent receiver corp, they're going to the playoffs with a chance to win the division.

Eh, not without some kind of pass defense we're not. It's going to take a few more years- the Shanahan's have drafted pretty well, but the team was such an unbelievable shambles before they got there they were really starting with basically nothing. Also we still have the $18 million cap penalty next year.

Steagles, you said in your beginning paragraph that there are no career Eagles left, and then mention Maclin, McCoy and Jackson. Those three are a good base for your offense.

jackson is in his 5th year, and maclin and mccoy are each in their 4th. (oh, and they're all also really, really young, as in, they're all younger than last year's first round pick) when the eagles made the superbowl in '04, brian dawkins and hollis thomas were in their 8th year, chad lewis was in his 7th, tra thomas, jeremiah trotter, ike reese, and david akers were in their 6th, and mcnabb was in his 5th.

that was a much more veteran core of homegrown leaders, and unlike jackson, maclin, and mccoy (and the two longest tenured eagles trent cole and todd herremens) they were also the leaders of the team. and that core was also much more nasty, and much more physical than this one.


and more importantly, when that team brought veteran free agents in (hugh douglas, jon runyan, terrell owens, jevon kearse), they weren't expected to gel into something new; they were expected to assimilate into what was already here. but right now, there is nothing here. everyone is playing at a different beat, because the entire team lacks a metronome to keep everyone together.


if you just look at the positions of the players in the first two paragraphs:
maclin and jackson are WRs, mccoy is a RB, herremens is a OL, and cole is a DE
but with the 04 team, mcnabb was the QB, thomas was the LT, trotter was the MLB, dawkins was the FS. those are great players, and great leaders, but if you look at who's at those leadership positions for the eagles right now, you have vick at QB, dunlap at LT, ryans at MLB, and allen at FS. those are mediocre players, none of them have been with the eagles long enough to really set the expectations for the team as a whole.


admittedly this is a kind of psychobabble that would not at all be an issue if the team is playing well, but if you're looking for reasons why the team is underperforming, it's seems like a really good place to start.

steagles

you are smarter than this stuff. philadelphia stinks because their offense and special teams stink

this offense has an awful line and a wildly overrated quarterback

So, is Tony Romo just a terrible, terrible QB?

No, he has just been afflicted with a unique case of blue/white colorblindness. From week to week this may manifest itself as green/blue or red/white, but the main symptom is an inability to distinguish Cowboy receivers from defenders.

As to RG3, hadn't he completed 70% of his passes coming in? His receivers had a terrible day dropping the ball in the rain (and he didn't make it better on one play as a receiver himself, committing interference), but they'd been doing something right earlier this year. I think BourbonSamurai has the basic point: the Redskins need to concentrate now on building their defense, which makes the Cowboys' unit look like the Seven Blocks of Granite.

Seattle might be the best 4-4 team in the league and Detroit might be the best 3-4 team. Both have got to be absolutely kicking themselves right now. Detroit is two or three plays away from 5-2 and Seattle is a few plays away from 5-3.

Best news for Detroit is that 2011 Stafford showed up and picked apart a very good Seahawks defense. Bad news is they are in a loaded division and will have to probably have to go 6-3 down the stretch even to have a shot at the wildcard, the NFC is that tough this year.

Alot of people thought Detroit would fall back to 9-7 and miss the playoffs in a loaded division, those predictions are looking dead on. They are still 1-2 players on both sides of the ball away from moving out of the middle of the pack (they are there in record and DVOA) and towards the front. Their recent drafts have been mediocre at best at building the sort of depth necessary for that to happen.

___________

Also, Sanchez is Joey Harringon 2.0 Mediocre arm strength without the elite accuracy or pocket awareness to overcome it. Lack of playmakers around him as well. He'll be a backup QB the rest of his career after 2012.

Seattle is a few plays away from 5-3.

And one play away from 3-5.

mad

the lack of depth in detroit is evident on special teams which might be the worst in the league

And one play away from 3-5.

No doubt, every team other than the bottom feeders probably can point to 2-3 games during the season that they "should have won". It's what makes the NFL so fun and occasionally infuriating when it's the refs that influence those "1 or 2 plays".

________

the lack of depth in detroit is evident on special teams which might be the worst in the league

yea they suck, I cannot stand watching Logan return kicks and punts. He must have pictures of Schwartz with a dead girl or a live boy because he has cost them plenty this year with his crap returns and constant fumbles. Kickoff and punt cover teams suck as well.

As to RG3, hadn't he completed 70% of his passes coming in? His receivers had a terrible day dropping the ball in the rain (and he didn't make it better on one play as a receiver himself, committing interference), but they'd been doing something right earlier this year. I think BourbonSamurai has the basic point: the Redskins need to concentrate now on building their defense, which makes the Cowboys' unit look like the Seven Blocks of Granite.

That was a ridiculously bad call by the refs. Calling offensive PI on RGIII and then let him get destroyed by the defense a second later and not call it was disgusting. If it was made by a replacement ref, FOX, CBS, and ESPN would have already played it 1000 times by the halftime of the afternoon games.

I think Fox is just showing a replay of the Chargers-Broncos game instead of Cowboys-Giants.

yea they suck, I cannot stand watching Logan return kicks and punts. He must have pictures of Schwartz with a dead girl or a live boy because he has cost them plenty this year with his crap returns and constant fumbles. Kickoff and punt cover teams suck as well.

I know the NFL doesn't want to pay more players, but it probably makes sense for rosters to expand to 60 per team, so teams can roughly split their rosters 20 offense, 20 defense, and 20 special teams. The NFL is the only pro sport that is massively under rostered compared to other pro sports that have a minor league/collegiate comparison. The NFL could probably go to 85 roster spots and still be insanely profitable. Or maybe make a true minor league system for the NFL with the potential roster spots.

I think it is clear though that they have to do more than what they're doing in terms of roster management.

The teams each have 8 more guys who they're paying anyway so it would be incredibly easy to expand to 60.

Players on the practice squad make substantially less than active roster players. But yeah, the NFL can afford expanded rosters.

Bears win a game I can't believe they actually and once again they are saved by a QB throwing a ball right to a defender. Also the offensive line once again proves they suck. I have a feeling the Bears are going to get spanked in the playoffs should they get there this year.

The defense did not look good and the offense was downright terrible despite the fact that the Panthers were giving the Bears great field position virtually every time they kicked them the ball.

I pretty much agree with McCoy. It was nice to come away with a win, but the offense just looked awful.

Alot of people thought Detroit would fall back to 9-7 and miss the playoffs in a loaded division, those predictions are looking dead on. They are still 1-2 players on both sides of the ball away from moving out of the middle of the pack (they are there in record and DVOA) and towards the front. Their recent drafts have been mediocre at best at building the sort of depth necessary for that to happen.

I hate to blame everything on Matt Millen, but this Lions team is still recovering from the Millen era.

They are close to the cap because we are paying high priced draft picks (and having to overpay for free agents to come here) and that did not help in free agency, the Lions had little money to make moves. The draft had been used to draft starters for the most part and the late round guys have been used for special teams but they are also the bottom feeders that get churned out if they don't stick (see guys like Aaron Brown or Derrick Williams or Follett) and replaced.

The crazy thing about the special teams is that they have 2 guys who are considered the best in special teams coverage: Osgood and Wendling. Ashlee Palmer is not that bad either, but we had to use some scrubs because of injuries especially in the secondary where apparently the Lions hate to have healthy players-I swear I have not seen a team so injury-prone at one position like the Lions have been at CB this season and last year.

Special teams has been frustrating, but so has the offense all year. Hopefully the passing attack against Seattle-who has one of the better pass defenses in the NFL-is a sign of change. Stafford's 2 TD passes in the first half were his first 2 TD passes in the first half this season. And Stafford and Calvin Johnson have yet to connect on a TD pass all season.