BBTF.org/m/giants : Bochy declares takout slide on Scutaro ‘illegal’

Thursday, May 23, 2013

Five Notes On the Ridiculous Pablo Sandoval

(www.mccoveychronicles.com)

posted 2 days ago by zenbitz to fat ichiro, giants | 0 comment(s)

A teaser:

I can’t … It’s just … that is so beautiful and hilarious. Again, that’s batting-average against from the catcher’s perspective, so picture a lefty-swinging Sandoval with his back to you over on the right side of your screen. The place you go in the strike zone is in on his hands but, for goodness sake, don’t go too far in! If you miss outside the zone and come close to hitting him, he kind of rakes those pitches. Which doesn’t make sense. But, hey, neither does Sandoval. ...Read More...

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51. SuperGrover posted on October 16, 2012 at 12:52 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

@Harvey -

I did not have the context of the game thread. Again, if I apologize if I mis-inferred the message of your post.

52. Into the Void posted on October 16, 2012 at 01:03 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

Well, we obviously can't be sure. But we've all seen take out plays, and I don't think I've ever seen one where where the runner goes in chest first. If Holliday was trying to hurt Scutaro, he chose a weird way to go about it.

I'm a Giants fan but I don't think Holliday was trying to hurt Scutaro, and everything I've read since (from Holliday, Posey, and former teammate Affeldt) confirms it. My guess is that Holliday is just a big, awkward, slightly clumsy kind of guy who meant to take Scutaro out but came in late and couldn't control himself. His fielding would confirm this lack of body control/awkwardness.

53. The Chronicles of Reddick posted on October 16, 2012 at 01:10 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

LaRussa is on KNBR 680 am right now with Radnich and Krueger talking about the play at 2nd. He says that Holliday isn't a dirty player and he just slid late on the play.

54. Smiling Joe Hesketh posted on October 16, 2012 at 01:21 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

LaRussa is on KNBR 680 am right now with Radnich and Krueger talking about the play at 2nd. He says that Holliday isn't a dirty player and he just slid late on the play.

Stunning that LaRussa would defend his own.

The video posted of Holliday nearly killing Starlin Castro indicates otherwise.

55. baerga1 posted on October 16, 2012 at 01:35 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

Mr. Scutaro could learn a thing or two from my namesake:

link

link

56. Slivers of Maranville (SdeB) posted on October 16, 2012 at 01:40 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

As with nearly every rule in this game, it is completely left up to the judgement of the umpire. Thus, there is no wrong or right answer to whether it was illegal; it was legal because the umpire said so.

It's no wonder I find myself watching less and less baseball these days.

It's been that way for 150 years, and it's just now starting to bug you?

57. PreservedFish posted on October 16, 2012 at 01:46 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

I didn't think there was any ambiguity in Harvey's posts on the subject. He said it in #1: "i hate the idea of a guy missing playoff games or more due to this stuff."

58. The Chronicles of Reddick posted on October 16, 2012 at 01:47 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

Then again Krukow said it was "bush league" and woke up the Giants.

59. Sleepy supports unauthorized rambling posted on October 16, 2012 at 02:46 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

As a cardinals fan, I was pretty disgusted and embarassed by the slide. If H gets beaned over it, or spiked in the chest next time he slides into second, it's deserved. I can't imagine how I'd feel if I was a Giants fan. OTOH, i think it's a bit over the line to call for someone to intentionally hurt kozma or descalso.

The umpire definitely should have called interference, although there were certainly enough make-up calls later in the game...

60. KJOK posted on October 16, 2012 at 02:58 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

My guess is that Holliday is just a big, awkward, slightly clumsy kind of guy who meant to take Scutaro out but came in late and couldn't control himself. His fielding would confirm this lack of body control/awkwardness.

Definitely, although Holliday does ALWAYS go in hard to break up the double play. However, usually the 2nd baseman moves either in towards 3b or in some cases out towards Right Field to be out of his way while he barrels over the bag. What he NEVER does is 'chase' the 2b baseman by sliding out of the baseline like a lot of other runners do (where the umpire will sometimes call interference). I think he was genuinely surprised to have Scutaro still there, and actually looked like he awkwardly planted his foot to try to stop himself.

61. Slivers of Maranville (SdeB) posted on October 16, 2012 at 03:01 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

What he NEVER does is 'chase' the 2b baseman by sliding out of the baseline like a lot of other runners do (where the umpire will sometimes call interference).

Castro, above.

62. Fred Lynn Nolan Ryan Sweeney Agonistes posted on October 16, 2012 at 03:10 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

Then again Krukow said it was "bush league" and woke up the Giants.

"I wasn't going to get a hit this time up... but now that one of their runners hurt my teammate, I'm going to get a hit! RARRRRRR!"

63. salvomania posted on October 16, 2012 at 03:18 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

What he NEVER does is 'chase' the 2b baseman by sliding out of the baseline like a lot of other runners do (where the umpire will sometimes call interference).

Too bad the same can't be said about not chasing the SS (see link in #29)

EDIT: Coke to SdeB

64. jacksone (AKA It's OK...) posted on October 16, 2012 at 03:36 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

What he NEVER does is 'chase' the 2b baseman by sliding out of the baseline like a lot of other runners do

What a fantastic post. An all-caps absolute that is directly contradicted by a previous example in this very thread.

65. rlc posted on October 16, 2012 at 04:14 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

While the main attraction of the video in #14 is the unapologetic violence of Morgan's roll block, I can't help noticing that in both the forceouts Green is taking the throw with his body on the first base side of the bag at second. In the gif from #16, which must have been between 4 and 8 years later, Randolph is set up on the third base side, as was Scutaro last night. Setting up on the first base side seems very risky, and I suspect doesn't happen nearly as much these days - does that match with other people's observations?

66. Ray (RDP)

posted on October 16, 2012 at 04:29 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

I'd like to see these kinds of slides end. (As well as the collisions at home, which is a similar but different issue.)

"Damn, we are about to hit into a double play, let me maim the pivot man" is no justification to hurt a player. At least the jackass plowing into home is trying to score.

67. Harveys Wallbangers

posted on October 16, 2012 at 04:29 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

dick green was a fearless second baseman. i think that had more to do with it than anything else.

68. pep21 posted on October 16, 2012 at 05:02 PM # hit 0 | hit 0

Stop talking about it and just drill Holliday. Case closed.

69. DFA posted on October 17, 2012 at 12:38 AM # hit 0 | hit 0

I'm surprised Vogelsong didn't hit Holliday in the back so we could all move on..

70. KJOK posted on October 17, 2012 at 01:46 AM # hit 0 | hit 0

What a fantastic post. An all-caps absolute that is directly contradicted by a previous example in this very thread.

Well, gee, I'm sorry I didn't click on every link of takeouts in the thread. Obviously NEVER was too strong as I apparently didn't see that particular game (looks like a Game of Week, and we probably got a different one where I live), and in that case interference clearly should have been called, but I have seen probably 300 games of Holliday's the past 4 years, and normally he takes a direct route right over the base even though he does often slide late and hard.

71. KJOK posted on October 17, 2012 at 01:52 AM # hit 0 | hit 0

72. Russ posted on October 17, 2012 at 06:59 AM # hit 0 | hit 0

Stop talking about it and just drill Holliday. Case closed.

Obviously you've never seen the Growing Pains episode about the war with the neighbors.

73. bunyon posted on October 17, 2012 at 09:20 AM # hit 0 | hit 0

I'm surprised Vogelsong didn't hit Holliday in the back so we could all move on..

It's the playoffs. You don't put guys on, just cause. Let him stew. Best case: Holliday worries about it and hits less than he would've. Worst case: you drill him in the spring.

I'm not saying if you have a chance to land on him or something in the next 3-5 games, you don't take it. But I wouldn't go putting runners on unless it's a blowout.

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Thursday, May 23, 2013

Five Notes On the Ridiculous Pablo Sandoval

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