Apparently a vaguely interested Walker was good enough to be real-life, medium-sized Hall of Fame good.

Imagine how good Joe Jackson must have been, batting .375, hitting a HR and driving in 6 runs in the 1919 World Series while simultaneously actively trying to lose games.

the knock on Walker being - he made everything look effortless, which sometimes led to the perception that the effort level wasn't 100%.

Did Joe DiMaggio ever get this kind of stuff? I've read about how his "long, loping strides" made both baserunning and covering a lot of ground in Yankee Stadium look "effortless", but I've never read that he was actually criticized by the press for being perceived as "lackadaisical". Whereas Ted Williams heard that kind of stuff from the Boston press all the time (perhaps deserving it sometimes, but I wonder how much of the commentary at the time was due to the player himself and how much was due to differences between Boston and NY press).

I think that's part of the point. For a long time writers didn't understand park effects. Then when Coors presented a stark example of the issue to them, they proved they still didn't understand park effects by simply separating Coors from every other park instead of realizing that every other park needs to be adjusted as well using similar methodology. So they over-compensated for Coors by concluding that the presence of Coors made every performance that looked great simply a mirage. Thus, there was no way, in their minds, to actually put up a great performance in Coors.

Actually, Ray, I've seen just the opposite reactions from some writers and especially casual fans (and what else are most writers but casual fans?). I've been at Padres games against the Rockies in years past where Colorado fans were raving about Galarraga, or Helton, or Walker - whoever was winning batting titles at the time - and when I tried to point out how much they were being helped out by their home park, the response was "well, Ted Williams had help from Fenway, too". Which is true to an extent, but the thing they couldn't understand was the degree to which playing in Denver helps a batter. There have been several years where Coors Field altered scoring so much that Fenway Park or Wrigley Field even in a year when the wind blows out a lot look like the Astrodome by comparison.

And I 100% guarantee that most writers - and fans, for that matter - still don't understand park effects to this day. A lot of the Miguel Cabrera supporters on this very website in recent months - generally fairly knowledgeable baseball fans - couldn't understand how park effects could make Trout's hitting numbers alone approximate Miggy's value offensively - without even having to take baserunning and fielding into consideration which would give Trout a huge edge. Anaheim being a pitcher's park is not some new sudden one-year variation, it has played that way for the last decade. Similarly, Comerica favors hitters pretty consistently. You have to take those things into consideration if you want to accurately measure value, and many fans - and almost 100% of all BBWAA members - don't have a clue about how to do that.

i don't believe for one second that larry walker didn't always give his best effort AND, like adam everett, he DID make it look easy. even when he was old and hurt he was a SMART baserunner and one of the 3 best i've seen in my lifetime of NL watching. he was a SMART basestealer, too. he was a GREAT fielder with a dead accurate arm and he didn't miss the effing cutoff man neither. all around just really great player - better than andre dawson, and more deserving than edgar martinez who was just a glorified pinch hitter.

and so he took a week off when his BEST FRIEND died? well, if that ain't a worthless weakass wimpy p*ssy thing to do i don't know what is. real men don't need more than 24 hours to deal with someone they love dying in some horrible crash.

12 - 14 hall of famers on one ballot and no electees - what horsepoopoo

And I 100% guarantee that most writers - and fans, for that matter - still don't understand park effects to this day. A lot of the Miguel Cabrera supporters on this very website in recent months - generally fairly knowledgeable baseball fans - couldn't understand how park effects could make Trout's hitting numbers alone approximate Miggy's value offensively - without even having to take baserunning and fielding into consideration which would give Trout a huge edge. Anaheim being a pitcher's park is not some new sudden one-year variation, it has played that way for the last decade.

The problem is Tiger park going from one of the better pitchers park in baseball to one of the better hitters parks (even with the fence brought in) is a little extreme. On top of that, there is something screwy going on in the AL west in which two or three of the best pitchers parks in the league reside there. On top of that, Anaheim went from a neutral(98-100 park factor to a very good pitchers park 92 the last two years) Did the addition of Yankee stadium make that much of a difference?

On top of that, there is something screwy going on in the AL west in which two or three of the best pitchers parks in the league reside there.

Actually, is there something in the weather patterns happening here? Coastal winds or humidity, being at sea level, something like that? It now seems like the entire West Coast (San Diego, LA, Anaheim, Oakland, SF, Seattle) consists of nothing but extreme pitcher's parks.

I think there's the feeling that there must have been a HoF-caliber starter who debuted between 1970 and 1984, and Morris, right now, is the only eligible guy.

This is actually a pretty good argument IMO, even if it required pruning of superior players to get there.

Actually, is there something in the weather patterns happening here? Coastal winds or humidity, being at sea level, something like that? It now seems like the entire West Coast (San Diego, LA, Anaheim, Oakland, SF, Seattle) consists of nothing but extreme pitcher's parks

Some people have mentioned that as a possibility. I do not know, but I don't take park factors 100% accurate over the last couple of years, especially in regards to the west coast teams.

I think there's the feeling that there must have been a HoF-caliber starter who debuted between 1970 and 1984, and Morris, right now, is the only eligible guy.


This is actually a pretty good argument IMO, even if it required pruning of superior players to get there.

It's about the only argument that is decent for Morris.

A lot of newspaper bloggers don't have any editors these days. Not to defend Santayana-style errors, but that's how the world works now.

the knock on Walker being - he made everything look effortless, which sometimes led to the perception that the effort level wasn't 100%.

Did Joe DiMaggio ever get this kind of stuff? I've read about how his "long, loping strides" made both baserunning and covering a lot of ground in Yankee Stadium look "effortless",

Perhaps Dimaggio was considered to be America's first black centerfielder.

And I 100% guarantee that most writers - and fans, for that matter - still don't understand park effects to this day.

To that you can add the number of people who cite overall park effects in asymmetrical ballparks without factoring in the different effects for right handed and left handed batters, or for pull hitters and all-field hitters. How can anyone possibly equate the park effects in the first Yankee Stadium for Joe Dimaggio and Yogi Berra?

To that you can add the number of people who cite overall park effects in asymmetrical ballparks without factoring in the different effects for right handed and left handed batters, or for pull hitters and all-field hitters. How can anyone possibly equate the park effects in the first Yankee Stadium for Joe Dimaggio and Yogi Berra?

As far as value is concerned, it doesn't matter whether the park is beneficial to lefties or righties. The only reason to bother learning that type of stuff, is if you are acquiring a player for your park, but for evaluating the players value, it doesn't matter in the slightest.

To that you can add the number of people who cite overall park effects in asymmetrical ballparks without factoring in the different effects for right handed and left handed batters, or for pull hitters and all-field hitters.

Who cares? Value is value is value. A RH hitter with a 140 OPS+ playing half his games in Yankee Stadium might be more talented than a LH hitter with a 140 OPS+ playing half his games in Yankee Stadium, but each is helping his team score runs just as much as the other.