Go to end of page
Statements posted here are those of our readers and do not represent the BaseballThinkFactory. Names are provided by the poster and are not verified. We ask that posters follow our submission policy. Please report any inappropriate comments.
His ERA was higher because much of his career took place during the height of the so-called steroids era. Offensive numbers were inflated across the board.
Also: Jack Morris was retired by 1995. Before you start talking about the era when Morris pitched, you might try actually learning when that was.
Maybe it’s a Detroit whine, but there does seem to be a slanted view with voters, which doesn’t give Morris and Alan Trammell, his shortstop with the Tigers, their due. It’s absurd Lou Whitaker didn’t stay on the ballot past his first season of eligibility. I don’t hear the battle cry from the Sabermetrics crowd for Trammell, who has not come close to election, even though he had a better career WAR than Barry Larkin, and isn’t much behind Derek Jeter and Ozzie Smith. Whitaker had a far better WAR than Craig Biggio, who will probably get in this year, and so did Trammell. In fact, Whitaker had the same career WAR, essentially, as Reggie Jackson, and much higher than Roberto Alomar.
Because Trammell did all the little, non-glamorous things that help a team win--defense, baserunning, etc that only the practiced eye of a sportswriter can appreciate.
Pos's take on this column.
I’m sure this column will be covered at length by the folks over at Baseball Think Factory. Fish. Barrel.
why is the title: "by any standard"
Enough! Let's just vote on the ten WORST players to play ten years and be eligible for the HOF
It's early, so I read the "Sabermetrics has its flaws" as "Saberhagen has his flaws." Comparing Jack Morris to Bret Saberhagen could be a thing.
LeMaster's list of appearances on leaderboards is outstanding.
Pretty cool that Doug Flynn and Darrell Chaney, another 10-year negative WAR guy, were the backup DP combination for a team that won 108 games.
Rk Yrs From To1 Lenny Harris 11 1989 20022 Dante Bichette 10 1990 20013 Doc Cramer 10 1933 19454 Charlie Grimm 10 1920 19335 Mark Loretta 9 1997 20096 Brad Ausmus 9 1994 20077 Alfredo Griffin 9 1980 19918 Bill Buckner 9 1971 19889 Don Kessinger 9 1965 197810 Tommy Dowd 9 1891 1901
Rk Yrs From To1 Jason Marquis 8 2001 20132 Jamie Moyer 8 1987 20103 Mike Caldwell 8 1972 19844 Jim Lonborg 8 1965 19785 Bill Dietrich 8 1935 1945
The more I think about it, there really is kind of a Grand Unified Theory of Jack (The Jack).
Lots of wins but a mediocre ERA: pitching to the score!
Most wins of the 80s: pitching to the era!
Lots of CGs/8+ inning starts: pitching to the ninth!
I'm not sure how to work Game 7 into this, though.
But Sabermetrics has its flaws. One of them, for evaluation purposes regarding the Hall, is not accounting enough for statistics era to era. A 3.00 ERA in 1968 didn’t mean nearly as much as a 3.00 ERA in 1995, for example.
Most seasons with 1.0 WAR or less, 100+ G, since 1890
Rk Yrs From To
1 Lenny Harris 11 1989 2002
2 Dante Bichette 10 1990 2001
3 Doc Cramer 10 1933 1945
4 Charlie Grimm 10 1920 1933
5 Mark Loretta 9 1997 2009
I don’t hear the battle cry from the Sabermetrics crowd for Trammell,
And this fascination with Smith is just beyond my understanding. IMHO I see relief pitching as purely a part time job who's importance is way overblown. Only the absolute best of all time(Mariano) or guys who did some combination of starting and relieving like Eck or Wilhelm should even be considered. The impact that a guy who only throws 1000 innings in a career is minimal.
Doug Flynn is a good candidate, he was a no hit, good field player except that he actually wasn't a good fielder. He just fooled people into thinking he was because he didn't make errors.
Morris' backers really sell the 1991 Game 7 10-inning shutout thing. What I wonder is - had Lonnie Smith not been fooled into stopping at third base in the 8th inning of that game - and had Atlanta been the 1-0 winner instead of Minnesota - would Morris even still be on the ballot today?
Does Bill Mazeroski get into the Hall if Rocky Nelson makes the play on Mickey Mantle in the top of the ninth?
I don’t hear the battle cry from the Sabermetrics crowd for Trammell, who has not come close to election, even though he had a better career WAR than Barry Larkin,
You must be Registered and Logged In to post comments.
Login to Join (1 members)
Page rendered in 0.7506 seconds, 58 querie(s) executed