I watched that game in a bar in Fort Lee, NJ. I rmember leaping off my stool when Knight cold-cocked Davis...

Those were the days.

An interesting game from a rules perspective, because the current rule against circulating the pitcher on and off the mound multiple times appears to have been in effect. Orosco switched places with McDowell and then switched back, but it happened at the start of innings and wasn't repeated again. Count me as thinking the rule is profoundly no fun. You should be able to platoon pitchers by rotating them in and out of the outfield à la cricket. If you want to combine that with loss of the DH, in a DH league, so be it, but otherwise I see no good reason to disallow the practice except you don't want baseball to be fun or interesting.

Always fun to read about a game you were at. My dad and I were at that game; we were Mets fans who lived about an hour from Cincinnati, and we drove down. What's most memorable to me is Parker flubbing Hernandez's liner to right in the 9th that would have ended the game, but instead allowed the Mets to tie it.

I was excited, my dad was too, but also a little disappointed that the game wasn't ending and he still had a drive ahead of him that he really didn't want to make.

It's only in retrospect that I see how interesting Davey Johnson was as a manager.

I goofed in my description of Sid Fernandez, who was an extreme FLYBALL pitcher, and in that same paragraph I should say that Rafael Santana had a SUPERIOR glove. Just wasn't thinking straight when I wrote that paragraph (and said the opposite of what's here).

IIRC 40 year old rusty stab was the OF flipping back and forth for McDowell and Orosco. As judge of the Mets kangaroo court he fined his manager for abuse of seniors after the game


Edit
Just checked the box score.... My memory failed me. That must have been a different year.

IIRC 40 year old rusty stab was the OF flipping back and forth for McDowell and Orosco. As judge of the Mets kangaroo court he fined his manager for abuse of seniors after the game
Edit
Just checked the box score.... My memory failed me. That must have been a different year.

that was this game. And he only switched once--played RF with a RH batter, then switched to left when Jason Thompson came up. Davey didn't want to put Staub in harm's way out there

I see no good reason to disallow the practice except you don't want baseball to be fun or interesting.

If they were switching off at an infield position, it wouldn't be too bad, but geez, aren't the games slow enough already?

it wouldn't be too bad, but geez, aren't the games slow enough already?

At least wait until La Russa is safely retired.

I see no good reason to disallow the practice except you don't want baseball to be fun or interesting.

Absolutely. I would love to see a platoon combine for a complete game. I suppose, to make it work, you would need two Brooks Kieschnicks of opposite handedness.

I've never heard of this rule. THis has nothing to do with the tie AS Game does it? I always assumed they just stopped because they didn't want to put a position player on the mound....which is silly because:

1) You play til there's a winner.

2) In 2008 (I think) J.D. Drew was fully prepared to take the mound.

Thanks for finding the game Pasta.

It's not related to the All-Star Game; the rule in question is a sentence in 3.03 that says

A pitcher may change to another position only once during the same inning; e.g. the pitcher will not be allowed to assume a position other than a pitcher more than once in the same inning.

I don't think there's any reason except to cut down on managerial shenanigans. As PreservedFish says, you'd need two guys who could plausibly hit and field another position to make it work for any length of time, but I don't see why for an inning or two, while you were avoiding the pitcher's spot in the batting order, you couldn't employ it as a risky venture with potential payoff. It might even save time; I wouldn't envision giving the pitchers warm-up tosses each time they switched out, just have them sprint between positions.

It's certainly no more a mockery of the game than the current parade of relievers. Cripes sake, the other night I watched Octavio Dotel leave a 10-run game after throwing a 4-pitch perfect inning. Why did I need to see the next reliever get warmup tosses at that point in the evening?

An interesting game from a rules perspective, because the current rule against circulating the pitcher on and off the mound multiple times appears to have been in effect. Orosco switched places with McDowell and then switched back, but it happened at the start of innings and wasn't repeated again. Count me as thinking the rule is profoundly no fun. You should be able to platoon pitchers by rotating them in and out of the outfield à la cricket. If you want to combine that with loss of the DH, in a DH league, so be it, but otherwise I see no good reason to disallow the practice except you don't want baseball to be fun or interesting.
,

Totally agree. I actually didn't know you couldn't do it anymore. I remember watching a game on WGN once where Don Zimmer did it and I'm telling you, my ten year old mind was BLOWN.

Nice to see Rick Aguilera reach on a PH BB, he actually had a decent bat. In addition to running around the field, Orosco walked and scored on HoJo's 14th inn HR. The 2nd of Orosco's 3 career runs.

I remember lou put a pitcher in the outfield brought another one in and after the one batter removed the pitcher and brought the other one back on the mound

Alvin Dark did it with with Sudden Sam, so he didn't have to face Frank Howard (who pwned him) He moved McDowell to 2nd base in one game and to 1st in another

I saw Bobby Cox do this a few years ago.

NY Times story

According to the story Roger McDowell was the one that recommended it. Pretty cool.

I have no idea why I would have been watching an early April game between the Braves and Pirates. Maybe he did this more than once?

Alvin Dark did it with with Sudden Sam, so he didn't have to face Frank Howard (who pwned him) He moved McDowell to 2nd base in one game and to 1st in another

In the first game you posted, when McDowell went to second base, Dean Chance came in to face Howard - and intentionally walked him. Why couldn't McDowell have done that?

#7:
that was this game. And he only switched once--played RF with a RH batter, then switched to left when Jason Thompson came up.

That's incorrect-- or rather, the BB-Ref boxscore is tragically incomplete. Rusty Staub played defense for seven innings, and switched positions several times. He made a gave-saving catch in the top of the 18th.

Count me as thinking the rule is profoundly no fun.

Agreed. It's double-dumb horsesh!t.

...but otherwise I see no good reason to disallow the practice except you don't want baseball to be fun or interesting.

You do realize Bud Selig is the commissioner of baseball?

In the first game you posted, when McDowell went to second base, Dean Chance came in to face Howard - and intentionally walked him. Why couldn't McDowell have done that?

I happened to be at that game,and they came out smelling like a rose. What happened was, Chance DID pitch to Howard at first, but after the count went to 2-0, they decided to walk him. Then, Reichard hit a one-hopper to 3rd, and even though Leon had plenty of time to go to first, he decided to go the short way to McDowell at 2nd, who wasn't expecting it (but, to his credit, he was covering), and he made an awkward catch and the side was retired

That's incorrect-- or rather, the BB-Ref boxscore is tragically incomplete. Rusty Staub played defense for seven innings, and switched positions several times. He made a gave-saving catch in the top of the 18th.

now that you mention it--you're right--I remember Staub trotting (very non-gracefully) between LF and RF several times in that game

the retrosheet box score is more accurate, but simply says: "Staub and Hurdle alternated
between left and right depending on batter handedness. It is not clear if they did it for every batter, so the change will only be listed once here, but it apparently happened several times"

I seem to remember Roger Craig doing this unsuccessfully with the Giants. My memory is that one of the relief pitchers served up a game winning home run that flew right over the head of the other relief pitcher watching pretty helplessly in the field.

I seem to remember Roger Craig doing this unsuccessfully with the Giants. My memory is that one of the relief pitchers served up a game winning home run that flew right over the head of the other relief pitcher watching pretty helplessly in the field.

That's the big chance you take and with today's media and the CYA attitude of many managers, its hard to see it happening today if they hadn't changed the rule. The first time a pitcher in rightfield drops a routine fly ball, the media will call you an idiot unless you're a TLR or someone of that stature.

Bob Dernier Cri, thank you for noting 3.03. I also did not know you couldn't do it anymore.

Besides the Staub and Hurdle game, the Jose Oquendo pitching game of 1988 (Braves @ Cardinals) featured two alternating Cardinals corner outfielders, one of them a pitcher, in extra-inning madness. I believe Whitey Herzog was using platoon matchups to protect "outfielder" Jose DeLeon. After seemingly every Braves AB, there was a longish delay as DeLeon and Tom Brunansky trudged across center field, crossing paths to take their new positions.

Retrosheet box score via B-R

I believe Whitey Herzog was using platoon matchups to protect "outfielder" Jose DeLeon. After seemingly every Braves AB, there was a longish delay as DeLeon and Tom Brunansky trudged across center field, crossing paths to take their new positions.

and after all that, it ended up not working because, according to the box score, Griffey Sr. hit a double to left field (where DeLeon was playing) to score 2 runs