I still can't believe this is real. I keep looking at twitter waiting for it to come undone. I'm not convinced until I see each three in Dodger blue.

According to Heyman, the Dodgers chartered a flight to bring Gonzalez, Beckett, and Punto to LA in time for tonight's game. They're already en route.

"the winner is Carl Crawford. He had to get out of that stadium, if there is one stadium in baseball designed to counter all his value/skills, it's Fenway. He's going to go out and post 115+ ops+"

He is a lifetime 105+ player as a corner outfielder (where players are expected to hit). He is on the wrong side of 30. He isn't worth half his contract now, and the divergence will get dramatically bigger, every year. It was brilliant for the Red Sox to dump him. He is chum, but paid as if he were caviar.

this is fun stuff.

Isn't it? I am thrilled to near-tears. I hate it when it's obvious the team is going nowhere, and this is the first year in a long time that's been the case.

I like that this got done during the waiver period.

I posted this in the Sox Therapy thread about the deal, but I think it's a big enough point that it should be made here as well: with the new compensation system, only the top 10 draft picks are protected if you're trying to sign free agents who have had the qualify offer extended by their old teams. So if the Red Sox can tank enough in September to get a top 10 draft pick, they'll be in a position where they can sign as many high end free agents as they want while merely losing their 2nd round pick.

I'm still a proponent of the unprovable "if the clubhouse is a disaster it won't matter much who's on your team" idea.

Like the A's squads of the early 70's or the Yankee squads of the late 70's?

James Loney--now that's the kind of guy you want playing first base. He's a real funeral attender.

I thought Selig still had to sign off on the deal. Has he done so yet?

Someone in this thread posited a 3 year, $45 million deal for Crawford if he were a free agent. I think he's a lot closer to Grady Sizemore's 1 year $5 million who knows? deal.

MLBTradeRumors says that De La Rosa is included technically as a PTBNL, since the Blue Jays claimed him off waivers. This seems like a glaring loophole in waiver trading, has it been used before?

Looking at my BTF "account statistics," I joined up on May 4, 2004. Today is the most important day at BTF since I joined. Basically, the core of this site is Boston Red Sox, with enough generality to avoid SoSH status. That core has paradigmatically changed today (last night) now.

Yes, since my being here there's been a World Series Win. And another. But, as of today, the Red Sox are officially "rebuilding." Yankees/Red Sox is back to what it meant when Pumpsie Green was a Sox. We're pre-Bernie Carbo, in a sense, at this point. The trade is like a time machine. It will be interesting to see how this affects everything from ESPN ratings to BTF.

@shredderpunto #dodgers doing it first class! (Photo of Gonzalez, Beckett, and Punto on the Dodgers' plane.)

Edit: Thanks to Lassus for catching my error (now fixed).

De La Rosa seems like Franklin Morales part 2.

OK, thanks for info on Crawford.

The Dodgers seem to be looking at buzz factor/LA eyeballs/bandwidth here as well:

Angels-have Trout, Weaver, and Pujols
Lakers-have Bryant, added Nash and Howard
Clippers-have Paul and Griffin, added Odom
Kings-won Stanley Cup
USC football-off probation, ranked #1 in preseason polls
UCLA basketball-had huge recruiting year, going back to renovated Pauley

So, even with no NFL team in LA, there is a lot going on in LA sports right now, but adding Victorino, Ramirez, Gonzalez, Beckett, and Crawford will keep people talking/writing Dodgers the rest of the way, particularly if they can win the NL West and the Angels miss postseason entirely.

asinwrek - you linked back here -

http://twitter.com/Shredderpunto/status/239433228858044416/photo/1

As a non-Sox fan, I find #112 totally bizarre.

Trust me, Preserved Fish, I'm not a Red Sox fan either.

#112 -- I dunno, that seems too cute by half. It's like saying the Yalta Conference was more
important than Operation Overlord.

Quick, someone murder Tommy Lasorda so we can see if Beckett goes to the funeral.

#112 is annoyingly moronic for two reasons:

1. There is no Red Sox core to BBTF.
2. Go look at the Pirates or current Astros for an example of a rebuilding team.

I happened to have SportsCenter on for a bit this morning, and there was a piece covering a lot like what is in 115. They didn't include Greinke either. I have my biases as a Brewer fan, but it struck me as odd to leave his acquisition out.

Then I checked how he has done with the Angels, and saw the reason.

Greinke

Greinke is pretty well-known, and has his hook, but he is not as big of a name locally/nationally as the others. Also, neither Greinke nor the team has done well since he was acquired, as you note. Jared Weaver is a SoCal guy. Lamar Odom is not a household name, but he is married to a Kardashian and has played most of his career in Los Angeles.

The guys the Dodgers got are not superfamous to casual fans, but they were all acquired from teams with high media profiles (even the Marlins were buzzy early in the season), so in that respect it is different than the Angels getting Greinke in a typical deadline deal.

I'm a Red Sox fan and I find #112 totally baffling.

@ 113 -- those guys sure look happy.

WRT to 112, I sort of get it, since there are more vocal Red Sox fans here than fans of any other team except maybe the Mets or the Yankees, but I don't see it affecting BTF at all. The kinds of guys who post here:

a) Mostly like the trade for Boston
b) Are generally very interested in stuff like WAR/$ and "market inefficiencies", so they will be more intrigued by the Red Sox than ever. We will see a lot of threads about how the Red Sox "leverage their new payroll flexibility" etc. Even if the Red Sox just suck next year, those guys will still talk about them all the time, and power to them.

I don't know how the more casual/talk radio side of the Boston fanbase will react to this; I would guess a mix of "Good riddance" and "They sold us out!"

I do think there's a strong Sox core, going by traffic on ST and Sox chatter vs the paucity of activity on others. Yankee fans seem the second-largest contingent, but the chatter's all but dead and there's no equivalent to ST.

As for the rest of 112, I'm not sure what the point was.

2. Go look at the Pirates or current Astros for an example of a rebuilding team.

The Astros have dynamited their team, it's still an open question if they are going to rebuild it.

WRT to 112, I sort of get it, since there are more vocal Red Sox fans here than fans of any other team except maybe the Mets or the Yankees, but I don't see it affecting BTF at all.

Yankees fans have been dwindling over the years and Mets fans have really thinned over the last two. I think the Sox have it clearly.

I don't think it will impact BTF at all. There is more than enough wide spread chatter here to offset any decline that may come from a lesser Sox team. I think if the Sox go through a decade long stretch of 70 win seasons that could have an impact but I doubt that is happening.

And even if it did, I think RobinRed's point is a good one. Those of us who are Sox fans are going to chatter endlessly about these guys no matter what, we're a bit twisted.

Post-trade, I do find the Red Sox more interesting, going forward. They've been a terribly hard team to like over the past year or so.

2013 should be a bridge year, where the Red Sox balance present and future goals with more of a tilt to the future, but they should not "punt" on a $170M budget with the core talent they still have

What core? They've got a legitimate star left (Pedroia) and he's coming off a down year and his second injury shortened year in the last three. Some guys who are capable of being stars but haven't been this year and are not locks to rebound (Ellsbury, Lester). They have some young guys who are good, but none scream frontline talent (Dubront, Buchholz, Middlebrooks). Their bullpen isn't anything special and obviously has some health issues. Salty is alright for a cheap catcher, but he also has a .285 OBP. That's not a core that's going to match up well with the Yanks or the Rays. Am I missing something?

I posted this in the Sox Therapy thread about the deal, but I think it's a big enough point that it should be made here as well: with the new compensation system, only the top 10 draft picks are protected if you're trying to sign free agents who have had the qualify offer extended by their old teams. So if the Red Sox can tank enough in September to get a top 10 draft pick, they'll be in a position where they can sign as many high end free agents as they want while merely losing their 2nd round pick.

Theoretically, they could lose their 2nd, 3rd, 4th, etc. In reality, I don't think we're going to see all that many qualifying offers made, since a team losing a FA only gains a sandwich pick.

MLBTradeRumors says that De La Rosa is included technically as a PTBNL, since the Blue Jays claimed him off waivers. This seems like a glaring loophole in waiver trading, has it been used before?

It's not really a loophole. It just means that they won't get De La Rosa until after the end of the season. So if he was someone that the Dodgers needed this year, they may not have done the deal.

I think.

Looking at my BTF "account statistics," I joined up on May 4, 2004. Today is the most important day at BTF since I joined. Basically, the core of this site is Boston Red Sox, with enough generality to avoid SoSH status.

I just threw up in my mouth. If I thought that was remotely true, I'd stop coming here. Nothing against Sox fans, but mainstream media is already extremely BoSox-heavy. The last thing the world needs is another Sox-centric arena.

Your 2013 Out Of My Ass Red Sox, after a brief look at their organizational info and Cot's contracts:

C: Salty/Napoli platoon (Napoli FA 3/21)
1B: Napoli/Reynolds platoon (Reynolds FA 2/14)
2B: Laser Show
SS: Stephen Drew (FA, 2/18)
3B: WMB
RF: Justin Upton (Trade)
CF: Ellsbury
LF: Torii Hunter (FA, 2/18)
DH: Papi w/ Reynolds on days off.

Util OF: Sands/Sweeney
Util IF: Ciriaco/Iglesias

SP: King Felix (Trade)
SP: Zack Greinke (FA 5/100)
SP: Lester
SP: Buchholz
SP: Doubront
CL: Bailey
8th: Bard
7th: Aceves/Morales
LOOGY: Some Dude
LR: Lackey

Contract amounts are also pulled completely out of my ass. So are trades, In my CFBPS world the Sox landed Hernandez without giving up Boegarts.

Napoli will ask for almost double that. Reynolds and Hunter are better off on other teams. Upton means trading Xander and Barnes. If we can get Drew for 9 per we should go five years.

Napoli at 1B by himself, Lavarnway at C. Sands/Sweeney might handle one of the corners.

King Felix... is this the Onion?

Do the Red Sox really have the trade chits to get both Felix Hernandez and Justin Upton? Upton, I guess, since there's always a good chance the Diamondbacks will do something dumb, like take Bailey and Ciriaco for him.

RF: Justin Upton (Trade)
SP: King Felix (Trade)

Who are they going to give up to get these guys? Nothing but minor leaguers?

C: Salty/Napoli platoon (Napoli FA 3/21)
SS: Stephen Drew (FA, 2/18)
SP: Zack Greinke (FA 5/100)

Napoli's going to want at ~12 million and Drew's going to want a lot more than 2 years. And do you really want to be the team that gives Greinke $100 million?

SP: King Felix (Trade)

Nope.

Reynolds sucks.
Napoli is okay but will cost more than that and isn't a great fit with Lavarnway around, there are better ways to spend that money.
Reynolds completely sucks.
Drew is questionable after his injury issues and also probably not signing that contract.
Justin Upton could happen, but I have no idea what Arizona expects in return at this point.
Torii Hunter would be a waste of money and is a terrible fit for this team.
The Mariners aren't trading Felix, I wish Red Sox fans would just shut the #### up about Felix Hernandez.
Greinke in this market for the money he's going to command? Iffy proposition.
Lackey is in the rotation. Deal with it.

Napoli might want 12m/year, but what are teams really going to give him? He's going to be a 31 year old with one excellent season under his belt, whose teams don't use him exclusively as a catcher, and coming off a good but not great season.

I also don't see Drew getting a long deal, but that's more of an open question. I'm guessing the A's don't pick up his 10m dollar option, and if I'm wrong on that then I'm clearly not understanding his market value.

Reynolds won't have that many suitors. He's the modern day Dave Kingman. He is only 28, so some team might want to make him their starter.

Greinke is probably not the best choice to spend 100m on. I don't think anyone is, this offseason. That's a guess at what it'd take to sign him, though, considering other recent pitchers deals. And at 5 years he'd only be 34 when the contract was over.

Felix, yeah. A boy can dream. The rotation in 2013 is likely to be Lester, Buchholz, Lackey, Doubront, Fill-In-Name-Here.

I don't think there's going to be much of a market for Torii Hunter, who remains a very useful ballplayer and who won't command a long contract. He's been a ~3 WAR player each year the last 3 years, and at short money makes a lot of sense for the Red Sox given the dearth of other options.

I thought BTF at its core was a bunch of libertarian lawyers.

Wow, Danny Glover and Neil Armstrong die on the same day. That's weird.

I don't think there's going to be much of a market for Torii Hunter, who remains a very useful ballplayer and who won't command a long contract. He's been a ~3 WAR player each year the last 3 years, and at short money makes a lot of sense for the Red Sox given the dearth of other options.

The parallels to Mike Cameron after 2009 are eerie.

I'd bet on Napoli but catchers with 1.000 OPS seasons, even one of them are rare. He makes sense as it gives the team enough flexibility with Lavarnway to have three catchers without making special room for three as Napoli plays 1B.

Reynolds is horrible even when he's at his best. He can't field or hit.

Drew is an SS who has had a couple .800 seasons and is still young. I can't see him not getting 4-5 years.

Hunter wouldn't bother me for a year or two.

Wow, Danny Glover and Neil Armstrong die on the same day. That's weird.

What's weird is that Danny Glover isn't dead, at least according to Google.

I thought BTF at its core was a bunch of libertarian lawyers.

Libertarian lawyers, sure, but they're also mostly Red Sox fans who love steroids and root for the Three True Outcomes, live in their momma's basement, get all their facts of life and sport from porno sites and BB-Reference, and think that the postseason is wildly overrated by unfair HoF voters who don't have a clue about what the game is really all about. Have I left anything out?

I'm a Red Sox fan and I find #112 totally baffling.

I think there's a pretty good chance that alcohol was involved.

What's weird is that Danny Glover isn't dead, at least according to Google.

What's weirder is that I thought he died a few weeks ago.