#48: As far as I've seen, MMORPGs are about the largest, riskiest thing you can do in computer gaming nowadays and 38 Studios simply did not appear to comprehend this. They seemed to think they could bring in ringers (to the extent that RA Salvatore and his crappy writing is a "ringer") and still build it in a fraction of the time and something like 1/5th the cost of other MMORPGs.

I guess it's not patently obvious to people not familiar with computer games but that's part of the deal here: if you're going to loan that kind of money to someone, you really need to go out and find people who are familiar with the industry you're loaning things to. Anyone with a passing interest in MMORPGs could have told the state that Schilling's plan was overly ambitious to the point of being a pipe dream.

I sure hope that Citizens Bank accepts Duchy of Sylvandale sovereign ducats.

Yes. Just like any other well-connected person.

There aren't that many "well-connected" people who pitched one of the most famous games in baseball history on a beloved regional team that hadn't won a World Series in 86 years and then got $75M from the govt for a gaming startup in that region, and then saw the startup go belly-up. If a famous, outspoken, conservative actor (say, Kelsey Grammer) did the same thing, it would be a story. Schilling has courted media attention his entire career; now he is going to get some he probably doesn't want. That reality may not be entirely fair to Schilling, but it makes perfect sense in context.

His pinata status here is because he is a vocal Republican.

Well, we've certainly given a pass to every high-profile former-player Democrat who has pissed away millions of dollars in taxpayer money on a business that was little more than a vanity project.

Are people actually surprised at how this works?

Uhh, no. Schilling's getting the money was far from surprising, and then there being media and internet blowback when it went under was entirely predictable. I have no knowledge base about the industry, so I have no idea if the failure of the company was predictable.

Well, we've certainly given a pass to every high-profile former-player Democrat who has pissed away millions of dollars in taxpayer money on a business that was little more than a vanity project.

You've fit Schilling into a category so small as to be meaningless. He goes in a box that is much larger than this.

Can someone here who is knowledgeable about the topic substantiate exactly WHY they are so certain that the business plan was a joke and/or he's ignorant and/or the company was a terrible idea? Aside from the fact that, obviously, it didn't succeed?

I know nothing of the details of Schilling's plan, but building a MMO from the ground up, based on a new IP is a terrible idea. Too much up front capital, too risky, too long of a development cycle, and the market doesn't need another "traditional" MMO.

Blizzard and the half dozen other companies have that on lock down. The absolute best a new MMO based on a new IP could probably grab at this point is around 1 million subs (for reference the recent Star Wars MMO, which was highly anticipated, in development for many years, and is ####### Star Wars; peaked at around 1.5 mil subs). You would need to hold those million subs for a few years to recoup the nearly $100 million upfront development costs, new content generation costs (I would assume around $20-$30 mil a year, average AAA console cost), and server/tech maintenance.

Simply put, there aren't many things worse than an MMO to invest in.

Saying it's on "the people of Rhode Island" is a bit broad - it's on the lame duck governor Carcieri who ramrodded the project through despite the opposition of the majority of Rhode Islanders and Chafee, the Republican nominee for governor. The examination of the decision process should prove interesting, although there has been stonewalling from those involved. It will get interesting if the banks' suit or some other legal action gets any of Carcieri, Keith Stokes (the head of the RIEDC), or Michael Corso, the tax credit broker deposed. I assume Schilling himself will definitely have to testify or be deposed in this matter, which will be illumaniting as well.

I assume Schilling himself will definitely have to testify or be deposed in this matter, which will be illumaniting as well.

Hopefully they'll get him under oath and they'll be able to ask him whether the blood on the Bloody Sock was real or was just red paint.

You would need to hold those million subs for a few years to recoup the nearly $100 million upfront development costs, new content generation costs (I would assume around $20-$30 mil a year, average AAA console cost), and server/tech maintenance.

You forgot to factor in the profit from selling the game boxes though. I believe the cheapest version of the Star Wars MMO was $70, that did include one free month though.

You forgot to factor in the profit from selling the game boxes though. I believe the cheapest version of the Star Wars MMO was $70, that did include one free month though.

That's only in the first months though. After 3-4 months, the prices drop waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay down and it becomes 'bargain' buying. You can buy the new Star Wars MMO on Amazon right now for $19.99 with free shipping and no tax.

As for Shilling, its part of his financing plan that irks me, like his insistance of getting tax credits that weren't spelled out in contracts and then claiming he got screwed over. Maybe some middle manager did promise him the moon, but damn man, if its not in the contract, it means nothing. To me, his plan seemed to be "I'm Curt Shilling, I can get people to give me money." And when people stopped, he tried to play the victim card.

He goes in a box that is much larger than this.

Am I the only one reading this as a fat joke?

Am I the only one reading this as a fat joke?

Could be an old Al Gore joke. Maybe Ray is talking about the lockbox.

That's only in the first months though. After 3-4 months, the prices drop waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay down and it becomes 'bargain' buying. You can buy the new Star Wars MMO on Amazon right now for $19.99 with free shipping and no tax.

Sure, but using the Star Wars MMO as an example again, it sold over 1.5 million units at that initial price(many were actually collector's editions that cost more). That recoups a lot of the initial development cost right there.

Another fun fad was the acohol mist bars.

Sure, but using the Star Wars MMO as an example again, it sold over 1.5 million units in the at that initial price(many were actually collector's editions that cost more). That recoups a lot of the initial development cost right there.

So is Curt going to have a "bloody sock" collector's edition of his game? A Star Wars anything shouldn't really be used as an example for any non-star wars involved scenario.

You forgot to factor in the profit from selling the game boxes though. I believe the cheapest version of the Star Wars MMO was $70, that did include one free month though.

Yes, I'm an idiot. The first month sales really help recoup the long development costs, but as Tripon points out that price drops quickly.

After a little more research, my 1 million subs might be extremely optomistic. From the data here, it looks like there are exactly 4 MMOs that currently have a 1mil+ sub base.

Don't forget that 38 Studios said they had sold the homes of some relocated employees but in fact did not sell any of them, which they found out about after they were laid off.

Well, you can buy Kingdom of Agular for under $30 now. And that game came out late Feb. It hasn't even been 4 months yet, and the price already been cut in half.

Edit: Very few games keep their price, except maybe the majority of Nintendo games. I still can't find an Zelda: OoT copy for $20 yet, and Mario Galaxy 2 is still selling for $40 despite it being over two years old now.

According to Chafee, Amalur needed to sell 3 million units to break even. Chafee's number may not be reliable, but even if it was 2 million units, it would be one the better selling RPGs of all time. Relying on your franchise startup to sell that well would be pretty dumb.

Relying on your franchise startup to sell that well would be pretty dumb.

Or overestimating the ability of your name to sell people on the franchise. I don't imagine Schilling has so much cred in the MMO gamer world that many people would say "Oh, CURT SCHILLING's game? I'm in for 5!". But in Curt Schilling mind, I'm sure that happens a lot.

According to Chafee, Amalur needed to sell 3 million units to break even. Chafee's number may not be reliable, but even if it was 2 million units, it would be one the better selling RPGs of all time. Relying on your franchise startup to sell that well would be pretty dumb.

Any smartly operated studio would be thrilled with the numbers KoA pulled in and would have publishers kicking down their door. If Chafee's number is to be believed, that's a situation that 38 studios put themselves in, and not some indictment on the video game industry. They had to sell that many units because they effed up that badly.

Any smartly operated studio would be thrilled with the numbers KoA pulled in and would have publishers kicking down their door. If Chafee's number is to be believed, that's a situation that 38 studios put themselves in, and not some indictment on the video game industry. They had to sell that many units because they effed up that badly.

Agree completely. 38 studios has to be mixing some of the costs of the console games and the MMO, or heavily factoring in the cost to acquire BHG with that kind of break even estimate.

2 million is right around the number that Mass Effect 2 sold.

Questions about whether 38 Studios was forthright with REIDC about the level of risk -

http://www.golocalworcester.com/business/investigation-secret-documents-reveal-true-risks-of-38-studios/

I have no idea what the development cost was, but Torchlight is a popular and successful game that had sold 1M copies as of a year ago. Like 38studios offerings, they also wanted to be an MMO, but reduced their scope to something more manageable to get something moneymaking out the door.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torchlight

Torchlight sold 1M copies, but was only like $14.99 at full price. I believe it was only digital sales though, which generally mean lower cost and more money going to the dev/publisher.