Que es mas macho? Alfredo Aceves o Lloyd Bridges?

Lloyd Bridges es muy macho.

This time it counts!

Not saying it is warranted in this case, but could a WBC suspension carry over to the regular MLB season?

Aceves’ Red Sox teammates were reported to have cheered at the sight of their pitcher fighting.

Not sure I saw all the skirmishes, but it looked like Aceves took more punishment than he dished out. Which raises the question as to whether Aceves Red Sox teammates were cheering him on or celebrating his beating?

Who was that dude walking around at the end looking super creepy in the hoodie?

Also, what are the rules for this? How would they decide the suspensions? Not that it matters for mexico.

Aceves' Red Sox teammates were cheering because his injuries were going to be treated by outside doctors.

What is it with Aceves? I don't remember him being a douche on the Yankees?

The start-to-finish brawl can be found here.

@JeffPassan

Larry Walker on Alfredo Aceves: "I had a hold of him, and I thought I saw Satan in his eyes."

There you go folks, Alfredo Aceves is possessed.

It looks like Aceves took a lot of head shots so at least there won't be any damage.

"NAFTA transformed our economy!"
"NAFTA transformed our economy more!"
"No it didn't!"
"Yes it did!"
"Hoser!"
"Stinking, fat, Canuck bastard!"

What is it with Aceves? I don't remember him being a douche on the Yankees?

I thought the story with Aceves being weirdly let go of by the Yankees, despite having options remaining, was that he was being a pinhead and everyone hated him. His crazypersonitis is a lifelong condition, as I understand it.

Blame Canada!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bOR38552MJA

I never heard of a single problem with Aceves during his Yankee years. They used him in a lot of different roles, but he never complained, at least not publicly.

The start-to-finish brawl can be found here.

This part of the article is curious. I wonder what was said, and how close the stands were to boiling over.

Things were so testy the PA announcer urged calm among the vastly pro-Mexican gathering of 19,581, threatening the immediate arrest and hefty fines. The message didn’t take – a foul ball thrown back into play from the stands nearly hit first base coach Larry Walker.

I thought the story with Aceves being weirdly let go of by the Yankees, despite having options remaining, was that he was being a pinhead and everyone hated him. His crazypersonitis is a lifelong condition, as I understand it.

I think it was more the back problems that limited him to 12 innings in 2010, compounded by a broken collarbone in a later bike accident. Perhaps he was a clubhouse problem, since it would not have cost that much to retain him, but I don't recall anything like that surfacing, so my guess is it was mostly the injuries.

Aceves discovered too late that the Canadians were actually Canadiens.

13/17 - I thought it was both.

I couldn't get the video from #9 to play.

I was watching live, and it appeared that calm was well on the way to be restored when Aceves charged out of the dugout into the fray, throwing punches.

Anyone else see it?

I couldn't get the video from #9 to play.

I was watching live, and it appeared that calm was well on the way to be restored when Aceves charged out of the dugout into the fray, throwing punches.

Anyone else see it?

I don't think the video in #9 is the whole thing. It starts off with an overhead cam where things look fairly calm, and then cuts to a closeup where all hell had broken loose. I think there is some time in between those two shots that might give a better since of where the first-throwing instigated.

The World Baseball Classic is a complete waste of time. I don't care who wins or loses, and this fight actually is filled with examples of why this is a waste of time:

1) The announcers speculate that the this fight might stem from a leadoff bunt single by the Canadians leadoff hitter of the top of the 9th inning. Team Canada was up 9-3 at the time. Apparently, Team Mexico took this as running up the score. The problem with that is: 1) run differential is a factor in breaking ties in the standings, and Canada had lost its first game by a large margin yesterday; 2)Is a six-run lead really that overwhelming?; 3) If this was a serious tourney, "running up the score" wouldn't be an issue. In the Olympics, Team USA Basketball would regularly keep playing even after being up by enormous amounts. In the NCAA basketball tourney, teams up 20 with 5 minutes to go are OK with continuing to push forward - because it's a tournament! If this were a real tournament, the same would apply in this game.

2) Who is getting suspended? For how long? Somebody might miss the rest of the WBC...but who cares? If you are an MLB team with a player on the roster, wouldn't you rather they miss the rest of the WBC than to miss, say, a couple of regular-season games?

1) are you familiar with international competitions? This sort of thing isn't unusual - it's just not part of baseball culture. Can't go double elim w/o further taxing pitchers either. You may see run differential replaced by runs allowed.
2) why would people miss regular season games?

I think it was more the back problems that limited him to 12 innings in 2010, compounded by a broken collarbone in a later bike accident. Perhaps he was a clubhouse problem, since it would not have cost that much to retain him, but I don't recall anything like that surfacing, so my guess is it was mostly the injuries.

My recollection is that the Yankees were very unhappy with Aceves' work ethic during his rehab from the back injury, perhaps best represented by the broken collarbone suffered biking around. I may be remembering that wrong, though.

from the last sentence of aceves' wikipedia entry, all you need to know about him:

Aceves wears #91, a number worn by Dennis Rodman, whom Aceves admires.[2]

Team Mexico found room for Karim Garcia?

What is it with Aceves? I don't remember him being a douche on the Yankees?

It may be that the presence of A-rod kinda just suck all the douchery out of everyone else ? ;)

The WBC is a waste of time because Steve Balbonis Personal Trainer doesn't care about it.

If this was a serious tourney, "running up the score" wouldn't be an issue. In the Olympics, Team USA Basketball would regularly keep playing even after being up by enormous amounts. In the NCAA basketball tourney, teams up 20 with 5 minutes to go are OK with continuing to push forward - because it's a tournament! If this were a real tournament, the same would apply in this game.

This sounds more like a criticism of baseball generally. Is there as much whining about "unwritten rule" infractions in other sports? ie. don't but for a hit when you're ahead, don't steal...I believe the Cubs actually started a tussle with the Nationals last year because Jayson Werth SWUNG AT A 3-0 PITCH when the Nats were up big. Whining about losing badly seems to be a part of baseball no matter what the event.

Or is this a criticism of the pool/round robin format rather than single elimination? I'm confused about how the running up the score issue applies specifically to the WBC.

I was trying to think about that earlier. A similar situation in hockey is that if you're up big, and you get a powerplay. you typically don't use your big guns but use it as an opportunity to "reward" 3rd and 4th line guys who have played hard with some unusual PP time. With that said, I can't recall a team ever complaining about another team not doing this. I am sure it's happened but it's pretty rare. Not like in baseball where we have to hear of this every week it seems. The whining about losing big and the unwritten rules has really become tiresome. I wonder how much it happened in the past. But oh, I'm sure teams never did these things in the past, when everything was better.

One complaint I have about the WBC, which is more a complaint about the format, is that the American team last night got to play a pivotal game against a team that really didn't care about it. I don't think that's all that fair, but then again is not unique to the WBC. Ideally, all games should mean the same to both sides. Italy wasn't going to pull out all the stops against the US which doesn't seem fair when the other three teams have to face an opponent giving 100% in all three games.

How stoopid are you to get into a bench-clearing brawl with Team Canada? Canadians *invented* the bench-clearing brawl, and 99% of the time they do it while wearing skates and standing on ice. They showed incredible restraint to not take advantage of the freedom they must have been feeling to be in cleats and standing on grass.

Secondly, this is an international tournament, and as mentioned run differential is a tie breaker. This ain't a September sleeper game between two teams that are 30 games out of first. Be mad at yourself for being so lazy or unattentive that you let someone lay down a bunt single on you, and answer with your bat or better pitching.

Thirdly, this is baseball. If the Marlins can score 8 runs in the 8th inning of a playoff game, you also have a chance to do the same off whatever A or AA relief pitcher Canada will be sending to the hill. It's not over until the 27th out.

Instead of looking at it this way, Mexico throws at their opponents and tries to fight them. That's not showing pride, or having a fire inside, or patriotism. This is actually the opposite, this is publicly giving up and saying "we don't think we can come back and win this game, so we are going to try to injure some of our opponents on our way out of the building." Unsportsmanlike is the most polite word to describe it; pathetic is a more acurate description but it is probably not strong enough.

Is there as much whining about "unwritten rule" infractions in other sports? ie. don't but for a hit when you're ahead, don't steal...

I recall there used to be a lot of whining about this NBA unwritten rule: call neither foul nor traveling on Michael Jordan.

The World Baseball Classic is a complete waste of time. I don't care who wins or loses, and this fight actually is filled with examples of why this is a waste of time:

1) The announcers speculate that the this fight might stem from a leadoff bunt single by the Canadians leadoff hitter of the top of the 9th inning. Team Canada was up 9-3 at the time. Apparently, Team Mexico took this as running up the score. The problem with that is: 1) run differential is a factor in breaking ties in the standings, and Canada had lost its first game by a large margin yesterday; 2)Is a six-run lead really that overwhelming?; 3) If this was a serious tourney, "running up the score" wouldn't be an issue. In the Olympics, Team USA Basketball would regularly keep playing even after being up by enormous amounts. In the NCAA basketball tourney, teams up 20 with 5 minutes to go are OK with continuing to push forward - because it's a tournament! If this were a real tournament, the same would apply in this game.

2) Who is getting suspended? For how long? Somebody might miss the rest of the WBC...but who cares? If you are an MLB team with a player on the roster, wouldn't you rather they miss the rest of the WBC than to miss, say, a couple of regular-season games?

3) I'm Canadian, and I don't care if Team Canada wins this game, or this tourney, or whatever. The American team obviously should be the best team, just on sheet numbers of players from which to choose. I mean, Verlander, Sabathia, etc., for a rotation...oh, yeah, none of them are actually pitching in the WBC. If they don't care, why should I?

The World Baseball Classic is a complete waste of time. I don't care who wins or loses, and this fight actually is filled with examples of why this is a waste of time:

1) The announcers speculate that the this fight might stem from a leadoff bunt single by the Canadians leadoff hitter of the top of the 9th inning. Team Canada was up 9-3 at the time. Apparently, Team Mexico took this as running up the score. The problem with that is: 1) run differential is a factor in breaking ties in the standings, and Canada had lost its first game by a large margin yesterday; 2)Is a six-run lead really that overwhelming?; 3) If this was a serious tourney, "running up the score" wouldn't be an issue. In the Olympics, Team USA Basketball would regularly keep playing even after being up by enormous amounts. In the NCAA basketball tourney, teams up 20 with 5 minutes to go are OK with continuing to push forward - because it's a tournament! If this were a real tournament, the same would apply in this game.

2) Who is getting suspended? For how long? Somebody might miss the rest of the WBC...but who cares? If you are an MLB team with a player on the roster, wouldn't you rather they miss the rest of the WBC than to miss, say, a couple of regular-season games?

3) I'm Canadian, and I don't care if Team Canada wins this game, or this tourney, or whatever. The American team obviously should be the best team, just on sheet numbers of players from which to choose. I mean, Verlander, Sabathia, etc., for a rotation...oh, yeah, none of them are actually pitching in the WBC. If they don't care, why should I?

I'm Canadian, and I don't care if Team Canada wins this game, or this tourney, or whatever. The American team obviously should be the best team, just on sheet numbers of players from which to choose. I mean, Verlander, Sabathia, etc., for a rotation...oh, yeah, none of them are actually pitching in the WBC. If they don't care, why should I?

I assume this is the wonky edit feature acting up again. This, for me, seems like a much more troubling aspect of the WBC as currently constituted. While some nations (both fans and players) take the tournament seriously, that attitude is nowhere near universal in the USA. It is a problem, and a significant one, but I've wanted to see a Canadian baseball team play at the highest possible international level since I was a kid, so I'll take what I can get.

Steve Balboni should have his personal trainer taken away.

Don't like the WBC? Don't watch it. Problem solved.

Figuring out a way to get higher-quality pitching in the WBC is a major issue, indeed. (I think it should be played in November, not March.)

No sporting event is meaningful in itself. They only become meaningful because of the feelings of fans and players. For some fans and players, the WBC is a valuable competition. I care about it, so do lots of other folks on this site. The East Asian teams have been taking it very seriously, and the Latin American teams more and more so. That's enough to make most of the games a lot of fun.

Man, it seems that Steve Balboni's Personal Trainer really thinks the WBC is a waste of time. :p

I love it, I love international competitions, and I really wish more US players took it seriously. Whatever, just watching the Japanese, Koreans, and Cubans alone (never mind the sheer talent of the DR, Venezuela, Puerto Rico...and HONKBAL) is worth the existence of the WBC.

Seriously.

I'm biased, because I'm sitting here wearing the Samurai Japan Hoodie that I bought at Petco Park in 2006 when I watched Japan beat South Korea in that year's semis, but that game and the 2009 finals are two of the finest and funnest and most intense baseball games I've ever had the pleasure to witness in person.

I mean, do what you like (unless you like gang-banging), but it seems to me that passing up appreciation of the WBC feels like the slightest kind of spite ...

How stoopid are you to get into a bench-clearing brawl with Team Canada?

Mexico's only chance was to clock them when they threw down their imaginary gloves.

This, for me, seems like a much more troubling aspect of the WBC as currently constituted. While some nations (both fans and players) take the tournament seriously, that attitude is nowhere near universal in the USA.

I'm actually not sure that's going to be a problem at all. The point of the tournament is to grow the sport internationally. It's much more important how the tournament is going over on the other continents than in North America.

And, really, a mediocre US team can only help in that respect. You hope that ultimately, one of the countries where we're trying to promote baseball beats the US, drawing a lot of attention to baseball in that country. (And that humiliating loss will of course, in turn, incentivize the US and its potential players to care more about the tournament.)

It's broadcast on MLB Network, which is obviously not going to cancel it.

The only problem I see with it being unpopular in the US is that many of the games are held in the US and you do want to sell tickets. But hey, if you fill stadiums with visiting fans, that's fine too.

Team Mexico found room for Karim Garcia?

Who is Karim Garcia?

I'm actually not sure that's going to be a problem at all. The point of the tournament is to grow the sport internationally. It's much more important how the tournament is going over on the other continents than in North America.

And, really, a mediocre US team can only help in that respect. You hope that ultimately, one of the countries where we're trying to promote baseball beats the US, drawing a lot of attention to baseball in that country. (And that humiliating loss will of course, in turn, incentivize the US and its potential players to care more about the tournament.)

I disagree. The WBC grows in stature the better the US does. Baseball fans in other countries know that the best ballplayers in the world are largely Americans. If there isn't something like an American "dream team" competing, it makes victories by other countries less impressive. Winning against a half-assed American team is less valuable than losing a tough game to a whole-assed America - the fans can see these things.

The WBC grows in stature in the US as soon as Japan wins a third title, and then insults the Americans about their lazy players.

Canada needed USSR/Russia (then USA) in hockey to really feel a passion for international hockey.
USA needed...well...anyone competitive (and a couple of losses) to care about international basketball.

Who is Karim Garcia?

That took me a few seconds to get...

The World Baseball Classic is a complete waste of time. I don't care who wins or loses, and this fight actually is filled with examples of why this is a waste of time:

The only thing better than baseball is more baseball.

Who was that dude walking around at the end looking super creepy in the hoodie?

Sergio Romo.

It just looks like Sergio Romo.

Baseball fans in other countries know that the best ballplayers in the world are largely Americans. If there isn't something like an American "dream team" competing, it makes victories by other countries less impressive.

I don't know. I mean, I want the US to be more competitive, and honestly I think the game would be better if top guys from other countries (Felix Hernandez being one) played. However, the intensity between Japan and Korea last time around was pretty awesome. Though I don't know, I imagine they have a complicated history, so I think the WBC is source of pride for individuals in those countries. I can enjoy that stuff, kind of like watching a hockey game between Canada and Russia.

The WBC grows in stature in the US as soon as Japan wins a third title, and then insults the Americans about their lazy players.

I sort of want to see the reaction if Cuba wins the WBC and, en route to doing so, thrashes the US soundly.

Team Canada are requesting that the USA jerseys have tie-down straps for today's game.

I think the game would be better if top guys from other countries (Felix Hernandez being one) played. However, the intensity between Japan and Korea last time around was pretty awesome. Though I don't know, I imagine they have a complicated history, so I think the WBC is source of pride for individuals in those countries. I can enjoy that stuff, kind of like watching a hockey game between Canada and Russia.

I agree with every word of this. I love it, too.

I'm just saying the WBC would be better with the US as a bully. That wouldn't diminish Japan-Korea or any of the rest, I think it would elevate it.

Well, this is interesting:

GOODYEAR, Ariz. -- The fallout from Canada's bench-clearing brawl with Mexico at the World Baseball Classic won't spill over into Sunday's crucial game against the United States.

World Baseball Classic officials have decided not to take further action against any if the players involved in the fight that occurred in Canada's 10-3 rout of Mexico on Saturday. Three Canadian and four Mexican players were ejected after the melee.

"We are extremely disappointed in the bench-clearing incident that marred the conclusion of today's game between Canada and Mexico. The episode runs counter to the spirit of sportsmanship and respectful competition for which the World Baseball Classic has stood throughout its history." World Baseball Classic, Inc., said in a statement.

"Because at least one club -- and potentially both -- will not advance to the second round, WBCI has determined that disciplinary measures would not have a meaningful corrective impact. Thus, discipline will not be imposed beyond today's seven game ejections. It is our firm expectation that the members of Team Mexico, Team Canada and all the tournament's participating teams will learn from this incident and set a better example -- one that befits the sport they share -- in the future."

One thing the WBC needs is a better website. The official website is like a training course in how not to deliver scores-and-standings information. Not only are the brackets and scores confusing, but their "pools and venues" page currently shows Brazil seeded into the second round and the finals.

Thats one long history of sportsmanship.

I wish we had a 50-game suspension for throwing a beanball; instead, we get one for steroids.

Yeah, player safety is paramount.

Thirdly, this is baseball. If the Marlins can score 8 runs in the 8th inning of a playoff game, you also have a chance to do the same off whatever A or AA relief pitcher Canada will be sending to the hill.

Which is why Team Canada should have kept Mark Prior in there longer, regardless of the consequences.

I wish we had a 50-game suspension for throwing a beanball; instead, we get one for steroids.

50 games? The poor guy wouldn't get to participate in a WBC game until he was 78!

So, if your team isn't advancing, anything short of murder doesn't get a suspension? Could make things even worse in the future.

I think this sergio romo character should be banned from all future competitions, and possibly monitored with an ankle tether.

I agree. It looks like he might be illegal.

you can watch the 2009 final or the Japan vs Taiwan game just a few days back to see if that's awesome baseball, you don't need to be the most talented guys ever to put up the greatest games ever. (for example, the great WS game every probably involved a light hitting 2B hitting a walk off HR in game 7 against the Micky Mantle Yankees...) There were a boatload of people who literally had a heartattack watching that game in both Taiwan and Japan.

I wish we had a 50-game suspension for throwing a beanball; instead, we get one for steroids.

Yeah, player safety is paramount.

That'd be one way of keeping Pedro Martinez out of the HOF.

58 - as one of the BA guys put it: the WBC needs the players more than the players need the tourney.
Want to suspend guys: you run afoul of the teams that contributed players (particularly non-suspended pitchers who face inning limits)
Fine them: they won't pay, won't play in the tournament again