Coming into today's games:
CQuentin, VORP = 18.5, 20th best in baseball, $400,000 salary
EByrnes, VORP = - 6.0, 663rd in baseball, $8,000,000 salary

But Eric Byrnes is a fan favorite, has a TV show and drives a Shaggin' Wagon

Carlos Quentin is just terrific.

I know he struggled all last year and was in the NL, but I find it strange that some of these guys had never heard of Carlos Quentin before. Oh well, everybody knows him now.

“Hey, Jeff made the right choice to keep an overrated and overpriced fourth outfielder over me. Jeff’s been in the game for a long time, which is a freaking miracle… but then again, dumb owners can persist in this game like algae. And how’s Mr. Heart&Soul;Eric Byrnes doing in AZ? Sucking as expected? Well, go figure.”

Please don't use quote marks when you are not quoting someone. Idiot.

Please don't use quote marks when you are not quoting someone. Idiot.

Please become capable of recognizing obvious satire. Simpleton.

Rich, am sorry my use of quotation marks was too confusing for you.

Best,
Idiot

P.S. Just for the record, Carlos did NOT say the words in quotation marks above.

Btw, Carlos is doing pretty well for a PCL-overrated prospect

To be fair - the Dbacks used what the White Sox traded for Quentin as a small fraction of what was traded for Danny Haren, who is a good player.

Granted, the Dbacks would be better off with Quentin instead of Byrnes, and the rest of what they traded for Haren, and random fifth starter, but still . . .

Oh. BTW. I'm a Dodger fan, who hates Colletti. But Quentin has been FAR more valuable than any prospect Ned has traded.

To be totally fair - there's still a realistic chance that Haren will be the #2 to Webb that dominates in the postseason, without the Dbacks needing Quentin. It's a longshot, but not unrealistically so.

Levski, the headline is misleading. Nothing in the article indicates that Quentin gave a "shout out" to Moorad. That's merely your editorializing. Not immediately apparent as a joke in any way, either, which makes it especially deceptive. Very shabby.

CQuentin, VORP = 18.5, 20th best in baseball, $400,000 salary
EByrnes, VORP = - 6.0, 663rd in baseball, $8,000,000 salary

Less than 2 months into a season is fairly paltry evidence for greatness or crappiness. Let a full season or more play out to judge Carlos Quentin and Eric Byrnes. Byrnes had (defense included) a great year last year. He's not a big talent by any means and he is overpaid. But it's premature to conclude Quentin will really be any better.

CQuentin, Win Shares in 2007 = 6, 16th on his team, pathetic in the NL
EByrnes, Win Shares in 2007 = 26, best on his team, 11th best in the NL

All, sorry about editorializing the headline. Quentin did not say the words in quotation marks, and did not give a shout out to Moorad. Now, hopefully we can put that to rest.

Rich, using win shares from last year, when Quentin was a) hurt and b) played sparingly, to prove that he's a worse player going forward than Eric Byrnes is ridiculously dumb.

Eric Byrnes had 2 (count them, 2) very good months last year, then reverted to his usual mediocrity the rest of the way. As usual, he was horribly bad in August/September.

He has 26 win shares because a) everyone else on offense sucked; b) the Dbacks won 90 games; and thus c) someone had to get those win shares, whether they deserved them or not.

To use win shares from last year to argue that Eric Byrnes at $30m/3 years is a better bet than Quentin at $400k/year over the next 2-3 years is the ultimate exercise in stupidity.

And I think you're a pretty smart guy.

Rich, it was pure folly to give Byrnes that extension. We don't need to see the rest of this year, or next year, or the year after, to know that. You talk about two months. Well...it was the 2 months of May and June of 2007 that caused that extension to be handed out. Prior to May 2007, was their one shred of evidence that Byrnes would be that good of an investment? Sure, his defense and baserunning last year made him an overall good player LAST YEAR. But he projected lousy...and he is 32 now, and oh....what a shock.....his legs are giving him trouble. This isn't Monday morning quarterbacking. We screamed bloody murder from the moment he was extended, and identified the fact that it meant the end of Quentin immediately. It's all on record. So we have a right to ##### here.

From the day he signed that contract, he has been a complete waste. From July 31st, 2007 to today, he has hit .229/302/.377 in over 400 plate appearances with just 11 homers and 46 RBI. (Including today's grand slam)

EByrnes, 32, Career OPS+ = 98 2008 OPS+ = 66
CQuentin, 25, Career OPS+ = 106 2008 OPS+ = 108

On any other team Byrnes would have been DL'ed and relegated back to bench duty. It's really only the Diamondbacks that seem to think he's the key part of a championship contender.

Also, Win Shares is an awful way to compare any 2007 Diamondback to the rest of the league. It's not very robust to begin with and it completely breaks down when you're dealing with a 90-win that was outscored by 20 runs.

Just for the record, I emailed Repoz and asked him if he could remove the "gives a shout out to Jeff Moorad" part from the headline. Seems like that's causing way too many problems for way too many people.

Could he change it to "...says the mongrel nation of Israel will soon be wiped off the map"? Just to avoid any further confusion here.

What about "whips out piece, urinates all over Berkeley, California."?

I see it's been fixed now. Thanks, Repoz. Am guessing Quentin is plenty busy getting on with the rest of his career to think about Jeff Moorad anyhow.

Btw, it's been discussed on the Dbacks message board that Q looks more crouched this year than before. Anyone know when the change happened? Is this recent, or was it something done during spring training? He looks a bit Bagwellesque at the plate now. It is working for him, obviously.

Now if someone could teach Eric Byrnes how to stop looking like a praying mantis after each #### infield popup...

I see it's been fixed now.

No probs...back to scouring for anti-Christian articles with little or no baseball content!

Byrnes this year in 177 At Bats = .215/.276/.373
Quentin last year in 229 At Bats = .214/.298/.349

I don't know what that means, but I thought it was interesting.

I suspect Quentin will cool off some but he's still young and it's obvious he can hit at least some. It'll be interesting to see just how much it will be.

Interestingly his career numbers now are almost exactly equal to what you'd expect in a normal season (around 640 PAs). He's got a .247/.343/.466 line in his career so far. Interestingly he's already been hit by 27 pitches, following a trend he displayed in the minors as well.

I bet White Sox fans are happy Jerry Owens got hurt now, aren't they? :)

As an Angels fan, when D-Back fans rant on and on, I know how it feels to be a Yankees/Red Sox fan observing fans of the other 28 for a few moments' immersion in incomprehensible drivel about nothing of particular importance.

That said, Quentin has been a pox on my house three games this season already. Enough.

As an Angels fan, when D-Back fans rant on and on, I know how it feels to be a Yankees/Red Sox fan observing fans of the other 28 for a few moments' immersion in incomprehensible drivel about nothing of particular importance.

Baseball message board on the internet.

How much more consequential does it get than talking about the third best hitter in the American League so far this season?

Fun fact: the three best hitters in the A.L. so far this year all played in the NL last year. League superiority this, #######.

Byrnes this year in 177 At Bats = .215/.276/.373
Quentin last year in 229 At Bats = .214/.298/.349

Quentin was also hitting with a torn labrum in his left shoulder, his "pulling" shoulder. That is more than enough to completely screw up your bat speed.

Quentin's stance right now looks very Jose Cansecoesque... apparently the Sox have taken to calling him "Cansequito" ("little Canseco").

As a Sox fan, the most encouraging thing about Quentin is that he's walking and striking out at nearly a 1:1 clip (25 BB : 29 K)... and not by doing the Ozzie Guillen thing either (same-ish numbers, but over 700+ plate appearances as opposed to Q's 200 this year)

I bet White Sox fans are happy Jerry Owens got hurt now, aren't they? :)

Yes. Does it make me a bad person that I would've been happy Owens got hurt regardless of Quentin's performance?

Quentin was also hitting with a torn labrum in his left shoulder, his "pulling" shoulder. That is more than enough to completely screw up your bat speed.

Byrnes, too, has been playing all season on balky hamstrings. But apparently management feels that his bat is too important to the team for him not be in there every day.

I repeat, the Diamondbacks are the only team in the majors that would give Byrnes anything close to the superstar treatment he's been enjoying all season. It makes me queasy.

Fun fact: the three best hitters in the A.L. so far this year all played in the NL last year. League superiority this, #######.

I really wanted to make this point.

Moorad also signed Russ Ortiz, Shawn Green and Troy Glaus to monster deals before Josh Byrnes got there to clean up the mess. I think the "blithering idiot" track record was pretty well established even before Quentin was squeezed out by the Eric Byrnes extension.

As a former two-time owner of Quentin in roto, I'm happy for his success and pissed that it didn't come when I would have benefited from it. I suspect there are others like me.

Fun fact: the three best hitters in the A.L. so far this year all played in the NL last year. League superiority this, #######.

All the good talent naturally gravitates towards the AL!!

or something.

Fun fact: the three best hitters in the A.L. so far this year all played in the NL last year. League superiority this, #######.

Another fun fact: Two of the top 10 MLB players in terms of OPS this season were given away by Arizona's GM for essentially nothing.

Very good point, 30. Josh Byrnes & co. have managed to piss away A LOT of the talent acquired by Mike Rizzo. The Uggla decision was a head-scratcher at the time, as the Dbacks sent him to the AFL, Uggla played 2B there, and raked with the bat--yet they left him unprotected. Granted, there were questions about him ability to stay at 2b defensively (there still are), but that was a brain fart.

The Eric Byrnes extension, coupled with the Hairston/Quentin trades, however, are simple inexcusable. Eric Byrnes is NOT someone you want for $30m/3 years. He is NOT someone you give a full no trade clause. He definitely is NOT someone you choose over younger, cheaper versions like Hairston and Quentin. In other words, the EB extension was a ridiculous fk-up of giant proportions.

Just for the record, Josh Byrnes deserves as much of the blame for the EB extension and the Hairston/Quentin trades as Jeff Moorad. He effed up as much as Moorad did.

And just for kicks, here's a post by Shoewizard on the dbacks message board from today

Since July 28th, 2007 thru to yesterday

Hairston:

240 AB .254/.303/.508 ,811 OPS 14 HR 33 RBI 2 SB, 1 GIDP

Also, as left fielder so far this year, RZR .911, 9 OOZ plays in 212 INN, 1 Assist and no errors

Byrnes:

390 AB .228/.302/.379 .681 OPS 11 HR 47 RBI 27 SB,...but 4 CS, and 14 GIDP

RZR .967, OOZ 10 in 371 INN, no errors

FYI, While Byrnes RZR leads the NL, Hairston would rank about 4th if he had enough innings to qualify. And he's actually made OOZ plays at a better rate than Byrnes. Hairston is not as good in left as Byrnes, but he's not bad at all.....he just looks awkward sometimes.

And even though Byrnes has those steals, he also has those CS and GIDP, so that pretty much negates that advantage.


Even this year, Hairston's OPS+ is 92, compared to Byrnes 80.

There hasn't been one single moment from the day Hairston was traded that he has not been a more valuable player than Byrnes. And thats in a straight up comparison, before you take contracts into account.

Very good point, 30. Josh Byrnes & co. have managed to piss away A LOT of the talent acquired by Mike Rizzo.

And for all my disdain of Jim Bowden, at least that's a charge you can't make against him.

Yet.

Can you imagine how good the D-backs would be if they had kept Quentin and Uggla? They are plenty good already but man, that would be an impressive team.

nterestingly he's already been hit by 27 pitches, following a trend he displayed in the minors as well.

He gets hit a lot because he crouches. See there, he crouches at the plate, so it makes it harder for him to move. He's crouching already, so there's nowhere for him to go. He can't get out of the way, so he gets hit by a lot of pitches. If he was standing up, he could move. But he's crouching, see how he's crouching, so he'll get hit more because he can't move out of the way. Usually you try to duck out of the way, but he's crouching, so he's already down. He has nowhere to go, so he gets hit.

I heard that too and just shook my head.

Listening to Morgan is truly painful.

Not that it makes up for the difference with the bat, but by THT's RZR, Quentin is ahead of only Burrell and Carlos Lee among qualified left fielders, so that is something to consider.

Morgan also called him Carlos Quintana before correcting himself.