A Papel visit to Baseball-Reference once in a while would be nice.
The question took Boston Red Sox closer Jonathan Papelbon off guard. Did he think he should be part of the Cy Young conversation?
“I don’t know man, how many times has a closer won the Cy Young, once?” Told it had happened at least seven times, he raised his eyebrows. “Seven times? I think for me, it’s just going out there and doing what I’m trying to do. If it happens, it happens. Who knows, man, we’ve still got a lot of baseball to determine that. Who knows?”
The idea of Papelbon contending for the Cy Young this year would shock many attentive Red Sox fans as well.
His core numbers are excellent: a 1.89 ERA and 36 saves. But anyone who has watched him - or looked up how many hits and walks he was allowing - could tell that for much of the year, this wasn’t the same pitcher who shortened games for Boston from 2006 to 2008. Papelbon allowed nearly 1.5 baserunners per inning before the All-Star break, and many of his successful saves were roller-coaster rides of walks, hits, and then finally strikeouts.
That has changed over the past month. Papelbon is now pitching efficiently and effectively, backing up his excellent core numbers with shutdown, worry-free performances, like Sunday’s three-strikeout scoreless inning. Since the end of July, he has improved to the point where talking about whether he should be in the Cy Young mix isn’t that crazy after all.
Repoz
Posted: September 15, 2009 at 10:33 AM |
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1. Steve Balboni's Personal Trainer Posted: September 15, 2009 at 11:17 AM (#3322058)Based on his knowledge of the Cy Young Award, I don't think you want to see him on "Stump the Schwab", either...
I haven't blown a save all season. In fact, I've yet to give up an earned run. I think it's time my name got tossed into the Cy Young debate.
and Mike Crudale.
FTR - As of end of the Sunday's games, Mariano had a better ERA+, a better H/9, a better BB/9 and a MUCH better K/BB (and he pitched a scoreless, one BB inning yesterday).
Papelbon does have 3.1 more innings pitched than Mariano (which is not that much), and slightly better HR/9 and K/9 than Mariano, but the differences are negligible.
Oh well.
The idea that he is a candidate is ludicrous.
Greinke not winning would be stupid. Anyone but Hernandez winning over Greinke would be criminal.
...but no. There's no way. I love Papelbon, defended him when other Red Sox fans were saying earlier this year that he was hurt or losing his effectiveness...but there's NO argument for him to even be in the CYA discussion.
1. Greinke
2. Hernandez
3. Halladay
If Halladay's ERA were to jump up a couple of tenths in the last month and Rivera were to go the rest of the month without giving up a run (while actually pitching), I could see putting Rivera in there at 3, but those top two look to be pretty much locked in right where they are.
If there were ten spots, I could put Papelbon on there somewhere at the bottom.
if you choose selective end points, i wasn't able to find a single closer besides dennis eckersley who had 2 years, let alone consecutive, of 2.00 era and 0.800 whip or better. and those aren't even papelbon's best numbers - that would be 1.85 and 0.776. gagne comes close. no gagne, nathan, rivera, wagner, etc.
in fact, mariano had his first such season last year!
eck 89, 90
gagne 03
goose 81
nathan 06
papelbon 06, 07
putz 07
rivera 08
saito 07
wagner 99
that's the list.
am I reading this right, he is in the discussion because he sucked for the most part early in the season then got hot? I'm guessing Yankee writers aren't the only one with a case of the stupids. Seriously is there any way he would be considered a Cy Young favorite if the award was for relievers only? I guess I can see a third place vote for him behind Nathan and Rivera but Aardsma deserves consideration also.
It's a weird list, Gagne is the only guy to do it in more than 80 innings, while Wagner, Eck's '90, Putz and Rivera are the only guys over 70. Gossage (in a strike year), Eck's '89 and Papelbon's '07 all came in fewer than 60 innings.
Although I agree with you that this is obviously what happened, I'm somewhat shocked by the notion that you would actually have to try to get Papelbon to say something stupid. I figured that he'd be more than willing to bring the stupid without any external prompting.
He's not in the discussion. The only one's talking about him being a candidate is one writer from a small, unimportant newspaper, and people on this thread. The first sentence said the question took him off-guard. Doesn't that suggest that no one has raised it before?
And that is why Derek Jeter should win the Cy Young Award.
FTFY.
It's a fun list, but with differences that small, I'm not sure it means too much.
and they used to have gagne. i think that's what theo was doing: take papelbon's best seasons, see who duplicated that, and acquire them, just in case if we lose papelbon. no matter if they haven't done that in 5 years =P
if you lower it to papelbon's career numbers (1.85/.776), the number goes down to 8, and half of them are eck/pap.
speaking of eck, there's some evidence for you. eck finished 6th and 5th in 89/90, argubably 2 of the best seasons in closer history. the irony being that he won it in 92, with worse numbers.
This would also explain Smoltz. :-)
A: 1082 IP, 202 ERA+
B: 1118 IP, 200 ERA+
Which of A or B is two pitchers, which is one, and who are they all?
One of them should be plainly obvious for this crowd.
Why not, it works for MVPs.
Yeah. I love me some Papelbon, but he still has to have Billy Wagner's career, which would take him through age 42, to catch Rivera in career value - and then there's the postseason. Rivera is the Jerry Rice of baseball.
...and promptly gets kicked out.
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