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Thursday, September 22, 2011

Boston Herald: Source: Sox made play for Mets’ Capuano

How desperate are the Red Sox to hold on to their incredible shrinking wild card lead? So desperate the team is looking to trade for pitchers to just finish out the regular season. According to the Boston Herald, the Red Sox have spent the last week trying to get lefty Chris Capuano from the Mets to start Sunday at Yankee Stadium.


According to the report, the Mets will hold on to Capuano, who is a free agent after the season. Capuano is the scheduled starter for the Mets on Thursady in a 1:45 p.m. game against the Cardinals.


If the Red Sox did get Capuano—or any other pitcher—that player wouldn’t be eligible for the postseason, but they could use him over the last week of the season.

On the other hand, I’m sure the Yanks would offer AJ Burnett’s services.

Avoid Running At All Times- S. Paige Posted: September 22, 2011 at 03:55 PM | 49 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: mets, red sox, rumors

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   1. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: September 22, 2011 at 07:11 PM (#3933252)
So would Casey Kelly have gotten a callup by now?
   2. Jose is Absurdly Unemployed Posted: September 22, 2011 at 07:14 PM (#3933253)
So would Casey Kelly have gotten a callup by now?


As part of Fan Appeciation night last night I think some guy in section 31 is going to be the set up man in New York.

So yeah, he would have. I say that having no idea how he's pitching in the Padre system.
   3. Sam M. Posted: September 22, 2011 at 07:20 PM (#3933261)
If the Red Sox are offering anything of any value whatsoever, I'd deal Capuano in a heartbeat. What an interesting situation -- how much is one start, maybe two, from Chris Capuano worth under these circumstances?
   4. Ravecc Posted: September 22, 2011 at 07:21 PM (#3933263)
Why are the Mets holding on to Cappy?

The $28 they save isn't much, but the "Re-sign Reyes Fund" needs all the help it can get.
   5. JimMusComp likes Billy Eppler.... Posted: September 22, 2011 at 07:23 PM (#3933266)
This made me laugh out loud. At first I assumed they meant at the trade deadline - or in August. NOT THIS WEEK! This collapse - if it comes to fruition - will make me giggle just a little every time I see the Red Sox play. Forever.

I lived through 1995 with the Angels and other teams need to be able to access that type of emotion. It shouldn't be hoarded by us Angel fans....
   6. Sam M. Posted: September 22, 2011 at 07:26 PM (#3933270)
Why are the Mets holding on to Cappy?


I assume it's a combination of the desire to hold onto him for next year (on the assumption that he'd be more likely to resign if he finishes the season with the Mets than if they trade him), and the Red Sox offering pretty much nothing of value.
   7. ellsbury my heart at wounded knee Posted: September 22, 2011 at 07:29 PM (#3933274)
I think they pretty much just offered cash.
   8. SoSH U at work Posted: September 22, 2011 at 07:29 PM (#3933275)
I lived through 1995 with the Angels and other teams need to be able to access that type of emotion. It shouldn't be hoarded by us Angel fans....


Yeah, some of us are old enough to have lived through 78. We're familiar with one of these thigns works, and would just as soon not go through it again. Thanks.
   9. Walks Clog Up the Bases Posted: September 22, 2011 at 07:33 PM (#3933282)
Red Sox Nation will rue the day the team did not trade for Carlos Zambrano. Rue, I tell you!
   10. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: September 22, 2011 at 07:36 PM (#3933284)
Rue the day? Who talks like that?
   11. Sam M. Posted: September 22, 2011 at 07:36 PM (#3933285)
I think they pretty much just offered cash.


Have fun with more of the Erik Bedard Show, then.
   12. zack Posted: September 22, 2011 at 07:37 PM (#3933286)
I have to imagine the Red Sox offer was "we'll pay his salary for next week, and here's a $200 bottle of scotch".

Personally, I would have taken the scotch, but I guess the Mets want somebody to burn off 180 innings next year.
   13. Jose is Absurdly Unemployed Posted: September 22, 2011 at 07:40 PM (#3933291)
I lived through 1995 with the Angels and other teams need to be able to access that type of emotion. It shouldn't be hoarded by us Angel fans....


Those of us old enough have '78, we're good. (already opened can of Coke to SoSH).

Seriously though, what teams don't have something devastating of this sort in their history? I'm not talking about just ineptitude, but a "had it won but then had Lucy pull the ball away" moment. this is an off the top of my head list so I probably missed something obvious.

Yankees - 2004 ALCS
Sox - 1978
Rays - None
Blue Jays - 1987
Orioles - 1979 World Series

White Sox - None
Indians - 1997 World Series
Tigers - Hmmm...can't imagine 2006 works here, maybe I'm missing one
Royals - 1977 ALCS
Twins/Senators - 1924 World Series

A's - 2003 ALDS?
Rangers - None
Mariners - Maybe 2001 ALCS belongs here just for "116 wins to nothing"
Angels - 1995

Braves - 1958 WS
Phillies - 1964
Marlins - None
Nationals/Expos - 1981 NLCS
Mets - 2007

Cardinals - 1985 World Series
Astros - 1980 NLCS
Pirates - 1992 NLCS
Cubs - 2003 NLCS
Brewers - None
Reds - None

Diamondbacks - None
Dodgers - 1951
Giants - 1993
Rockies - None
Padres - 2007
   14. mswift Posted: September 22, 2011 at 07:42 PM (#3933293)
Should MLB allow a trade like this ?

In the middle of a wildcard race to simply buy a pitcher ?
   15. Sam M. Posted: September 22, 2011 at 07:43 PM (#3933294)
Mets - 2007 & 2008


We went back-to-back, jack.
   16. Swedish Chef Posted: September 22, 2011 at 07:44 PM (#3933295)
Marlins - None

The 1998 dismantling was pretty devastating.
   17. zack Posted: September 22, 2011 at 07:45 PM (#3933296)
Losing a postseason series is a whole different, mundane kind of shitball compared to wasting a season away.

Should MLB allow a trade like this ?


Why not? The punishment is already built-in by disallowing him from the postseason roster. Every in-season acquisition is in the middle of a race.
   18. SoSH U at work Posted: September 22, 2011 at 07:48 PM (#3933299)
White Sox - None


That whole "Team in World Series, loses on purpose" thing would probably work in a pinch.
   19. The District Attorney Posted: September 22, 2011 at 07:50 PM (#3933304)
These very same Red Sox acquired Mike Stanton (the lefty reliever, natch) from Washington on Sep. 29, 2005.

Boston gave up two 19-year-old pitchers, Rhys Taylor and Yader Peralta. Surprisingly to me, they had both shown signs of life in their careers -- Taylor had a 1.49 ERA that season, while Peralta had put up a 2.10 in the previous -- but ultimately, neither one even made it to AA ball.

Before the games of Sep. 29 were played, Boston was 92-66, tying them for the wild card with Cleveland. The Yankees were 93-65, and their final series of the season was against the Red Sox.

Stanton faced his former Yankee teammates in the penultimate game of the season, on Oct. 1. After history's greatest monster, Tim Wakefield, gave up seven runs in five innings, Stanton came in to face three consecutive lefties in Hideki Matsui, Robinson Cano and Tino Martinez. Stanton struck out Matsui, gave up a single to Cano, picked him off, and then retired Tino. The Red Sox still lost the game, 8-4.

Boston did win the season finale, and Cleveland ended the season on a three-game slide, so the Red Sox took the wild card.

Anyway, that is the latest in-season trade I have ever heard of, and I suppose the best guideline we've got for what the Sox would have to give up, or for how much difference it would make...
   20. Rally Posted: September 22, 2011 at 07:53 PM (#3933307)
Why are the Mets holding on to Cappy?


Is he a potential type B free agent?
   21. Jose is Absurdly Unemployed Posted: September 22, 2011 at 07:54 PM (#3933309)
From the Sox' perspective one competent start is looking like a real difference maker.
   22. RB in NYC (Now Semi-Retired from BBTF) Posted: September 22, 2011 at 07:56 PM (#3933310)
These very same Red Sox acquired Mike Stanton (the lefty reliever, natch) from Washington on Sep. 29, 2005.
I knew the Sox had done this once before for someone who was associated with the Yankees and not very good anymore. But I couldn't remember who.

I wonder if Stanton got a playoff share.
   23. Sam M. Posted: September 22, 2011 at 07:56 PM (#3933311)
From the Sox' perspective one competent start is looking like a real difference maker.


I wonder what the Angels might offer to keep one competent starter away from the Red Sox? Who could have predicted: a bidding war for Chris Capuano!!!! Sandy Alderson's master plan is paying off! The man is a genius!
   24. The Yankee Clapper Posted: September 22, 2011 at 07:57 PM (#3933312)
. . . Red Sox have spent the last week trying to get lefty Chris Capuano from the Mets to start Sunday at Yankee Stadium.


That smacks of desperation, but perhaps not unwarrantedly so. Still, if pitching is this big a problem, you'd think there might be a spot for Hideki Okajima on a 40-man squad. I consider it a significant failure of the media covering the Red Sox that this issue has (apparently) gone unexplained.
   25. Jose is Absurdly Unemployed Posted: September 22, 2011 at 08:00 PM (#3933314)
That smacks of desperation, but perhaps not unwarrantedly so. Still, if pitching is this big a problem, you'd think there might be a spot for Hideki Okajima on a 40-man squad. I consider it a significant failure of the media covering the Red Sox that this issue has (apparently) gone unexplained.


Two things on that;

1. Okajima was not very good in his limited time with the club this year.

2. I have no way of demonstrating this but Peter Abraham, who seems to be the lead guy at boston.com covering the club, seems to not like Okajima. I don't know how to explain it but he wrote about him both this year and last year in a style that came across as ###### sometimes. Presumably he'd be the guy leading the charge.

EDIT: Not saying Okajima's absence isn't worth exploring, just that I don't think he'd have been a big difference maker. Franklin Morales has taken the innings Oki probably would have taken and actually pitched pretty well.
   26. RJ in TO Posted: September 22, 2011 at 08:01 PM (#3933317)
I wonder what the Angels might offer to keep one competent starter away from the Red Sox? Who could have predicted: a bidding war for Chris Capuano!!!!

With a 4.47 ERA (83 ERA+), it might be stretching things to call him a competent starter. It might be better to just call him a "less incompetent than the guys the Red Sox currently have" starter.
   27. Sam M. Posted: September 22, 2011 at 08:03 PM (#3933318)
With a 4.47 ERA (83 ERA+), it might be stretching things to call him a competent starter. It might be better to just call him a "less incompetent than the guys the Red Sox currently have" starter.


Killjoy.
   28. RJ in TO Posted: September 22, 2011 at 08:05 PM (#3933322)
Hey, the less competent he is, the funnier it would be if the Angels and Red Sox were to get in a bidding war over him.
   29. Random Transaction Generator Posted: September 22, 2011 at 08:07 PM (#3933325)
I wonder what the Angels might offer to keep one competent starter away from the Red Sox? Who could have predicted: a bidding war for Chris Capuano!!!!

Can you make "negative trades"?
Where you give a team something (cash, PTBNL, bats) to not make a trade?

The closest I can come up with is trading something to a team to NOT draft another player in a rule 5 draft or expansion draft.
Has that happened?
   30. Jose is Absurdly Unemployed Posted: September 22, 2011 at 08:07 PM (#3933326)
With a 4.47 ERA (83 ERA+), it might be stretching things to call him a competent starter.


That's 1990 Roger Clemens compared to the pieces of crap we are rolling out right now. I don't know who posted it in the chatter last night but the Sox have won 1 game this month in which they scrored less than 12 runs.
   31. ellsbury my heart at wounded knee Posted: September 22, 2011 at 08:08 PM (#3933327)
I consider it a significant failure of the media covering the Red Sox that this issue has (apparently) gone unexplained.


I actually emailed Abraham about this, since the media hadn't really been talking about it. He was nice enough to respond and basically said that since Okajima's success is based on deception, he was tricking minor league hitters, but that was something he lost the ability to do in the majors last year, and that the team didn't see him as being helpful.

BTW, Abraham seems like a really nice guy.
   32. The Yankee Clapper Posted: September 22, 2011 at 08:20 PM (#3933340)
Okajima was not very good in his limited time with the club this year.

Okajima's success is based on deception, he was tricking minor league hitters, but that was something he lost the ability to do in the majors last year, and that the team didn't see him as being helpful.

Okajima wasn't much in Boston this year, but he had a 2.29 ERA in 51 innings after being sent down. While it's possible his stuff just won't work on the Major League level anymore, I'd think you'd want to test that out a bit to be sure. Giving Okajima, who had some past MLB success, a September audition doesn't seem as risky as some of the other moves lately, but perhaps there is more to the story. Too late now, in any event.
   33. Jay Seaver Posted: September 22, 2011 at 08:20 PM (#3933341)
I consider it a significant failure of the media covering the Red Sox that this issue has (apparently) gone unexplained.

There were comments practically back in Spring Training indicating that neither really seemed to want the other - Okajima commented about not wanting to be the guy on the Boston-Pawtucket shuttle (especially after having been up and down once), and the story was that the Sox signed him as a courtesy when he was without a team late in the off-season so that he could demonstrate that he wasn't finished to other teams and maybe get something useful in trade.

It does seem a little odd, since he certainly seems useful and the fan base seems to like him more than the average replaceable relief pitcher, but I gather Okaji is kind of a moody guy - there were lots of reports last year about how lonely and isolated he felt in Boston, and how he didn't do a lot to learn English or otherwise fit in, so I was kind of surprised to see him back in the US at all this year. I'm not surprised Abraham doesn't like him; PeteAbe breaks the snark out really quickly and Okajima isn't quite good enough to get away with ignoring/snubbing the press (in their eyes).
   34. Every Inge Counts Posted: September 22, 2011 at 08:28 PM (#3933346)
Tigers - Hmmm...can't imagine 2006 works here, maybe I'm missing one


2009 works just fine for me. 4 games to go, up by 2 games and we end up having to play in a one game playoff against Minnesota...that we lose in extra innings.
   35. Fernigal McGunnigle Posted: September 22, 2011 at 08:29 PM (#3933348)
Anyway, that is the latest in-season trade I have ever heard of, and I suppose the best guideline we've got for what the Sox would have to give up, or for how much difference it would make...


The Braves and Cubs also made a September 29th trade -- Kevin Blankenship and Kevin Coffman for Jody Davis, Sept 29, 1988. The season ended on Oct 2 in both '88 and '05, so they were equally late in the year. The timing of the Davis deal was weird -- the two teams were a combined 61.5 games out of first, so it's not like it was something that couldn't have waited another couple of weeks. At least it let the Braves' announcers imagine for a couple of days that the team had found a replacement for Ozzie Vergil. Davis of course went 169/246/242 in 1989.

EDIT: I should point out that Davis was arb-eligible, but not a FA. So it was just a generic trade that happened to occur at the very end of a season, not a FA-to-be deal like Stanton or Capuano.
   36. Rally Posted: September 22, 2011 at 08:53 PM (#3933368)
I wonder what the Angels might offer to keep one competent starter away from the Red Sox? Who could have predicted: a bidding war for Chris Capuano!!!! Sandy Alderson's master plan is paying off! The man is a genius!


Might not be a bad idea. Angels catching the Red Sox is probably more likely than passing them, and if this goes to game 163 Santana/Weaver/Haren will not be available - they are pitching the last 3 games.

I'd like to see a 3 way playoff though - enough to delay the ALDS.
   37. Jose is Absurdly Unemployed Posted: September 22, 2011 at 08:54 PM (#3933370)
34 - Oh yeah. That was the "base hit...caught out there!" game wasn't it?
   38. Sam M. Posted: September 22, 2011 at 09:10 PM (#3933378)
Angels catching the Red Sox is probably more likely than passing them, and if this goes to game 163 Santana/Weaver/Haren will not be available - they are pitching the last 3 games.


If this goes to a Game 163, I'd put the over/under on the runs the Angels will score at 9.5. Does it really matter who pitches for them?
   39. Robert in Manhattan Beach Posted: September 22, 2011 at 09:31 PM (#3933396)
Braves - 1958 WS

The '96 WS left some pretty good scars too.
   40. Roger Cedeno's Spleen Posted: September 22, 2011 at 09:31 PM (#3933397)
Astros - 1980 NLCS


2003 - Gagging the division away to the Cubs
2008 - IKE

2008 was my low point as an Astro fan. It's not considered one of the great historic collapses, because the Astros never held a large lead, but it deserves some sort of honorable mention... pretty much the most screwed up ending to a race and a season, ever. This was a horrific real life tragedy intruding into sports but with absolutely none of the inspiring narrative that followed 9/11 or even the 1989 earthquake. The five games starting with the Zambrano no-hitter were brutal beyond words, about as bad a five games of baseball as any team has ever played. The Astros were already mentally and emotionally destroyed going into those games. Watching them try to play baseball was like watching Ali try to fight Holmes.

What made it all especially sickening was the realization that the whole 2008 playoff run was the last gasp of a mortally ill franchise and that those were probably the last truly meaningful games the team would play for the better part of a decade...

1986, 1998, 1999 and 2004 were all tough, but none of those involved the loss of something seemingly won and/or a contest derailed by some totally unexpected and ridiculous event... unless you consider Kevin ####### Brown to be an act of God...
   41. zack Posted: September 22, 2011 at 09:46 PM (#3933412)
unless you consider Kevin ####### Brown to be an act of God...


Well the Great Old Ones are kinda gods...
   42. Something Other Posted: September 22, 2011 at 10:05 PM (#3933431)
So... odd that the R Sox didn't think of this a month ago. It's not like their pitching is going to be a whole lot deeper next season, and Capuano is decent depth, so he'd be worth having in the organization in 2012 if they can re-sign him, and if he goes elsewhere they get a pick, assuming he's a Type B. What would a fair offer from the Red Sox be--Capuano's remaining salary, and a minor league guy, slightly better than what you'd expect from the pick the Mets would get if Capuano didn't re-sign with the Mets in the offseason?

I've heard Capuano's looking for a pretty good deal this offseason. I can't imagine the Mets have any interest in signing him, just as I can't imagine the Red Sox don't know that.
   43. tfbg9 Posted: September 22, 2011 at 10:32 PM (#3933445)
#19 makes mention of another, unfocused-upon, Tim Wakefield "clutch situation" pitching mound turd deposit.

Just sayin'...
   44. The Long Arm of Rudy Law Posted: September 22, 2011 at 10:48 PM (#3933465)
The White Sox have a few semi-competent pitchers and they can all be had for whatever it costs to frame Alex Rios for Adam Dunn's murder.
   45. Srul Itza Posted: September 22, 2011 at 10:52 PM (#3933470)
From the Sox' perspective one competent start is looking like a real difference maker.


Until the Rays show they can beat even a "House Money" Yankee line up, I don't know that the Sox have much to be concerned about.
   46. Sam M. Posted: September 22, 2011 at 11:19 PM (#3933505)
Until the Rays show they can beat even a "House Money" Yankee line up, I don't know that the Sox have much to be concerned about.


Warning: Objects in the AL West may be closer than they appear.
   47. Srul Itza Posted: September 22, 2011 at 11:57 PM (#3933563)
I did not realize they had climbed so close.

With Oakland and Toronto on the schedule, and Texas probably having clinched when they meet, I think the Sox have more to worry from them than the Rays.
   48. tfbg9 Posted: September 23, 2011 at 03:44 AM (#3933794)
Smart.
   49. JimMusComp likes Billy Eppler.... Posted: September 23, 2011 at 06:50 PM (#3934254)
If this goes to a Game 163, I'd put the over/under on the runs the Angels will score at 9.5. Does it really matter who pitches for them?


Yeah, and just think if the Angels could field a competent offense?

Anyway, Angels are done.

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