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Sunday, January 27, 2013

BP: Understanding the Umpire-Manager Arguments of 2012

This is fantastic, GIFs and videos of some great ejections and lip-read transcriptions of the conversations:

Joe Maddon: He tagged him on his ball sack! His ####### ass is on the bag!

AND

After being ejected by Joe West for arguing balls and strikes from the dugout, Girardi speaks for all major-league managers when he says:
Joe Girardi: It’s embarrassing, Joe. Horseshit! Hey, Joe, don’t laugh! You’re not better than this stuff. You think you are, but you’re not! You’re a bastard!

MM1f Posted: January 27, 2013 at 01:30 AM | 14 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: cowboy joe west, ejections, umpires

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   1. 'zop sympathizes with the wrong ####### people Posted: January 27, 2013 at 08:36 AM (#4355862)
It's funny, Girardi is the most articulate of all the arguers. I always thought that Northwestern man identity was a bit of bullshit - Girardi was a college boy the same way I was a ball player - but he's not entirely a degenerate ####.
   2. The District Attorney Posted: January 27, 2013 at 09:47 AM (#4355884)
It's funny, Girardi is the most articulate of all the arguers.
He has truth on his side.

It's actually nice in a warped way to see how relatively non-personal it is. I mean, a lot of profanity is used, but the manager's argument almost always boils down to "He was safe/out! You have to get that one right!" Girardi got personal in that excerpt, but again, it's Joe West so it's fine.
   3. Zach Posted: January 27, 2013 at 11:15 AM (#4355913)
"People always want to know whether there’s a magic word. Is it ‘cocksucker’? Is it ‘asshole’? No. The magic word is 'you.'"—Umpire Gary Cederstrom

I thought it was Catfish.
   4. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: January 27, 2013 at 01:19 PM (#4355985)
ron arguing anything comes as a bit of a shock to brewer fans.
   5. Robert in Manhattan Beach Posted: January 27, 2013 at 01:25 PM (#4355989)
The ejections without leaving the dugout are always the most impressive. Bobby Cox could get ejected without ever leaving his seat in the dugout. He was the master.
   6. phredbird Posted: January 27, 2013 at 02:58 PM (#4356044)
the clips were all close plays fer sure. they could have gone either way. but i guess that's what gets the managers riled the most.

this was really cool.
   7. KJOK Posted: January 27, 2013 at 03:11 PM (#4356052)
Tim Timmons: I missed the call.


I'm guessing this may really be "I missed the call?"

   8. Joe Kehoskie Posted: January 27, 2013 at 04:38 PM (#4356121)
Fun article. I'm not sure about the "You're a bastard!" comment attributed to Girardi toward West, though.
   9. Greg K Posted: January 27, 2013 at 04:45 PM (#4356126)
I'm guessing this may really be "I missed the call?"

I was thinking perhaps a sarcastic..."yeah, I missed the call".

It would be fun to see an umpire play along and act like the manager has convinced him to reverse the call, only to pull the rug out from under the poor guy just as he's starting to believe it.
   10. CFBF Is A Golden Spider Duck Posted: January 27, 2013 at 04:59 PM (#4356133)
The argument between Hurdle and Darling is amusing, simply because both men understand how pointless the entire thing is. It gets at something I've wondered for a while: if it's a question of judgment and not rules interpretation (and boy, I would love to see the Fredi Gonzalez argument from the NL Wildcard game), what is there to say beyond, "He was out!" "No, he wasn't!"

Gary Darling: [Comes in at end of sentence]

Clint Hurdle: Oh, he did not! He didn’t [Obscured]

GD: Yes he did.

CH: There's no way. There's no way! [Obscured] The ball— [Obscured] He put down the tag, he's out.

GD: The guy was on the bag.

CH: He's out, Gary. He's out.

GD: No, he wasn't.

CH: Yes, he is! He's out. Look now, you make the right call here. Make the right call, here. He's OUT.

GD: I did make the right call.

CH: He's OUT, Gary! He's OUT! Just make the right call.

GD: I did!

CH: You DIDN'T make the right call.

GD: [Obscured]

CH: You made the wrong call. On a thing like that.

GD: Yeah, well, that, thank you, thank you for that, yeah.

CH: Yeah, all right. ... Make the right call! Make the right call!

GD: I did, though, Clint. This is going nowhere.

CH: I understand that...
   11. Austin Posted: January 27, 2013 at 06:45 PM (#4356182)
what is there to say beyond, "He was out!" "No, he wasn't!"

Well, there are occasional arguments that don't just involve judgment and rules interpretation:

Bobby Valentine: What the ####?! He had a big mark on his ####### wrist!

Brian O’Nora: (Tosses him)


You almost have to feel sorry for Bobby V in a situation like that.
   12. The District Attorney Posted: January 27, 2013 at 09:25 PM (#4356260)
I can totally buy an ump simply saying "I missed the call." As alluded to, these are almost never actually angry exchanges, but rather legitimate (if high-volume) attempts for the ump and manager to understand each other. I definitely remember Weaver or some other perpetually embattled manager saying that sometimes the ump would preempt them by admitting right away that they missed the call, and at that point there was nothing left for the manager to do besides throw a theatrical tantrum...
   13. cardsfanboy Posted: January 27, 2013 at 09:36 PM (#4356264)
Well, there are occasional arguments that don't just involve judgment and rules interpretation:


If they had Bobby Cox doing it, it would be the same thing "Reverse that call or else I'm going to treat you like my wife....or I'll withhold the payments the Braves have been making to you for the years of beneficial calls"
   14. Crispix reaches boiling point with lackluster play Posted: January 27, 2013 at 11:43 PM (#4356315)
This is great stuff. Really what the internet was made for. A bit disappointed to see the vague description of whatever Charlie Manuel said. Censorship!

Ron Roenicke certaily looks like the kind of guy who gets angry all the time, but sources say he doesn't.

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