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Thursday, April 19, 2018

Bryan Price dismissed as Reds manager | MLB.com

The Bryan Price era is over.

Jim Furtado Posted: April 19, 2018 at 09:47 AM | 98 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: bryan price, jim riggleman, reds

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   1. Barry`s_Lazy_Boy Posted: April 19, 2018 at 09:59 AM (#5656383)
3-15 is bad, but April firings are a headscratcher.
   2. Nasty Nate Posted: April 19, 2018 at 10:06 AM (#5656388)
Former Jays and Sox manager John Farrell was hired as a scout by the Reds a month ago...
   3. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: April 19, 2018 at 10:06 AM (#5656389)
3-15 is bad, but April firings are a headscratcher.


Yes. I just posted this in the dugout:

"Stupid move. I don't know anything about Price, but what do the Reds know now that they didn't 18 games ago? And if Jim Riggleman is the answer, you're in a heap of trouble no matter what the question is."
   4. Jose is an Absurd Doubles Machine Posted: April 19, 2018 at 10:08 AM (#5656391)
Former Jays and Sox manager John Farrell was hired as a scout by the Reds a month ago...


Last time he took over a team they won the World Series in his first year.
   5. Jose is an Absurd Doubles Machine Posted: April 19, 2018 at 10:08 AM (#5656392)
And agree completely with Misirlou. What exactly were the Reds expecting?
   6. SoSH U at work Posted: April 19, 2018 at 10:12 AM (#5656394)
3-15 is bad, but April firings are a headscratcher.


To be fair, a fifth year of the Bryan Price era was a headscratcher to begin with.
   7. Zonk cooks his superfish with raisins Posted: April 19, 2018 at 10:12 AM (#5656395)
I'm 1-0 against the vaunted and allegedly invincible Cubs, what more do you want?!?

/Price
   8. puck Posted: April 19, 2018 at 10:13 AM (#5656396)
What exactly were the Reds expecting?


8-10?
   9. Random Transaction Generator Posted: April 19, 2018 at 10:21 AM (#5656397)
The firing at 3-15 is simply an early exit for the guy they were going to can anyways at the end of the season (barring a miracle) and is an attempt to appease the frustrated fan base.

Also, it increases the chances infinitesimally of seeing player-manager Joey Votto. :)
   10. jmurph Posted: April 19, 2018 at 10:22 AM (#5656399)
And if Jim Riggleman is the answer

I can't believe anyone would ever hire him again after the way he left the Nationals. Who would want to play for him?
   11. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: April 19, 2018 at 10:23 AM (#5656400)
To be fair, a fifth year of the Bryan Price era was a headscratcher to begin with.


Well, that's the point.
   12. BDC Posted: April 19, 2018 at 10:29 AM (#5656402)
I saw Riggleman in the Reds' dugout last month and was mildly amazed that he was still in baseball. He's only 65, which certainly doesn't seem old to me :) but not a lot of guys manage in the majors at that age. The current crop of elder statesmen (Bochy, Showalter, Yost) are in their early 60s, and guys like Scioscia and Francona, who have been around forever, aren't even 60 yet.
   13. SoSH U at work Posted: April 19, 2018 at 10:34 AM (#5656408)
Well, that's the point.


There are two, aren't there?

Some very early-season firings are strange because we can't possibly have enough information to change courses so early in the campaign, and if you thought the manager was your guy before the season, it seems odd to give up so quickly.

But in this case, there's the secondary point that Bryan Price had already managed for four seasons without showing any proficiency at the task whatsoever. What exactly has happened under him that would have provided any hope going into the 2018 season?

   14. Crispix Attacksel Rios Posted: April 19, 2018 at 10:48 AM (#5656417)
John Farrell? Jim Riggleman? Bring back Dusty Baker!
   15. Moses Taylor, aka Hambone Fakenameington Posted: April 19, 2018 at 10:52 AM (#5656420)
The current crop of elder statesmen (Bochy, Showalter, Yost) are in their early 60s, and guys like Scioscia and Francona, who have been around forever, aren't even 60 yet.

Maddon is 64
   16. Zonk cooks his superfish with raisins Posted: April 19, 2018 at 10:59 AM (#5656422)
Maddon is 64


To be fair, he was only 62 before watching Tyler Chatwood walk a bazillion guys last start.
   17. The usual palaver and twaddle (Met Fan Charlie) Posted: April 19, 2018 at 11:04 AM (#5656428)
I didn't think he'd last the year, but I never thought they'd pull a Yogi on him...
   18. Baldrick Posted: April 19, 2018 at 11:07 AM (#5656429)
This doesn't feel that weird. Maybe the players like Price and the ownership figured: 'we're not going to the playoffs this year anyways, so why rock the boat for no reason?' A 3-15 start could easily change that equation.
   19. Steve Parris, Je t'aime Posted: April 19, 2018 at 11:08 AM (#5656431)
I was for letting Price go after last season but I saw the argument to give him one more season. The pitching has been a dumpster fire the last two years but some of the younger guys (Castillo, Romano, Stephenson) showed development in the second half. Since Price was previously the team's pitching coach it made some sense to see if he could continue his momentum.

Granted the 2018 sample size is small, but the pitching staff was showing no development whatsoever. Last in FIP and HRs. May as well see what Farrell (hopefully, god help me if it's Riggleman) can do on a prolonged interim basis.
   20. BDC Posted: April 19, 2018 at 11:09 AM (#5656432)
Huh, Maddon always seems younger to me. Maybe it's the glasses. Are there any active managers older than Riggleman?
   21. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: April 19, 2018 at 11:11 AM (#5656433)
John Farrell? Jim Riggleman? Bring back Dusty Baker!
Is Sparky still with us?

EDIT: No, he is not. Check him off the list.
   22. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: April 19, 2018 at 11:11 AM (#5656435)
Huh, Maddon always seems younger to me. Maybe it's the glasses.
He started dying his hair last year.
   23. Jose is an Absurd Doubles Machine Posted: April 19, 2018 at 11:16 AM (#5656436)

But in this case, there's the secondary point that Bryan Price had already managed for four seasons without showing any proficiency at the task whatsoever. What exactly has happened under him that would have provided any hope going into the 2018 season?


This is 100% true and bringing him back didn't make a ton of sense. But given that they did what's changed? You've had four years to evaluate the guy, what have you learned in 18 games that you didn't learn in 648? Maybe they just wanted his record to reflect 666 games managed as a warning to other teams?
   24. SoSH U at work Posted: April 19, 2018 at 11:23 AM (#5656442)
This is 100% true and bringing him back didn't make a ton of sense. But given that they did what's changed?


I'm not advocating firing a guy after 18 games. I was merely pointing out that in Price's case, it was equally puzzling that they'd have brought him back in the first place. That isn't always the case with early-season firings (for example, in the same city 25 years earlier, Tony Perez was dismissed after 44 games of his first, and only, managerial season). That one was truly inexplicable.

Not all early-season shitcannings are the same.
   25. PASTE, Now with Extra Pitch and Extra Stamina Posted: April 19, 2018 at 11:24 AM (#5656445)
Agreed. Price overstayed his welcome by two years, but firing him three weeks into the season makes for a double indicator that upper management has no idea what the hell they're doing.
   26. Zonk cooks his superfish with raisins Posted: April 19, 2018 at 11:25 AM (#5656446)
Granted the 2018 sample size is small, but the pitching staff was showing no development whatsoever. Last in FIP and HRs. May as well see what Farrell (hopefully, god help me if it's Riggleman) can do on a prolonged interim basis.


I suppose there's Farrell... but generally speaking, don't intra-season hires generally tend to be caretaker interims?

I'm having a hard time remembering the last in-season replacement who kept the job long term.

I'd think they'd just go caretaker and do a more thorough search in the offseason. I would think the other advantage of a guy who knows he's just filling shoes would be that he'd be easier to get onboard with whatever "we want to get an extended look at this guy, etc" the front office might want.

How long has Dick Williams been at the helm? I know he got promoted a couple years ago, but I think he was in the GM spot as long as Price was manager, no?
   27. PreservedFish Posted: April 19, 2018 at 11:28 AM (#5656451)
I still remember the Rob Neyer article where he introduced the pioneering new Mariners pitching coach, Bryan Price, who would lead the organization - and, in particular, top draft pick Ryan Anderson - to glory, with his innovation: the 100 pitch limit.
   28. The usual palaver and twaddle (Met Fan Charlie) Posted: April 19, 2018 at 11:29 AM (#5656453)
I'm having a hard time remembering the last in-season replacement who kept the job long term.


Pete Mackanin should have.
   29. SoSH U at work Posted: April 19, 2018 at 11:30 AM (#5656454)
I'm having a hard time remembering the last in-season replacement who kept the job long term.


Bucky Showalter was the last, I think. Jim Tracy, Davey Johnson (after Riggs' AWOL act in D.C.) and, further back, the Crown Prince of the Mid-Season Hire, Trader Jack.

Your own Mike Quade even squeezed out a full year.

But Farrell was never a mid-season hire. He was pursued by the Red Sox while still in the employ of the Blue Jays in the same position.
   30. SoSH U at work Posted: April 19, 2018 at 11:31 AM (#5656455)
Pete Mackanin should have.


Early returns say he was better at interiming than full seasoning.
   31. Moses Taylor, aka Hambone Fakenameington Posted: April 19, 2018 at 11:32 AM (#5656456)
Huh, Maddon always seems younger to me. Maybe it's the glasses.

He got a late start. He also acts younger than he is (see the hair dye, etc)
   32. Ziggy's screen name Posted: April 19, 2018 at 11:32 AM (#5656457)
player-manager Joey Votto


I am Ziggy's screen name, and I approve of this message.
   33. Steve Parris, Je t'aime Posted: April 19, 2018 at 11:32 AM (#5656458)
I was merely pointing out that in Price's case, it was equally puzzling that they'd have brought him back in the first place.

The argument was he'd develop the crop of young pitchers the Reds have been counting on. Some of those guys showed some progress late last year, as I mentioned.
   34. Jose is an Absurd Doubles Machine Posted: April 19, 2018 at 11:34 AM (#5656459)
That isn't always the case with early-season firings (for example, in the same city 25 years earlier, Tony Perez was dismissed after 44 games of his first, and only, managerial season). That one was truly inexplicable.


See that makes sense to me. It's like a first date, you meet the girl, she's cute, seems nice enough and you ask her out then on your first date you discover she's a flaming racist. Interviews are great and all but seeing something in action (e.g. Mr. Kapler) can give you a new insight that makes you say "oh crap we've made a terrible mistake."

In the case of Price I think we are on the same page. I completely agree that bringing him back seemed odd. But once you've done that I'd love to know what the Reds think they learned in 18 games.
   35. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: April 19, 2018 at 11:35 AM (#5656462)
He got a late start. He also acts younger than he is (see the hair dye, etc)
It also could be that our thoughts about manager ages were formed when guys who looked like Maddon were actually 35.
   36. Jose is an Absurd Doubles Machine Posted: April 19, 2018 at 11:37 AM (#5656463)
I'm having a hard time remembering the last in-season replacement who kept the job long term.


The problem with succeeding is almost by definition you are inheriting a shitshow. When is the last time a manager of a team over .500 was fired in-season*? I wouldn't be surprised if you had to go back to the 70s Yankees for that one.

* - Not counting teams that fired a manager on the last day of the season or something like that.
   37. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: April 19, 2018 at 11:42 AM (#5656468)
When is the last time a manager of a team over .500 was fired in-season*? I wouldn't be surprised if you had to go back to the 70s Yankees for that one.
I think the Yankees still did that into the mid-'80s.
   38. Dunn Deal Posted: April 19, 2018 at 11:44 AM (#5656470)
You've had four years to evaluate the guy, what have you learned in 18 games that you didn't learn in 648? Maybe they just wanted his record to reflect 666 games managed as a warning to other teams?


Maybe they're going to hire Chris Truby.
   39. SoSH U at work Posted: April 19, 2018 at 11:45 AM (#5656471)
When is the last time a manager of a team over .500 was fired in-season*?


During the Brewers' playoff season of 2008, Ned Yost was fired with eight games remaining.
   40. Lassus Posted: April 19, 2018 at 12:07 PM (#5656480)
But once you've done that I'd love to know what the Reds think they learned in 18 games.

That they were the same as the 500 prior and someone in ownership somewhere had had enough?
   41. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: April 19, 2018 at 12:16 PM (#5656483)
When is the last time a manager of a team over .500 was fired in-season*? I wouldn't be surprised if you had to go back to the 70s Yankees for that one.
I think the Yankees still did that into the mid-'80s.


Not only that, it also addresses the question of an interim manager remaining on the following year.

In 1975, Bill Virdon was fired after going 53-51. he was replaced by Billy Martin, who managed until...

1978, when he was fired after starting 52-42, replaced by Bob lemon, who stayed until...

1979, when he was fired after starting 34-31, to be replaced by Billy Martin, who was fired at the end of the season, breaking the string.

In 1981, Gene Michael was fired after starting 48-34, replaced by Bob Lemon, who remained until...

1982, when he was fired after starting 6-8, replaced by Bob lemon, who did not last the season, fired after going 44-42. his replacement, Clyde king finished the season and was not rehired.

Advancing a little further, Billy Martin was fired in 1988 after starting 40-28.
   42. Non-Youkilidian Geometry Posted: April 19, 2018 at 12:17 PM (#5656485)
Maybe they're going to hire Chris Truby.


I'm so sick of all these ex-ballplayers like Chris Truby and Albert Belle with all their being hired as interim managers of the Reds and everything.
   43. Batman Posted: April 19, 2018 at 12:22 PM (#5656488)
Is Sparky still with us?
Pete Rose is technically alive, no matter how corpse-like he looks. That may be an effort to get around the lifetime ban.
   44. SoSH U at work Posted: April 19, 2018 at 12:24 PM (#5656491)
Speaking of Belle, I don't think I saw anything here about it, but the indecent exposure charge against him was dropped. So, I guess that puts him back in the running for the Reds full-time gig.

   45. Never Give an Inge (Dave) Posted: April 19, 2018 at 12:36 PM (#5656506)

Huh, Maddon always seems younger to me. Maybe it's the glasses. Are there any active managers older than Riggleman?

Both Terry Collins and Dusty Baker are 68 and were managing last year, but neither are back this year.
   46. mathesond Posted: April 19, 2018 at 12:53 PM (#5656512)
I'm having a hard time remembering the last in-season replacement who kept the job long term.


Cito Gaston did it a couple of times with Toronto. Won a couple of World Series, or so I'm told...
   47. JJ1986 Posted: April 19, 2018 at 12:56 PM (#5656517)
I'm having a hard time remembering the last in-season replacement who kept the job long term.
Craig Counsell's got almost 3 years managing the Brewers.
   48. Silas Wegg Posted: April 19, 2018 at 01:11 PM (#5656525)
The problem with succeeding is almost by definition you are inheriting a shitshow. When is the last time a manager of a team over .500 was fired in-season*? I wouldn't be surprised if you had to go back to the 70s Yankees for that one.


For shame, Jose!

https://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/BOS/1988.shtml
   49. For the Turnstiles (andeux) Posted: April 19, 2018 at 01:18 PM (#5656531)
Bob Melvin, who took over the A's mid-season 2011, is another one.
   50. flournoy Posted: April 19, 2018 at 01:21 PM (#5656534)
I'm having a hard time remembering the last in-season replacement who kept the job long term.


I wouldn't call it long-term yet, but Brian Snitker took over as the Braves' manager in mid-2016, and is still there. (He's also 62 years old, to address the earlier posts about current managers in their 60s.) If the Braves stay over .500 this year, I think Snitker will be around for at least another season.
   51. Batman Posted: April 19, 2018 at 01:24 PM (#5656537)
He's not the last one, but Tony La Russa was an in-season replacement twice. He lasted six and a half more years with the White Sox and nine more with the A's.
   52. Jose is an Absurd Doubles Machine Posted: April 19, 2018 at 01:28 PM (#5656545)
For shame, Jose!

https://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/BOS/1988.shtml


Oh my god, I am a horrible human being.
   53. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: April 19, 2018 at 01:53 PM (#5656577)
"Stupid move. I don't know anything about Price, but what do the Reds know now that they didn't 18 games ago?
What's the earliest in a season any manager has been fired? Cal Ripken Sr. was fired after going 0-6 in 1988.
   54. geonose Posted: April 19, 2018 at 02:00 PM (#5656583)
I'm having a hard time remembering the last in-season replacement who kept the job long term.

Everybody seems to be forgetting the obvious name...Ned Yost replaced Trey Hillman in May 2010 and is now the Royals' longest-tenured manager ever.
   55. jacksone (AKA It's OK...) Posted: April 19, 2018 at 02:04 PM (#5656585)
top draft pick Ryan Anderson


Apparently THE name to have if you want to be a semi-athletic, 6'10" professional athlete. Are we sure Anderson didn't quite baseball, emigrate to the DR, immigrate to the US with a younger birth certificate, and pick up basketball?
   56. Batman Posted: April 19, 2018 at 02:17 PM (#5656595)
What's the earliest in a season any manager has been fired? Cal Ripken Sr. was fired after going 0-6 in 1988.
ESPN says Ripken is tied with Phil Garner, briefly of the 2002 Tigers. That only goes back to 1973 though.

At least four managers have been fired during spring training, including Tim Johnson who had to report back to his platoon in Nam.
   57. The usual palaver and twaddle (Met Fan Charlie) Posted: April 19, 2018 at 02:38 PM (#5656606)
At least four managers have been fired during spring training, including Tim Johnson who had to report back to his platoon in Nam.


Alvin Dark with the 1978 Padres (replaced by Roger Craig) is the one I remember...
   58. The usual palaver and twaddle (Met Fan Charlie) Posted: April 19, 2018 at 02:51 PM (#5656620)
And then, there's the case of the 1960's & 1970's Pirates.

In 1960, the Pirates won the World Series under Danny Murtaugh.

After the 1963 season, Murtaugh was replaced by Harry "The Hat" Walker.

In 1967, Walker was replaced by Danny Murtaugh.

In 1968, Murtaugh was replaced by Larry Sheppard.

In 1969, Sheppard was fired after compiling an 84-73 record and Alex Grammas finished out the season going 4-1. (12 games behind the Mets)

In 1970, Grammas was replaced by Danny Murtaugh. They won the NL East.

Mutaugh retired after winning the 1971 World Series and was replaced by Bill Virdon.

136 games into the 1973 season, Virdon was fired and replaced by... wait for it... Danny Murtaugh.

Murtaugh stayed on the job through 1976, and only relinquished the position because he died that December.


   59. BDC Posted: April 19, 2018 at 03:02 PM (#5656627)
Not fired, of course, but both Eddie Sawyer (Phillies) and Eddie Stanky (Rangers) famously quit after a single game. Sawyer's was Opening Day, after he'd managed Philadelphia for many years; Stanky's one game was his only one with Texas. (And Stanky wasn't an interim, IIRC; he was given the regular job and promptly quit.)

Sawyer had the best reason. "I'm 49 years old, and I want to live to be 50."
   60. Jose is an Absurd Doubles Machine Posted: April 19, 2018 at 03:15 PM (#5656634)
At least four managers have been fired during spring training,


The Red Sox had a weird one. In 2001 they fired Jimy Williams mid-season for Joe Kerrigan. Kerrigan promptly sent the team into the abyss and he got fired at the end of the season. The Sox explored options but at the same time were in the process of selling the team to the John Henry group. I don't remember the exact sequence but the Yawkey Group eventually hired/promoted third base coach Mike Cubbage to the managerial job. When the Henry group took over in February they didn't want Cubbage so they fired him and hired Grady Little.
   61. The Yankee Clapper Posted: April 19, 2018 at 03:19 PM (#5656638)
Cincinnati Reds: "Tanking? How dare you accuse us of such. We just fired the manager. What more could you want? Go buy some tickets."
   62. The usual palaver and twaddle (Met Fan Charlie) Posted: April 19, 2018 at 03:20 PM (#5656640)
All this talk of premature managerial firings and not yet one mention of Wally Backman...
   63. The usual palaver and twaddle (Met Fan Charlie) Posted: April 19, 2018 at 03:21 PM (#5656641)
Cincinnati Reds: "Tanking? How dare you accuse us of such. We just fired the manager. What more could you want? Go buy some tickets."


Good point.
   64. Joe OBrien Posted: April 19, 2018 at 03:37 PM (#5656648)
The best explanation I've heard for early season firings in the modern era is cost savings. If they canned Price last fall, his replacement would be making $2-3 million at least. An interim guy is much cheaper, and ownership probably figured the season was hopeless anyway.
   65. Batman Posted: April 19, 2018 at 03:37 PM (#5656650)
According to his Notre Dame resume, George Leary was fired by several MLB teams in the middle of the same season.
   66. Nasty Nate Posted: April 19, 2018 at 03:46 PM (#5656655)
If they canned Price last fall, his replacement would be making $2-3 million at least. An interim guy is much cheaper, and ownership probably figured the season was hopeless anyway.
Maybe, but is his replacement really going to accept much less to manage 145 games than he would for the full season?
   67. Walt Davis Posted: April 19, 2018 at 04:03 PM (#5656673)
#41: The beginning of that also led to Virdon being hired by the Astros the same season the Yanks fired him. So he managed two teams in one season. And as a mid-season replacement, he then managed the Astros for the next 8 seasons.

And Virdon pops up in that Murtaugh sequence. He won the NL East with 96 wins with Pitt in 72, was just 2 games under 500 when he was fired. He won 89 with the Yanks in 74, was those two games over in 75 when he got fired. In Houston, he was 500ish until winning 89 then 93, then the split season (500ish) then 49-62 fired. Then to the Expos where he was 2 games over in 83 then a solid 64-67 when he was replaced again.

Final record 74 games over 500, only team he was under 500 was the Expos at 146-147.
   68. TDF didn't lie, he just didn't remember Posted: April 19, 2018 at 04:03 PM (#5656674)
Do any of you guys actually watch the Reds? Because.therr are 2 data points Castellini and Williams have that they didn't before the season began:

1. After Suarez was hurt, Price had 3 options for a replacement - roster fodder Phil Gosselin, roster fodder Clif Pennington, or 25 year old with nothing left to prove Alex Blandino. Guess who got the fewest PA of the 3?

2. Yovanni Gallardo pitched in a close game, when every other mber of the bullpen was available. One out later, a 4-2 game had turned into a 10-2 game.

In a nutshell, it's as if Price didn't even care any more, or was actively sabotaging the rebuild.
   69. Jose is an Absurd Doubles Machine Posted: April 19, 2018 at 04:25 PM (#5656691)
68 - No I haven't seen the Reds and those are two questionable decisions (though I'd need to be sold a bit more on Blandino but I'll defer to you for now). But that's two questionable decisions, no manager gets them all right. If he's been a good manager for four years those two decisions in the first three weeks of the season, bad as they are, are not enough to warrant being fired.

The one thing about Blandino I'll say is that if Williams went to Price and said "hey, we are in building mode here and we want you to play Blandino, it's #### or get off the pot time for him" and Price refused that would be a fireable offense.
   70. Graham & the 15-win "ARod Vortex of suck" Posted: April 19, 2018 at 04:32 PM (#5656698)
Cincinnati Reds: "Tanking? How dare you accuse us of such. We just fired the manager. What more could you want? Go buy some tickets."


The Reds are trying to rebuild; they are just doing a poor job.
   71. vortex of dissipation Posted: April 19, 2018 at 04:44 PM (#5656709)
I think this is just change made for the sake of change. I'm not sure why Price held the job for so long in the first place. Riggleman is not the answer, but it's clear the Reds don't see him as that; he's just an interim. But the start they have had is so poor that they had do something, even if it's a cosmetic change that's grasping at straws.
   72. TDF didn't lie, he just didn't remember Posted: April 19, 2018 at 05:20 PM (#5656735)
though I'd need to be sold a bit more on Blandino
Here's the thing - Pennington and Gosselin were both signed to minor league deals and should see the field only if the Reds have no other options, while Blandino is a 25 year old who may or may not be part of the future (even if just as a backup IF). There's no reason a rebuilding team should be playing the first two over the latter.
If he's been a good manager for four years those two decisions in the first three weeks of the season, bad as they are, are not enough to warrant being fired.
I know he's only a part of the puzzle, but look at his record. He hasn't been a good manager.
   73. bfan Posted: April 19, 2018 at 05:52 PM (#5656748)
To be fair, he was only 62 before watching Tyler Chatwood walk a bazillion guys last start.


No Cubs fan should complain about having a bazillion guys walked; they staged a 9 run inning last week, and hit the ball fair, 3 times.
   74. frannyzoo Posted: April 19, 2018 at 06:34 PM (#5656758)
Maybe they're going to hire Chris Truby.


A look disappointingly shows no mention of BBTF or Satan-worship on the Chris Truby Wikipedia page. I am so disappointed in so many here. Shameful.
   75. Walt Davis Posted: April 19, 2018 at 06:57 PM (#5656773)
No Cubs fan should complain about having a bazillion guys walked; they staged a 9 run inning last week, and hit the ball fair, 3 times.

I feel like we're not getting enough credit for our awesome HBP ability.
   76. Slivers of Maranville descends into chaos (SdeB) Posted: April 19, 2018 at 07:21 PM (#5656782)
In 1981, Gene Michael was fired after starting 48-34, replaced by Bob Lemon, who remained until...

1982, when he was fired after starting 6-8, replaced by Bob lemon,


I thought Billy Martin had an odd career but this has to be the first fired manager who was replaced by himself.
   77. Jose is an Absurd Doubles Machine Posted: April 19, 2018 at 07:48 PM (#5656793)
72 - Yeah bringing him back is a noodle scratcher but once you’ve done that I think you stick with him barring something more glaring than the errors you’ve described. Doing this just looks like an organization in disarray.

“Hey did we do everything on our off-season check list?”

“Yeah, we’re good, wait...did you fire Price?”

“No, you were going to do that.”

“Shit.”
   78. stevegamer Posted: April 19, 2018 at 09:15 PM (#5656828)
The Phillies fired Pat Corrales in 1983 - while the team was not only over .500, but also in first place.

He then got another job with another team later that year.
   79. Walt Davis Posted: April 19, 2018 at 09:19 PM (#5656830)
It occurs to me they didn't fire him because they knew this season was going to be a disaster. Bring in a genuine new guy, they're still probably 3-15 and now the fans are clamoring (to the extent they still have fans who care enough to clamor) for that guy's ouster. It also makes it look the FO has no clue how to find a good manager. Even if that guy stuck it out for the year, they might be lucky to scratch out 60 wins and probably won't be much better next year. So you have a guy under contract, keep him around until you need a scapegoat, put a vet you don't care about in as interim ... unfortunately that only took 18 games.

It's early yet but as of this moment, MLB has two teams playing under 200 (KC and Cinci), another 4 teams playing under 300 and one under 400.
   80. Non-Youkilidian Geometry Posted: April 19, 2018 at 09:33 PM (#5656848)
I thought Billy Martin had an odd career but this has to be the first fired manager who was replaced by himself.

Probably, but in hockey the Maple Leafs’ owner Harold Ballard once fired coach Roger Neilson and then rehired him the next day. He wanted Neilson to coach the next game wearing a paper bag on his head but Neilson refused.
   81. Steve Parris, Je t'aime Posted: April 19, 2018 at 10:12 PM (#5656870)
In a nutshell, it's as if Price didn't even care any more, or was actively sabotaging the rebuild.


I've made the point above but apparently not forcefully. It's all about the pitching. Price was the pitching coach, and the staff has outright sucked for the last few years. Regardless of who was on the roster the team expected something better than the dead last for HRs and walks for two straight years. It started to look a little better last August, but it didn't carry over. I don't think whether he played a future utility IF like Blandino enough during the past week registered at all in this decision.
   82. Graham & the 15-win "ARod Vortex of suck" Posted: April 19, 2018 at 10:48 PM (#5656890)
It's early yet but as of this moment, MLB has two teams playing under 200 (KC and Cinci), another 4 teams playing under 300 and one under 400.


How does that compare to a typical season through April 19th, though?
   83. Rennie's Tenet Posted: April 20, 2018 at 12:49 AM (#5656927)
#58: Danny Murtaugh retired near the end of the 1976 season, and replaced by Chuck Tanner in early November. Murtaugh died in early December.
   84. RMc's Unenviable Situation Posted: April 20, 2018 at 10:06 AM (#5656991)
A look disappointingly shows no mention of BBTF or Satan-worship on the Chris Truby Wikipedia page. I am so disappointed in so many here. Shameful.


I tried to fix it, but it was promptly reverted, and I'll be damned if I'm wading into another GD wiki editing war. Li'l help?
   85. Zonk cooks his superfish with raisins Posted: April 20, 2018 at 10:41 AM (#5657011)
I thought Billy Martin had an odd career but this has to be the first fired manager who was replaced by himself.


Peak Steinbrenner produced plenty of odd managerial careers.
   86. Batman Posted: April 20, 2018 at 11:22 AM (#5657033)
I tried to fix it, but it was promptly reverted, and I'll be damned if I'm wading into another GD wiki editing war. Li'l help?
"internet gossip sourced to a blog? certainly not the main thing he's known for."

I'll always know him for his love of interpretive dance and his room-clearing farts.
   87. Endless Trash Posted: April 20, 2018 at 11:30 AM (#5657045)
Geez, I had never heard of this guy. I figured this must be one of those quick hiring and firings, but no, he's been manager of the reds since 2014. Shows how much I pay attention these days. I am ashamed.
   88. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: April 20, 2018 at 11:32 AM (#5657048)
I'll always know him for his love of interpretive dance and his room-clearing farts.
The best is when he combines the two.
   89. Dunn Deal Posted: April 20, 2018 at 11:59 AM (#5657072)
Geez, I had never heard of this guy. I figured this must be one of those quick hiring and firings, but no, he's been manager of the reds since 2014. Shows how much I pay attention these days. I am ashamed.


Life comes at you fast. Trust me, you haven't missed much in Cincinnati over the past 4 years. :-)
   90. Jesse Barfield's Right Arm Posted: April 20, 2018 at 02:15 PM (#5657129)
Pete Mackanin should have.


He did get the permanent job, then oddly got an extension (odd in that the Phillies fired him a few months after the extention).
   91. Walt Davis Posted: April 20, 2018 at 05:20 PM (#5657233)
#82 ... I don't know ... but I'm guessing you can use b-r's "standings on any date" just as easily as I can to start investigating.
   92. Walt Davis Posted: April 20, 2018 at 05:26 PM (#5657235)
But to get the ball rolling ... in 2017 after about 18-20 games, there were 0 teams under 200, 1 team under 300 and 3 teams under 400. In 2016, it was 0, 4, 2. In 2016, it was 1, 0, 3. (I used Apr 23).
   93. cardsfanboy Posted: April 20, 2018 at 10:00 PM (#5657339)
I tried to fix it, but it was promptly reverted, and I'll be damned if I'm wading into another GD wiki editing war. Li'l help?


I would have made it a reference in popular culture heading instead of 'internet joke'.
   94. Don August(us) Cesar Geronimo Berroa Posted: April 21, 2018 at 09:11 AM (#5657454)
Best Reds can be after 20 games is .200. My guess is that they will be .150. They cant beat the Cards, even when they are good. Also, Blandino with the start at 3b last night.
   95. Edmundo got dem ol' Kozma blues again mama Posted: April 21, 2018 at 09:46 AM (#5657459)
It's early yet but as of this moment, MLB has two teams playing under 200 (KC and Cinci), another 4 teams playing under 300 and one under 400.


And the Mets, Phils, Pirates and DBacks over .600 in the NL. Whoever had that quartet pre-season, please take a bow!
   96. Edmundo got dem ol' Kozma blues again mama Posted: April 21, 2018 at 10:13 AM (#5657468)
The Phillies fired Pat Corrales in 1983 - while the team was not only over .500, but also in first place.


1 game above .500 on what was viewed as an underperforming team. They went 47-30 the rest of the way under GM Paul Owens.
   97. Panic Posted: April 21, 2018 at 10:02 PM (#5657799)
I saw Riggleman in the Reds' dugout last month and was mildly amazed that he was still in baseball. He's only 65, which certainly doesn't seem old to me :) but not a lot of guys manage in the majors at that age. The current crop of elder statesmen (Bochy, Showalter, Yost) are in their early 60s, and guys like Scioscia and Francona, who have been around forever, aren't even 60 yet.


Francona turns 60 tomorrow, so he will officially be an elder statesman.
   98. Don August(us) Cesar Geronimo Berroa Posted: April 27, 2018 at 10:24 AM (#5661542)
Revisiting this: Alex Blandino has started 6 of 7 games since Price's firing. .429/.455/.429. A little light on power so far, but, .429 will play anywhere. :-) Also, Pennington has been dumped from the roster.

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